Cricket Thread

[Black Diamond]

He gets smashed, dosn't take any wickets and is shown to be the fraud we all know he is.
When has he taken the wicket of a batsmen who wasn't trying to score runs? answer never. If a batsmen is there trying to bat out time then Lyon has no chance of taking a wicket. He failed miserably in Adelaide and and Hobart. And not even Warney could take wickets in India so I really don't give him a hope of keeping his spot for England.

If Warne wasn't good enough to take wickets in India then why is Lyon a fraud if he also doesn't take wickets i.e. does just as well?

We do have 3 vics in the team and Wade's keeping is horrific. He needs to improve.

Finally, a Victorian who has taken the blinkers off. Wade's batting is not good enough to have him miss an opportunity every test.

BTW against Sri Lanka Lyon took a series total of 7 wickets at 43.9 and a strike rate of 84.5. If Wade takes two of the three regulation catches/stumpings he missed those figures become 9 wickets at 34.1 and a strike rate of 65.8.

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

If Warne wasn't good enough to take wickets in India then why is Lyon a fraud if he also doesn't take wickets i.e. does just as well?

Do I really need to answer this?

Shane Warne bowled us to victory on countless occaisions.

Nathan Lyon is yet to do it once and has failed miserably on what should have been spin friendly day 5 pitches in Adelaide and Hobart. IMO he is just wasting a spot that a strike bowler with the ability to win us a game could take.

 

[Black Diamond]

Do I really need to answer this?

Shane Warne bowled us to victory on countless occaisions.

Of course you have to answer it. If Warne, the greatest spinner we have ever produced, was ordinary in India then Lyon can hardly be labelled a fraud if he also doesn't produce in India. That is what you said after all.

Nathan Lyon is yet to do it once and has failed miserably on what should have been spin friendly day 5 pitches in Adelaide and Hobart. IMO he is just wasting a spot that a strike bowler with the ability to win us a game could take.

You didn't address Wade spilling sitters from Lyon's bowling. A wicket keeping doing their job would have greatly improved Lyon's series against Sri Lanka. I'm not sold on Lyon as such; he certainly could do better but some of the criticisms of him are rubbish. I wouldn't mind playing four quicks in the Ashes - Pattinson, Siddle, Bird and Starc, leaving Lyon out.

 

[KiwiRoo]

Was Higgs wearing a helmet? I can vaguely recall the incident and thinking at the time that the umpires have lost the plot (again) in their favouritism for the home team.

Cairns was medium pace at best and couldn't have intimidated a club cricketer.

Speaking of ''Garry'', I have to laugh when he's racing through his overs when he's the one who is supposed to be spinning out the opposition.

Yeah he had a helmet on..he needed one ! he only took a bat out for decoration

Cairns was a handy bowler..but probably only a touch quicker than Hussey..thats what made it ridiculous. I can understand the intimidation rule when tailenders didnt wear helmets. You only have to see the footage of Ewan Chatfield getting sconned by the poms and literally dying on the pitch before getting revived to understand why

 

[KiwiRoo]

Hughes has made something like 1300 runs in close to 40 innings in test cricket, highly inflated by your (fairly) indicated recent good form.

He was good in the last couple of games but I don't feel thats a reflection of just how good he is, he destroys games when he's playing state cricket but as an international player I feel he is slightly lacking, prone to stage fright and brain explosions.

The Watson comparison is a fair one, but as pointed out Watson is less one dimensional than Hughes, he can also bowl and field rather well, whereas Hughes can ummm... chuck the keepers gloves on if Wade/Haddin/Paine break their hands.

Are his recent innings an indication of his development as a player? I hope so, I'm happy to be proven wrong, but when Hughes fails he fails spectacularly.

It's fine to chuck up his first class stats, but when the majority of his good innings have come at state level I don't think it tells the whole story.

Your point re the brain explosions is a good one. On the other hand he has scored 2 test centuries against the South Africans so he does have talent. Will he take the Steve Waugh route and tighten his game and become a good player or will he keep getting out caught at slip or in the gully.Time will tell

 

[Mr Reliable]

He gets smashed, dosn't take any wickets and is shown to be the fraud we all know he is.
When has he taken the wicket of a batsmen who wasn't trying to score runs? answer never. If a batsmen is there trying to bat out time then Lyon has no chance of taking a wicket. He failed miserably in Adelaide and and Hobart. And not even Warney could take wickets in India so I really don't give him a hope of keeping his spot for England.

