Gabba surface under Critisicm again

[Rockliff38]

It seems the Gabba cannot catch a break. Last week Jared Brennan said that it caused his injury last year and now Ross Lyon is taking a crack at it.

http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl...r-brisbane-lions/story-e6frf3e3-1226043306902

 

[Lets Roar like '44]

Re: Gabba surface under Chritisicm again

The Lions have been complaining about the pitch, and the hard surface for 10 years. Until the cricketers decide to comply, it's gonna stay that way for a while yet

 

[justlookingaround]

Re: Gabba surface under Chritisicm again

Criticism*

 

[Rockliff38]

Re: Gabba surface under Chritisicm again

Criticism*

Haha thanks missed that bit.

 

[MICKYCONLAN]

Re: Gabba surface under Chritisicm again

Agree with ross Lyon 100 %. He wasn't hysterical or slamming the surface. He quiely and calmly pointed out that it was a poor surface which detracted from game. It was dissapointing. Why didn't they put the sprinklers on the day before instead of the same day that the match was on?

 

[damochandler]

didn't the afl tell them to water the ground before every game or was that the gabba trust.

queensland cricket and the gabba trust can always say. go play somewhere else

 

[Haggis McHaggis]

didn't the afl tell them to water the ground before every game or was that the gabba trust.

queensland cricket and the gabba trust can always say. go play somewhere else

Bingo. Courtesy of the last round of whinging to come out of a Melbourne based club, in Collingwood. Not only that, but we no longer get reserves games before the seniors. I used to love going & spending an afternoon watching the 2's, then the big show in the evening. Eddie got that taken away, and the whinging continues. To be honest, I'm completely ****ing sick of it.

 

[Sir G]

didn't the afl tell them to water the ground before every game or was that the gabba trust.

queensland cricket and the gabba trust can always say. go play somewhere else

The trust wouldn't be stupid enough to say such a thing. Where else would they attract a co tenant that can pay the rent they charge the Lions and also think the Qld Govt would have a say after the amount of money they poured into the redevelopment. Other atest match and traditional one dayer,now 20/20 the Gabba would struggle without the Lions being their. To add The suns playing draws extra attention to the gabba. So I doubt they will tell the Lions to play somewhere else.

 

[Tassie4ever]

To imply, or as many semi-literate St. Kilda supporters have said openly that we arranged for watering of the ground in an attempt to cheat, that the Lions have any say whatsoever in the surface preparation of the Gabba is possibly the most ridiculous accusation ever. If only.

What I find simply impossible to understand is why the curator needs to keep the centre area rolled during winter, as he quite obviously does. Does he anticipate a very, very early start to the cricket season? Perhaps around May/June?

Personally I await with great anticipation the first legal action. If the Lions have any sense they will have their arses covered with a very clear letter to the Gabba Trust outlining the dangers involved to players' welfare by having a centre square continually heavy rolled.

 

[Old Den]

The Gabba is a hard surface because of Brisbane's dry Winters...it is also a very well drained ground...the cricket pitch area is harder than the other parts of the ground when dry and slippery when wet...in this day and age common sense suggests that it shouldn't be there for the football season but it is still a dry Winter.

The long term aggregate of average rainfall April to September (the Footy season) is in the order of 290 mils or 58 mils per month.

Compared to the October to March figures of 860 mils or 123 mils per month.

 

[John]

Or just maybe the other night was warm and humid and there was a heavy dew on the ground.

I just finished mowing the back yard and the grass was wet. Damn that wet weather and humidity.


And tassie waiting "with great anticipation the first legal action" comes across to me as if you actually want a player to be injured so you can get your rocks off on a legal case. That seems a bit sad to me.

 

[The Flying Belgian]

Or just maybe the other night was warm and humid and there was a heavy dew on the ground.

I just finished mowing the back yard and the grass was wet. Damn that wet weather and humidity.

Fair suck John. I say the following as someone who is on the record of being somewhat of a traditionalist re: the Gabba pitch.

I've been watching footy at the Gabba since they came up from the Coast and that was the most problematic I've seen handling on a fine night that I can remember. The dew is usually synonymous with nighttime footy at the Gabba, even in winter, but that same-day watering can't have helped handling. I wonder if it had the desired outcome?

