List Mgmt. Carlton's 2019 Draft Thread

[The Bighouse]

Draft away and let the Luke Power led development team (+ AR school of fitness) drill them into AFL players.

Get the right traits and let the games begin from our coaches.

 

[murphster]

1AW was quite 'aerial'. A super leap and strong hands. Plus deceptively tall for a running player. So he was an overhead threat. Not in the same league as Fyfe, but sort of that unusual match-up.

Stephens has the same kind of dash, running power and kicking. Maybe a 'ground' version of 1AW?

More Campo than 1aw.

 

[Mr_Plow]

Would just like to highlight that criticisms of the pure best available approach doesn't mean taking Polson ahead of Cripps because we need small forwards.

Keen for the draft to come around.

 

[AT97]

I'd be looking at the Swans picks 25 and 32, seeing if we can jag at least one of these for a future pick (s).

For example, Swans pick 25 and future 4th for our future 2nd round pick. They'd likely be keen to rack up some points in 2020 for their academy boys.

According to Doerre's phantom draft, a mid 20's pick would potentially give us access to a player such as Bergman, Taylor, Day, Williams, Schoenberg, Dow, Bianco, Taheny, Cahill etc

Interestingly many of the draft ranges in the afl draft profiles Page have changed To (I’m sure) reflect tidbits of info that are being leaked out.

eg. Macasey, maguiness 8-20, sharp 10-30

May have been there for a while just haven’t looked at recently.

Draft Prospects - AFL.com.au

We take a look at the top group of prospects for this year's NAB AFL Draft.

www.afl.com.au

 

[thylacine60]

Draft away and let the Luke Power led development team (+ AR school of fitness) drill them into AFL players.

Get the right traits and let the games begin from our coaches.

how far have we come since the days of turning up to training to see that grub liberatore playing 20 metre kick to kick in his role as assistant coach........

 

[murphster]

Because Essendon needs another small mid/fwd to go with AMT, Fantasia, Merrett, Devon Smith, Parish, Mosquito, Ham and Snelling.

Dodoro is going to drive that list into the ground

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

Agree if they take a small forward over a big bodied mid they have rocks in there head, if I was dodo, which I thank god I’m not, I would be packaging those two picks and trying to get in the C Stephens range, alternately would look at Philp.

 

[thylacine60]

Drafting for needs is an interesting concept. Imo "needs" does not just apply to positions on the ground.

I think this whole century we have been a pitiful club in terms of standards and committment to performance and all that entails "doing what needs to be done to help the team win".

I still think our "need" is all the genuine leaders and drivers and lifters we can get. Doc(26), Cripps(25), Weiters(21) and Walsh(19) are these players so far. Of the candidates around the Pick 9 mark this year, Robertson is the standout candidate with these qualities. Ash and Serong as well but a level down. Robertson from all accounts is a real leader in the Cripps mould. Brings his players with him. Has a bit of fun and really well liked but leads by example.

I think we have an incredibly talented young list put together over 4 years. I think, as a playing group, if they are driven and led the right way on the ground on matchday, on the track every session, in the gym, in the off season...then we can turn this club around from the "just turning up is good enough" attitude we've had in the past.

Another "real" leader is a "need" for me. We have the talent. Get the best talented leader. This group are gonna be together for 10 years hopefully.

That's my final push for the "get Robertson" campaign lol....if he's there at 9.

There are so many interesting views looking at things in slightly different ways. But we've got a competant team in SOS, Agresta and Brodie. So am looking forward to Wednesday without trepidation of what they'll do.

excellent post right there.........

 

[murphster]

This was exactly my reasoning in an earlier post, Robertson has the attributes we need and would improve any deficiencies quickly with Cripps alongside him, leadership and a great work ethic can overcome any minor faults as we have seen with Cripps.

 

[LemmingMaster]

Agree with Arr0w.
Draft the best available, and trade for needs.

The thing is best available can change depending on a clubs needs.
When I am currently ranking tall defenders, I place them further down the order, because I don't feel like that is a pressing need for Carlton.
If my rankings system is comparing say Ash v McAsey V Young v Henry.... In my rankings McAsey will naturally be placed further down the list.

Often when ranking players there is a slight elements of list structure that comes into play. If 6 years in a row a key defender happened to be your highest ranked player, I think you're crazy drafting that player each year when there is often a fine line between the 8th and 9th ranked player.

Unless their is a massive gap in the talent, I think an element of needs is placed in drafting a player.

 

[GT619]

Matt Balmer on Twitter posted this
Thoughts?
The first round of Wednesday's #AFLDraft is beginning to firm up.

But Hawthorn's Pick 11 will shape the draft. Will they take classy SA mid Dylan Stephens? Or could it be Cody Weightman/Miles Bergman in their sights?

