List Mgmt. Carlton's 2018 Draft Thread (cont. in Part 2)

[blueballs99]

Here is my prediction

Pick 1- Walsh
Pick 69- Hamill
Pick 71- BSOS
Pick 77- Palmer

Rookies
Blakey
Goddard
Bugg

Would also like to add Wil Hickmott

Fair crack ...oh plz not another silvagni ..having one that can't play is bad enough ..rather hickmott if their dead set on bringing in a father and son

 

[mediumsizered]

Fair crack ...oh plz not another silvagni ..having one that can't play is bad enough ..rather hickmott if their dead set on bringing in a father and son

BSOS has more to offer our current list make-up than what Hickmott does. Plays tall, can play as a lock down defender (we don't have Rowe anymore), is quite mobile & can play forward if required.

What Hickmott offers we already have a number of players who offer the same, but better.

 

[ParapMarkets]

Can remember a game against North at Etihad later in his career where they were tagging him off the bench, and he just kept running, goal kicked, ran the centre square, ball in play, ran end to end, and one by one he literally burnt them off.

**** it, I’m putting on the 95 grand final DVD. I wonder who kicks the first goal?

 

[thylacine60]

manton? oh right - that's was the 99 pf

 

[BLUEALLTHRU]

Fair crack ...oh plz not another silvagni ..having one that can't play is bad enough ..rather hickmott if their dead set on bringing in a father and son

I'll let the Carlton recruiters'list management be the judge of that! Jack is still raw and I reckon will turn into a handy player.

 

[ray8182]

Would have thought you could get bsos with a rookie pick. Hasn’t done much. Lucky just to be on an afl list. Is anyone else going to select him?


On iPad using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Eiffel 65]

The simple fact is that SOS considered McGovern's worth to more than what he could acquire with Picks 26 & 28 (1406 points) in this years draft and a Future 5th Rounder in next years draft.

Don't think that's entirely the case.

Think we just needed to add some senior talent to our list.

 

[Eiffel 65]

Here is my prediction

Pick 1- Walsh
Pick 69- Hamill
Pick 71- BSOS
Pick 77- Palmer

Rookies
Blakey
Goddard
Bugg

Would also like to add Wil Hickmott

Are you sure BSOS has been nominated as a father son?

Can't find anything released from the club saying they've nominated him for the national draft.

Draft is in less than a week so would have thought they would have done it by now.

 

[footyfan1978]

**** it, I’m putting on the 95 grand final DVD. I wonder who kicks the first goal?

Braddles from memory. I remember thinking game was over then for Cats...lol...
Meanwhile, fast forward 23 years and I sitting at Darklands v Fremantle and two minutes in I knew game was over at other extreme.


Welcome aboard Sam Walsh and Ben Silvagni next week and whomever else gets drafted with our last pick.

 

[djw1952]

Fair crack ...oh plz not another silvagni ..having one that can't play is bad enough ..rather hickmott if their dead set on bringing in a father and son

I find that comment of yours to be totally off considering what the Silvagnis have done for our club. Sounds like something an opposition supporter would say, and how would you know if BSOS is up to it or not anyway you know all

 

[ParapMarkets]

Poppycock gentlemen, absolute poppycock. At the time of trade, the Swans received Picks 26, 28 & 40 (1835 points) for Pick 13 (1212 points). 13!!! 13!!! as Anthony Hudson would cry. The simple fact is that SOS considered McGovern's worth to more than what he could acquire with Picks 26 & 28 (1406 points) in this years draft and a Future 5th Rounder in next years draft. Justin Reid values the prospect he thinks he can acquire with Pick 13 better than what he'll achieve with Picks 26, 28 & 40 (1835 points). That's a 623 point differential gentlemen and we're not even talking Top 5 Picks here. We're talking about a 623 point differential for a 1st Round Pick outside the Top 10*. Some things to think about:

• Do you honestly think the Swans feel guilty about extracting a 50% (623) point premium for Pick 13 or do you think they were happy to make off like bandits into the night???
• Do you think Reid was pissed he had to part with 1835 points to get Pick 13 or do you think he left happy walking away with a mid 1st Round Pick in a Super Draft, which is what he initially set out to do???*
• Do you think SOS was pissed about having to use both his early 2nd Round Picks in a very deep Super Draft, or did he leave happy having kept Pick 1 intact and acquiring McGovern, which is what he set out to achieve???* *(Future 3rd Rounder used by AFC in this trade effectively paid for McAdam)

Lends a whole different perspective doesn't it.

Port gave up Picks 6 & 35 in this years draft & Freo's Future 3rd (approximately 2650 points) for Pick 5 (1878 points) and Sam Mayes. Wouldn't have thought Mayes was worth any more than a mid/late 3rd Rounder, if that, and is no lock to make Ports best 22. In effect Port gave up around an 500-600 point premium just to nudge up the pecking order from Pick 6 to Pick 5. Food for thought:

• Do you think Port were pissed having to give up an 500-600 point premium to climb one rung up the Draft Ladder or they walked away happy having put themselves in a position to potentially snaffle all of Rankine, Rozee & Hately while adding a little depth to their list which is what they set out to do???

