NO TROLLS Homophobia in the AFL - 4 Corners

[phantom13]

Probably does, I'm not exonerating Aker here at all.

But not being able to speak his name? Come on, someone would have to do something really, really disgustingly heinous to even get close to that type of realm

I couldnt imagine getting to that point personally but i'm also not gonna pass judgement on someone else doing especially given Akers pretty obvious real thoughts on the matter.

Bob seems like a fairly emotional guy as well so i cant say it shocks me that he would be that way.

 

[Bluelegs]

Thought it was very well done on 4Corners last night.

The guy with AIDS, I remember that episode of the footy show. I remember his constant mentioning of a girlfriend and he got infected via a blood transfusion and not from travelling Europe partying. I didn't get that 'superpower' comment from Bob. If there was to be a player to come out it would surely be as they or shortly after they retire. Trying to do it whilst playing might seen as selfish by some teammates, fans, the club in general with the hyperbole that would surround it. Like someone said before the AFL would want a teary video and AFL360 would devote a week to it.

It's also been, what, almost 30 years since Ian Roberts came out when playing league for Manly?

It was a nice sentiment from Murphy and his heart is obviously in the right place, but it was a little fanciful and somewhat patronising to say having an openly gay player would make a team better. The dream should rather be that a gay player would feel so comfortable with their identity that it isn't anything special, that it would be a non-issue as a player but also something they feel comfortable to express openly.

Don't really agree that teammates or others at a club would view it as selfish. Those people should grow up if they think a person not having to hide who they are is selfish in any way.

 

[00Stinger]

Off-topic, but I found out recently that Australian officials threatened to boycott games involving Magic Johnson at the 1992 Olympics because Andrew Gaze didn't want AIDS.

30 years ago, I know, but it did make me think about what a bunch of backward *in' yokels we really are sometimes.

Did Magic Johnson keep playing after getting HIV? I always thought he stopped playing after his diagnosis

If that is the case I don't think this one is as clear cut as you make it out to be

 

[BomberManU]

I made that pretty clear a few times

The fact that Murphy cannot even bring himself to say Akermanis' name over some ignorant comments is ridiculous and over the top

Yes, that part I agree with, no matter how big a fool Aker is. And 'fool' is being kind.

 

[00Stinger]

I couldnt imagine getting to that point personally but i'm also not gonna pass judgement on someone else doing especially given Akers pretty obvious real thoughts on the matter.

Bob seems like a fairly emotional guy as well so i cant say it shocks me that he would be that way.

Aker has a few ****ed up thoughts, no one can doubt that

Bob's comments come off as a bit preachy to me. If Akers comments were more hatefully aggressive, I would still think its over the top but a bit more understandable.

 

[phantom13]

Off-topic, but I found out recently that Australian officials threatened to boycott games involving Magic Johnson at the 1992 Olympics because Andrew Gaze didn't want AIDS.

30 years ago, I know, but it did make me think about what a bunch of backward *in' yokels we really are sometimes.

To be fair in 1992 Gazey wouldnt have been alone in thinking that.

 

[BomberManU]

The footage from the Footy Show was cringe.

 

[kickazz]

Off-topic, but I found out recently that Australian officials threatened to boycott games involving Magic Johnson at the 1992 Olympics because Andrew Gaze didn't want AIDS.

30 years ago, I know, but it did make me think about what a bunch of backward *in' yokels we really are sometimes.

I thought it was Phil Smyth, not Gaze.

 

[phantom13]

Aker has a few ****ed up thoughts, no one can doubt that

Bob's comments come off as a bit preachy to me. If Akers comments were more hatefully aggressive, I would still think its over the top but a bit more understandable.

Yeh Bob was a touch preachy, he sort of always has been but i also think youre judging Bobs thoughts about him based on Aker being pretty measured and considered in an interview that he would have been acutely aware would be framing him in a certain light. Bob has years of private conversations with Aker to consider and Aker got sacked for his part in it all, Bob got asked up onto the podium when the dogs won the flag...

