Brian Lara, How Good Was He?

[DrEvil_]

Just looking up the scorecards, it's clear that 1992-3 series was the one that got away from us.

We had them 8 down in Brisbane on the last day, and couldn't bowl them out.

Went 1-0 in Melbourne then racked up 500 in the first innings in Sydney....then came the magical Lara/Richardson partnership to save them.

And of course the heartbreak of Adelaide.

Definite "sliding doors" material was that one.

How I long for those matches again, the sheer twists and turns in those series vs the windies were unbelievable.

 

[blackcat]

Sangakara only averaging 52 against the big guns? What a dud!

not the point I was making tho.

I may have been ambiguous, like you may also be ambiguous, I was never meant to be (read as) underselling his preternatural ability

 

[blackcat]

Brian Lara is my favourite player of all time.

Just majestic to watch. I barracked for him to make big runs whenever he played against us. That 226 he made in his last Test in Australia will forever live in my memory.

also, VVS was good to watch

 

[blackcat]

I don't know how to articulate it. There's something about showing a high level of talent as a youngster. Even before you start playing tests. It took a while for Steve Waugh to elevate himself to the top echelon. Ponting could've played for Australia at 14. Clarke is not in the conversation afaik.

he was captained by Klinger in the underage national team. Klinger was playing district 1's when he was 16 for St Kilda.

Alot of players from the subcontinent are christened[sic] early, and given that halo of greatness, there was always a "16yo" player getting national duties for Pakistan.

 

[DrEvil_]

It would take a very unique and special sort of player to knock Lara off his perch for me.

AB De Villiers might come closest of the modern players and maybe KP in a different way too, although of course I appreciated the pure quality of the likes of Ponting, Tendulkar (who I never actually rated as being especially interesting to watch, just ******* good), Sangakarra, Clarke and Dravid.

But there was something about Lara, something about the flourishing backlift, the fiery temperament, the fact he was a one-man band for two-thirds of his career, how hard he hit the ball...it was just the pure package for mine and I doubt it will be replicated easily.

The thing about Lara is that even when he hits you for six every ball there is nothing agriculture about it. Watching some video today just reminds me of how normal the bats looked back in the days.

 

[imadodgyumpire]

he was captained by Klinger in the underage national team. Klinger was playing district 1's when he was 16 for St Kilda.

Alot of players from the subcontinent are christened[sic] early, and given that halo of greatness, there was always a "16yo" player getting national duties for Pakistan.

I'm sorry. Which player are you referring to?

 

[blackcat]

I'm sorry. Which player are you referring to?

the one-day player who bowled fast leggies for Pakistan. He would be about 35 now. "supposedly" he was 16. He played mostly one-day, opened the batting for a while, was an explosive batsmen in a time before 2020, like Gilchrist. That guy, never made it in tests... and he may have got into trouble in Australia with the police over "girl issues".

 

[blackcat]

Border was a better player than Steve Waugh for mine. He was probably less naturally talented than Waugh (although too much is made of his being a battler, you don't score 11,000+ runs without some serious skills too) but he excelled against all types of bowling in all sorts of conditions (he actually average far better overseas than in OZ). Border also played a huge amount of match saving and rear guard innings out of necessity as he was the only genuinely elite batsman during the nadir of Australian cricket. Waugh was around in the bad days too but was more of a handy all rounder at that point and only became a genuine quality batsman in 1989 when the renaissance of Australian cricket truly began.

medusala Meds is a big Border and Billy the Kid Brereton fan

 

[imadodgyumpire]

the one-day player who bowled fast leggies for Pakistan. He would be about 35 now. "supposedly" he was 16. He played mostly one-day, opened the batting for a while, was an explosive batsmen in a time before 2020, like Gilchrist. That guy, never made it in tests... and he may have got into trouble in Australia with the police over "girl issues".

I meant who was captained by Klinger?

 

[blackcat]

I meant who was captained by Klinger?

edit: Michael Clarke (I thought).

...original reply...
no, Klinger captained Michael Clarke in the underage national teams, and therefore Shane Watson.

I dont know who captained Klinger at St Kilda. I need to read my first post to see if it was ambiguous

 

[STFU Donnie]

the one-day player who bowled fast leggies for Pakistan. He would be about 35 now. "supposedly" he was 16. He played mostly one-day, opened the batting for a while, was an explosive batsmen in a time before 2020, like Gilchrist. That guy, never made it in tests... and he may have got into trouble in Australia with the police over "girl issues".

