Opinion Financial impact on structure of Port, the AFL and long lasting Covid issues

[Muh Village]

Ports crowds were absolute trash untl AO was redeveloped. Only our first couple years in the AFL showed decent numbers. But yeah, it does seem to keep stemming back to the stadium deal. Does anyone know why we can't re-negotiate?

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[Muh Village]

What's an overload? Sorry. Not a finacial manager like everyone else here.

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[TeeKray]

What's an overload? Sorry. Not a finacial manager like everyone else here.

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It's not a financial term, it's just a way of saying the people who have control over us (ie the SANFL 1997-2013, the SMA 2014-present). We are totally unable to run our business without them running unreasonably high levels of interference on what should be one of our key sources of revenue (ie putting on games of football).

 

[Muh Village]

I thought the AFL got our licence?

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[AFC AFeederClub]

the less money in the AFL the better, who knows we just might scrap the womens comp, it would be a shame because they are so elite and i'll miss the highwater mark of a 8 goals game as compared to a 3 goal 15 behind because my drink game is based on behinds not goals

 

[Muh Village]

The women's game is important

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[PowerBaz]

It's not a financial term, it's just a way of saying the people who have control over us (ie the SANFL 1997-2013, the SMA 2014-present). We are totally unable to run our business without them running unreasonably high levels of interference on what should be one of our key sources of revenue (ie putting on games of football).

It would be in the AFL’s interest for us to be more financially viable would it not, as what’s been seen in the last few weeks, without Port and the Crows the house of cards falls, who holds the aces here?

• we need a better cut of game day $

• we need to wear prison bars

 

[tribey]

Nearly 2 mill people in sa. Crows are loaded. We've been around way longer and have built a rock solid culture. Yet as soon as we joined the AFL we went broke. Doenst make sense to me.

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• Port paid $4,000,000 + interest for its AFL/SANFL sublicence.

• With the PAFC/PAMFC split by SA Football Commission decree, Port spent $1,100,000 setting up the Magpies at Ethelton.

• Port Adelaide and Port Magpies were forbidden from pursuing joint-marketing and revenue initiatives beyond the PAMFC having a 25% share in The Port Club.

• The SANFL took 80% of Crows and Port profits until 2001.

• Football Park breakeven was around 28,000-29,000 (with the clubs paying down expenses and making good any shortfall regardless) with no wiggle room despite circumstances increasingly hurting the gate — Sunday trading, consistently terrible timeslots, Channel 10 and Fox Footy broadcasting live into Adelaide, etc.

• From 2014-2029 Port is paying the SANFL $6,985,000 for its AFL licence.

• Port relinquished its share of the AAMI Stadium sell-off as a condition of the One Club merger.

• We’re paying off millions in debt from when we were bleeding to death from 08-13.

• The SMA siphons a buttload of our gameday revenue to fund the SANFL.

Basically, everything that made the club the biggest in the state was deliberately and wantonly eroded by a bunch of myopic c**ts who weren’t fit to run a lemonade stand.

 

[AdamMarrett]

• Port paid $4,000,000 + interest for its AFL/SANFL sublicence.

• With the PAFC/PAMFC split by SA Football Commission decree, Port spent $1,100,000 setting up the Magpies at Ethelton.

• Port Adelaide and Port Magpies were forbidden from pursuing joint-marketing and revenue initiatives beyond the PAMFC having a 25% share in The Port Club.

• The SANFL took 80% of Crows and Port profits until 2001.

• Football Park breakeven was around 28,000-29,000 (with the clubs paying down expenses and making good any shortfall regardless) with no wiggle room despite circumstances increasingly hurting the gate — Sunday trading, consistently terrible timeslots, Channel 10 and Fox Footy broadcasting live into Adelaide, etc.

• From 2014-2029 Port is paying the SANFL $6,985,000 for its AFL licence.

• Port relinquished its share of the AAMI Stadium sell-off as a condition of the One Club merger.

• We’re paying off millions in debt from when we were bleeding to death from 08-13.

