Politics Climate Change Paradox (cont in part 2)

[Better Loosen Up]

I prefer to trust the mass of reputable science organisations for the argument.

That's nice. I prefer to trust scientists who are willing to openly provide the data that supports their research, not keep it hidden from anyone outside of their little circle jerk in case they get challenged, i.e. IPCC scientists.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Geez you must be deaf!

Or in denial.

Don't bother with him. He's an uneducated conspiracy theorist of the highest order. Doesn't like her message, uses the term handlers.. says enough about his inability to debate anything. Australian farmers for you.

 

[madmug]

Well that's what ad hom is, an attempt to smear. The fact that he's no longer around to defend himself against the countless others who have sought to dismiss his views in the same way just makes it worse in my view.

I quoted his experience with censorship within the IPCC. I quoted others too. You ignored all of the people I quoted and what they said and instead did a little google search on Seitz. Having found that he'd received a piddling amount of money from a tobacco company sometime in his lifetime on behalf of an institution he was working for at the time you thought gotcha, I don't have to engage with his damning comments all I need to do is poison the well. Straight into ad hom, as I knew you would.

Rather than assassinating characters I'm happy to debate the wider issue with you. Pick a topic.

Climate change.

But are you qualified?

 

[Chief]

She has no message.

And yet:

She's peddling fear with absolutely no contribution to the answer.

We're all f***ed in 8.5 yrs.

So say her handlers.

Misogyny, male rage and the words men use to describe Greta Thunberg

Greta Thunberg’s critics say the climate activist is unstable, hysterical and mentally ill. That’s because she challenges the view that the world is theirs to conquer.

theconversation.com

Which is your choice from the usual ragey grab-bag?

* Mentally ill?
* Young?
* Misbehaving?
* Weird?
* Emotional?
* Manipulated? *BING BING BING*

At a deep level, the language of climate denialism is tied up with a form of masculine identity predicated on modern industrial capitalism – specifically, the Promethean idea of the conquest of nature by man, in a world especially made for men.

By attacking industrial capitalism, and its ethos of politics as usual, Thunberg is not only attacking the core beliefs and world view of certain sorts of men, but also their sense of masculine self-worth. Male rage is their knee-jerk response.

 

[madmug]

And yet:

Misogyny, male rage and the words men use to describe Greta Thunberg

Greta Thunberg’s critics say the climate activist is unstable, hysterical and mentally ill. That’s because she challenges the view that the world is theirs to conquer.

theconversation.com

Which is your choice from the usual ragey grab-bag?

* Mentally ill?
* Young?
* Misbehaving?
* Weird?
* Emotional?
* Manipulated?

What that guy said!

 

[TimmeT]

And yet:

Misogyny, male rage and the words men use to describe Greta Thunberg

Greta Thunberg’s critics say the climate activist is unstable, hysterical and mentally ill. That’s because she challenges the view that the world is theirs to conquer.

theconversation.com

Which is your choice from the usual ragey grab-bag?

* Mentally ill?
* Young?
* Misbehaving?
* Weird?
* Emotional?
* Manipulated?

Nice words from a feminist extremist. Funny how there wasn't this same staunch defence and same sort of criticism directed towards those attacking the Covington dude for example by the very same people defending greata thunberg

 

[Taylor]

Nice words from a feminist extremist. Funny how there wasn't this same staunch defence and same sort of criticism directed towards those attacking the Covington dude for example by the very same people defending greata thunberg

It's actually worse than that. That Covington kid just stood there while someone delivered a message at him and they got torn to bits for it.
This kid is wheeled out and championed because she gets attention for the right message.

There are a series of approved narratives:
The rich will destroy the planet unless we allow more government control of everything to regulate them
Racist white people supporting Trump mass shooting
Islamic terrorist violence

If it doesn't fit into one of those it will quickly disappear. You can even have two happen at the same time and the one that fits the narrative will be discussed while the other is left to fade into the background Ohio noise.

 

[Sainteric]

So we just ignore the vast majority of scientific consensus, & do nothing.

Just like the original smoking debate & argument by vested interests.

That's the greens platform, you shouldn't steal it?

 

[madmug]

Nice words from a feminist extremist. Funny how there wasn't this same staunch defence and same sort of criticism directed towards those attacking the Covington dude for example by the very same people defending greata thunberg

You miss again. Its about defending the message. Defending science. Defending the facts.

And pointing out the Sociological reasons & psychological explanation for the testosterone filled attacks on the messengers, from clearly small male appendage type individuals.

 

[its free real estate]

Do you really want people to read this post?

You still have time to delete it.

He’s right. Consensus is neither sufficient for necessary for science to be correct.

 

[madmug]

That's the greens platform, you shouldn't steal it?

The Greens have scientific, facts based policy on those matters?

Geez, I didn't know that.

 

[madmug]

He’s right. Consensus is neither sufficient for necessary for science to be correct.

The data is the data. The analysis is the analysis. Peer reviewed is----.

Good job Galileo. I know which side of this 'debate' he'd be on.

 

[Craven Morehead]

Don't bother with him. He's an uneducated conspiracy theorist of the highest order. Doesn't like her message, uses the term handlers.. says enough about his inability to debate anything. Australian farmers for you.

And here's you saying that you have me on ignore.

Go on, tell me why the Wide bay Burnett shouldn't have been developed for farming.

Go on son, you have so much to say with nothing to say at the same time.

Here's your big chance to actually say something.

And yet:

Misogyny, male rage and the words men use to describe Greta Thunberg

Greta Thunberg’s critics say the climate activist is unstable, hysterical and mentally ill. That’s because she challenges the view that the world is theirs to conquer.

theconversation.com

Which is your choice from the usual ragey grab-bag?