Shahid Afridi.

His test record is OK. 1716 runs @ 36.51 with 5 centuries. I think his problem was his mindset; he didn't like 5-day cricket, but he certainly had the talent to make it.

 

[rezagun]

Started watching this bloke play in the 92 world cup and followed his career for the many highlights. An absolute champion of the game and a great bloke. He often carried the team and inspired those around him. A couple of superb hundreds at adelaide oval were great to watch live. His most memorable knocks imo were obviously his record breaking efforts of 375, 400, 501.. His batting against australia in australia was always great to watch, making big hundreds. But his domination over australia in the caribbean ranks highly, scoring a double ton and then 160 odd n/o pummeling mcgill and warne to all parts in jamaica, i think the final test they chased down a score of 350-400..?? And he hit the winning runs with courtney walsh defending the previous over. A pure matchwinner and a batsmen on another level than most he is a legend.

 

[free at last]

Give me gilly in full flight over Lara

 

[imadodgyumpire]

Give me gilly in full flight over Lara

Lololol...

 

[Cleavy]

When the cricket bottomed out today (when the two Windies fielders were fighting over the ball on the boundary) I watched this from our tour there in 1999.



The Windies had just got annihilated by South African 5-0 and lost the first test to us in the Caribbean, getting bowled out for 51 (their record low). Lara was about to lose the captaincy. The he went double century, unbeaten hundred and fifty, century and they managed to square the series 2-2. Against McGrath and Gillespie no less.

We would have won 3-1 if Healy didn't drop an easy catch at the end of the 3rd Test. That's when we knew that he was on borrowed time.

 

[free at last]

Lololol...

No laughing matter when gilly was in full flight.Youtube his 57 ball ton,second fastest in test history.Only the great Sir Issac Vivian Richards bettered gilly for getting to a ton in quicker time.

Gilly>Lara when in full flight

 

[Carbine Chaos]

Weird logic. It's like saying give me Gayle in full flight over Tendulkar.

 

[Sammo360]

No laughing matter when gilly was in full flight.Youtube his 57 ball ton,second fastest in test history.Only the great Sir Issac Vivian Richards bettered gilly for getting to a ton in quicker time.

Misbah says hi

 

[imadodgyumpire]

No laughing matter when gilly was in full flight.Youtube his 57 ball ton,second fastest in test history.Only the great Sir Issac Vivian Richards bettered gilly for getting to a ton in quicker time.

Gilly>Lara when in full flight

No, I agree. My earlier post was due to an initial sore bottom your opinion caused me. The difference is marginal. As a viewer, your opinion is of merit. It's unlikely Brian has played a better knock in odi that what Gilly did in the 07 WC final.

However. When discussing the merits of their abilities. I think Gilly would be considered that quarter step behind Lara.

 

[JackOutback]

Gilly's average was close to that of the greats over a significant number of Tests despite coming in late (with his strike rate making up for more limited opportunities). He never achieved anything like the massive innings of Lara and would be behind him, imo, but perhaps we need to consider him more in these discussions rather than just limiting him to discussions of best keeper.

 

[Oaktree]

Gilly's role in the test team as a batsman was completely different to Lara, so it's not a fair comparison comparing the two.

Lara should be compared with those who batted at 3 and 4, like Ponting, Tendulkar, Sangakkara, etc.

Gilly is a middle order batsman who on most occasions had a license to hit out and attack from the get go.

Lara batted at 3 and 4 his entire career and had to come in under lots of pressure after the loss of an early on many occasions.

The batting positions are two different sets of circumstances.

 

[STFU Donnie]

Misbah says hi

I must be living under an effing rock, as that record completely slipped by me!!!

 

[Big Bryza]

He's alright. But not as good as what he others are saying. I'd rate Warner's 23 yesterday better than anything Lara's produced.

Thanks Slats.

 

[imadodgyumpire]

Bill Lawry waffled on about it as well.

 

[MisterMarcus]

Am I the only one who rates Ponting over Sachin? I rate Kallis over Sachin too. I reckon he was pretty overrated.

Lara > Ponting > Kallis > Tendulkar. I'd almost have Sanga over Tendulkar.

Kallis is a strange one. Almost nobody would rank him as the best of that era, above Lara, Tendulkar, etc. Yet he averaged 55 with the bat while also averaging 33 with the ball in Test cricket. That's basically a batting career on par with the greatest of the time, plus a very respectable bowling average as well.

I always wondered why he was so under-rated.