If I'm an established AFL club in a traditional market such SA, WA & Vic then I wouldn't hesitate and simply take Picks 2, 3, 6, 24 & 29 to the draft, but the Suns are an expansion club in an emerging market with some unique problems.

• Absolutely butchered their first attempt at a list build, and with it, the opportunity to build a club with a culture that stood for something. They simply cannot afford to bugger it up a second time. Lukosius & Walsh would provide the best possible start.
• After losing both Lynch & May, the Suns are desperate for a couple of Franchise Players. They need to be more than just very good footballers, they need to be media friendly, mature, intelligent and marketable. They need a couple of young professionals with integrity to build their brand around. For the Suns, this aspect could well be worth the 900 point premium to get Walsh on its own.
• I don't subscribe to the notion of bringing in a bunch of SA kids together. Of all the kids in the top 10, I think Rankine and Rozee are potentially the biggest flight risks, especially if they end up in the northern states. I'd much prefer to have the calm and rational voice of Walsh providing support to Lukosius rather than the other 2 blathering away how they want to go home all the time when it begins to get a little bit too hard after the first 12 months. Just my take.

So if you think a 900 point differential will stop GCS from using Picks 3 & 6 to trade up to Pick 1 then think again. The lesson to be learned is this;

• It's not about overs,
• It's not about unders,
• It's not about evens,
• It's not about points,
• It's not even about picks.
• It's about the prospects/players you think you can, or can't, acquire with those picks and how they'll fit into your system to achieve the club's goals.

.....and just to add a little fuel to the fire here's a quote I'll leave you with from our very own TheRedPill.

Good post. My own take is that I think GC will prefer to spread their risk rather than concentrate it by trading big for Walsh. Walsh won’t want to go there just as much as the other guys (although it’s a great part of the world to go to at 18 - or any age really).

If they are willing to trade big for him it is because of qualities that we desperately need too. It needs to be a trade that pays us significant overs as opposed to a “reasonable trade” imo. It’s hard to see us not accepting a trade that would acquire Rankine + Smith/Rozee/??, but to me it just feels like fantasy.

I know it’s easy to be pessimistic about 2019 for us, but if we can get a better run of injuries, we add Doc and McGovern (who replace our bottom players who have been delisted) we will be much better. Confidence is the key, once our group gets a bit of swagger the whole landscape changes, it’s a compounding effect, and people will view us differently.

Go Blues!

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

The risk is that waiting for a midfielder and all round top footballer via trades as good as Walsh will be is fraught with the same dangers as Shiel this year. Really may as well stab oneself in the foot. It just has to be done I am convinced.

It is a risk to expect to be able to trade in the future to find a top line mid but it is just my personal opinion that I rate Rankine and Walsh about the same so I would go for the much more rare talent in Rankine

 

[The Smoking Gun]

Good post. My own take is that I think GC will prefer to spread their risk rather than concentrate it by trading big for Walsh. Walsh won’t want to go there just as much as the other guys (although it’s a great part of the world to go to at 18 - or any age really).

This, exactly this..........and you'd think if you were Craig Cameron, Stuart Dew, etc, that you'd be selling that fact for all you're worth. I go up there every year for our game up there. It's a must do.

I know it’s easy to be pessimistic about 2019 for us, but if we can get a better run of injuries, we add Doc and McGovern (who replace our bottom players who have been delisted) we will be much better. Confidence is the key, once our group gets a bit of swagger the whole landscape changes, it’s a compounding effect, and people will view us differently.

Just like every other club, we will always incur injuries. You need to plan to have enough genuine depth so that you can cover up to 20% of your list being unavailable at any given time. You need a best 32 rather than a best 22 if that makes sense.

 

[Arr0w]

Fair crack ...oh plz not another silvagni ..having one that can't play is bad enough ..rather hickmott if their dead set on bringing in a father and son

You would be game to write off Jack

 

[Pinnell]

I'll let the Carlton recruiters'list management be the judge of that! Jack is still raw and I reckon will turn into a handy player.

I would have thought "raw" would describe a kid that started playing when they were 15 or 16, or came from another sport. Jack has been immersed in footy since day dot

 

[Lace_Out]

Jack's are supposed to be nimble and quick, we were robbed.

 

[Brutalitops]

Here is my prediction

Pick 1- Walsh
Pick 69- Hamill
Pick 71- BSOS
Pick 77- Palmer

Rookies
Blakey
Goddard
Bugg

Would also like to add Wil Hickmott

Not a fan of Bugg, though he would much needed mongrel. He's a loose unit though

 

[BIGGUS 64]

Fair crack ...oh plz not another silvagni ..having one that can't play is bad enough ..rather hickmott if their dead set on bringing in a father and son

Wow... sorry mate, but that's an abysmal post.

