Draft mechanisms under review

[sr36]

Do the glenelg fans like Michalaney?

You've missed my point, which is that father son is a meaningless concept if your father didn't play for the club. The AFL introduced it to SA and WA to try to get rid of the advantage into the system. Instead they should have changed the system so that you didn't get father sons (or academy kids) at a bargain.

 

[sr36]

Like Daicos?

Yes. We paid a handful of junk for a bloke looking like being something extraordinary.

 

[Swanssince91]

You've missed my point, which is that father son is a meaningless concept if your father didn't play for the club. The AFL introduced it to SA and WA to try to get rid of the advantage into the system. Instead they should have changed the system so that you didn't get father sons (or academy kids) at a bargain.

So Collingwood can have father sons but these clubs can't?
Or are you saying it should be scrapped all together?

 

[sr36]

So Collingwood can have father sons but these clubs can't?
Or are you saying it should be scrapped all together?

Sydney can have father sons but GWS can't. It's only an issue because the top ones are so under priced. Same with the academy kids. Get the pricing right so it's not an advantage and what's the issue?

 

[go_the_dockers]

Agree. It's the ridiculous bargains that is the issue.

The issue for is the vic clubs get a massive advantage, nsw and qld get a bit and sa and wa clubs get nothing.

Make it even, and no one complains.

 

[sr36]

The issue for is the vic clubs get a massive advantage, nsw and qld get a bit and sa and wa clubs get nothing.

Make it even, and no one complains.

Why do Vic clubs get a massive advantage but Sydney and Brisbane only a bit?

 

[go_the_dockers]

Why do Vic clubs get a massive advantage but Sydney and Brisbane only a bit?

Father son. Favours established clubs in the comp for over 30 years. Mostly vics
Academy. Nsw and qld sides
Nga. Favoured vic over wa and sa
Home grown talent. Favours vic
Home grown talent in draft. Favours vic massively.

 

[sr36]

Father son. Favours established clubs in the comp for over 30 years. Mostly vics
Academy. Nsw and qld sides
Nga. Favoured vic over wa and sa
Home grown talent. Favours vic
Home grown talent in draft. Favours vic massively.

Sydney and Brisbane had access to Fitzroy and South Melb as FS. Plus they have now been in the Comp long enough that it's no longer relevant. It's really only you guys, Port, GC and GWS for whom it's still relevant.

 

[go_the_dockers]

Sydney and Brisbane had access to Fitzroy and South Melb as FS. Plus they have now been in the Comp long enough that it's no longer relevant. It's really only you guys, Port, GC and GWS for whom it's still relevant.

Father son will be close to equal in 5 or 10 years. Now we just need to fix the rest.

 

[Swanssince91]

Sydney can have father sons but GWS can't. It's only an issue because the top ones are so under priced. Same with the academy kids. Get the pricing right so it's not an advantage and what's the issue?

Our last few father sons didn't want to move to Sydney
Josh Dunkley wanted to stay in Melbourne
Joe Daniher chose essendon over us
Tom Mitchell only came to us because we offered him 5 years

 

[sr36]

Our last few father sons didn't want to move to Sydney
Josh Dunkley wanted to stay in Melbourne
Joe Daniher chose essendon over us
Tom Mitchell only came to us because we offered him 5 years

You've been in Sydney for 41 years. Any difference in FS outcomes is just luck.

 

[go_the_dockers]

You've been in Sydney for 41 years. Any difference in FS outcomes is just luck.

Not when drafting mostly non local players.

The chance of Collingwood get a non vic father son is about 20% of all father sons.

For Sydney it is about 60% of all father son.

Percentage of local talent in draft matters

 

[sr36]

Not when drafting mostly non local players.

The chance of Collingwood get a non vic father son is about 20% of all father sons.

For Sydney it is about 60% of all father son.

Percentage of local talent in draft matters

That's 85% made up.

 

[go_the_dockers]

That's 85% made up.

Your list is 85% Victorian. Higher on average if you go back 20 years.
There's is maybe 50 percent now, but would drop significantly over the last 20 years.

 

[Mostyn]

I firmly believe that the AFL should move to an entirely points based trading and drafting.

Teams are given points based on where they finish on the ladder, with more points going to the bad teams.

