Crows Players 'Fear for Future'

[Crow Envy]

Re: Troubled Times

The problem with this rebuild is to date we have gained very little. We have let go our no 1 ruckmen, no 1 Forward, a Top 10 draft pick, a 1st rd draft pick and a good "wingman" for some ordinary draft picks and 2 unproven footballers, although I think Symes will be good . Not to mention weve decided to do it in an ordinary draft.

 

[Stiffy_18]

I don't disagree with what you've said there Stiffy because as theoretical principles they're fine.

However, at this stage we don't know whether Craig is guilty of poor man management or not.

WW is right when he says it was time for a shake-up and re-build irrespective of feeling, sentiments etc and I think you do agree with that. You can't always do that nicely.

Craig had empowered the players too much and there was no reward for it. Neither will there be if Craig goes down the path of Adolph Ayres with a dictatorship.

Criag has to regain control of the group, but on an inclusive basis.

Rather than go off half cocked about what had to be done, let's wait with interest and see if Craig can get the balance right during the new pre-season and coming season.

Now THAT is the key here! This PS will be more interesting that any prior IMHO because it will tell us a lot about whether or not Craig has control and trust of the group.

You can have a list of battlers but if they have trust and want to play for their coach, they will achieve results. OTOH, you can have a list of superstars but if they do not have trust in their coach and don't want to play for him, you have a bottom 4 team.

I think the difference between 2004 and 2005 pretty much prove this. With the same list in 2004 we were shithouse but in 2005 you win 17 games and minor premiership and you could see the contrast in group harmony one year compared to the other.

Craig needs to get the group on his side and the only way he can do that is by being innovative and as fair as possible in his dealings with players.

 

[Mismatched]

Re: Troubled Times

Including...

Bassett
Biglands
Burton
Edwards
Goodwin
McLeod

Its hard to see any of these players playing in 2009 if the past month is anything to go by.

I think Mcleod, Goodwin and Edwards are most likely to survive out of that group, even purely just from a leadership perspective. These 3, whilst none may be captain next year, are the spiritual leaders of our club now that Roo and Hart are gone, all played in both 97 and 98 premierships, Mcleod and Edwards 250+ game players, Goodwin 200+ and as long as the bodies are holding up, which they are at this stage, they will be kept on.

Biglands will have to do something special to last more than one year, or Griffen and Maric must have shockers, I think he may be reinvented as a quick fix forward whilst Tippet, Sellar and Walker are being developed.

Basset may struggle, if he again has a year where injury has the best of him it might be the end, unfortunately his unwavering courage may have the best of him.

As for Burton, if he can keep fit, his X-factor and ability to trouble opposition teams will probably keep him another year or so, if he can't get out on the park though, he may struggle.

As for Fjeldstadts article, by the sounds he has just re-written Mcdermotts article from a week ago. Struggling to find anything really to write about, he is doing, as journalist do, pulling something from practically nothing.

We are going through a rebuilding phase, Sanders came out and admitted it, we don't expect to seriously challenge for probably 2 years, so unfortunately the older players who arn't quite top notch are going to find it harder and harder to get a guernsey. This happens at all clubs, not just the Crows, its just that we live in a 2 team state, the "chief football writer" hates our guts and the last time anything of this magnitude, in terms of players leaving was 96, 11 or 12 years ago. The second time in club history.

It had to happen and it has been put off 3 years so that some of the older blokes, like your Torney's, Welshs, Bodes etc could have a shot at a premiership and they gave it a pretty good go, in all 3 years the was a realistic shot at a GF appearance.

The club has now bitten the bullet and said times up, you guys arn't going to do it, so we need to start again, like we did in 96/97 and let some of the younger blokes take over, it is their time now, they have been brought up in a winning atmosphere and given a year or so when the forwards start to come through, will take us right back to the top.

Everyone has said we need to refresh our list, unfortunately I don't think anyone really realised how hard it would be and what would have to be done. I would say this is the area I would trust Craig and Reid, on the field, I trust Neil a lot less and hopefully the coaching box shake up will work, I fear it wont, because the main area of change was the defense, the one part that is yet to fail us under craig. Have some faith and I think we will be rewarded.