 

[Fassbasstd]

With all the modern technology available, would it not be easier to just have a 'drop in' cricket square?

 

[The Flying Belgian]

With all the modern technology available, would it not be easier to just have a 'drop in' cricket square?

Without reviving another thread and avoiding the cricket vs footy arguments, it's always been maintained that it's impossible to transport a drop-in pitch into the Gabba. There is not an entry with sufficient width apparently.

 

[John]

Fair suck John. I say the following as someone who is on the record of being somewhat of a traditionalist re: the Gabba pitch.

I've been watching footy at the Gabba since they came up from the Coast and that was the most problematic I've seen handling on a fine night that I can remember. The dew is usually synonymous with nighttime footy at the Gabba, even in winter, but that same-day watering can't have helped handling. I wonder if it had the desired outcome?

And with all due respect I wonder than how they took a mark in the mud back in the old days.

 

[NoelMugavin]

surface to hard...surface to wet ? come on...

damned if you do, damned if you dont...

both sides put up with the same conditions..move on Ross - take the four points and shut up

 

[Rockliff38]

surface to hard...surface to wet ? come on...

damned if you do, damned if you dont...

both sides put up with the same conditions..move on Ross - take the four points and shut up

It seems everytime a team plays at the gabba and they lose or nearly lose they always complain about the ground. And it's a different reason every time.

 

[Last of the Roys]

How about using something to try and get the moisture off the surface before the start of these night games? I think I have seen in cricket the use of a ride-on squeegee / roller type machine.

 

[The Flying Belgian]

And with all due respect I wonder than how they took a mark in the mud back in the old days.

They didn't.

 

[3KZ is Football]

''The condition really surprised me, to be honest,'' Lyon said. ''It hasn't rained for two days. Clearly the sprinklers were on the ground this morning to soften the pitch … it was like it had been raining.

''I think we've got a right to expect if it hasn't rained for two days to be a bit better than that.

''It certainly wasn't just dew, because we rolled up and it was wet underfoot"

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/gabba-surface-takes-another-hammering-20110422-1drih.html

I think Lyon's criticisms are perfectly reasonable, as the state of the ground impacted negatively on the game. Like me, there are many who enjoy the hard tackling and increased contested ball that are a feature of wet weather games, but also like me, most would be happy for Mother Nature to decide if the conditions were going to be wet or dry.

Quite apart from the result, I found the game to be ugly and a frustrating one to watch.

 

[Fassbasstd]

Without reviving another thread and avoiding the cricket vs footy arguments, it's always been maintained that it's impossible to transport a drop-in pitch into the Gabba. There is not an entry with sufficient width apparently.

Yeah FB, I read about that, but remain unconvinced. I reckon its just too hard for the 'owners'. Just wait for the first litigation case, then watch 'em make it happen!

Whats got more money! Cricket or Footy??

 

[John]

Yeah FB, I read about that, but remain unconvinced. I reckon its just too hard for the 'owners'. Just wait for the first litigation case, then watch 'em make it happen!

Whats got more money! Cricket or Footy??

The 'owners' are the tax payer of the state of QLD. As an 'owner' I will support any state government of any ilk that tells the tenants to go find a new stadium to play out off. This will happen just after they have made a litigation case against 'us'. mark my words it would be very easy to pull the joint down and sell it off. As is a huge possibility for a good few sites 'owned' by the tax payer in Wooloongabba I might add.

Seriously some of you need to think harder about some of these subjects and the consequences?

 

[western royboy]

For those who don't have a great deal of knowledge in the area of sporting ovals and their construction allow me to give you a few brief details so that you can make your own better informed opinion.

Turf Cricket Wickets

Turf Wickets are constructed from black cracking clays which have a high clay level and as such are able to hold a large amount of water in them as opposed to sand or loam based soils in which the water simply drains through. These soils when combined with a couch grass are ideal for preparing turf cricket wickets because when prepared properly they have an extremely hard surface (like concrete) that has a full covering of grass. The perfect wicket for most cricketers is one with pace and bounce. The pace and bounce come from compaction of the soil by rolling together with an even matting of grass. The GABBA is recognised as one of the best cricket wickets in the world because a) you have probably the worlds best curator - Kevin Mitchell Jnr and b) you have a perfecty constructed wicket square.