"Another Silvagni"? Seriously? I can only assume you're a youngster who never saw his dad play. I guess you can't help that.

Jack had a rising star nomination in 2017 saying he can play. If his 2018 season was underwhelming, he had plenty of mates in that department. It was a crap season for the club overall, so singling Jack out is really poor form.

A whole new season lies ahead. With the right support, Jack will be a fine player for us.

 

[ferrisb]

Jack's are supposed to be nimble and quick, we were robbed.

Reckon JSOS could probably jump over a candlestick...

 

[Blutopia]

I can easily make a case for 12

Start the ball rolling with some retirements

Simmo, Daisy, Levi

Others injury prone/shown very little

Phillips, Pickett, Garlett, Lang, Lebois

Players under pressure

Cuners, Fasolo, Jones, Plowman

You could name a couple of others to this category

Not every player can get 30 touches a game. Lang can either be a solid mid/forward who plays a role. Has shown enough and may not get 30 a game but can easily get 20 and a goal and play his role.
Pickett will be a jet and has shown enough before injured. Garlett has the talent and his best is more than worthy so should be more consistent 2nd year around.
Cunningham has shown enough to be a solid HB/mid with good pace.
Jones will be better with more support from Weiters/Marchbank next year.
Plow has been solid so I am confused as to why ge’s On list.
Fasolo on 3 year deal and has the talent, just fell behind others at Pies.
I see that 4 from list is likely, another 3 are maybe at best and the rest highly unlikely to be chopped.

 

[Blue and Blue]

Wow... sorry mate, but that's an abysmal post.

"Another Silvagni"? Seriously? I can only assume you're a youngster who never saw his dad play. I guess you can't help that.

Jack had a rising star nomination in 2017 saying he can play. If his 2018 season was underwhelming, he had plenty of mates in that department. It was a crap season for the club overall, so singling Jack out is really poor form.

A whole new season lies ahead. With the right support, Jack will be a fine player for us.

Watching various highlights..its Jack that has the best pinpoint kicks into the forward line..he makes things happen..makes fantastic decisions and executes with precision...he spent a year in limbo really..all over the ground...broadening his scope and sphere of influence

 

[Arr0w]

Not every player can get 30 touches a game. Lang can either be a solid mid/forward who plays a role. Has shown enough and may not get 30 a game but can easily get 20 and a goal and play his role.
Pickett will be a jet and has shown enough before injured. Garlett has the talent and his best is more than worthy so should be more consistent 2nd year around.
Cunningham has shown enough to be a solid HB/mid with good pace.
Jones will be better with more support from Weiters/Marchbank next year.
Plow has been solid so I am confused as to why ge’s On list.
Fasolo on 3 year deal and has the talent, just fell behind others at Pies.
I see that 4 from list is likely, another 3 are maybe at best and the rest highly unlikely to be chopped.

Try looking at it this way, the 12 players I listed, can you honestly make a strong case for them being a lock in 2020?

 

[Blue and Blue]

Try looking at it this way, the 12 players I listed, can you honestly make a strong case for them being a lock in 2020?

I see your point of course.
I would say that none of us can, but apart from the retirements...all the players mentioned..and more besides can make their own case for it.
And in the meantime we can just enjoy the journey with optimism, hoping for each of their sakes they succeed and knowing that all won't.
I for one can't be enthusiastic about the next season while worrying about the one after it because some of the list will change. I've watched that happen for decades. They come and they go. Some make it some don't.

 

[Blutopia]

This, exactly this..........and you'd think if you were Craig Cameron, Stuart Dew, etc, that you'd be selling that fact for all you're worth. I go up there every year for our game up there. It's a must do.


Just like every other club, we will always incur injuries. You need to plan to have enough genuine depth so that you can cover up to 20% of your list being unavailable at any given time. You need a best 32 rather than a best 22 if that makes sense.

Agree with this but if you look at our run it was pretty well the worst in the league. Easily the worst through first half of season and by then it was game over, a young list low on confidence.
We have rectified this by getting into club the expert on training and conditioning which by all reports, lacking in this area contributed to excessive injuries.
Next year is so much more promising and I think we will surprise many.

 

[Arr0w]

I see your point of course.
I would say that none of us can but apart from the retirements...all the players mentioned..and more besides can make their own case for it.
And in the meantime we can just enjoy the journey with optimism, hoping for each of their sakes they succeed and knowing that all won't.
I for one can't be enthusiastic about the next season while worrying about the one after it because some of the list will change. I've watched that happen for decades. They come and they go. Some make it some don't.

I agree, apart from the possible retirements, every player has the opportunity to stake a claim.

If the players on the fringe step up, it will only create more competition, which is healthy