Religion Irreligion - the world's fastest growing 'religion'

[TheHeatleyStand]

Who then created the creator?

creator doesn't exist in time and space. God has always existed before the universe and before time

he exists outside of the paradigm you and I share with the cabbage

which is why all this is possible

you'll need to think about why that isn't more logical than what you think happened

 

[Moti]

An oldie but a goodie, have never heard even a vaguely plausible answer; except from literalists who suddenly become poets.

Apart from the fact it is probably is kinda poetry, it can work other ways. Day 1 is where it says let there be light, not Day 4, it mentions the distinct lights appear in the sky.

The words in that passage do not mean create or appear “from nothing” but “revealed”. If you look at evolutionary theory, it was only when the light and radiation reaches the earth that life is possible. Before that occurs it is only a light glow. You can tell day from night but not much else.

Once the atmosphere began developing then it was possible to distinguish the different celestial objects. Hence you can then identify the sun, moon and stars separately. This would happen after basic plants and animals populated the earth.

So it can work with basic science, not that anyone should be basing their faith on any of it.




On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Roylion]

creator doesn't exist in time and space. God has always existed before the universe and before time

How does one verify your claim? Or is this concept purely formed by man's imagination and believed as true totally by faith? Does one merely accept your claim because you say so?

he exists outside of the paradigm you and I share with the cabbage

Not only do you, I and the cabbage share the same paradigm. We share the same ancestor. Cabbage shares approximately 50% of the properties of the human gene. Cytochrome C is the protein that is common in both.

Very good. Evolution.

Well done. You're finally getting somewhere.

And 'He'? How do you know 'god' is a 'he'? Does 'god' have male genitalia?

Does 'god' look like this?

which is why all this is possible

Is it? There are no other possible explanations, other than the one provided by imagination and faith?

you'll need to think about why that isn't more logical than what you think happened

Yes, yes. Argument from first cause. Thomas Aquinas.

And of course while everything in the universe is assumed to have a cause, 'god' is free from this requirement.

 

[Boston tiger]

creator doesn't exist in time and space. God has always existed before the universe and before time

he exists outside of the paradigm you and I share with the cabbage

which is why all this is possible

you'll need to think about why that isn't more logical than what you think happened

“he exists outside of the paradigm you and I share with the cabbage”

That’s made my day.

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

How does one verify your claim? Or is this concept purely formed by man's imagination and believed as true totally by faith? Does one merely accept your claim because you say so?



Not only do you, I and the cabbage share the same paradigm. We share the same ancestor. Cabbage shares approximately 50% of the properties of the human gene. Cytochrome C is the protein that is common in both.

Very good. Evolution.

Well done. You're finally getting somewhere.

And 'He'? How do you know 'god' is a 'he'? Does 'god' have male genitalia?

Does 'god' look like this?

View attachment 665918



Is it? There are no other possible explanations, other than the one provided by imagination and faith?



Yes, yes. Argument from first cause. Thomas Aquinas.

And of course while everything in the universe is assumed to have a cause, 'god' is free from this requirement.

God is God
he has no human form
he is omnipresent and omnipotent limitless and boundless
I call him a he so a simpleton might understand as his vastness can not be comprehended
to us even an aircraft carrier is too large to fathom so how can one fathom God who he is not of time or space?

I think your perception of what God is is very, very limited!

which is why you don't get it!

it's very difficult to describe something unlimited to a mind that is limited by what can be seen through a microscope.. and when he can no longer find the equation pretend there is no equation

tell me my friend... do you also believe in climate change?
do you think it will destroy earth?

 

[Roylion]

God is God, he has no human form

How do you know this?

So man was not created in God's image?

he is omnipresent and omnipotent limitless and boundless

How do you know this?

I call him a he so a simpleton might understand as his vastness can not be comprehended

Why not call 'god' an 'it'? That is also easy to udnerstand.

to us even an aircraft carrier is too large to fathom so how can one fathom God who he is not of time or space?

I don't find an aircraft carrier to large to fathom. If God is not of time and space, how can you know of 'god's existance or nature?

I think your perception of what God is is very, very limited!

I don't know what god is or even if God exists.. I submit that you don't either. Nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of god.

it's very difficult to describe something unlimited to a mind

So how do you know that? Is 'god' a product of your imagination?

tell me my friend... do you also believe in climate change?

The scientific evidence appears to be in support of climate change.

do you think it will destroy earth?

No. The planet's climate has changed in the past. And will again in the future.

 

[Boston tiger]

How do you know this?

So man was not created in God's image?



How do you know this?



Why not call 'god' an 'it'? That is also easy to udnerstand.



I don't find an aircraft carrier to large to fathom. If God is not of time and space, how can you know of 'god's existance or nature?



I don't know what god is or even if God exists.. I submit that you don't either. Nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of god.



So how do you know that? Is 'god' a product of your imagination?



The scientific evidence appears to be in support of climate change.



No. The planet's climate has changed in the past. And will again in the future.

Fun Fact

Ancient Hebrew had no grammatically neutral-gender pronouns.