Things to note. As mentioned before the top layer of the cricket square is made up of black clay which when it becomes wet or very wet becomes slippery and if wet enough boggy. On the flipside when it is too dry it is like concrete. Watering them is a very difficult art and there is a fine line that can easily be crossed if unexpected atmospheric conditions such as fog, dew, mist or rain are not accuraely taken into account.

Rolling the wicket

It is still essential to roll the wicket even in footy season to keep it flat. Given that we have to water the wickets to make them safe that makes them prone to being ripped and gouged by the stops on players boots. If these were left as was it would be unsightly as well as allow water to pool on the wickets which would stop grass from growing / regrowing. It essential to keep the wickets flat at all times and a couch is a creeping grass rather than one that grows upwards the grass on the wickets is maintained at a lower height that that of the outfield.

Drop In Wickets

Drop in wickets have become more common in recent years as stadiums become more multi purpose. They are more suited to one off or limited use grounds rather than traditional cricket grounds because as a rule the compaction of the clay/turf is compromised in the moving and as a general rule they tend to produce wickets that are "slow" in that the reaction between ball and the pitch is dulled a bit. Slow wickets do not produce attractive cricket as opposed to a fast pitch.

The MCG had its choice it would still have turf wickets but given the contribution and usage from the AFL there was little choice but to move to drop ins. This has definately been to the detriment of cricket despite the best efforts of the curator.

The GABBA, SCG, WACA, Adelaide Oval and Bellreive Oval all still maintain a full Turf Wicket Square.

The Gabba Outfield

My understanding is that the hardness of the Gabba is not only related to the wicket area but also the outfield which was relaid prior to the 2000 Olympics Soccer being played there. The outfield is constructed of sandy loam and in most cases will have a different grass to the couch varieties that are on the cricket wickets. These soils and bases are designed specifically to drain well particularly given the tropical climate in Queensland. It is my understanding that they laid a harder "base" underneath the surface which when compacted makes the overall ground harder. Note that Etihad has a similar base and there have been complaints about how hard it is as opposed to say the MCG.

Watering

Watering the pitch area is essential prior to a game or esle it would be just too hard. As stated before it is a very difficult thing and Kevin Mitchell would be the best at it in the world no doubt but you are going to get variations.

With the outfied if you have watered during the day, then the moisture is still relatively high in the surface and any combination of humidity and or dew will bring it back up to the surface.

That is all I know.

 

[Quigley]

The 'owners' are the tax payer of the state of QLD. As an 'owner' I will support any state government of any ilk that tells the tenants to go find a new stadium to play out off. This will happen just after they have made a litigation case against 'us'. mark my words it would be very easy to pull the joint down and sell it off. As is a huge possibility for a good few sites 'owned' by the tax payer in Wooloongabba I might add.

Seriously some of you need to think harder about some of these subjects and the consequences?

Really?

So if you were in charge and you were sued you would get rid of your most profitable tennant and then commit political suicide by selling off the Gabba for development?

Come on John I know you are savy in these things. Absolutely zero chance of either of those things happening no matter which way it went.

 

[idel one]

Thanks for the advice re ground preparation RoyBoy.

One thing I do know about the Gabba (listened in to an ABC Grandstand chat before the Ashes Test between Quentin Hull & Kev Mitchell Jnr) is that the outfield has rye grass during winter, and couch grass during summer.

If I can remember it correctly, Kev mentioned that the rye grass had held on longer this year due to Brisbane not being as hot in October. Apparently the rye dies off as the heat increases,allowing the legends couch to grow through. He mentioned that they do have problems sometimes in summer with excess rain and lack of hot days - some of you might remember a few cricket seasons ago when the surface was very patchy due to a fungal infection that got hold when it was very wet.

He cuts the grass at different lengths during the cricket season, leaving it longer the closer they get to the end of the season.

There's probably a bit more than that too but that's the extent of my recollection. It got pretty technical about ph levels and drainage rates through the sand . . . I remember thinking at the time that whoever said it was easy to grow grass in Brisbane needed to sit down with Kev!

I'd be interested to know what fellow forumers regard as the ideal playing surface for AFL - there seems to be whinges about just about every venue - although funnily the SCG never seems to cop anything about its surface or its wicket block. Maybe they have found the magic formula!