 

[Mismatched]

great posts Stiff and Macca

 

[MickyCrow]

Re: Troubled Times

As for Fjeldstadts article, by the sounds he has just re-written Mcdermotts article from a week ago. Struggling to find anything really to write about, he is doing, as journalist do, pulling something from practically nothing.

Dont bullshit to me mate, we all know the advertiser doesnt hire journalists!!!

 

[fightingdreamer88]

Blaaaaah blah blah blah-diddy-blah. FD88 is here to sort this shit out: bottom line is it would be much better to have a team built by Craig than built by Ayers (in the world's opinion) and I would prefer he did it quickly and ruthlessly than slowly and "nicely". Forget that it's Torney, forget that it's whoever the hell else (could be a green rat for all I care), Craig knows that if he wants to build his own side out of his own players he needs to get cracking RIGHT NOW. Do whatever you have to do to make it happen Craigy.

That is all; leave your letters of admiration for FD88 on your way out kids. Money is always appreciated too.

 

[fightingdreamer88]

Re: Troubled Times

It's all BS, Craigy is building a team and getting rid of whoever he doesn't see as part of that picture without hesitation.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Re: Troubled Times

I don't think its a long bow to draw and quite frankly, the leaks of player unhappines has been happening all year at Adelaide and its at times shown on the field. There is more to this story than just a journalist being controversial and the evens this year hardly do anything to discredit the story.

The point I am trying to make here is that the approach we are taking is right but the method in which we are doing it is not. I got no problem with weeding out older players and expendable players in order to bring in some more youth into the team. However, you can't be one thing one year and the other thing next year!

Craig came on board as this perfect new age coach with exceptional reputation for man managment. He stroked the egos, instilled belief into average players and got them firing on all cylinders. Thats great! However, you don't go from that guy to the other extreme and dictate to the point where players are not having fun anymore and are not happy in their workplace. Once you start going from one extreme to the other you lose the players. Its a proven formula for failure in team sports.

This is not the only article that hints at player disharmony. Throughout the year there have been stories and leaks about players tiring of Craig's methods.

Great leaders to make tough calls but their do it in style and do it the right way. Doing it with a hard ass aproach doesn't solve a thing, especially if you have had a different approach in the few years prior to this point.

I have always claimed that I didn't like Craig's unwillingness to trade and you have always stuck up for him with a view that his method is to create trust and team feeling among players and that way he gets the best out of them. Well, I think its much more of a violation of that method to do what he has done so far this off-season than it was to trade because the actions so far have led to fractures within the playing group and ignoring them won't solve them.

1. Stiffy Iam not sure where we have handled any situation badly ....your not argueing about letting these players go just the method ......Iam not understanding where you think we have handled these badly ????


2. I keep hearing of Craig changing and becoming a dictator ......sorry but when did this become reality versus assumptions derived from anonymous leaks??

How do we know he is simply not making tough decisions that players disagree with ....which will always be the case.

3. I saw no evidence of player disharmony on the field this year ......quite the opposite considering our injuries.

4. Re Craigs unwillingness to trade .....yes I have supported that view and will continue.

But I also have had to dismantle a culture to rebuild .....one rebuilt then teamwork and player loyalty both ways is critical.

But you can't rebuild and do the team building simultaneously ....got to go thru the process of putting the right blocks into place.

5. I would think Craig has been tremendously loyal to his group of players .....as has Paul Roos

But like Roos there comes a time when you have to dismantle and rebuild ......Sydney have done exactly the same thing as us.

Does that make both Paul Roos and Neil Craig the hard ass, and dictatorialthat he's being made out to be.

Given Craigs stated view on trading and team building hasn't this exercise been the opposite to what he is being labelled ......INFLEXIBLE.

I believe he is showing flexibility by adopting these actions which iam sure he would preferred not to have done but did for the benefit of the AFC.

 

[Mismatched]

Re: Troubled Times

Dont bullshit to me mate, we all know the advertiser doesnt hire journalists!!!

Now, now, thats unfair on the Advertiser, Jesper works for the sunday mail. Same holds true though!!!