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

How do you know this?

So man was not created in God's image?



How do you know this?



Why not call 'god' an 'it'? That is also easy to udnerstand.



I don't find an aircraft carrier to large to fathom. If God is not of time and space, how can you know of 'god's existance or nature?



I don't know what god is or even if God exists.. I submit that you don't either. Nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of god.



So how do you know that? Is 'god' a product of your imagination?



The scientific evidence appears to be in support of climate change.



No. The planet's climate has changed in the past. And will again in the future.

I know this because everything is so perfect
a super ego did the calculations to put everything in place
everything exactly in its place.. all the calculations are so exact that you as a human work so perfectly
you have ears to capture sound
you can smell and think and have awareness
you even know what's wrong and what's right

but look around you and wonder at all the beauty you can see with your eyes and feel with your heart!
you can create and you can write and you can climb and you can find water to replenish your body

you think this is all some kind of randomness?

if you believe that the whole of the universe and it's exactness happened randomly or as Hitchens says " might have been aliens" you should go buy a tatts ticket tonight

but my theory of a super ego putting the world together in its exactness has to be better than any kind of explanation you or Christopher Hitchens can or have given so far!

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

Fun Fact

Ancient Hebrew had no grammatically neutral-gender pronouns.

if you follow it through Christianity

God arrives to us in a human form but not in his God form
that's the Christian explanation

so if he was to come to us as God he wouldn't have arrived as his human form in Christ!

and to tell us to become more "godlike" we move to the philosophical theological " Theosis" to become more like the vastness of God by walking through Christ as the doorway!

you should actually read some Hellenic philosophers and follow the dots into Christianity and the language of the Bible

if you're unlearned in the scriptures it's very easy to believe narratives

the early church fathers never said God was human in form which is why God through Christ became human to allow us to interact and hopefully understand what we should be doing for each other to live in a better society

forgive
love

and the "acts "
how to behave!)

I'm not sure how there's so much hate for Christianity when we live in such a depressed, cold, selfish society

anyway certainly beats a blackboard full of formulas that prove nothing and go nowhere showcasing the ignorance of man without time and tested moral structures

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

humans have always known that science and religion go hand in hand

because without religion you have your focus on science which is not so much for moral good but for markets and profits

it's the same with culture etc

the kind of art we have today is funny

it's more a way that rich people can wash money than actual art

when you go to Europe and you see what Christianity inspired in culture you'll get my gist when you compare that to modernism nihilism
the festivals
the beautiful beautiful architecture and paintings
the music

you really can't compare modernists secular culture to that

it's funny to even try

 

[Roylion]

I know this because everything is so perfect

Everything is not "so perfect".

Disease, oncogenes, mutations

All you're arguing is the concept of Irreducible complexity

a super ego did the calculations to put everything in place
everything exactly in its place.. all the calculations are so exact that you as a human work so perfectly

I don't work perfectly.

you think this is all some kind of randomness?

Yep. In terms of the development of life on this planet it's called evolution for which the scientific evidence is overwhelming.

if you believe that the whole of the universe and it's exactness happened randomly or as Hitchens says " might have been aliens"

Hitchens said no such thing. You're just making this up.

What he did say was:

“My own view is that this planet is used as a penal colony, lunatic asylum and dumping ground by a superior civilization, to get rid of the undesirable and unfit. I can't prove it, but you can't disprove it either.”

but my theory of a super ego putting the world together in its exactness has to be better than any kind of explanation you or Christopher Hitchens can or have given so far!

Your theory of a "super ego" is not backed up by any sort of evidence at all. It's merely your opinion backed by nothing more than faith, lilely inspired by a fee ancient writings, now collected in some 'holy book'

I'll ask again. Why should I accept your claim that "a super ego put the world together in its exactness"?

 

[chelseacarlton]

It's interesting reading the pseduo-intellectual religious come up with logical fallacies and circular one-liners to "prove" that God is beyond science... I imagine they are quite smug... you know that smug look, like the one Cardinal Pell had when debating Richard Dawkins on Q&A a few years back.

Just for the lols

 

[chelseacarlton]

It is true that a God such as Christians believe – infinite, far beyond human power to understand – is difficult to proves his existence, hence why faith is essential. By the same token, it is also impossible to demonstrate his non-existence hence why millions of rational folks still stick fat.

Ok, prove to me that I’m not harbouring a pink, rainbow glitter farting unicorn in my garage and I’ll use the same technique you do?

 

[chelseacarlton]

Not quite.Christianity doesn’t muck around. We saw him rise from the dead. It becomes ..do you believe your fellow man. This is the platform that Christianity is based on .

“That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon and touched with our hands, concerning the word of life . . . that which we have seen and heard we proclaim also to you, so that you may have fellowship with us (1 John 1:1, 3).

Why should I believe?”, John is saying, “Because we saw him risen from the dead, we talked to him, we touched him,” etc.

Lol
Quoting the bible is not a rational way to debate!
Rewritten into Latin from Greek translations of copied Hebrew text, passed on by word of mouth.
Yeh, I don’t see a problem here at all!