I would go with 4 quicks + Clarke (best spinner in the country), Warner (Leggie) and either Hussey or Maxwell as the offie if they are selected over Doolan.

No argument from me re Lyon.

What's behind your nomination of Holland for the Ashes?

 

[SpiderBurton22]

He gets smashed, dosn't take any wickets and is shown to be the fraud we all know he is.
When has he taken the wicket of a batsmen who wasn't trying to score runs? answer never. If a batsmen is there trying to bat out time then Lyon has no chance of taking a wicket. He failed miserably in Adelaide and and Hobart. And not even Warney could take wickets in India so I really don't give him a hope of keeping his spot for England.

I would go with 4 quicks + Clarke (best spinner in the country), Warner (Leggie) and either Hussey or Maxwell as the offie if they are selected over Doolan.

There is no chance of this happening. You cannot go into games in India with part time spinners.

While these blokes might look O.K in short spells they will get found out bigtime if they have to bowl 40 overs in an innings.

India and England both opened with spinners in their recent test series so Lyon is a lock, he probably be partnered by Maxwell or even Doherty might get another run.

 

[DarkPhoenix]

Your point re the brain explosions is a good one. On the other hand he has scored 2 test centuries against the South Africans so he does have talent. Will he take the Steve Waugh route and tighten his game and become a good player or will he keep getting out caught at slip or in the gully.Time will tell

Yeah they were in '09 though.

When he bats on he seems to make 70-80, but theres far too many 10s and 20s between those scores for more liking.

Tim Paine for me as the next keeper behind Wade as well. Wouldn't have been dropped if it hadn't have been for his broken finger.

Would add Doherty to the full squad as well to give us a spinner that can actually turn it and take wickets on his own work rather than a batsman holing out trying to score.

 

[year of the roo]

If Warne wasn't good enough to take wickets in India then why is Lyon a fraud if he also doesn't take wickets i.e. does just as well?



Finally, a Victorian who has taken the blinkers off. Wade's batting is not good enough to have him miss an opportunity every test.

BTW against Sri Lanka Lyon took a series total of 7 wickets at 43.9 and a strike rate of 84.5. If Wade takes two of the three regulation catches/stumpings he missed those figures become 9 wickets at 34.1 and a strike rate of 65.8.

Can we just establish the fact that Wade is not Victorian before accusing people of bias? Great, thanks.

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

There is no chance of this happening. You cannot go into games in India with part time spinners.

While these blokes might look O.K in short spells they will get found out bigtime if they have to bowl 40 overs in an innings.

India and England both opened with spinners in their recent test series so Lyon is a lock, he probably be partnered by Maxwell or even Doherty might get another run.

IMO Lyon is the equivillent of a part time spinner. I don't think he is any more likely to get the Indian top order out than Maxwell, Clarke or Warner. I have no issue at all with trialing Maxwell or O'keefe or Doherty.

The only time we have beaten India in India in my lifetime was when we played to our strengths and didn't bother with spin.

Of course you have to answer it. If Warne, the greatest spinner we have ever produced, was ordinary in India then Lyon can hardly be labelled a fraud if he also doesn't produce in India. That is what you said after all.


You didn't address Wade spilling sitters from Lyon's bowling. A wicket keeping doing their job would have greatly improved Lyon's series against Sri Lanka. I'm not sold on Lyon as such; he certainly could do better but some of the criticisms of him are rubbish. I wouldn't mind playing four quicks in the Ashes - Pattinson, Siddle, Bird and Starc, leaving Lyon out.

No I didn't... if you read what I said I called him a fraud on the basis of his inability to bowl teams out in spin friendly conditions, not only that, but as you yourself put it, he rushes through his overs when he is the one supposed to be bowling us to victory. IMO that is just pure unadulterated fraudulence.

I'm all for taking him to India where ideally, he gets exposed and is not in England taking the spot of a bowler who could win us a test match something this guy is yet to do....The only time he has bowled well on the last day of a test was in the West Indies, where he took 3 wickets on the last day. Michael Clarke, a FAR superior bowler IMO took 5 in the same conditions.

He is a fraud based on his Australian performances. Not becuase of what he may or may not produce in India. He either starts taking wickets in the 2nd innings of matches or he is done. Afterall that is his job.

