The Law 'D.C. Sniper' to be executed today

[Dont be a lemon]

You might remember this from when it happened seven years ago (felt like it was much more recent to me, but apparently not).

Virginia Governor Will Not Stay Sniper Execution

By IAN URBINA
Published: November 10, 2009

WASHINGTON — Gov. Tim Kaine of Virginia said he would not stay the scheduled execution Tuesday night of John Allen Muhammad, the man known as the D.C. Sniper whose murderous shooting spree in the fall of 2002 left at least 10 dead.

In a written statement on Tuesday, Mr. Kaine said: “I find no compelling reason to set aside the sentence that was recommended by the jury and then imposed and affirmed by the courts. Accordingly, I decline to intervene.”

On Monday, the Supreme Court refused to intervene in the case involving Mr. Muhammad, 48, who was sentenced to die for the killing of Dean H. Meyers, an engineer who was shot in the head at a gasoline station in Manassas, Va.

Mr. Meyers was one of 10 people killed in Maryland, Virginia and Washington over three weeks in October 2002. Mr. Muhammad’s accomplice, Lee Boyd Malvo, who was 17 at the time, was sentenced to life in prison without parole. The two are also suspected of fatal shootings in Alabama, Arizona and Louisiana.

The execution will bring to a close a case that has fixated the region ever since local residents were gunned down while doing the most mundane tasks, like shopping or pumping gas. The random nature of the shootings left people fearful and led many to remain indoors as much as possible to avoid becoming a target.

When the police announced that witnesses had reported having spotted white box trucks near the sniper shootings, the public became obsessed with the ubiquitous work vehicles and a sense of panic often beset anyone sitting at an intersection near the trucks. After a teenager was shot outside his Maryland school, local officials decided to keep schoolchildren inside at recess and they began drilling on duck-and-cover techniques.

Mr. Muhammad’s execution will also end a hard-fought legal battle.

Continued: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/11/us/11sniper.html?hp

 

[mr_cellotape]

Typical lawyer bullshit from his attorney (taken from CNN article):

"In its effort to race John Allen Muhammad to his death before his appeals could be pursued, the state of Virginia will execute a severely mentally ill man who also suffered from Gulf War Syndrome the day before Veterans Day."

The guy basically terrorised two states for almost a month. Stuff him.

 

[MrMeaner]

The guy basically terrorised two states for almost a month. Stuff him.

So, if his lawyer is right and the bloke suffers from a mental illness that removed his ability to judge between right and wrong, he should still be executed?

If that's what you're saying, there is absolutely no deterrence value in this execution. It is vengeance, pure and simple.

 

[bit_pattern]

Is that Bill Rawls in your avatar, Cellotape?

Completely off topic for a sec, but did you see the episode when Brother is looking for Omar and sends his lackey into the gay bars to find him, did you catch the snippet where you see Rawls in the background partying with his gay friends? That's why I love the show, they can make a character like him so complex as to be gay, but not make a big deal of it, juist slip it in for half a second and then making nothing more of it. Top quality drama!

Back on topic, I still oppose the death penalty, and wouldn't it be worth keeping him alive so we can at least study him and see what makes him tick?

 

[jonoman89]

Good. The people of the USA shouldn't have to pay out of their own pocket so this scumbag can watch cable tv for the rest of his life.

 

[Magnum]

If that's what you're saying, there is absolutely no deterrence value in this execution. It is vengeance, pure and simple.

How is it vengeance? It's punishment.

If I punish my child by sending them to their room, it's not vengance, it's punishment.
If somone is sentanced to community service for valdalising a train, it's not vengance, it's punishment.
If somone is sentanced to prison for kidnapping and inprisonment, it's not vengance, it's punishment.

I have no problem with this human garbage being executed for what he did.

 

[mr_cellotape]

So, if his lawyer is right and the bloke suffers from a mental illness that removed his ability to judge between right and wrong, he should still be executed?

From what I've been reading this morning, his defenses have been all over the place, and this supposed mental illness could simply be a late resort. Sorry that I didn't answer your strawman, though. The one point I will concede is that this has happened very quickly; appeals in the States usually take ages.

Is that Bill Rawls in your avatar, Cellotape?

Been my avatar on here for yonks. Dunno why. Guess when I was being a surly stooge on this SRP board one night I thought it fit

re: that episode moment; yep. Came out of nowhere and was awesome. The agro of a repressed man explained. Then, at the end of season four (highlight to reveal from here) after Bubbles spews on Landsman, and he sees the "Rawls sucks ****" graffiti in the Homicide offices' toilets. Just genius. Best show ever, end of discussion.

 

[The_Eagles]

Good to see it didn't take 20-25 years for him to get the chop. **** this guy, killing a dozen people to cover up his planned murder of wife to get back his kids. Also shot a 13 year old boy.

 

[theGimp]

Back on topic, I still oppose the death penalty, and wouldn't it be worth keeping him alive so we can at least study him and see what makes him tick?

He is a crunt.

/study /cost

 

[MrMeaner]

From what I've been reading this morning, his defenses have been all over the place, and this supposed mental illness could simply be a late resort. Sorry that I didn't answer your strawman, though. The one point I will concede is that this has happened very quickly; appeals in the States usually take ages.

How was my comment a strawman?

If his defences have been all over the place, then so be it. They may have been without merit (something I conceded might have been the case in my post). Did he have the same counsel all the way through?

There is a problem with mentally ill people being sentenced to death in the 'States. The criticism is often that public defenders appointed to defend them fail to pick up and plead their mental illness as a defence. This may or may not be one of those cases.

