How long do Kochie and Thomas wait?

[OneGreatClub]

Caro has been hinting at this for a couple of weeks and even Hutchy was bullish. They think Gold Coast preference is an experienced coach.

They think there is some disconnect with Koch and that he makes contradictory statements. Gary Lyon thought it was a bit of a reach.

Thanks. I know their rumours sometimes turn out to be right but they all creatively deal in innuendo. KT said that the 3 K's want to stay together and are very close. He sounded frustrated at the continual media rubbish. I noticed how testy Ken was too about all the media crap Dixon has to cop. I hope we move to a system of isolating ourselves from the media a bit like the Crows do and just release our own stuff. Caro etc hate that but at least the message can be more controlled.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Well Koch has made a lot of promises in the past and said personnel would not be going because they are under contract and they have.

Please just don't make any hasty decisions Port.

It's probably Ken starting the GC rumours to extend his contract at Port

I don't think that's Ken's style. Seems like a pretty open and honest bloke to me. Could be wrong i guess.

 

[raman]

Already on the last two pages of this thread the narrative seems to have shifted from "Ken will be lucky to keep his job" to "Port will be lucky to keep Ken". WTF.

 

[Capital Power]

I don't really follow the EPL but I notice this morning some poor coach has been sacked after just four matches in charge (all of which his team lost). If that were the norm in AFL, we could pick up Longmire . I'm all for "ruthless" but that does seem a little OTT.

 

[tribey]

Already on the last two pages of this thread the narrative seems to have shifted from "Ken will be lucky to keep his job" to "Port will be lucky to keep Ken". WTF.

The underlying narrative - and one that is even being echoed by some of our fans - is that we should be forever grateful that our penniless minnow of a club is now relatively competitive. That Hinkley is some sort of miracle worker we'll forever be indebted to.

Rather than the true state of play that is Port finally being able to punch its true weight with the cash injections of 2013 and beyond and if anything, underperforming badly since the obvious foundations laid and launchpad established in 13/14.

Merely making finals in 2017 was the goal after all...

 

[El_Scorcho]

We have completely lost the ruthlessness that defined our club.

The people who said that we'd stolen Alberton and stolen the Port Adelaide name were correct, in a way. We've stolen it from the Port Adelaide Football Club who sacked it's greatest legend as coach after seasons where we finished 3rd then 2nd because that wasn't good enough.

Nobody is arguing that we should be winning every 2nd flag at AFL level, but to not have a single win against a quality, in form football team in over 2 full seasons is completely unacceptable by any reasonable standards.

It makes me sick to my stomach that we are disgracing the antideluvian legends who made our club the greatest club in the country by extending the contract of the coach in these circumstances. #NotMyPortAdelaide

 

[The Flying Doormat]

We have completely lost the ruthlessness that defined our club.

The people who said that we'd stolen Alberton and stolen the Port Adelaide name were correct, in a way. We've stolen it from the Port Adelaide Football Club who sacked it's greatest legend as coach after seasons where we finished 3rd then 2nd because that wasn't good enough.

Nobody is arguing that we should be winning every 2nd flag at AFL level, but to not have a single win against a quality, in form football team in over 2 full seasons is completely unacceptable by any reasonable standards.

It makes me sick to my stomach that we are disgracing the antideluvian legends who made our club the greatest club in the country by extending the contract of the coach in these circumstances. #NotMyPortAdelaide

POTY...for squeezing in antideluvian

 

[Harlott]

We have completely lost the ruthlessness that defined our club.

The people who said that we'd stolen Alberton and stolen the Port Adelaide name were correct, in a way. We've stolen it from the Port Adelaide Football Club who sacked it's greatest legend as coach after seasons where we finished 3rd then 2nd because that wasn't good enough.

Nobody is arguing that we should be winning every 2nd flag at AFL level, but to not have a single win against a quality, in form football team in over 2 full seasons is completely unacceptable by any reasonable standards.

It makes me sick to my stomach that we are disgracing the antideluvian legends who made our club the greatest club in the country by extending the contract of the coach in these circumstances. #NotMyPortAdelaide

I agree with a lot of this but we sacked our greatest legend because we had arguably our greatest legend who had already coached four flags from 5 attempts waiting in the wings. I would suggest we would be equally ruthless if we knew Clarko was waiting in the wings right now.

 

[chiwigi]

I don't really follow the EPL but I notice this morning some poor coach has been sacked after just four matches in charge (all of which his team lost). If that were the norm in AFL, we could pick up Longmire . I'm all for "ruthless" but that does seem a little OTT.

If there was relegation in footy it would happen.
A relegation from the Premier League would cost a club 100's of millions. A relegation from the AFL to say the SANFL would turn it semi pro.

