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Explain the forward press to me

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stefoid

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Mar 8, 2002
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Can we have a team-agnostic discussion about the modern gameplan?

As far as I understand it, the forward press is about flooding your own forward half so that the opposition cant clear the ball from your forward 50.

But there has to be more to it than that? What are teams doing in different parts of the ground at different times?

Are there any competing game plans having success at the moment?

Why would you have your entire forward line flooding to your defensive end when the opposition has the ball? Wouldnt you be better off at least leaving your best 1:1 forward inside your F50 as a long target at all times?
 
Good question.

I guess they call it a "press" rather than a "flood" because its something that doesnt happen all the time. It sort of "breathes" like a pair of lungs. So often the forward line can be quite open and a key forward can get an opportunity to take a mark.

Bottom line is that it relies heavily on a teams ability to apply defensive pressure. It also needs you to have a dozen players you can rely upon to kick a goal. Without that, its pointless.
 

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Good question.

I guess they call it a "press" rather than a "flood" because its something that doesnt happen all the time. It sort of "breathes" like a pair of lungs. So often the forward line can be quite open and a key forward can get an opportunity to take a mark.

Bottom line is that it relies heavily on a teams ability to apply defensive pressure. It also needs you to have a dozen players you can rely upon to kick a goal. Without that, its pointless.

So lets say one team has the ball inside their D50 and the opposition has flooded their own F50 trying to keep the ball in their half.

Why does the team trying to get the ball out of the D50 flood all of their players into their defensive half also?

Is it because

a) they were already there because flooding into defence is a given?
b) because you dont want any free opponents inside their own forward half if you do turn it over trying to get it out?
c) other?

I cant see why you wouldnt leave one guy in your own f50 even when the ball is trapped in your D50. A forward with blistering speed for instance. If you work the ball to within a long kick of your F50, you just kick to open space and make it a foot race between your guy and whoever the opposition has minding him. no science or precision, just kick the effing thing as far as you can.?
 
Can we have a team-agnostic discussion about the modern gameplan?

As far as I understand it, the forward press is about flooding your own forward half so that the opposition cant clear the ball from your forward 50.

But there has to be more to it than that? What are teams doing in different parts of the ground at different times?

It's not only about occupying the space, it's about placing implied pressure on the ball carrier or kicker, essentially squeezing a team into making an error in defensive 50.

Are there any competing game plans having success at the moment?

I'm not sure if it's really a game plan, but a very skillful side can run through it with precision passing and doubling back / switching play to open up space.

Why would you have your entire forward line flooding to your defensive end when the opposition has the ball? Wouldnt you be better off at least leaving your best 1:1 forward inside your F50 as a long target at all times?

Yeah I've thought about that (though this isn't really to do with the forward press which essentially involves flooding forward), and I'm not entirely sure. I suppose the idea is, that in theory, if said forward is fit enough he can do both, be involved defensively and double back to make an impact forward.

Having said that, I think it was Lloyd (not sure about that, might have been someone else) that said he thinks making forwards run back and forth is affecting the quality of kicking by key forwards, because they are so physically stuffed that the actual act of kicking is difficult, which kind of makes sense.

I know I've noticed Fletcher (I know you said agnostic, but obviously I have more working knowledge of my own team), trying to work himself into space on the defensive end of the centre square with the intent of using the back and forth flock of players, which opens space, to either kick long to a forward or take it upon himself to kick goals.

A disadvantage to the forward press, is the incredible toll it takes on players. Collingwood are the only team I have seen do it consistently well.
 
So lets say one team has the ball inside their D50 and the opposition has flooded their own F50 trying to keep the ball in their half.

Why does the team trying to get the ball out of the D50 flood all of their players into their defensive half also?

Is it because

a) they were already there because flooding into defence is a given?
b) because you dont want any free opponents inside their own forward half if you do turn it over trying to get it out?
c) other?

Yes, fair question.....but on answer of course is that in your defensive 50 you want to prevent your opponent from scoring, so to win the ball you dont want to be outnumbered.

Having won the ball then both teams bolt toward the other end as quickly as possible. Kicking 50+ metres to clear the press is an option but requires exquisite skill to hit the target, and a turnover (which is the object of the press) is likely. The safer option is the short kick. This doesnt breeach the press but you dont lose posession. Kicking over the press is high risk.
 
Remaining team-agnostic, but I'll use Carlton as an example because I am most familiar with their style... the Blues have a pretty effective forward press, because they're a side built with a fair bit of speed and smaller players, rather than big lumberers. They're also very strong at clearances, which I think is a must for a team using the forward press.