Latest mail suggests Brodie Kemp could get into the teens.

 

[Eiffel 65]

Matt Balmer on Twitter posted this
Thoughts?
The first round of Wednesday's #AFLDraft is beginning to firm up.

But Hawthorn's Pick 11 will shape the draft. Will they take classy SA mid Dylan Stephens? Or could it be Cody Weightman/Miles Bergman in their sights?

Latest mail suggests Brodie Kemp could get into the teens.

I think TerryWallet summed it up perfectly in the pick 9 thread.

Most likely means Fremantle are looking at Young and Robertson with their picks, which would allow Serong, Stephens and Kemp to be available at our selection.

If Melbourne have committed to Pickett, it means that we could trade down with Port and be guaranteed one of Serong or Kemp (assuming they trade up to get Stephens), which would give us a bit of extra currency.

 

[The Grover]

I think TerryWallet summed it up perfectly in the pick 9 thread.

Most likely means Fremantle are looking at Young and Robertson with their picks, which would allow Serong, Stephens and Kemp to be available at our selection.

If Melbourne have committed to Pickett, it means that we could trade down with Port and be guaranteed one of Serong or Kemp (assuming they trade up to get Stephens), which would give us a bit of extra currency.

Be interesting if Sydney took Robertson.

 

[Eiffel 65]

Be interesting if Sydney took Robertson.

I reckon Freo would just take Flanders. Don't think that would change things much.

 

[Pafloyul]

If we're picking best available at 10 and based on our ranking the top 9 have gone, taking our 10th best at 10 probably isn't a great outcome.
Compared with say our 6th best still being there.
But the only ways that happens is if
a) our ranking is flawed
b) other club's rankings are flawed
c) there is a mismatch in rankings due to needs-biased selections

As you get further down the list the opportunity for ranking mismatches grows.

Or it could be that every other club that picked before us has rankings that are exactly the same as ours. I'd rather take our 10th ranked player than our 15, if it came to that.

 

[Bamboo Harvester]

It almost feels like the Cows pick at #6 could influence our trade options, if we choose that path.

If they select McAsey, that's been suggested, then it's likely Stephens will be there at our pick 9/10...assuming that Freo select Robertson and Ash/Young. We could then potentially broker a trade with Port if they are keen on picking up their home product. Hawks will select him at their pick before Port.

If Cows select Stephens to get him before Port, McAsey will likely be available at our pick...which the Cats would be licking their chops. Hawks have also been linked to McAsey according to Twomey, so Cats would be nervous.

So potentially we could have either pick 12 (Port) or pick 14 (Geel) with additional/future picks.

I'm thinking that there'll be clubs coming at us pretty aggressively on draft night...including GCS, who would be desperate for another top 10 pick.

 

[Aphrodite]

2019 NAB AFL Draft - Round 1

When: Wednesday, November 27, 7:00pm - 9:30pm
Where: Marvel Stadium, Melbourne
TV: Fox Footy (Channel 504) Live
Streaming: AFL Live Official App




2019 NAB AFL Draft - Round 2 onwards

When: Thursday, November 28, 7:00pm
Where: Marvel Stadium, Melbourne
TV: Fox Footy (Channel 504) Live
Streaming: AFL Live Official App

AFL Draft - AFL.com.au

The AFL Draft, first held in 1986, is the major list management tool for AFL clubs

www.afl.com.au

 

[HARKER]

Would just like to highlight that criticisms of the pure best available approach doesn't mean taking Polson ahead of Cripps because we need small forwards.

Take Polson every time.

Of course people aren't going to agree across the board and no one has said just go for needs at the expense of anything and everything.
I used to say just get the best player available and we'll work things out thereafter too, but I just don't think it's proved itself to be the only and best method to be applied at all times for the sake of list completion.

e.g. (I'll have to use names because it will easier to visualise)

We rated O'Brien at #10 in 2007. That's perfectly fine. (Use O'Brien, SPS, Fisher, Dow but given he was our last #10 used, lets try it.)
The player we have on our list is an O'Brien clone. There's a player a #15 on our list that's exactly what we'd love to have from the point of view of a need.

Let's just say that the sum of the ratings are -
a. #10=89 & #15=89 - We take the player we need right? Common sense.
b. #10=89 but #15=85 - Who do we take now?
c. #10=89 but #15=80 - ???
d. #10=89 but #15=75 - ????????

It's hard to express what those numbers may look like on the field but you get the idea.
The next point is that your #10 rated clone of O'Brien may have limited opportunity as for now we can't even guarantee O'Brien a game given the depth we have in that role.

I treat opportunity as a very important factor of types we should chase and another example why -
Macreadie looked terrific in his first year and started from day 1, but somehow we had many talls and then some more talls. Macreadie spends more time in our Northern Blues and he doesn't even look like the player we had in his first year. i.e. Play enough reserves football and you become a reserves player and this applies to our NB's more than for most other teams' reserves. It just does.