 

[chelseacarlton]

a painting has a creator
your house
your computer

tell me one thing that doesn't have a cause that made it exist

The universe!

 

[M Malice]

I have yet to see a skerrick of evidence from you TheHeatleyStand of the existence of a institutionalized religious style creator other than take my word for it and classic god of the gaps arguments.

If you'd be so bold as to share a personal experience/s or an epiphany moment re your god faith I'd be interested to hear it or was it purely your logical mind that led you to that conclusion.

Talking an impressive amount of fluff though, are you standing for election on the 15th? You'd fit in seamlessly.

 

[chelseacarlton]

by the way irreligion is only the fastest growing religion in the West
but the West is population negative
and it's being replenished with religious people who breed much faster than secular people!
also religion is really catching on in places like China and Cuba

so I doubt the world is becoming more irreligious with its 1 child a family average

I'm pretty sure no matter the propaganda.. that the world is becoming more religious

but traditional western white people that are secular are being surpassed ...

love to see the overall statistics and projections into the next score

There are massive underground non belief movements in Islamic countries, particularly amongst the younger generations.
It’s not a good idea to be open about it, much like being gay if you play in the AFL, ARU, NRL, Australian Cricket etc.
Women don’t seem to have an issue in elite Aussie sport for some reason!

 

[chelseacarlton]

humans have always known that science and religion go hand in hand

because without religion you have your focus on science which is not so much for moral good but for markets and profits

it's the same with culture etc

the kind of art we have today is funny

it's more a way that rich people can wash money than actual art

when you go to Europe and you see what Christianity inspired in culture you'll get my gist when you compare that to modernism nihilism
the festivals
the beautiful beautiful architecture and paintings
the music

you really can't compare modernists secular culture to that

it's funny to even try

Modern 20th century art s**t all over everything that came before it!
Next......

 

[chelseacarlton]

creator doesn't exist in time and space. God has always existed before the universe and before time

he exists outside of the paradigm you and I share with the cabbage

which is why all this is possible

you'll need to think about why that isn't more logical than what you think happened

Prove it?

 

[chelseacarlton]

 

[M Malice]

View attachment 666084

LOL, classic cc.

 

[LFTWNG11]

I know this because everything is so perfect
a super ego did the calculations to put everything in place
everything exactly in its place.. all the calculations are so exact that you as a human work so perfectly
you have ears to capture sound
you can smell and think and have awareness
you even know what's wrong and what's right

My favourite delusional argument... Reminds me of this:

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

Everything is not "so perfect".

Disease, oncogenes, mutations

All you're arguing is the concept of Irreducible complexity





I don't work perfectly.



Yep. In terms of the development of life on this planet it's called evolution for which the scientific evidence is overwhelming.



Hitchens said no such thing. You're just making this up.

What he did say was:

“My own view is that this planet is used as a penal colony, lunatic asylum and dumping ground by a superior civilization, to get rid of the undesirable and unfit. I can't prove it, but you can't disprove it either.”



Your theory of a "super ego" is not backed up by any sort of evidence at all. It's merely your opinion backed by nothing more than faith, lilely inspired by a fee ancient writings, now collected in some 'holy book'

I'll ask again. Why should I accept your claim that "a super ego put the world together in its exactness"?

it's pretty perfect mate

because as beautiful as this life is its only fleeting
if there was no death there would be no life

because you couldn't have trillions of people on the planet at the one time

so the age old question is while you're here how do you get your ticket to the next place . eternity?

most religions rationalise here for something even more elevated and perfect than here again

to eternity

so with most religions it's count your blessings here.. whatever they are.. live the best way you can.. with one eye to eternity.. because as beautiful as this all is . it's not sustained for you!

you need to prepare yourself into what is sustained
through hardships you learn to appreciate good

for instance
I have a friend who has a very severely autistic son
for many people their lives are hell
but he feels the joy of the extra love he passes to his son through his own sacrifice!

what it's taught him is patience and strength that he didn't know he had

O wouldn't call this friend religious but he has learnt more about himself and life than most people

the thing is everything is beautiful!
could you ask him to lose the son which is such a personal burdon?

he would never do it!

all life is precious

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

My favourite delusional argument... Reminds me of this:

you're entitled to your opinion
but that doesn't mean you have a better meaning for life

and of course you can ridicule as much as you like with your banana

but try doing that with a pineapple and your rectum for example and you'll realise God created some stuff for you to make jokes about but not everything can be joked about or make your narrative complete

and that is the real atheists delusional argument

try it and let me know


your narratives have too many holes in them

they're not holy!

did you get the point?

 

[Roylion]

it's pretty perfect mate

No. It's not.

so the age old question is while you're here how do you get your ticket to the next place . eternity?

How do you know there's eternity?

most religions rationalise here for something even more elevated and perfect than here again

So life isn't 'perfect'? There's something more 'perfect'?

so with most religions it's count your blessings here.. whatever they are.. live the best way you can..

Why do I need 'god' to live the best way I can? How do you know there's something after? Wishful thinking.