As for Wade's keeping, I have mentioned in other posts that he needs to lift. But don't forget some of the truly horrible performances behind the pegs by Haddin, who makes Wade look like Darren Berry most of the time.

No argument from me re Lyon.

What's behind your nomination of Holland for the Ashes?

I reckon we may have already seen him this summer if it weren't for the shoulder issue. I see him as a really decent option long term. He is a lefty as well which makes sense as he is taking it away from right handers.

 

[KiwiRoo]

Calling Lyon a fraud is a bit strong. He's gone ok. If all the chances he created got taken (as has been mentioned before), then he would have probably bowled Aust to victory in Adelaide. Plus he's provided good support in other tests
I dont think hes a real match winning spinner, but hes the best avaliable in Aussie right now, so needs to play. You need to play a spinner in most conditions, especially India .What happens if one of your pacemen breakdown (likely occurance judging by whats happened so far this year). Bowl Warner & Clarke ?
Clarke has a dodgy back so cant expect a big workload out of him and Warner bowls pies .

He might go ok in India too. Spinners who bowl faster have done ok in India

 

[DarkPhoenix]

Wade is Tasmanian, people need to stop taking what the idiot commentators say as fact.

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

Calling Lyon a fraud is a bit strong. He's gone ok. If all the chances he created got taken (as has been mentioned before), then he would have probably bowled Aust to victory in Adelaide. Plus he's provided good support in other tests
I dont think hes a real match winning spinner, but hes the best avaliable in Aussie right now, so needs to play. You need to play a spinner in most conditions, especially India .What happens if one of your pacemen breakdown (likely occurance judging by whats happened so far this year). Bowl Warner & Clarke ?
Clarke has a dodgy back so cant expect a big workload out of him and Warner bowls pies .

He might go ok in India too. Spinners who bowl faster have done ok in India

Lyon wouldn't have bowled us to victory in Adelaide or Hobart on the back of 3 extra wickets, that is insane... he was trying to rush through his overs so the real bowlers could take the wickets.

The whole concept of "needing" a spinner is absurd. The great West Indian teams didn't bother with a spinner. How many series did Viv Richards lose without having a spinner in his team? The answer to that is ZERO. He never lost a series as a captain.

We currently do not have a spinner who is good enough to make the team. We are playing one on the basis that traditionally we have played one, which imo is not playing to our strengths.

We have the best stable of fast bowlers in our history. Lets bloody well use them.


Cummins @ 16
Bird @ 16
Pattinson @ 23 & 38 with the bat.
Harris @ 23
Starc @ 29 & 31 with the bat.
Siddle @ 28
Johnson @ 30 & 23 with the bat
Hazelwood
Richardson
Cutting
Hilfenhaus

Why we are bothering with a pox off spinner without a doosra astonishes me.

 

[KiwiRoo]

Well when you have 4 fast men the quality of Marshall, Holding, Garner, Roberts & Croft etc (bowling on decidely juicier pitches than todays) then you dont play a spinner

But you dont, therefore u play a spinner

and as for the best stable of fast bowlers in your history ?..oh please...potentially maybe.......a big maybe
Half that list you gave me have been on the long term injury list and of the others Johnson is either hot or cold, Siddle is a very good bowler, but not World class, Starc has potential, Hilfenhaus couldnt buy a wicket his last few tests. Bird has played a couple of tests against a weakened and past it Sri Lankan side
The same bowlers also got absolutely carted around Perth

If they cut the poms a new one , I'll change my opinion, but untill then "the best stable of fast bowlers" is hot air from a few ex cricketrs talking up the Aussies ahead of an ashes series...nothing new there

and you're bothering with a pox off spinner because your spinning stocks are very average and hes the best available.
But you still need that option to give your fast bowlers a rest, provide variety and be able to use last day conditions
If a side cant get another side out with 3 quicks..4 isn't going to do the job..

 

[SpiderBurton22]

Lyon wouldn't have bowled us to victory in Adelaide or Hobart on the back of 3 extra wickets, that is insane... he was trying to rush through his overs so the real bowlers could take the wickets.

The whole concept of "needing" a spinner is absurd. The great West Indian teams didn't bother with a spinner. How many series did Viv Richards lose without having a spinner in his team? The answer to that is ZERO. He never lost a series as a captain.

We currently do not have a spinner who is good enough to make the team. We are playing one on the basis that traditionally we have played one, which imo is not playing to our strengths.