It wouldnt shock me in the slightest if Aker is a full blown hate preaching homophobe and thats what Bob is reacting to moreso than a pretty shit take in a column from 20 odd years ago.

 

[tandino]

Did Magic Johnson keep playing after getting HIV? I always thought he stopped playing after his diagnosis

If that is the case I don't think this one is as clear cut as you make it out to be

He retired upon being diagnosed, but returned to play in the All-Star game that year, which was contentious for similar issues, and then played in the Olympics. He then had a NBA comeback in the second half of the 1996 season.

 

[_Mike_]

The fact that Murphy cannot even bring himself to say Akermanis' name over some ignorant comments is ridiculous and over the top

There's history between Aker and Muprhy, but not just Murphy. Aker burnt bridges with L Matthews and many others. Acker was always outspoken, brash, uncensored and came across as a narcissist. When things went wrong at the Lions he was the first to point fingers.

Quote Leigh Matthews “I could never work out whether the series of conflicts that arose with Aker were just random or cleverly planned. He was already contracted (to Brisbane) for the 2007 season, but I think he saw himself as the next Sam Newman and just maybe wanted to get to Melbourne to pursue the greater AFL media opportunities down south.”

Villains - Jason Akermanis - The Mongrel Punt

How do you remember Jason Akermanis? The magician in Brisbane colours, or the man who was ostracised by the footy world? Hero? Or Villain?

themongrelpunt.com

 

[Percel]

Don't forget that a certain AFLW player refused to play in a game where she would have to wear a rainbow flag on her jumper because of cultural reasons

Or Isarael Folau and his remarks a few years back. Or a heap of the NRL players just last year

That was quite a strong reaction. There's a lot more Pasifika (incl strong Christianity) playing league than what were in Roberts time, so there's potential for further situations to flare up if mor NRL players were to come out.

 

[_Mike_]

The footage from the Footy Show was cringe.

The footy show is cringe.. fixed that.

 

[Mr_Bojangles]

Did Magic Johnson keep playing after getting HIV? I always thought he stopped playing after his diagnosis

If that is the case I don't think this one is as clear cut as you make it out to be

He did retire immediately and then came back for the All Stars game 6 months later and the Olympics before playing for the Lakers a little while longer.

It was Smythe that said he didn't want to play against Magic, not Gaze.

 

[notliondown]

Geez the whole it's none of our business arguments frustrate me... and it completely misses the point of the whole investigation and the larger issue in general. If your not interested in whether or not a player is gay don't watch, don't listen. Perhaps don't make the effort of going into a thread and posting it because is sure seems like you are interested if you go to all that trouble.

It's also not about forcing someone to come out or forcing them to take his partner to the Brownlow or live his life in the public eye.

The question is, does a player off his own back and comfortable enough in his own sexuality, feel that the AFL is a safe enough space for him to make those choices for himself? No more and no less.

The fact that people claim to know gay players, past and present and almost certainly future, yet no has made that choice is the issue.

The fact that clubs and players alike shut down when the question was asked speaks volumes.

This isn't about forcing players to be out or shoving their sexuality down your throats. It's about gay players feeling they have same freedoms and security that eveyone else takes for granted and trying to ensure they are protected from the village idiots.

Like it or not the AFL have a history of publicly leading and contributing to societal conversations. As they should. They should lead by example, they should try to be better and they should help normalize acceptance and tolerance.

The question here is, after publically committing to do so, have they? Or is this topic too hard and they hope empty rhetoric will be enough. Being held to account is no bad thing.

 

[Toump Ass]

OK so I totally lied about it being Andrew Gaze. I have no idea who was behind the boycott threats.
(Edit: The article I read just said Australian Delegation, another article points to an Australian doctor).

To be fair in 1992 Gazey wouldnt have been alone in thinking that.

Certainly not in this country, but that's the point.

I didn't read about any other country having a sook that Magic Johnson played.