* Mentally ill?
* Young?
* Misbehaving?
* Weird?
* Emotional?
* Manipulated? *BING BING BING*

Far be it for me to put labels on someone when I am in the midst of an expert.

Label away Chief.

btw...just how comfortable would you be in placing your own child in Greta's position?

Rhetorical question...you'd do it in a heartbeat.

 

[Chief]

And here's you saying that you have me on ignore.

Go on, tell me why the Wide bay Burnett shouldn't have been developed for farming.

Go on son, you have so much to say with nothing to say at the same time.

Here's your big chance to actually say something.


Far be it for me to put labels on someone when I am in the midst of an expert.

Label away Chief.

btw...just how comfortable would you be in placing your own child in Greta's position?

Rhetorical question...you'd do it in a heartbeat.

From what I’ve read she’s done it with her parents being reluctant to let her.

it would scare me silly but if one of my kids took the initiative and created a protest movement then I’d be there with them.

But I’ve dealt with trolls and nasty types on the net for 20 years.

 

[Craven Morehead]

From what I’ve read she’s done it with her parents being reluctant to let her.

it would scare me silly but if one of my kids took the initiative and created a protest movement then I’d be there with them.

But I’ve dealt with trolls and nasty types on the net for 20 years.

The funny thing is that you actually believe that she composed the diatribe you posted earlier.

The equally funny thing is that you believe that her parents aren't right behind her.

For an apparently smart guy, you really are being sucked in by this bullshit.

 

[Goosecat]

As far as this young 16 year old is concerned I don't have any issue with her promulgating her point of view.
The problems come from adults with agendas both in and out of the media positioning a 16 year old child and her views as being fully formed and informed.
What 16 year old teenager doesn't think the world needs changing whilst simultaneously thinking they already know it all?
The reality is this 16 year old child knows roughly as much regarding the worlds systems as you did when you where 16.

 

[madmug]

As far as this young 16 year old is concerned I don't have any issue with her promulgating her point of view.
The problems come from adults with agendas both in and out of the media positioning a 16 year old child and her views as being fully formed and informed.
What 16 year old teenager doesn't think the world needs changing whilst simultaneously thinking they already know it all?
The reality is this 16 year old child knows roughly as much regarding the worlds systems as you did when you where 16.

You are generalising oh so much.

I've met some very smart & aware young people. Easy to see that, all things being equal, they should have a bright future in front of them.

Also met some very 'thick' adults. The sort that would have failed shoe tying in Kindy. I've worked with some of those types. I often wondered how they even got a job, let alone a promotion. They're the sort who jump easily to conclusions & really have a poor ability understand of how to analyse facts & situations.

 

[its free real estate]

The data is the data. The analysis is the analysis. Peer reviewed is----.

Good job Galileo. I know which side of this 'debate' he'd be on.

Peer reviewed means nothing. Simply exists as a sanity check. Does not validate the science.

 

[madmug]

Peer reviewed means nothing. Simply exists as a sanity check. Does not validate the science.

Taking note of the rigour of the science is a sounder option than reading RWNJ websites & listening to RW shock jocks.

 

[its free real estate]

Taking note of the rigour of the science is a sounder option than reading RWNJ websites & listening to RW shock jocks.

The rigour of science is demonstrated through experiment and parsimony. The majority of people who say they believe the science have zero scientific training. No science is as certain as climate change activists assert it is.

 

[Number37]

Peer reviewed means nothing. Simply exists as a sanity check. Does not validate the science.

Aren't you the genius that tried to use a poor citation index as proof of a lack of credibility?
Yes, you are.

 

[its free real estate]

Aren't you the genius that tried to use a poor citation index as proof of a lack of credibility?
Yes, you are.

And?

 

[Craven Morehead]

Jesus Christ.

This is like when creationists demand to see evolution happening.

Nothing anyone says will change your mind.

No it's not.

Your teenage demi-god made a very clear statement to the UN.

I'm asking where it is happening now and how it is a symptom of current climate change?

Surely you have an answer to that since a 16 yr old kid made an unequivocal statement at a global forum?

 

[Chief]

No it's not.

Your teenage demi-god made a very clear statement to the UN.

I'm asking where it is happening now and how it is a symptom of current climate change?

Surely you have an answer to that since a 16 yr old kid made an unequivocal statement at a global forum?

What are you talking about “Demi god”?

I mean seriously. If I don’t buy into the angry guy list of irrelevant objections to an activist I am emotionally fixated on them?

I can see at least one guy who is responding emotionally. It ain’t me.

Have a look at the reef and the effects of changing temperature, and pollution.

Land clearing and development have brought koalas to the brink of functional extinction in the wild.


“
We identified ecosystems across Australia that have recently experienced catastrophic changes, including:

• kelp forests shifting to seaweed turfs following a single marine heatwave in 2011;
• the destruction of Gondwanan refugia by wildfire ignited by lightning storms in 2016;
• dieback of floodplain forests along the Murray River following the millennial drought in 2001–2009;
• large-scale conversion of alpine forest to shrubland due to repeated fires from 2003–2014;
• community-level boom and bust in the arid zone following extreme rainfall in 2011–2012, and
• mangrove dieback across a 1,000km stretch of the Gulf of Carpentaria after a weak monsoon in 2015-2016.

Of these six case studies, only the Murray River forest had previously experienced substantial human disturbance.”

Ecosystems across Australia are collapsing under climate change

Australia has seen an unprecedented number of widespread, catastrophic transformations in response to extreme weather events.

theconversation.com

 

[Chief]

It helps your credibility if you make argument with a suggested solution, especially when you start off whinging about a problem you expect others (ie. right wingers) to actually, scientifically resolve with that old chestnut, "hard work".

Right wingers have been specifically burdened with the job of solving issues of environmental damage?