We have the best stable of fast bowlers in our history. Lets bloody well use them.




Cummins @ 16
Bird @ 16
Pattinson @ 23 & 38 with the bat.
Harris @ 23
Starc @ 29 & 31 with the bat.
Siddle @ 28
Johnson @ 30 & 23 with the bat
Hazelwood
Richardson
Cutting
Hilfenhaus

Why we are bothering with a pox off spinner without a doosra astonishes me.

You have no idea about cricket if you're comparing these bowlers to the great West Indies era.

None of these bowlers would have got a game for the Windies based on their current output.

Lyon is the best of an average bunch of spinners we've got in this country and he will take wickets in India because the conditions are so different there.

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

Well when you have 4 fast men the quality of Marshall, Holding, Garner, Roberts & Croft etc (bowling on decidely juicier pitches than todays) then you dont play a spinner

But you dont, therefore u play a spinner

and as for the best stable of fast bowlers in your history ?..oh please...potentially maybe.......a big maybe
Half that list you gave me have been on the long term injury list and of the others Johnson is either hot or cold, Siddle is a very good bowler, but not World class, Starc has potential, Hilfenhaus couldnt buy a wicket his last few tests. Bird has played a couple of tests against a weakened and past it Sri Lankan side
The same bowlers also got absolutely carted around Perth

If they cut the poms a new one , I'll change my opinion, but untill then "the best stable of fast bowlers" is hot air from a few ex cricketrs talking up the Aussies ahead of an ashes series...nothing new there

and you're bothering with a pox off spinner because your spinning stocks are very average and hes the best available.
But you still need that option to give your fast bowlers a rest, provide variety and be able to use last day conditions. If a side cant get another side out with 3 quicks..4 isn't going to do the job..

Exactly... thanks for agreeing with me.

What has a few ex cricketers got to do with my opinion? I'm not writing on their behalf. I've written the team i'd play, not sure why you are bringing up the depth players in Hilfy,Johnson & IMO Siddle... who aren't world class performers. The ones who I ave mentioned are clearly tracking as WORLD CLASS matchwinners.

I'll repeat, Lyon's job is to bowl us to victory on wearing pitches, something he has proven he isn't capable of doing. Our best/only chance IMO at winning the ashes is to go with 5 quicks + Clarke/Warner/D Hussey/Maxwell as the spinning/variety options.

For the record, the Sri Lankan batting line up had 3 blokes who average 48+. It wasn't as if it was bangladesh. And they wouldn't have been battered and brusied if it were not for the quicks.

Did you miss their bowling averages? I'll just repeat it so you get the picture:

Cummins 16
Bird 16
Pattinson 22
Starc 28
Siddle/Johnson @ 28/30

With an average age of what, 23?

You chuck in the depth of: Harris, Richardson, Hazelwood, Hilfenhaus and Cutting. And you get the best stable of fast bowlers we've ever had IMO.

PS: When we get to England on juicier wickets, my fire and brimstone team of 4 quicks all capable of bowling at 140+ for extended periods of time + Big Bird Phillander jagging them all over the place, Nathan Lyon's nude nuts will be a distant memory. And from next season on, our pitches will be greener and juicier to ensure we are basically impossible to beat with our pace attack from Heaven.

You have no idea about cricket if you're comparing these bowlers to the great West Indies era.

None of these bowlers would have got a game for the Windies based on their current output.

Lyon is the best of an average bunch of spinners we've got in this country and he will take wickets in India because the conditions are so different there.

I have no idea about cricket... um not quite sir. Who would you compare them to?

Pattinson is 21, Averages 22 with the ball and 38 with the bat.
Cummins is 19, averages 16 with the ball and has 1 MOM from 1 game.
Bird is 26, averages 16 with the ball and has 1 MOM in 2 games.
Starc is 21, averages 28 with the ball and 30 with the bat.

Malcolm Marshall averaged 89 in his first 3 test series. 29 in his second and 25 in his 3rd series.
Michael Holding averaged 61 after 5 tests.
Andy Roberts averaged 41.33 after his first test series
Joel Garner averaged 27 in his first series.


And only Cummins has played in South Africa where the conditions help the bowlers.

The rest have been battling it out on Australian Highways against very good batting opposition.

I am comparing them to the best becuase they are potentially going to be as good. The starts to their careers have been equally if not more impressive than any of the blokes from the carribbean. This in undeniable.