 

[powermacs]

It all hinges on the definition of "successful".

I'm seeing some of the derpiest posts I've ever read racking up the likes on the various facebook fanpages.

'Re-sign him he's a revolutionary and every other coach has copied him'

'Had we won on Saturday night with all those kids people would be hailing him as the next Sheedy'

'By re-signing we would be showing our faith in him'

'We have potential that he needs to see through'

As a populist morning show host these are precisely the types Koch would listen to.

I'm not so sure. The last few days Koch has started to use the word premiership instead of saying we want success. He's a businessman, I reckon he starting to see the light that just being good citizens doesn't guarantee success.

 

[powermacs]

I would imagine it's entirely possible that your Board would prefer not - on the basis of a season of improvement but only moderate success - not to extend Hinkley's contract and to see how things play out next year.

However they could have their hand forced by the Gold Coast - especially if Hinkley's manager is doing his job.

It's not a stretch to think that his manager could leverage a four year offer out of Gold Coast to entice Ken away from where he is (similar situation to contracted players). Then the manager turns around to Port and says he needs more security than entering into the final year with no guarantees of a new deal and so wants a minimum two year extension.

Now you're looking at the least worst option between extending him until the end of 2020 even though the jury's still out or seeing him walk now (and no I don't believe a contract will give you much protection).

Rock and a hard place...

Bullshit. You can't poach head coaches if they are under contract. We don't have to do a thing. The only way he's at GC next year is with our blessing. Which is what I hope happens.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

The people who said that we'd stolen Alberton and stolen the Port Adelaide name were correct, in a way. We've stolen it from the Port Adelaide Football Club who sacked it's greatest legend as coach after seasons where we finished 3rd then 2nd because that wasn't good enough.

I'm kind of curious who you mean here. Fos Williams? He was sacked after winning his 5th premiership in a row (1958) because he retired as a player and Bob McLean thought a playing coach was a necessity. He was sacked again in 1973 after finishing 2nd, 2nd and 5th in the preceding 3 years (and not having won a flag since 1965).

Not arguing your basic philosophy, just the facts around the removal of the coach.

 

[Andre]

I'm kind of curious who you mean here. Fos Williams? He was sacked after winning his 5th premiership in a row (1958) because he retired as a player and Bob McLean thought a playing coach was a necessity. He was sacked again in 1973 after finishing 2nd, 2nd and 5th in the preceding 3 years (and not having won a flag since 1965).

Not arguing your basic philosophy, just the facts around the removal of the coach.

I'm fairly sure he meant sacking Ebert as coach.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

I'm fairly sure he meant sacking Ebert as coach.

Okay I misread greatest legend as coach. But it's still not right. Ebert finished 4th his last two seasons. We went out of finals in straight sets and never played a prelim or grand final in those last 2 years. We never finished 3rd when Ebert was coach and were second in 1984. He was sacked at the end of 1987.

Russell only ever won one final as coach of Port in 5 years (the 1984 second semi final) and was replaced by John Cahill who if he wasn't the best sanfl coach of all time, was in the top 3. We're certainly not in that position this time.

Again not arguing the ruthlessness point. In fact rumour had it Bruce Weber wanted Jack back as coach in 1985 after Russell had led Port to a grand final in 1984.

 

[TeeKray]

Just listened to KT's 5AA interview.

• Saturday night was the most devastated he's ever been after a game of football. More painful than 2014 for him. Spoke to Robbie Gray who was "bawling his eyes out after the 2014 prelim" and Robbie thought it was close.

• Happy with our form overall but concerned with our forward line entries and ineffciency. Said our team looks good on paper but there is a disconnect somewhere. Need better ball users to deliver the ball forward.

• Outlined the Trengove situation well. Was a hard decision to leave him out given all that he has done for the club and meant to the club. Decision not taken lightly by the coaches, sound reasoning behind it. Gave the vibe that the club is bigger than the individual and tough calls have to be made.

• Has been concerned about the crowds all year. Said the club underestimated the level of discontent surrounding our 2015 and 2016 campaigns. Had made the assumption that crowds would return to 2014 levels if performance improved but they didn't. Wasn't as concerned by only 41k at the final, price sensitivity a major issue for some fans.

• Happy with the coaching panel and not looking to make changes to the football department. A lot of change last off season which was tough but effective. Davis and Nicks moved into new roles, Ken introducing a significantly new game plan. Aim for this off season is to build on gains made in the last 12 months.

People who are concerned with the administration of the club need to relax. Yes Kochie shoots his mouth of from time to time but he's not running the club day to day, KT has that under control. There is no way any of the other 17 AFL clubs have a CEO with a better understanding of how a football club works than KT. Add to that his outstanding interpersonal skills and he's almost certainly the best CEO in the business. Whatever he chooses to do with Ken will be based around a better understanding of the situation at the club than any of us have. Let's just trust in KT, he's not going to let us down.