I understand people being dismissive of these points but I've seen them and continue to see them, therefore I have little choice but to factor them in.

For the 2019 draft and should we keep the pick we have -

I'd take Young even if we don't need him as much as others. I just think he's too good to not take.
I'd take Stephens too but O'Brien may start worrying about his position in our squad.
Kemp - The CFC love him, but I don't like the idea and don't care how good he may become. It's just feels wrong.
Serong - No problem.

 

[RoyalParade]

Matt Balmer on Twitter posted this
Thoughts?
The first round of Wednesday's #AFLDraft is beginning to firm up.

But Hawthorn's Pick 11 will shape the draft. Will they take classy SA mid Dylan Stephens? Or could it be Cody Weightman/Miles Bergman in their sights?

Latest mail suggests Brodie Kemp could get into the teens.

I'm thinking we will take best available at 9, then trade back in to pick up kemp later.

 

[HARKER]

Drafting for needs is an interesting concept. Imo "needs" does not just apply to positions on the ground.

I think this whole century we have been a pitiful club in terms of standards and committment to performance and all that entails "doing what needs to be done to help the team win".

I still think our "need" is all the genuine leaders and drivers and lifters we can get. Doc(26), Cripps(25), Weiters(21) and Walsh(19) are these players so far. Of the candidates around the Pick 9 mark this year, Robertson is the standout candidate with these qualities. Ash and Serong as well but a level down. Robertson from all accounts is a real leader in the Cripps mould. Brings his players with him. Has a bit of fun and really well liked but leads by example.

I think we have an incredibly talented young list put together over 4 years. I think, as a playing group, if they are driven and led the right way on the ground on matchday, on the track every session, in the gym, in the off season...then we can turn this club around from the "just turning up is good enough" attitude we've had in the past.

Another "real" leader is a "need" for me. We have the talent. Get the best talented leader. This group are gonna be together for 10 years hopefully.

That's my final push for the "get Robertson" campaign lol....if he's there at 9.

There are so many interesting views looking at things in slightly different ways. But we've got a competant team in SOS, Agresta and Brodie. So am looking forward to Wednesday without trepidation of what they'll do.

You're onto the Shane Rogers mantra - "We'll select the best players for Carlton"
One out of how many isn't bad, is it?

Great points Terry. Very insightful.

 

[GT619]

I'm thinking we will take best available at 9, then trade back in to pick up kemp later.

how we do that

 

[TerryWallet]

You're onto the Shane Rogers mantra - "We'll select the best players for Carlton"
One out of how many isn't bad, is it?

Great points Terry. Very insightful.

Good ol Shaneo might have had his mantra's right, but he just had terrible judgement both of his list and the players he was selecting.

Helping with selecting senior tried blokes suitable for rookieing up in the sun now isn't he. But all niggling aside, he picked Crippa as you mentioned, so nearly all is forgiven.....if not forgotten lol

 

[bigm386]

Why do Melbourne want Jackson? I am still so confused by this.....

 

[HARKER]

Good ol Shaneo might have had his mantra's right, but he just had terrible judgement both of his list and the players he was selecting.

Helping with selecting senior tried blokes suitable for rookieing up in the sun now isn't he. But all niggling aside, he picked Crippa as you mentioned, so nearly all is forgiven.....if not forgotten lol

Who really knows what happened as a matter of fact?

McKay wanting Temay.
Malthouse wanting outside speed and run - Boekhorst & DVR
Can't blame Rogers for Giles and Holman had promise but his mind was elsewhere.

I don't pine for those good old days of meddling and it's not as though..........hang on......

 

[Bamboo Harvester]

Good ol Shaneo might have had his mantra's right, but he just had terrible judgement both of his list and the players he was selecting.

Helping with selecting senior tried blokes suitable for rookieing up in the sun now isn't he. But all niggling aside, he picked Crippa as you mentioned, so nearly all is forgiven.....if not forgotten lol

Yep, who can forget back in 2009 when we were screaming for KPP's, he selected Kane Lucas ahead of Daniel Talia.

Just wrong on a number of levels

He did get us Crippa though, although the 2014 draft/trade - his last - was a complete disaster.

 

[windows1]

At 9? Best available from his rankings no matter what position that player plays

Strangely enough- someone last night said to me “why aren’t we talking about McAsey at all?”

Frankly he probably fits the needs AND best available criteria. Needs? What we are banking on Ben Silvagni to replace Jones?? Like McAsey is a TRUE key position. We have one under 29 next year.

Best available? I’d rather McAsey than Serong or Kemp. There’s hardly a question mark on him other than ‘may not be a champion’. Pretty hard to see him not locking down ChB somewhere for ten years.