 

[BomberManU]

The footy show is cringe.. fixed that.

Sure is, no doubt. But when you see specific instances, like the Brownless comments, I'm still shocked.

 

[phantom13]

OK so I totally lied about it being Andrew Gaze. I have no idea who was behind the boycott threats.


Certainly not in this country, but that's the point.

I didn't read about any other country having a sook that Magic Johnson played.

Id say pretty much every country in 1992.

You never seen Philadelphia or read anything about the AIDS crisis.

In 92 and through a decent chunk of the 90s mass hysteria about AIDS was off the charts. Im not defending it but that was a global thing.

 

[Bluelegs]

Id say pretty much every country in 1992.

You never seen Philadelphia or read anything about the AIDS crisis.

In 92 and through a decent chunk of the 90s mass hysteria about AIDS was off the charts. Im not defending it but that was a global thing.

Was just about to mention Philadelphia. Came out in 93 and was inspired by a number of real life cases.

 

[IKnowtheDog]

Aker was also involved in the leaking of confidential doggies material to the media.

Jerry Smith isn't in the NFL Hall of Fame, which gives an idea on the difficulties homosexuality and AIDS has in the US at the professional level.

 

[Bluelegs]

Before my time but I remember reading that Australia did pretty well in how AIDS was responded to comparatively to many other countries. Government bodies recognised and responded to it quickly and put in place a lot of disease prevention programs and public health advertisements that treated it as a medical issue.

Very different to somewhere like the US where the governement at the time were openly calling it the natural consequence of the gay lifestyle.

 

[blueboy25]

I thought it was Phil Smyth, not Gaze.

I thought it was Shane Heal

 

[00Stinger]

There's history between Aker and Muprhy, but not just Murphy. Aker burnt bridges with L Matthews and many others. Acker was always outspoken, brash, uncensored and came across as a narcissist. When things went wrong at the Lions he was the first to point fingers.

Quote Leigh Matthews “I could never work out whether the series of conflicts that arose with Aker were just random or cleverly planned. He was already contracted (to Brisbane) for the 2007 season, but I think he saw himself as the next Sam Newman and just maybe wanted to get to Melbourne to pursue the greater AFL media opportunities down south.”

Villains - Jason Akermanis - The Mongrel Punt

How do you remember Jason Akermanis? The magician in Brisbane colours, or the man who was ostracised by the footy world? Hero? Or Villain?

themongrelpunt.com

I'm not arguing for Aker at all

Just that being physically unable to say his name out loud is rather over the top

 

[Dazzler9]

Geez the whole it's none of our business arguments frustrate me... and it completely misses the point of the whole investigation and the larger issue in general. If your not interested in whether or not a player is gay don't watch, don't listen. Perhaps don't make the effort of going into a thread and posting it because is sure seems like you are interested if you go to all that trouble.

It's also not about forcing someone to come out or forcing them to take his partner to the Brownlow or live his life in the public eye.

The question is, does a player off his own back and comfortable enough in his own sexuality, feel that the AFL is a safe enough space for him to make those choices for himself? No more and no less.

The fact that people claim to know gay players, past and present and almost certainly future, yet no has made that choice is the issue.

The fact that clubs and players alike shut down when the question was asked speaks volumes.

This isn't about forcing players to be out or shoving their sexuality down your throats. It's about gay players feeling they have same freedoms and security that eveyone else takes for granted and trying to ensure they are protected from the village idiots.

Like it or not the AFL have a history of publicly leading and contributing to societal conversations. As they should. They should lead by example, they should try to be better and they should help normalize acceptance and tolerance.

The question here is, after publically committing to do so, have they? Or is this topic too hard and they hope empty rhetoric will be enough. Being held to account is no bad thing.

Genuine question. What is it the AFL needs to be doing? What specific actions?

 

[_Mike_]

I'm not arguing for Aker at all

Just that being physically unable to say his name out loud is rather over the top

Yeah, agree