• The SMA siphons a buttload of our gameday revenue to fund the SANFL.

Basically, everything that made the club the biggest in the state was deliberately and wantonly eroded by a bunch of myopic c**ts who weren’t fit to run a lemonade stand.

The SANFL took 80% of ours and the Crows profit? How in the blue hell do they ever claim to be broke

 

[tribey]

The SANFL took 80% of ours and the Crows profit? How in the blue hell do they ever claim to be broke

It was scrapped chiefly because we kept finding ways to not make a profit and lose any excess cash to those fiends — they kept sucking our marrow at Footy Park though.

 

[Magus]

the less money in the AFL the better, who knows we just might scrap the womens comp, it would be a shame because they are so elite and i'll miss the highwater mark of a 8 goals game as compared to a 3 goal 15 behind because my drink game is based on behinds not goals

We don't have a women's team so what difference would it make to you whether the women's league continues or not?

 

[Muh Village]

Wow. Thank you for the information. You are very well read. It's so sad that all these compounding factors have put us in the situation we are.

It's like the SANFL have not forgiven us for 1990. And are doing everything they can to make us fold.

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[Pablo Escobar]

I am not a footy tragic but have followed Port closely as I grew up on the Eyre Peninsula. I would happily consider joining as a member to repay the enjoyment the club has given me (until the last 15 years anyway),
however, the main barrier to me doing this is 1) my wife has lost her job, and more importantly 2) I am finding it difficult to justify stumping membership $$ if Ken is still getting $500k and some players are still getting $300-$500k per year when the club is in such a dire position.

Why can’t there be more transparency so people such as myself can make an informed decision, or have I got it all wrong???

 

[GremioPower]

We don't have a women's team so what difference would it make to you whether the women's league continues or not?

In itself, there is nothing wrong with the AFLW. Quite the contrary, actually. However, it is not self-sufficient, and the AFL has limited resources. It may become a heavy burden to bear in the short term.

The AFL will probably be forced to rethink it. I wouldn't be surprised if they limit the teams only to Victoria. It would reduce both travel and roster costs.

The other clubs would simply shut down their women's teams or play in their home states. If they remain playing, there could be some kind of national Finals to compensate them. Still, the AFL may not have much choice.

 

[Magus]

In itself, there is nothing wrong with the AFLW. Quite the contrary, actually. However, it is not self-sufficient, and the AFL has limited resources. It may become a heavy burden to bear in the short term.

The AFL will probably be forced to rethink it. I wouldn't be surprised if they limit the teams only to Victoria. It would reduce both travel and roster costs.

The other clubs would simply shut down their women's teams or play in their home states. If they remain playing, there could be some kind of national Finals to compensate them. Still, the AFL may not have much choice.

I don't doubt any of what you said.

But why care about something that you don't like and we aren't a part of anyway? Completely pointless.

 

[GremioPower]

I don't doubt any of what you said.

But why care about something that you don't like and we aren't a part of anyway? Completely pointless.

We will have a team at some point, and there are people who care about it. Moreover, it is a branch of the AFL, and it is currently a burden for the league. Hence, it affects the AFL as a whole, Port included.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Sheedy has suggested to make up the $$$ lost and give more content to broadcasters, play 28 minor round games for 3 years instead of 22 and play each team 5 times over 3 years - which would mean 1 season is 29 games.

Some will say bloody Sheedy again. But his rational is sound. Seasons used to have night series/preseason games. He said his first year in 1981 he coached in 5 night series games plus 22 minor round games for 27 games when players were part timers.

I remember looking at games played in the SANFL when the whole debate about how SANFL counted its games for the father son rules and saw that in 1988 I think it was, Peter Carey played 31 games which was added to his total games played total ie 5 preseason cup games + 22 minor round games + 4 finals.

If part timers could play so many games I'm sure full time professionals could handle it with altered specific training schedules.

Plenty of people say that the gap between end of season and start of new season is too long. This is one way to reduce it and see if players can handle it.