The great West Indians played against poor opposition... No South Africa. An ordinary world series ravaged Australia, England & India. Pakistan hadn't yet become a force and Sri Lanka weren't even a test playing nation and as said previously they played on FAR juicier wickets.

This all needs to be taken into consideration before you start shooting off half cocked.

 

[DarkPhoenix]

I think the main argument here is the definition of 'best'.

Theres a difference between BEST and DEEPEST pace attack for instance.

We have a lot of decent quicks (depth), but I'd say in the past we've had a better 'when all fit' pace attack.

 

[TennisPlayerAndy]

My ideal line-up

Siddle
Pattinson
Bird
Starc/Johnson.

Cummins next in line. Not sure Hilfenhaus will see a lot of test action in the future.

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

I think the main argument here is the definition of 'best'.

Theres a difference between BEST and DEEPEST pace attack for instance.

We have a lot of decent quicks (depth), but I'd say in the past we've had a better 'when all fit' pace attack.

Good point. 100% the deepest.

At this stage, Mcgrath, Gillespie, Fleming, Lee, Kasperwisz etc was obviously better. Davison, Lindwall, Miller was reasonable too. Lillee, Thompson, Hogg, Tangles, Pascoe, Alderman, Massie was obviously brilliant too.

I have watched a lot of cricket and the current group of youngsters is the best I've seen come through together. They need a bit of continuity and luck with injury, but by playing 5 in the one team, you can afford one to break down without it affecting your ability to win the match. Given you have Watson and a few part timers who can roll the arm over if required.

 

[Roo-Boy]

Melbourne Renagades 2013 BBL Premiers and Muttiah Muralitharan will be the Norm Smith medalist.

 

[SpiderBurton22]

I have no idea about cricket... um not quite sir. Who would you compare them to?

Pattinson is 21, Averages 22 with the ball and 38 with the bat.
Cummins is 19, averages 16 with the ball and has 1 MOM from 1 game.
Bird is 26, averages 16 with the ball and has 1 MOM in 2 games.
Starc is 21, averages 28 with the ball and 30 with the bat.

Malcolm Marshall averaged 89 in his first 3 test series. 29 in his second and 25 in his 3rd series.
Michael Holding averaged 61 after 5 tests.
Andy Roberts averaged 41.33 after his first test series
Joel Garner averaged 27 in his first series.


And only Cummins has played in South Africa where the conditions help the bowlers.

The rest have been battling it out on Australian Highways against very good batting opposition.

I am comparing them to the best becuase they are potentially going to be as good. The starts to their careers have been equally if not more impressive than any of the blokes from the carribbean. This in undeniable.

The great West Indians played against poor opposition... No South Africa. An ordinary world series ravaged Australia, England & India. Pakistan hadn't yet become a force and Sri Lanka weren't even a test playing nation and as said previously they played on FAR juicier wickets.

This all needs to be taken into consideration before you start shooting off half cocked.

Ha, I'm the one shooting half cocked. You are the one comparing some of the all time greats to a bunch of blokes that are lucky to have played 10 tests between them.

While these blokes have great potential, the West Indies they are not. Add the fact they can't as a unit get on the park together due to injury.

Fast forward 2 years and all these blokes are injury free and knocking over teams then maybe, just maybe we will see a 4 pronged pace attack in most Tests. So suck it up and get used to fact the Aussie team will more than likely contain Nathan Lyon.

 

[KiwiRoo]

you're enthusiastic Arjen I'll give you that !

But you need more extended careers before you can even start to compare

Pattinson is 21, Averages 22 with the ball and 38 with the bat. Injured
Cummins is 19, averages 16 with the ball and has 1 MOM from 1 game. Injured. Who knows, he may never play test cricket again.
Bird is 26, averages 16 with the ball and has 1 MOM in 2 games. He played a pretty weak Sri lankan side. hells bells the kiwis beat them at home just recently, when Sri Lanka were at full strength.Not the injury ravaged side Bird played. He looks a good bowler, but would like a look at him bowling against good opposition first
Starc is 21, averages 28 with the ball and 30 with the bat. Lots of potential. But SA smashed him at times