So when the ball is deep in their forward line, instead of midfielders and halfbacks staying in position, they push forward ~50m. Midfielders jam up to and into the forward 50, whilst the half backline (guys like Yarran, Gibbs, Russell) are up to halfway, or even into the forward half. The forward line, instead of sagging back and guarding space, rushes the ball-carrier and chases and harrasses the defenders. A good tactic when your forwards are Betts, Garlett and Walker (ie. quick).

This means the forward half is crowded, and scoring opportunities are usually hurried and under pressure. But it also means the opposition trying to get the ball out are surrounded by tackling forwards and everywhere within one kick's range (say, 50m) is chock-full of Carlton players. It puts pressure on the kicker, and often forces turnovers or at least kicks to a contest. It also forces the the defending team to drag numbers back, which limits the outlet opportunities.

The downside to the tactic is it generally leaves the defensive half wide open. So when a team DOES break out of the press, they're often kicking to forwards on their own or isolated 1-on-1 with plenty of room to move.

The stats would show that, over the season, the Blues have largely done very well in "time in attacking half" stats, but also have a habit of giving up "easy goals" when the ball pops out of the press. This vulnerability to counter attack is why teams who half-ass the press or who are really poor at clearances struggle with the forward press. If there's a little room to move, or they're consistently getting done at clearances, the ball is going to pop out more often than not and an open forward line scores more easily than a choked up one every time.
 
Is being outnumbered 18:17 in one half of the ground that big a disadvantage?

I reckon having the 'out' of booting the ball 70m to empty space so your quick guy can run onto it would improve your odds of not turning the ball over.
 
Remaining team-agnostic, but I'll use Carlton as an example because I am most familiar with their style... the Blues have a pretty effective forward press, because they're a side built with a fair bit of speed and smaller players, rather than big lumberers. They're also very strong at clearances, which I think is a must for a team using the forward press.

So when the ball is deep in their forward line, instead of midfielders and halfbacks staying in position, they push forward ~50m. Midfielders jam up to and into the forward 50, whilst the half backline (guys like Yarran, Gibbs, Russell) are up to halfway, or even into the forward half. The forward line, instead of sagging back and guarding space, rushes the ball-carrier and chases and harrasses the defenders. A good tactic when your forwards are Betts, Garlett and Walker (ie. quick).

This means the forward half is crowded, and scoring opportunities are usually hurried and under pressure. But it also means the opposition trying to get the ball out are surrounded by tackling forwards and everywhere within one kick's range (say, 50m) is chock-full of Carlton players. It puts pressure on the kicker, and often forces turnovers or at least kicks to a contest. It also forces the the defending team to drag numbers back, which limits the outlet opportunities.

The downside to the tactic is it generally leaves the defensive half wide open. So when a team DOES break out of the press, they're often kicking to forwards on their own or isolated 1-on-1 with plenty of room to move.

The stats would show that, over the season, the Blues have largely done very well in "time in attacking half" stats, but also have a habit of giving up "easy goals" when the ball pops out of the press. This vulnerability to counter attack is why teams who half-ass the press or who are really poor at clearances struggle with the forward press. If there's a little room to move, or they're consistently getting done at clearances, the ball is going to pop out more often than not and an open forward line scores more easily than a choked up one every time.

So you particularly want fast forwards if you have a forward press.

a) to tackle when the ball is in their own F50
b) to fast break when they are coming out of defence.

Are lumbering forwards basically doomed?
 
Are lumbering forwards basically doomed?

I think you can only carry one.

It's why the ruckman resting forward thing isn't working as well as people initially thought. For example, Essendon's forward setup with Ryder and Hille forward was, amongst other things, just too slow. Not when the ball was kicked in there, but once it hit the ground and the defence got a hold of it.

You still need the marking power in the air (see Travis Cloke), but you must be able to chase and harass.
 

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So you particularly want fast forwards if you have a forward press.

a) to tackle when the ball is in their own F50
b) to fast break when they are coming out of defence.

Are lumbering forwards basically doomed?

Certainly for pressure, yes fast forwards are incredibly effective. As for the fast break, I'm not so sure. I've seen it multiple times this year, a team can break the press and simply have nothing to kick to.... I think that is probably a tactical problem that will be overcome in the next couple of years. I'm not sure how, possibly by having tall forwards occupy to corridor and break backwards as soon as possession is won.

As for the lumbering forwards, I think your Dunstall type forward is absolutely cooked as far as the current day game is concerned for sure.

Tall forwards however are still incredibly useful, Franklin is your obvious example. IMO, particularly as the game wears on, tall forwards can be used for devastating impact within the congested space.