The issue is if one side after 10 games has won 0 or 1 game it will be a long 18 games without the prospect of making finals. That's why it could be tried for 3 years but not become a permanent thing.

If this happens then every club should be allowed to play 2 of their 14 home games away from their normal home ground stadium, if they want to and can negotiate better stadium deals for those games.

That way we could play a home game in China and a home game at Alberton - provided some upgrades are put in. China might be put on hold for 2 or 3 years so that would be 2 games at Alberton which gives us the chance to make some decent $$$$ from those games with no greedy SMA involved, but they get an extra home game to help them as we would play 12 instead of 11 at AO.

If its good enough to play in minor round games at stadiums like Alice Springs, Ballarat, Cairns why not Alberton??

It also would mean all 18 teams have an AFLW team as Sheedy wants double headers in March.

Kevin Sheedy says 28-round home and away seasons in each of the next three years would help save football

Part of Kevin Sheedy's long-term scheduling plan would include:

* Scrapping the pre-season series;

* Starting before the NRL season;

* Playing games on Tuesday and Wednesday nights;

* Quarters remaining at 16 minutes each plus time-on;

* Six players per team on interchange;

* AFLW games being played as a double-header with the men’s matches throughout March.

 

[GremioPower]

Sheedy has suggested to make up the $$$ lost and give more content to broadcasters, play 28 minor round games for 3 years instead of 22 and play each team 5 times over 3 years - which would mean 1 season is 29 games.

Some will say bloody Sheedy again. But his rational is sound. Seasons used to have night series/preseason games. He said his first year in 1981 he coached in 5 night series games plus 22 minor round games for 27 games when players were part timers.

I remember looking at games played in the SANFL when the whole debate about how SANFL counted its games for the father son rules and saw that in 1988 I think it was, Peter Carey played 31 games which was added to his total games payed total ie 5 preseason cup games + 22 minor round games + 4 finals.

If part timers could play so many games I'm sure full time professionals could handle it with altered specific training schedules.

Plenty of people say that the gap between end of season and start of new season is too long. This is one way to reduce it and see if players can handle it.

The issue is if one side after 10 games has won 0 or 1 game it will be a long 18 games without the prospect of making finals. That's why it could be tried for 3 years but not become a permanent thing.

If this happens then every club should be allowed to play 2 of their 14 home games away from their normal home ground stadium, if they want to and can negotiate better stadium deals for those games.

That way we could play a home game in China and a home game at Alberton - provided some upgrades are put in. China might be put on hold for 2 or 3 years so that would be 2 games at Alberton which gives us the chance to make some decent $$$$ from those games with no greedy SMA involved, but they get an extra home game to help them as we would play 12 instead of 11 at AO.

If its good enough to play in minor round games at stadiums like Alice Springs, Ballarat, Cairns why not Alberton??

It also would mean all 18 teams have an AFLW team as Sheedy wants double headers in March.

Kevin Sheedy says 28-round home and away seasons in each of the next three years would help save football

Part of Kevin Sheedy's long-term scheduling plan would include:

* Scrapping the pre-season series;

* Starting before the NRL season;

* Playing games on Tuesday and Wednesday nights;

* Quarters remaining at 16 minutes each plus time-on;

* Six players per team on interchange;

* AFLW games being played as a double-header with the men’s matches throughout March.

It makes tons of sense actually.

 

[tribey]

Sheedy has suggested to make up the $$$ lost and give more content to broadcasters, play 28 minor round games for 3 years instead of 22 and play each team 5 times over 3 years - which would mean 1 season is 29 games.

Some will say bloody Sheedy again. But his rational is sound. Seasons used to have night series/preseason games. He said his first year in 1981 he coached in 5 night series games plus 22 minor round games for 27 games when players were part timers.

I remember looking at games played in the SANFL when the whole debate about how SANFL counted its games for the father son rules and saw that in 1988 I think it was, Peter Carey played 31 games which was added to his total games payed total ie 5 preseason cup games + 22 minor round games + 4 finals.