How is it vengeance? It's punishment.
If I punish my child by sending them to their room, it's not vengance, it's punishment.
If somone is sentanced to community service for valdalising a train, it's not vengance, it's punishment.
If somone is sentanced to prison for kidnapping and inprisonment, it's not vengance, it's punishment.

I have no problem with this human garbage being executed for what he did.

Vengeance and punishment can be synonyms. See the definition of vengeance in the OED:

The action or an act of avenging oneself or another; (an) infliction of injury or punishment in retribution for wrong to oneself or another.

On your other examples, taking someone's life is not equivalent to sending someone to their room.

 

[mr_cellotape]

How was my comment a strawman?

Because I didn't make any judgment on whether or not the mentally ill should be executed for such crimes. I simply implied that from my knowledge - albeit filtered through the ridiculous US media - of this particular case, he's not such a person, and should therefore be treated accordingly by the system.

No doubt there are issues with the quality of public defenders and the justice system in general in the States.

 

[theGimp]

There is a problem with mentally ill people being sentenced to death in the 'States. The criticism is often that public defenders appointed to defend them fail to pick up and plead their mental illness as a defence.

It goes without saying that the actions of this bloke and other great humans like the guy who threw his daughter off the westgate were 'mentally ill' when performing their crimes. IMO, it shouldnt be taken into consideration in such cases.

 

[Magnum]

Vengeance and punishment can be synonyms. See the definition of vengeance in the OED:

On your other examples, taking someone's life is not equivalent to sending someone to their room.

Yes it is, just examples of severity of punishment.

If you want to use the more 'emotive' word of "revenge", that's you perogative, however the terms are NOT interchangable.

Or do you think I'm being vengeful to my child if I withhold her pocket money because she's misbehaved?

Is the judge being vengeful when putting a prisoner in jail?

What's the difference here, simply because the punishment is death?

 

[evo]

Is the judge being vengeful when putting a prisoner in jail?

What's the difference here, simply because the punishment is death?

There can be reasons for putting people in jail other than to punish/ seek vengeance.

Utilitarian, for example.

 

[Magnum]

There can be reasons for putting people in jail other than to punish/ seek vengeance.

Utilitarian, for example.

Indeed there are. I don't see how this applies to this though.

You either think he deserves to be executed (as punishment/revenge call it what you will), or you don't. How you reason that is up to ones own beliefs.

Personally, this human should be executed with less compunction than one would give squashing a cockroach. In fact a cockroach deserves life on this planet infinitely more than this human being. But that's just me. And I'm fine for others to believe differently.

 

[rdhopkins2]

The execution has been completed according to CNN.

 

[TheBloods]

No reason not to execute him.

 

[bit_pattern]

Yes the is. There are many reason not to. Not least that state sanctioned executions are an archaic and barbaric form of justice and retribution.

 

[MrMeaner]

Because I didn't make any judgment on whether or not the mentally ill should be executed for such crimes. I simply implied that from my knowledge - albeit filtered through the ridiculous US media - of this particular case, he's not such a person, and should therefore be treated accordingly by the system.

That's not how I read your post. I read it as meaning that mental illness should not be a barrier to putting someone to death. Sorry for misinterpreting you.

There can be reasons for putting people in jail other than to punish/ seek vengeance.

Utilitarian, for example.

Yep. Bentham's ideas are still put into practice today.

Indeed there are. I don't see how this applies to this though.

You either think he deserves to be executed (as punishment/revenge call it what you will), or you don't. How you reason that is up to ones own beliefs.

Personally, this human should be executed with less compunction than one would give squashing a cockroach. In fact a cockroach deserves life on this planet infinitely more than this human being. But that's just me. And I'm fine for others to believe differently.

I'm happy to agree to disagree and leave it there.

 

[TheBloods]

Yes the is. There are many reason not to. Not least that state sanctioned executions are an archaic and barbaric form of justice and retribution.

That's not a reason. Just a weak emotional plea. Locking someone in a prison for the rest of their lives is also quite barbaric. It's also pointless. May as well eradicate him. No downside to that.

 

[MrMeaner]

That's not a reason. Just a weak emotional plea. Locking someone in a prison for the rest of their lives is also quite barbaric. It's also pointless. May as well eradicate him. No downside to that.

It may be a 'weak emotional plea' to you just as to many of us who agree with BP on this, your position is emotional and bloodthirsty. It is a matter of perspective.

 

[bit_pattern]

That's not a reason.

Yes it is.

 

[KevinCat07]

Meh, good riddance to another Islamist fundie.

John Allen Muhammad has now split Hell wide open. You would have to still feel some compassion for a killer to want him to live.

 

[TheBloods]

It may be a 'weak emotional plea' to you just as to many of us who agree with BP on this, your position is emotional and bloodthirsty. It is a matter of perspective.

It's pointless keeping him in jail for the rest of his life.

 

[telsor]

In theory, I'm OK with the idea of the death penalty for those who have commited crimes so vile they should never be allowed to reenter society.

I do however believe that it's better to leave 100 guilty people alive rather than risk one innocent person to be killed, so I think for any execution the burden should not be 'beyond reasonable doubt' but rather 'beyond *ANY* doubt'.

How do you do that? The prosecutor who calls for the punishment, and Judge who decrees that is to happen are considered to be guilty of manslaughter if evidence later appears that leads to an executed person should have been aquitted.

Somehow I doubt there would be many capital cases if those were the consequences.