If they have the endurance to continually work into space, and the marking prowess to take it under a tight situation they are worth there weight in gold. It's why I'm praying so bloody hard that Gumbleton stays fit..... :D
 
It'll last a season or two before tactics shift again. Perhaps to an American football style setup where the defensive team gets the ball back to a "quarterback" like Shannon Hurn/Josh Drummond/Matt Suckling and provides a protective screen (like the offensive line in gridiron) to get the ball over the press? Something. The game constantly develops and self-corrects on this stuff. Except where the AFL jump the gun and come up with a poorly thought-out rule to fix something that doesn't need fixing.
 
I think you can only carry one.

It's why the ruckman resting forward thing isn't working as well as people initially thought. For example, Essendon's forward setup with Ryder and Hille forward was, amongst other things, just too slow. Not when the ball was kicked in there, but once it hit the ground and the defence got a hold of it.

You still need the marking power in the air (see Travis Cloke), but you must be able to chase and harass.

Pretty much, as soon as Ryder stopped grabbing them it became a liability. Need the marking prowess to mark it work.
 
Youre bringing the ball out of defence, you probably have it near the boundary about 20m back of centre wing...

If your forwards are contested markers, then you have to hold up the ball to allow everybody (your forwards and their opponents) to run forward of you, then kick to their advantage. This seems hard.

If your forwards are genuinely quick, just kick the bejesus out of the ball into a vacant paddock and let the Stawell gift decide who wins possession. This seems easy by comparison.
 
Is being outnumbered 18:17 in one half of the ground that big a disadvantage?

I reckon having the 'out' of booting the ball 70m to empty space so your quick guy can run onto it would improve your odds of not turning the ball over.

The guys on the outer perimiter of the flood would likely have enough time to get to the fall of the ball from the long kick and cause a contest. Even if this player takes a mark, whats he going to do with nobody in front of him? Play on and run the ball another 50+ metres and try and score a touchdown?
 
If your forwards are genuinely quick, just kick the bejesus out of the ball into a vacant paddock and let the Stawell gift decide who wins possession. This seems easy by comparison.

Even if you are right and you jag a goal or two this way, theres only so many Stawell Gifts you can run during a game of football. Exhaustion will eventually kick in. Which is another objective of the forward press. To tire the opposition.
 

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The guys on the outer perimiter of the flood would have enough time to get to the fall of the ball and cause a contest. Even if this player takes a mark, whats he going to do with nobody in front of hime? Play on and run the ball another 50+ metres and try and score a touchdown?

More or less. Im thinking of guys like Gartlett (blues), Grant (dogs)... guys who are basically significantly quicker than most of their opponents. Dont kick to them in order to mark it, kick in front of them and they run onto the loose ball and then run it all the way to 20m out. Fast break, and easy layup in basketball terms.

I guess basketball, despite only 5 a side, is the best game to steal strategies from as it doesn't have any reverse passing or off-side rules. It has a shot clock and a 'no taking the ball back into your defensive half' rule, but these dont fundamentally alter the nature of the game like the other rules do.
 
Even if you are right and you jag a goal or two this way, theres only so many Stawell Gifts you can run during a game of football. Exhaustion will eventually kick in. Which is another objective of the forward press. To tire the opposition.

Does the forward press tire the the opposition more than the team doing it?
 
Look up full court press....you'll find it on a basketball site somewhere.

That should explain everything.

It will also help you understand zones, power forwards and team defense ;)
Yes indeed . Thats the game today for sure. Also you can see the open arms coraling of an apponant instead of running straight at him if you cut him off and try and tackle or get the footy off him. No they stand 4 feet off and open their arms , its like guarding the key. And if you jump up and collide with an apponant under the ring its a foul, ha ha well
that happens in every second contended marking contest hand in the back knocking the arms , what the hell has the AFL done to footy. Effing well killing it thats what.
 
I guess basketball, despite only 5 a side, is the best game to steal strategies from as it doesn't have any reverse passing or off-side rules. It has a shot clock and a 'no taking the ball back into your defensive half' rule, but these dont fundamentally alter the nature of the game like the other rules do.


A basketball court isnt 150 metres long.
 
Has a few different incarnations. One method is just to flood the defensive 50, but the rolling zone is a far more structured version of it.

Basically every player sets up on kick in's, guarding designated areas rather than going man on man. It's intention is that anywhere that opposition kicker brings the ball out to can be quickly shut down by several defenders converging and forcing 2-3 on one contests. If the team bringing it out successfully finds a target, the entire zone rolls back up the field.

The best exponents of it place their best contested marks 70-80 meters out from their goal on opposition kick ins. You see Cox, Kennedy, Hurn etc take many a contested mark of opposition balls coming out of defense doing exactly this.

And yes, it's a tactic that is very physically taxing and it can break down easily once fatigue sets in. The eagles have basically been trialing it for 3 years but the kids haven't had the tank/nous to pull it off until now
 

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Explain the forward press to me


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