Opinion Is there a God? Atheists, agnostics and believers please slug it out here.

[sirlothie]

***Mod edit: new thread started, with posts moved from the 'Life is unfair/precious' thread. Kicking off with Sirlothie's post which sets the scene for vigorous discussion!***

One man's religious doctrine is another man's Fifty Shades of Grey.

I believe there is a God but I believe he doesn't care about church and definitely believe he does not want killing in his name and I believe he has a plan for everyone.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

I believe there is a God but I believe he doesn't care about church and definitely believe he does not want killing in his name and I believe he has a plan for everyone.

I have no problem with that. But like I suggested, the Bible, if you don't have faith, is just a book. It's no different to fairy tales.

 

[Magpie Girl]

I have no problem with that. But like I suggested, the Bible, if you don't have faith, is just a book. It's no different to fairy tales.

Faith is one thing, the bible is something else altogether

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Faith is one thing, the bible is something else altogether

You can argue terminology but my point is that religious artifacts, symbols, holy days, traditions... they have whatever value you place on them. It's not universal. In attempting to convince a non-believer that there is a God, citing the Bible carries no more authority than citing a K-Mart catalogue.

That's not to say that the Bible isn't 100% accurate; maybe it is, but there is no evidence contained within to weigh against anything offered up by any other organised religion.

Personally, I think if it makes you happy and you're tolerant of other people's beliefs, then have faith in whatever the * you want.

 

[sirlothie]

You can argue terminology but my point is that religious artifacts, symbols, holy days, traditions... they have whatever value you place on them. It's not universal. In attempting to convince a non-believer that there is a God, citing the Bible carries no more authority than citing a K-Mart catalogue.

That's not to say that the Bible isn't 100% accurate; maybe it is, but there is no evidence contained within to weigh against anything offered up by any other organised religion.

Personally, I think if it makes you happy and you're tolerant of other people's beliefs, then have faith in whatever the **** you want.

Collingwood.

 

[BlackWhiteBlood]

Collingwood.

The one true faith

 

[Prankster]

Not really, just because you believe in fairy tales doesn't change reality.

 

[Kappa]

I believe there is a God but I believe he doesn't care about church and definitely believe he does not want killing in his name and I believe he has a plan for everyone.

Did God also have a plan for every dinosaur?

Or were they just his play thing until he waited for monkeys to evolve over hundreds of millions of years into slightly smarter monkeys that took over one rock amongst 10000000 billion other rocks

Edit* oops I may be derailing thread

 

[Vicky Park]

Just wondering where is the evidence that God is a 'he'? Because of lots of old paintings? Because it says so in lots of old books? That's very 100 AD.

 

[Kappa]

Just wondering where is the evidence that God is a 'he'? Because of lots of old paintings? Because it says so in lots of old books? That's very 100 AD.

Asking for evidence in a religious discussion .

God was invented by male dominated society's which is why they imagine "him" as a "he". Sounds better than saying "it" I guess. Most religions around the world are still extremely sexist and male dominated (just look at the Vatican) so don't expect gender equality in the religious sector any time soon.

 

[Vicky Park]

Asking for evidence in a religious discussion .

God was invented by male dominated society's which is why they imagine "him" as a "he". Sounds better than saying "it" I guess. Most religions around the world are still extremely sexist and male dominated (just look at the Vatican) so don't expect gender equality in the religious sector any time soon.

I'm an atheist so I should probably butt out of the discussion before I offend anyone, or offend anyone further. But its always amazed me how people have absolute confidence that A) there is a God, and B) that God is a he. As a deity, there could be another gender option of which we are not aware, due to not hanging around in deified circles.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Just wondering where is the evidence that God is a 'he'? Because of lots of old paintings? Because it says so in lots of old books? That's very 100 AD.

There has to be evidence of a God before there can be evidence of said deity having a gender.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

You can argue terminology but my point is that religious artifacts, symbols, holy days, traditions... they have whatever value you place on them. It's not universal. In attempting to convince a non-believer that there is a God, citing the Bible carries no more authority than citing a K-Mart catalogue.

That's not to say that the Bible isn't 100% accurate; maybe it is, but there is no evidence contained within to weigh against anything offered up by any other organised religion.

Personally, I think if it makes you happy and you're tolerant of other people's beliefs, then have faith in whatever the **** you want.

I think the K-Mart catalogue would make more sense and be closer to the truth

 

[Kappa]

I'm an atheist so I should probably butt out of the discussion before I offend anyone, or offend anyone further. But its always amazed me how people have absolute confidence that A) there is a God, and B) that God is a he. As a deity, there could be another gender option of which we are not aware, due to not hanging around in deified circles.

It's called brainwashing.

Tell kids a fairy tale about a magical sky wizard who sends his son to earth to get murdered, which atones for our sins, (sins the sky wizard created) while their brains are still developing and they'll believe it.

It also helps that the number 1 fear of the human species is the unknown. People are so terrified of the unknown surrounding death they force themselves to believe anything that promises them Utopia after they pass away.. deep down somewhere they know it's crap, but it comforts them.

 

[sirlothie]

If you have no faith, no spirituality, no belief, no concept of the soul or belief in a greater plan you are a very poor person.

And God is He just like Mother Nature is a she, it is that way in every faith and scripture. Feminism trying to claim God now too... good lord.

Our Father, who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name...