Then points are used for trades, so you never get a situation where a team just doesn't quite have the picks in the right range to trade for a certain player. Teams could go "I think my player is worth 425 points" and the other team say "no, that is dumb, he is worth 310" and then after some negotiation they settle on the player being worth 380 points.

Then you have the draft, so pick 1 comes up, every team enters a silent auction where they are allowed to put in how many points they are willing to bid for pick 1 for, and the player they want. After 2 minutes it is announced which team has the highest bid, then that team gets the player they nominated, and then onto pick 2 with the same process.

If an Academy kid gets bid on then the team that has the rights to that player has 1 minute to decide if they want to match the bid, so match the number of points the bidding team said they were willing to pay and if they do match they get said player.

To me this is a much better system and would solve a lot of issues.

Not sure if it's better but it sounds like fun.

 

[Dogflogger]

You've been in Sydney for 41 years. Any difference in FS outcomes is just luck.

Do we even want luck in the game though? when we see teams like collingwood get 16 father sons in 30 odd years and teams like st kilda get 1 in that time period, just adds complete chaos when in most cases the player with the father son will trade picks to draft him or trade later to get him to the team, ,so the only complaint i actually see is you want these players to be 1 club players.

 

[Caligo]

Do we even want luck in the game though?

Drafting is mostly luck.

 

[Dogflogger]

Drafting is mostly luck.

not a discounted player with potential loyalty to the team drafting them, also you dont get to pre train draftees as far as im aware.

 

[Caligo]

not a discounted player with potential loyalty to the team drafting them, also you dont get to pre train draftees as far as im aware.

You do get to pre train draftees under limited circumstances. I was talking more about the general luck that comes with drafting though.

 

[sr36]

Do we even want luck in the game though? when we see teams like collingwood get 16 father sons in 30 odd years and teams like st kilda get 1 in that time period, just adds complete chaos when in most cases the player with the father son will trade picks to draft him or trade later to get him to the team, ,so the only complaint i actually see is you want these players to be 1 club players.

It's an oval ball that bounces unpredictability - yes we want luck in the game.

I just think they need to get the matching system right, so that the early ones are not obscene bargains

 

[go_the_dockers]

You've been in Sydney for 41 years. Any difference in FS outcomes is just luck.

It is not luck, if most of your potential father sons don't live in your state.

Home grown talent percentage surely impacts this.

 

[sr36]

It is not luck, if most of your potential father sons don't live in your state.

Home grown talent percentage surely impacts this.

There's only been 2 blokes who turned down father son. Are you back to it's bias that Vic produces more footballers? You'll probably next go with the contradictory complaint that there's too many teams in Victoria.

It's a bloody even comp with most teams having had a stint at both the bottom and top over the last 2 decades.

 

[go_the_dockers]

There's only been 2 blokes who turned down father son. Are you back to it's bias that Vic produces more footballers? You'll probably next go with the contradictory complaint that there's too many teams in Victoria.

It's a bloody even comp with most teams having had a stint at both the bottom and top over the last 2 decades.

The first step is to find the advantages certain teams have, the next thing is address them.

It is not the vic clubs fault, that most of the talent comes from Victoria.

But if we ignore the advantage then the premierships will mostly be won by vic teams.

 

[RUNVS]

The first step is to find the advantages certain teams have, the next thing is address them.

It is not the vic clubs fault, that most of the talent comes from Victoria.

But if we ignore the advantage then the premierships will mostly be won by vic teams.

The problem is that the Victorian teams are happy to ignore the advantages.

 

[sr36]

The first step is to find the advantages certain teams have, the next thing is address them.

It is not the vic clubs fault, that most of the talent comes from Victoria.

But if we ignore the advantage then the premierships will mostly be won by vic teams.

You're grouping clubs into two broad groups and looking at the results of grand finals as your only data point and assuming they're the product of bias.

If you look at it more holistically, non Vic clubs have been very represented up the top of the ladder and haven't been overrepresented down the bottom of the ladder. And it's been Vic clubs most inclined to find themselves stuck in the bottom half for lengthy periods.

We've had 3 great teams from Vic - Hawthorn, Geelong and Richmond win a heap of flags skewing the grand final results towards Vic. Prior to that we had a great team from QLD doing the same, with a NSW, WA, and SA team regularly up there getting close throughout the whole time.