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Craig needs to get the group on his side and the only way he can do that is by being innovative and as fair as possible in his dealings with players.

I have never heard that he is anything but .......

Also believe that players wanted a lighter PS last year and then approached Craig to say "no we were wrong" next PS needs to be hard again.

I'd suggest the newbies are in for a hell of a summer

 

[PCORF]

Re: Troubled Times

Really worrying times ahead for the AFC. I would like to know why the AFC's administration/management is so ruthless with its appraisal/management of its players yet perennial non-preformers from within its own ranks escape judgement year after year. It appears our off field dept is imune from having their own performances measured.

Who knows we may have that 3rd premiership trophy in th cupboard if at the end of 2002 or 2003 someone from within the AFC looked at our recuitment/trading record and said "gee Reidy and Fantassia, our trading, and especially recruiting, have been pretty ordinary over the past few years we thinks it's time to move you on".

With his record, how the hell was Fantassia allowed to leave at the end of 2006 on his own accord? Why the hell is John Reid still employed by the AFC - how many KPI's did he fail just at this years trade week?

Boys Club - yes indeed.

I have feeling we will see a thorough cleanout both on and the off field(including the coaching dept) before we see our next premiership.

This club has ruined itself and beaten itself up for way too long and blowing 3 prelim finals in recent years is not good at all because it is just so hard to recover from. This team can't win when it matters most and thats why we are losing players. Sometimes it makes me feel like barricking for another team.

Things will change next year, thats for sure because I have been frustrated for way too long. But I may be wrong and I might be saying this again in 5 years time. Stop bagging on about winning premierships because we aint going to win another one for several dosen years.

 

[Mismatched]

I have never heard that he is anything but .......

Also believe that players wanted a lighter PS last year and then approached Craig to say "no we were wrong" next PS needs to be hard again.

I'd suggest the newbies are in for a hell of a summer

Heard the same mate, he got it a little wrong last year by the sounds, i'd have a fair bit of money on him getting it right this time though.

 

[Mismatched]

Re: Troubled Times

This club has ruined itself and beaten itself up for way too long and blowing 3 prelim finals in recent years is not good at all because it is just so hard to recover from. This team can't win when it matters most and thats why we are losing players. Sometimes it makes me feel like barricking for another team.

Things will change next year, thats for sure because I have been frustrated for way too long. But I may be wrong and I might be saying this again in 5 years time. Stop bagging on about winning premierships because we aint going to win another one for several dosen years.

Go find another team.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Heard the same mate, he got it a little wrong last year by the sounds, i'd have a fair bit of money on him getting it right this time though.

No he didn't he took on board feedback from the leadership group .......they were wrong.

So much for him being inflexible .........or a dictator

 

[James23]

Re: Troubled Times

This club has ruined itself and beaten itself up for way too long and blowing 3 prelim finals in recent years is not good at all because it is just so hard to recover from. This team can't win when it matters most and thats why we are losing players. Sometimes it makes me feel like barricking for another team.

Things will change next year, thats for sure because I have been frustrated for way too long. But I may be wrong and I might be saying this again in 5 years time. Stop bagging on about winning premierships because we aint going to win another one for several dosen years.

dont let the door hit you on the way out

 

[BlackDouglas]

Re: Troubled Times

This club has ruined itself and beaten itself up for way too long and blowing 3 prelim finals in recent years is not good at all because it is just so hard to recover from. This team can't win when it matters most and thats why we are losing players. Sometimes it makes me feel like barricking for another team.

Things will change next year, thats for sure because I have been frustrated for way too long. But I may be wrong and I might be saying this again in 5 years time. Stop bagging on about winning premierships because we aint going to win another one for several dosen years.

Seeay, wouldn't want to be Ya - Biatch

 

[dA Crow]

Re: Troubled Times

It may well be in the Advertisers best interest to start naming their sources. Either that or the paper is, once again, making up their information as they need it.

 

[dA Crow]

Re: Troubled Times

This club has ruined itself and beaten itself up for way too long and blowing 3 prelim finals in recent years is not good at all because it is just so hard to recover from. This team can't win when it matters most and thats why we are losing players. Sometimes it makes me feel like barricking for another team.