 

[Holden Hillbilly]

In KT we trust.

 

[raman]

• Has been concerned about the crowds all year. Said the club underestimated the level of discontent surrounding our 2015 and 2016 campaigns. Had made the assumption that crowds would return to 2014 levels if performance improved but they didn't. Wasn't as concerned by only 41k at the final, price sensitivity a major issue for some fans.

Performance didn't return to 2014 levels either.

Edit: that said, it's refreshing to know that the club actually recognises the correlation!

 

[afl2004]

Just listened to KT's 5AA interview.

• Saturday night was the most devastated he's ever been after a game of football. More painful than 2014 for him. Spoke to Robbie Gray who was "bawling his eyes out after the 2014 prelim" and Robbie thought it was close.

• Happy with our form overall but concerned with our forward line entries and ineffciency. Said our team looks good on paper but there is a disconnect somewhere. Need better ball users to deliver the ball forward.

• Outlined the Trengove situation well. Was a hard decision to leave him out given all that he has done for the club and meant to the club. Decision not taken lightly by the coaches, sound reasoning behind it. Gave the vibe that the club is bigger than the individual and tough calls have to be made.

• Has been concerned about the crowds all year. Said the club underestimated the level of discontent surrounding our 2015 and 2016 campaigns. Had made the assumption that crowds would return to 2014 levels if performance improved but they didn't. Wasn't as concerned by only 41k at the final, price sensitivity a major issue for some fans.

• Happy with the coaching panel and not looking to make changes to the football department. A lot of change last off season which was tough but effective. Davis and Nicks moved into new roles, Ken introducing a significantly new game plan. Aim for this off season is to build on gains made in the last 12 months.

People who are concerned with the administration of the club need to relax. Yes Kochie shoots his mouth of from time to time but he's not running the club day to day, KT has that under control. There is no way any of the other 17 AFL clubs have a CEO with a better understanding of how a football club works than KT. Add to that his outstanding interpersonal skills and he's almost certainly the best CEO in the business. Whatever he chooses to do with Ken will be based around a better understanding of the situation at the club than any of us have. Let's just trust in KT, he's not going to let us down.

The lack of change to the coaching department will and has destroyed our chances for a flag for the next 3 to 5 years. We are in huge trouble if we don't cut this coaching department

 

[Lagooner]

Performance didn't return to 2014 levels either.

The only win we can hang our hat on this year is Sydney IMO.

For all the derp about not beating a top 8 team all year it's possible that we could end up beating the eventual premiers on their home turf. Not that it means all that much right now.

2015 called...

 

[El_Scorcho]

Okay I misread greatest legend as coach. But it's still not right. Ebert finished 4th his last two seasons. We went out of finals in straight sets and never played a prelim or grand final in those last 2 years. We never finished 3rd when Ebert was coach and were second in 1984. He was sacked at the end of 1987.

Russell only ever won one final as coach of Port in 5 years (the 1984 second semi final) and was replaced by John Cahill who if he wasn't the best sanfl coach of all time, was in the top 3. We're certainly not in that position this time.

Again not arguing the ruthlessness point. In fact rumour had it Bruce Weber wanted Jack back as coach in 1985 after Russell had led Port to a grand final in 1984.

I got my info from the 1986 and 1987 SANFL season pages from australianfootball.com, which showed the ladder at the end of the minor round. It appears that we finished 3rd and 2nd respectively in the minor round before going out in straight sets.

Regardless, it's certainly a different standard from what we're seeing today.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

I got my info from the 1986 and 1987 SANFL season pages from australianfootball.com, which showed the ladder at the end of the minor round. It appears that we finished 3rd and 2nd respectively in the minor round before going out in straight sets.

Regardless, it's certainly a different standard from what we're seeing today.

Okay, yeah unfortunately Russell just couldn't get them up for finals. Although that 1987 final against the Bays where we hit the post 5 times still burns.

Although if John Cahill hadn't been available, I doubt Port would have moved on Russell. It was messy enough as it was even to get Jack back.

 

[El_Scorcho]

Just listened to KT's 5AA interview.

• Saturday night was the most devastated he's ever been after a game of football. More painful than 2014 for him. Spoke to Robbie Gray who was "bawling his eyes out after the 2014 prelim" and Robbie thought it was close.

• Happy with our form overall but concerned with our forward line entries and ineffciency. Said our team looks good on paper but there is a disconnect somewhere. Need better ball users to deliver the ball forward.