If part timers could play so many games I'm sure full time professionals could handle it with altered specific training schedules.

Plenty of people say that the gap between end of season and start of new season is too long. This is one way to reduce it and see if players can handle it.

The issue is if one side after 10 games has won 0 or 1 game it will be a long 18 games without the prospect of making finals. That's why it could be tried for 3 years but not become a permanent thing.

If this happens then every club should be allowed to play 2 of their 14 home games away from their normal home ground stadium, if they want to and can negotiate better stadium deals for those games.

That way we could play a home game in China and a home game at Alberton - provided some upgrades are put in. China might be put on hold for 2 or 3 years so that would be 2 games at Alberton which gives us the chance to make some decent $$$$ from those games with no greedy SMA involved, but they get an extra home game to help them as we would play 12 instead of 11 at AO.

If its good enough to play in minor round games at stadiums like Alice Springs, Ballarat, Cairns why not Alberton??

It also would mean all 18 teams have an AFLW team as Sheedy wants double headers in March.

Kevin Sheedy says 28-round home and away seasons in each of the next three years would help save football

Part of Kevin Sheedy's long-term scheduling plan would include:

* Scrapping the pre-season series;

* Starting before the NRL season;

* Playing games on Tuesday and Wednesday nights;

* Quarters remaining at 16 minutes each plus time-on;

* Six players per team on interchange;

* AFLW games being played as a double-header with the men’s matches throughout March.

All this is obviously contingent on some moron on another continent not consuming biohazardous wildlife and sending us right back to this point or worse within 18 months-5 years.

 

[TeeKray]

Playing more games is very logical, even was before this crisis. The AFLPA won't like it because their mantra is less work, more pay. Stuff them. They're professional footballers, they can play football. Keep the list sizes where they are and rotate players through for conditioning.

 

[Burningleviathan]

Sheedy has suggested to make up the $$$ lost and give more content to broadcasters, play 28 minor round games for 3 years instead of 22 and play each team 5 times over 3 years - which would mean 1 season is 29 games.

I have argued before that this is how they should do the schedule except i had four times over three years. It's as close to fair as we can get and your double up teams can be set years in advance so no manipulation of the draw.
Instead we get nonsense like conferences.

 

[Capital Power]

Playing more games is very logical, even was before this crisis. The AFLPA won't like it because their mantra is less work, more pay. Stuff them. They're professional footballers, they can play football. Keep the list sizes where they are and rotate players through for conditioning.

This is certainly Dangerfield's mantra, but does he really speak for the majority of the players? I would imagine particularly the younger players would welcome more opportunity to prove themselves and cement a first 22 spot.

 

[TeeKray]

This is certainly Dangerfield's mantra, but does he really speak for the majority of the players? I would imagine particularly the younger players would welcome more opportunity to prove themselves and cement a first 22 spot.

I think you're right, there would be a decent chunk of players who would be happy with more footy, but they aren't going to speak out against the majority who want their big long holidays, etc.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Thanks to Kwality in another thread for posting the link to the message from Freo Ceo Simon Garlick to members yesterday about their position and he outlines some of the things the AFL have done re their financial package. I will cut out the Freo specific stuff, so you get an idea of what all clubs have had to comply with so far and what Port have to comply with if, ok when, they ask for further assistance from AFL.

An update from the CEO

A letter to members and supporters from Fremantle CEO Simon Garlick on the COVID-19 crisis.

www.fremantlefc.com.au

To our Purple Army,
I hope that you and your family are healthy and safe.
......
The AFL is continuing to work with all 18 clubs to ensure the game’s sustainability, not just for the next few months but with a clear focus on the long-term. The challenges for the AFL and the clubs have been and remain enormous.You are all aware of the reality of the situation and that a massive reduction in football related revenues associated with a standard season means the existence of our Club, and the code itself is at stake.