 

[The Royal Sampler]

If you have no faith, no spirituality, no belief, no concept of the soul or belief in a greater plan you are a very poor person.

I am incredulous when I hear people say this.

Life is borderline miraculous, the world around us is incredible in its beauty, variety, sophistication and nuance*. Embracing the idea that you only have one life to live is what I consider "spirituality", and it enriches my existence to the extent that I laugh at the idea of some eternal payoff.

So what kind of sick, ungrateful and short-sighted individual needs to make up fantasies about what lies beyond, to make the present bearable? Wasting a life, stumbling along trying to appease an imaginary God, in order to get past the velvet rope to a non-existent afterlife; that's what I think of as a "poor person".

*So much so that this is in itself presented as an argument in favour of a higher power, called the "intelligent design" theory, but that's another story.

 

[sirlothie]

I am incredulous when I hear people say this.

Life is borderline miraculous, the world around us is incredible in its beauty, variety, sophistication and nuance*. Embracing the idea that you only have one life to live is what I consider "spirituality", and it enriches my existence to the extent that I laugh at the idea of some eternal payoff.

So what kind of sick, ungrateful and short-sighted individual needs to make up fantasies about what lies beyond, to make the present bearable? Wasting a life, stumbling along trying to appease an imaginary God, in order to get past the velvet rope to a non-existent afterlife; that's what I think of as a "poor person".

*So much so that this is in itself presented as an argument in favour of a higher power, called the "intelligent design" theory, but that's another story.

Maybe the greatest trick the Devil ever played was convincing the world God doesn't exist?

How can you have any respect for your life and the world you live in if you have no respect for it's creator? Nothing is just THERE, you should know that, nothing just appears, so what makes you think the world and universe just appeared, answer me that with your scientist hat on....

As previously pointed out, religion and faith are two entirely different things. I do try to appease God just by being a good person.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Maybe the greatest trick the Devil ever played was convincing the world God doesn't exist?

How can you have any respect for your life and the world you live in if you have no respect for it's creator? Nothing is just THERE, you should know that, nothing just appears, so what makes you think the world and universe just appeared, answer me that with your scientist hat on....

As previously pointed out, religion and faith are two entirely different things. I do try to appease God just by being a good person.

So now we need one imaginary character to trick people into thinking the other doesn't exist? The more rational explanation is that neither exists.

As for "nothing just exists" which is the cornerstone of intelligent design theory; well your God would just exist without explanation of how it came into being, yes? So that's a contradictory line of argument to begin with. Again, it's far more rational to argue that the universe which plainly does exist managed to do so without help from the unseen omnipotent, than it is to argue that it was created by an unseen God who itself has no reason for being.

I'm all for being a good person, but I choose to do so because that's how as a rational adult I decided I want to live my life, not out of fear of fire and brimstone or longing for a post-existence utopia.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Some people need a crutch to get through life, just as some people need to take drugs to do the same thing.
If that's what gets them through the day, good luck to them, but don't tell me I am a lesser person for not engaging in their fantasy stories or drug induced haze

 

[sirlothie]

Some people need a crutch to get through life, just as some people need to take drugs to do the same thing.
If that's what gets them through the day, good luck to them, but don't tell me I am a lesser person for engaging in their fantasy stories or drug induced haze

Lol believing in God is a sign of weakness now, OK brother. A lot of stronger men than you had faith in God.

 

[sirlothie]

So now we need one imaginary character to trick people into thinking the other doesn't exist? The more rational explanation is that neither exists.

As for "nothing just exists" which is the cornerstone of intelligent design theory; well your God would just exist without explanation of how it came into being, yes? So that's a contradictory line of argument to begin with. Again, it's far more rational to argue that the universe which plainly does exist managed to do so without help from the unseen omnipotent, than it is to argue that it was created by an unseen God who itself has no reason for being.

I'm all for being a good person, but I choose to do so because that's how as a rational adult I decided I want to live my life, not out of fear of fire and brimstone or longing for a post-existence utopia.

You have a long way to go mate, I was you 10 years ago but when you open yourself up to it you will see it.

 

[Obese Arachnid]

I'm an atheist so I should probably butt out of the discussion before I offend anyone, or offend anyone further. But its always amazed me how people have absolute confidence that A) there is a God, and B) that God is a he. As a deity, there could be another gender option of which we are not aware, due to not hanging around in deified circles.

Are you saying God is Caitlin Jenner?

 

[The Royal Sampler]

You have a long way to go mate, I was you 10 years ago but when you open yourself up to it you will see it.

You were never me, nor ever will be me, so please keep the condescension to yourself.

The "not open to it" idea is another one that gets trotted out a lot. The same speech is used by people who believe in the paranormal, i.e. you can't see ghosts unless you are "open to it", you can't connect with spirits during a seance unless you are "open to it".

It's a self-serving explanation that ensures that the indoctrinated are protected from having their baseless beliefs questioned.

I'm not here to question your beliefs, only to point out that my appreciation for what is present and tangible is not diminished by the lack of a need for something more.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Lol believing in God is a sign of weakness now, OK brother. A lot of stronger men than you had faith in God.

A placebo effect is still an effect.

 

[Vicky Park]

Are you saying God is Caitlin Jenner?

Just flagged the possibility of an alternative deity related gender option. Think I will name it ADRGO. Constitutes a very small but (apparently) powerful minority.

500 years ago I would have been burnt at the stake for these thoughts!