• Outlined the Trengove situation well. Was a hard decision to leave him out given all that he has done for the club and meant to the club. Decision not taken lightly by the coaches, sound reasoning behind it. Gave the vibe that the club is bigger than the individual and tough calls have to be made.

• Has been concerned about the crowds all year. Said the club underestimated the level of discontent surrounding our 2015 and 2016 campaigns. Had made the assumption that crowds would return to 2014 levels if performance improved but they didn't. Wasn't as concerned by only 41k at the final, price sensitivity a major issue for some fans.

• Happy with the coaching panel and not looking to make changes to the football department. A lot of change last off season which was tough but effective. Davis and Nicks moved into new roles, Ken introducing a significantly new game plan. Aim for this off season is to build on gains made in the last 12 months.

People who are concerned with the administration of the club need to relax. Yes Kochie shoots his mouth of from time to time but he's not running the club day to day, KT has that under control. There is no way any of the other 17 AFL clubs have a CEO with a better understanding of how a football club works than KT. Add to that his outstanding interpersonal skills and he's almost certainly the best CEO in the business. Whatever he chooses to do with Ken will be based around a better understanding of the situation at the club than any of us have. Let's just trust in KT, he's not going to let us down.

KT has always been rock solid to me, which is why I hope the rumours of a Hinkley contract extention are false at this stage. An extension at this point doesn't put Hinkley under the required pressure to perform and doesn't leave us with an easy out if we stay on this plateau next season.

The lower crowd is a direct response to the lack of faith people have in this football team. If we finished 5th with a few big scalps along the way, i'd suggest our crowds would have been well up by the end of the season. People have been beaten down by our inability to win against good teams. It's hard to muster up the motivation to go and spend money when the team you're going to see are so frustratingly predictable.

Extend Hinkley's contract at this point and you'll take another membership hit next year, IMO.

 

[BornPort]

Just listened to KT's 5AA interview.

• Saturday night was the most devastated he's ever been after a game of football. More painful than 2014 for him. Spoke to Robbie Gray who was "bawling his eyes out after the 2014 prelim" and Robbie thought it was close.

• Happy with our form overall but concerned with our forward line entries and ineffciency. Said our team looks good on paper but there is a disconnect somewhere. Need better ball users to deliver the ball forward.

• Outlined the Trengove situation well. Was a hard decision to leave him out given all that he has done for the club and meant to the club. Decision not taken lightly by the coaches, sound reasoning behind it. Gave the vibe that the club is bigger than the individual and tough calls have to be made.

• Has been concerned about the crowds all year. Said the club underestimated the level of discontent surrounding our 2015 and 2016 campaigns. Had made the assumption that crowds would return to 2014 levels if performance improved but they didn't. Wasn't as concerned by only 41k at the final, price sensitivity a major issue for some fans.

• Happy with the coaching panel and not looking to make changes to the football department. A lot of change last off season which was tough but effective. Davis and Nicks moved into new roles, Ken introducing a significantly new game plan. Aim for this off season is to build on gains made in the last 12 months.

People who are concerned with the administration of the club need to relax. Yes Kochie shoots his mouth of from time to time but he's not running the club day to day, KT has that under control. There is no way any of the other 17 AFL clubs have a CEO with a better understanding of how a football club works than KT. Add to that his outstanding interpersonal skills and he's almost certainly the best CEO in the business. Whatever he chooses to do with Ken will be based around a better understanding of the situation at the club than any of us have. Let's just trust in KT, he's not going to let us down.

I think he's only half right regarding crowds. It's not just that we're not winning as much it's that we are ****ing painful to watch even if we do win. I've been dragging myself to watch us all year. It's a ****ing chore.

 

[jeg01]

KT has always been rock solid to me, which is why I hope the rumours of a Hinkley contract extention are false at this stage. An extension at this point doesn't put Hinkley under the required pressure to perform and doesn't leave us with an easy out if we stay on this plateau next season.

The lower crowd is a direct response to the lack of faith people have in this football team. If we finished 5th with a few big scalps along the way, i'd suggest our crowds would have been well up by the end of the season. People have been beaten down by our inability to win against good teams. It's hard to muster up the motivation to go and spend money when the team you're going to see are so frustratingly predictable.

Extend Hinkley's contract at this point and you'll take another membership hit next year, IMO.

 

[Bob Neil]

Bullshit. You can't poach head coaches if they are under contract. We don't have to do a thing. The only way he's at GC next year is with our blessing. Which is what I hope happens.

Of course you can legally hold them to a contract, I'm not disputing that - but would you actually enforce that right if your head coach just told you that his preference is to head to another mob instead for the next four years? At that point you're probably going to want them out of your club and so the whole contract issue becomes moot. That's the point I'm trying to make.