A recent and crucial outcome achieved by the AFL to help all clubs survive the Covid-19 crisis was to secure a significant funding facility from the NAB and ANZ, using Marvel Stadium and other assets as security.

The banks placed strict conditions on the AFL in return for the draw down capacity the funding facility provides. With that in mind, the AFL has, understandably, in turn placed stringent controls across all clubs who access the facility over time.

The confirmation of the line of credit saw all 18 clubs sign the AFL’s Covid-19 Pandemic - Letter of Financial Support, which was precipitated by a drastic cost cutting program across the entire industry.
......

The Letter of Financial Support provides strict guidelines which all clubs are required to operate under and adhere to and were critical in helping the AFL both procure and maintain the funding lines the industry will need to get through this crisis.

The practical way in which this will work, is that the AFL will provide an identical fund to all clubs to cover the renegotiated player payments for the remainder of the year, however all other previous funding provided to clubs by the AFL has been withdrawn until 31 October.

What that means is that we are now required to pay for all other staffing costs and operational expenditure associated with the administration of our Club for the remainder of the year.

There are some clubs, as you will have heard, who believe they have sufficient cash flow to get through the entire year off their own bat, while other clubs will require assistance from the AFL within a matter of weeks.

When a club does require funding assistance, it will take the form of an interest free loan up until 31 October this year. The key implication of becoming an AFL assisted club, is that any loan funds obtained from the AFL will ultimately be interest bearing from 1 November, 2020.

The more a club requires to borrow, the more it will have to pay back and the more challenges that presents in the future.

The clear message I want to convey to you is that we will do everything we possibly can, for as long as we can, to remain debt free and what the AFL deems as an “unassisted club” for as long as possible.We will look to achieve this through strong financial management, managing our costs as tightly as possible, and at the same time looking for ways to retain and even build revenue, while continuing to be focussed on being the best AFL club we can be on and off field. We will also be relying on the patience, understanding and support of our loyal and passionate members and supporters like we never have before.

Prior to the Covid-19 crisis, Fremantle was one of a handful of clubs that was debt-free and held cash reserves.

But the reality of the situation is, that at some stage in 2020, we are likely to require to seek some funding assistance from the AFL.

Rest assured however that in the event that we are required to incur some form of debt, your Club will do everything it can to ensure it takes on as little as possible and has plans in place to eradicate it as soon as practical. It is abundantly clear that the stronger financial position that the Club is in and the less debt we have when we emerge from this crisis, the better off the Club will be in the short and long-term.

The retention of revenue, including broadcast, sponsorship, membership and ticketing revenues, is proving challenging, given there still remains a level of uncertainty over the timing and make up of season 2020.

We do know that the AFL and all 18 clubs will do everything possible to ensure that we play the remaining 144 games and finals.
......

Any decision by the AFL on when the season could resume will be based on advice from Federal and State governments and relevant health experts, as it should be. Whether games are played every night of the week involving clubs in hubs or clusters to get a high volume of games and the season up and running, or double and triple headers, the one thing we do know is this year is going to look like no other.

The rule book is out the window and it’s going to allow us to make some bold decisions as an industry.

We'll know more in a couple of weeks whether that will be soon or if we have to wait a little bit longer to get the season going again.

Understandably you want to find out as much as you can about how the format of the season will affect your membership entitlements. But at this stage we are yet to have clarity on whether, for example, the 144 games are played in empty stadiums or a combination of some games with members and supporters in the stands and some without.
..........

In the article Caro wrote on 3rd of April and I posted at #205 says the interest charged on any borrowings left after 31st October will be charged at 3.3%.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

From Gil's virtual presser today with jouno's. You can watch the full 21 minute video at

When will footy return? AFL CEO on coronavirus latest

League chief executive Gillon McLachlan's expansive and wide-ranging press conference

www.afl.com.au

If you think KT ummhs and arrghs a lot, well Gil is in the same league. But he looks tired and stressed and hasn't had a shave for a couple of weeks I reckon.