Malcolm Marshall averaged 89 in his first 3 test series. 29 in his second and 25 in his 3rd series. 374 wickets at 20.94
Michael Holding averaged 61 after 5 tests. 249 wickets at 23.68
Andy Roberts averaged 41.33 after his first test series 202 wickets at 25.61
Joel Garner averaged 27 in his first series 259 wickets at 20.98

and you say the West Indians played weakened opposition. I'd say the windies weakened the oposition. They still played a number of series against full strength English & Aussie sides and demolished them. From 1976 to 1990's they were so superior to all sides. Dont cheapen their achievements

yes you have a number of good quality young quick bowlers. But anything can happen. Ian Bishop was the quickest bowler in the world, but stuffed his back, Shane Bond stuffed his back,Bruce Reid..the list goes on.
Your young quicks havent achieved anything yet

The proof will be in the ashes pudding

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

you're enthusiastic Arjen I'll give you that !

But you need more extended careers before you can even start to compare

Absolutely. But you can't on one hand bag the young aussies for the opposition they have played against so far and on the other hand rap the West Indians for beating up on crap teams. Australia was an absolute shambles during the 80's torn apart by rebel tours and WSC. Losing to everyone including NZ at home LOL. The grounds were bigger, the outfield slower, Pitches weren't prepared the same and the bats were like twigs.

All this must be taken into consideration before you label the efforts of our young superstars as anything but awesome. We were beating South Africa until Pattinson got injured and that was without Cummins playing a part in the series.

I'm very confident of beating anyone if we pick the right team.

Patrick Cummins may not play again??????????

Can you imagine Bigfooty if our first round selection had 40 touches and kicked 4 in his first game and had an injury during the NAB cup (which we went on to win) and didn't play for 6 months.....

I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be sitting here telling me he wasn't going to play again.

That entire notion is absurd.

He is 19 FFS and a superstar already. He might average 10 with the ball if get to play NZ in NZ anytime soon.

 

[Zondor]

......BTW against Sri Lanka Lyon took a series total of 7 wickets at 43.9 and a strike rate of 84.5. If Wade takes two of the three regulation catches/stumpings he missed those figures become 9 wickets at 34.1 and a strike rate of 65.8.

If Dean Laidleys had played Leigh Brown in a ruck/forward roaming role like Mick Malthouse did when Leighroy played at the Pies then Browny would have been an out and out star at the NMFC. :stern look

 

[KiwiRoo]

Absolutely. But you can't on one hand bag the young aussies for the opposition they have played against so far and on the other hand rap the West Indians for beating up on crap teams. Australia was an absolute shambles during the 80's torn apart by rebel tours and WSC. Losing to everyone including NZ at home LOL. The grounds were bigger, the outfield slower, Pitches weren't prepared the same and the bats were like twigs.

All this must be taken into consideration before you label the efforts of our young superstars as anything but awesome. We were beating South Africa until Pattinson got injured and that was without Cummins playing a part in the series.

I'm very confident of beating anyone if we pick the right team.

Patrick Cummins may not play again??????????

Can you imagine Bigfooty if our first round selection had 40 touches and kicked 4 in his first game and had an injury during the NAB cup (which we went on to win) and didn't play for 6 months.....

I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be sitting here telling me he wasn't going to play again.

That entire notion is absurd.

He is 19 FFS and a superstar already. He might average 10 with the ball if get to play NZ in NZ anytime soon.

Arjen..the Windies were a dominant side for near on 20 years..saying they beat up on crap teams is a bit over the top. They made sides look crap. The windies also lost players to rebel tours too and didnt they also play in WSC ?. Yes the bats were different and the grounds different, but the ball wasnt, and it was getting to the other end at a rapid rate of knots.
Not their fault Aussie werent a strong side

and you're calling your young bowlers superstars already ..based on what ? Beating up on Sri lanka when their best bat didnt play on after breaking his hand ?.A great debut from a young quick a year ago ?. Hes played one test for gods sake
Let them develop and earn their stripes before you go over the top

Beating South Africa ? Michael Clarke & Hussey were beating South Africa, not your bowlers. First 2 tests your top order failed and got bailed out.

and its a possibility Cummins may not play again..He's had 2 pretty major injury setbacks. Go back and have a look over history how many young quicks have had injury setbacks and not played again or not reached the same level. And if you want to use football analogies, how many players have had a promising start, then injury and then never reached the heights again.
Lots !

And i hope he does tour NZ.I'd like to see him bowl . But i also remember Shane Bond who was a brilliant bowler, but stuffed his back. they wrapped it in wire (literally), but he couldnt make it back. It happens