Things will change next year, thats for sure because I have been frustrated for way too long. But I may be wrong and I might be saying this again in 5 years time. Stop bagging on about winning premierships because we aint going to win another one for several dosen years.

How about you actual post on the board who's team you support. You obviously have no support for Adelaide.

 

[Macca19]

Re: Troubled Times

Love your work, 100% agree

And just for the record, who gives a flying **** if your not having fun??????

Your an extremely well paid individual (the players) at work with a job to do

Grow up FFS

I work in a production shed despatch office, my job is to get trucks with stock out the door aa quickly as possible.

Not to have fun not to laugh

Your job is to play football

. That whole 'we're not having fun anymore' thing is childish and really irks me

I disagree with that. Youve gotta be able to fun at work and enjoy what you do. Considering people spent more time at work than they do doing anything else when they are awake, then you have to have fun at work.

 

[jenny61_99]

Re: Troubled Times

Some people just can't handle change... players and supporters alike, it appears. Right decisions made at the right time. Players looking after themselves, fair enough. Club looking after itself, even better. I think it will be exciting to be a part of AFC in 2008.... can't wait!


PS. Is the cricket over yet???

 

[AndrewJo]

Re: Troubled Times

Yes but the discipline is only one issue .....and in reality a very minor one

If Hudson and Welsh had had major discipline issues they would not have been offered new contracts.

Their dispute was over the terms of the contract ......they are looking after their interests .....the club looking at managing their list responsibly to give us the supporters long term success without doing an Essendon.

So lets not paint this situation for something it's not about

I think you need to move the word not in your bold sentence.
If Hudson and Welsh had had major discipline issues they would not have been offered new contracts. It maybe should read...
If Hudson and Welsh had not had major discipline issues they would have been offered new contracts.
Discipline is certainly not a minor issue when offering extended contracts.

 

[BlackDouglas]

Re: Troubled Times

Some people just can't handle change... players and supporters alike, it appears. Right decisions made at the right time. Players looking after themselves, fair enough. Club looking after itself, even better. I think it will be exciting to be a part of AFC in 2008.... can't wait!

Agree

PS. Is the cricket over yet???

Did it even start for the redbacks?

 

[MickyCrow]

Re: Troubled Times

I disagree with that. Youve gotta be able to fun at work and enjoy what you do. Considering people spent more time at work than they do doing anything else when they are awake, then you have to have fun at work.

True, buy you still have to conduct yourself as a professional, or Im just grumpy cos I have to work on a Sunday, hmmm.....

 

[TigerHunter]

Re: Troubled Times

Craig is a lot like Ayres. he won't make a damn change even when the rest of the footie world can see a game slipping away. Also he lacks creativity or an imagination when it comes to making match winning moves.

Spot on, its madness on craigs part. Dont know whether its pride or stupidity or even just too much faith in his players.

 

[Tas]

Re: Troubled Times

Including...

Bassett
Biglands
Burton
Edwards
Goodwin
McLeod

Its hard to see any of these players playing in 2009 if the past month is anything to go by.

I can see McLeod and Burton playing in 09 but for the rest it comes down to circumstances and strategy. I can see the two mentioned playing at 33 and 31 respectively but for the others a lot will depend on where the list is at after 08, how their bodies hold up and what kind of young players show promise at an early age.

NC will want to get his hands on as many good young kids as possible over a short period of time but a lot depends on how good draft seasons are over the next few years and how deep into the draft he wants to be taking players. There are probably not a lot of 6th or 7th round players come good and by the time you go through the motions of having them on your list for two years it can be a real roll of the dice.

Ideally, he would want to take anyone on the veteran list off it and go with a maximum number of rookies, he should really look at the possibility of trading players towards the end of their careers who probably have a good 2 or 3 years left in them, give them a chance to play out their careers and if you can get a second, third or fourth round pick then that is going to be light years better than trying to squeeze blood out of stone and have too many late round picks on the list.

As long as you have a good core leadership group and some younger players developing maturity and showing the ability to be future leaders then the club is still in good hands.