Gill on longer seasons, the draft and when footy could return

The key takeaways from Gillon McLachlan's expansive and wide-ranging press conference

www.afl.com.au

SUPPLEMENTING a reduced 2020 season with more matches next year appears unlikely, with AFL CEO Gillon McLachlan casting doubt over the League's ability to fit more games into future schedules. There has been a widespread view that additional matches will need to be played from next season in order to help both teams and the League recover from the financial pitfalls of the coronavirus crisis.

REVEALED The AFL's plan to restart footy

The current campaign has already been reduced to just 17 matches per side, with the season in the midst of a suspension period that will last until at least May 31 due to the global outbreak of the COVID-19 virus.

However, speaking in a Zoom call with reporters on Thursday, McLachlan said there were a number of issues that could hamper the AFL's ability to expand future seasons beyond the traditional 22 matches.

"It is challenging to think of going beyond 22 rounds for a few reasons," McLachlan said.

"There is venue availability, there's challenges around the ability of the players to cope with an extended season and we've got commitments and contracts with venues, broadcasters and others that are challenging to roll into different seasons.

"It might be possible, we'll have a look at it. But instinctively, there are some structural challenges to doing that. But right now, there aren't bad ideas. It's incumbent upon us to look at everything."

Here are the key takeaways from McLachlan's expansive and wide-ranging press conference:

ON WHEN THE AFL WILL DECIDE ABOUT THE RETURN OF PLAY …
"We've been working towards making a public announcement by the end of April. That would contemplate having narrowed down all of the alternatives to a way that we would resume our season. We'll be clear about in what form our resumption would take and I'm optimistic that it would have a return-to-training date and a season resumption date. That's the intention. We flagged that some weeks ago and we're still confident we can get to that position by the end of April."

ON THE POTENTIAL OF PLAYING IN HUBS …
"It's incumbent upon us to look at every option. That ranges from playing the way we have historically, to various levels of quarantine. We are working with the right people, the government, security experts and the right medical officers to get a considered view about the right way to take us forward."

ON WHAT THE DRAFT WILL LOOK LIKE THIS YEAR …
"I'm very confident that the draft will go ahead. Clearly, there's a possibility that it will be in a different form. But we will need a draft. The draft age is being discussed by working groups. I know there are various views on all of that, but one thing I've heard in the last 24 hours from various people around football – and, again, this is trying to help without being definitive – is that the best 18-year-old kids are walking straight into very good teams and are having an impact straightaway. People are looking for the whole draft class to be more mature, but they certainly don't want to have less access to the best 18-year-olds. Hopefully that gives you a level of direction."

ON HOW THE MATCHES WILL LOOK UPON THE RESUMPTION OF COMPETITION …
"The shorter quarters, we've already seen. Certainly, the reality is that we'll be starting without crowds. That gives us flexibility with the scheduling. I don't have an answer on interchange, but I know Steve Hocking is looking at it at the moment. The reality is that we need to be agile and flexible and we've said that right the way through to get this season away."

ON WHETHER THE 30-DAY SUSPENSION IF A PLAYER TESTS POSITIVE TO THE CORONAVIRUS WILL CONTINUE IN THE FUTURE …
"The 30 days applied when we didn't have the protocols and the resilience measures that we have now and will certainly have in place with our players. With all of that stuff we are increasingly aware of as individuals about how we put resilience measures in place to protect ourselves individuals, families, work forces … we're optimistic it will be shorter than that (the minimum 30 days) going forward."

ON WHETHER CUTS TO LISTS WILL HAPPEN THIS YEAR …
"No, there's certainly not anything I'm aware of where it would happen this year. For reasons that are obvious, all aspects of football are under review going forward. List sizes have come up, but I have no information that it would mean it would have any impact this year."

ON THE MINIMUM NUMBER OF GAMES NEEDED THIS YEAR …
"I've talked about integrity. Our focus is on getting 144 games away. At the moment, we're not looking at doing anything other than that. We're not looking at shorter seasons or anything else. Today, in mid-April … it feels possible."