Jack Anthony.

[Go_collingwood_]

why would buckley not want to play JA? this is bullshit

 

[doppleganger]

I don't believe this for a second. No way know would Buckley begin interfering with players and forcing decisions already. He is not the coach, and this certainly would not be tolerated by Mick.

If this sort of thing is happening already then I can't even imagine the type of disharmony and confusion it would bring the playing group.

Bucks is the forward coach......supposedly our good patch of form against Carlton et al was down to Buckley straightening us up!

Even if false, these things happen....coaches feel that players are better suited to different roles.

If Dawes is the preferred main target, perhaps Bucks feels JA would struggled as a more opportunist type option. Especially when we also have L.Bronw and Jolly drifting forward at times under the current structure.

 

[The Big League]

I understand he is the forward coach, however ultimately it's Micks team, and if Mick wants him in the forward line then that's where he will be, with or without the consent of Buckley.

 

[Kirby]

Oh FFS, Crackers is full of shit. Doesn't everyone realise that??

I don't think he's ever been proved right. Not once!

 

[Quicky]

Just heard on the Mondayitis footy podcast, "Crackers" Keenan said that he knows for a certainty that

• Bucks doesn't want Anthony in his forward line
• Anthony has been told to "reinvent" himself as a backman.

Since he was originally a defender, you would say he'd have to de-invent himself as a forward, but his role in the backlines for the 2's gives credence to Keenan's statement.
It is possible, however, that his appearance in the backlines is more as a result of Brown & Maxwell injuries and Goldy's elevation. Or maybe they're trying a similar tactic as to whatever they were attempting with Rusling down back.
Still haven't figured out that one.

Be interesting if it were true that Bucks is deadset against Jack appearing in his forward line, but with his lack of form in there for the 1's this season, not especially surprising.

I don't think it lends credence to anything. Crackers has seen Anthony play defense in the 2's and invented shit up to make a story. The fact we had Reid, Presti and Goldy playing in the 1's and Brown and Carter injured in the 2's meant outside Keeffe we had no other KPD's to throw back in the VFL. Anthony was the obvious solution. Just another example of Crackers talking shit.

 

[soreplums]

Problem for Jack is that Brown offers one key ability that Jack doesn't and that is to go into the ruck for periods of the game and provide a good contest, which is absoutely critical to us with Fraser and Wood playing in the VFL.

Jack is the ideal Adam Hunter type who can swing forward or back, but at the moment we need that same player to perform the task fo backup ruck, Brown can do all 3 and Jack can't, even though you could argue that Jack performs 2 of the 3 roles better.

Our problem is clear, and it's a good problem to have.

Reid, Anthony, N.Brown, Dawes, Goldsack, L.Brown and even Fraser - are all too good to be playing in the VFL. But there is only room for 3, or at the most 4 - of these players in our AFL squad in any given week.

I'd prefer him to be the Daniel Bradshaw type.

 

[TradeDraft]

JA is vertsile as he can play Down Back and Forward. Think he is a Better Defender that Forward those

 

[Quicky]

JA is vertsile as he can play Down Back and Forward. Think he is a Better Defender that Forward those

It's impossible to say that until we see him as a defender at AFL level which I think has hardly happened. As a forward he is much better than people give him credit for especially your good self Dave. If Anthony could improve his tank - which is very fixable - i'd go as far to say he is our best KPF. Right now he is suffering from a poor preseason, lack of fitness and form. He'll be back.

 

[shawthing09]

I'd prefer him to be the Daniel Bradshaw type.

And bingo was his nameo, which is the exactly reason I'd like him given more time to develop as a foward.

 

[Snag Breac]

Haven't time to read whole thread, but can anyone please explain what has happened to JA this year? From our top goal kicker to lucky to make the team.

Is it simply the position he's playing this year - when he plays at all? Or did he fail to develop as required?

 

[HFF]

Haven't time to read whole thread, but can anyone please explain what has happened to JA this year? From our top goal kicker to lucky to make the team.

Is it simply the position he's playing this year - when he plays at all? Or did he fail to develop as required?

Pre-season shoulder surgery, restricted pre-season which resulted in a lack of fitness, in turn affecting form. Playing as a HFF doesn't help either, considering he is not fit enough due to the above circumstances.

A strong and solid pre-season leading into next season will do wonders for Jack as he bulks up and improves his tank.

 

[Zahki]

I have no idea what happened to Jack. After a 50 goal season expectations were high that he would make Full Forward his own, stamp his authority on the position since Rocca left and that just hasn't happened. Willing to give him some slack because of his preseason surgery, but how long can you keep using that excuse? He's been dropping easy marks, making dumb mistakes and just seems to be completely out of his depth this year.

Frankly even if he does reinvent himself as a backman I can't see the point. Our backline is the strongest part of our squad right now, Shaw, O'Brien, Maxwell, Presti, Reid, N. Brown?

You could make an argument that he could be our swingman, with an eye to him replacing Leigh Brown and playing a similar role to Brian Lake, but performing as he is currently I have severe doubts if he could even do that.

I'm going to say the next 2 weeks, with Cloke out of the side could make or break Jacks career. He has an opportunity now to fill the gap if Mick moves Dawes to CHF, which seems the obvious option. If he can make the most of this chance he can hang on, if not then I wonder whether he'll have a place on the list next year.

 

[Bonuspoints]

Yeah I can't see him making it as a back either...well not at Collingwood. Its got nothing to do with ability just more a reflection of how our defense is forming. I think other than Presti our current back six is set for the next few years. And its Nathan Brown that is being groomed for that spot. The only other spot would be Maxwell, but given he's years from retirement or decline I doubt that the club or Anthony would be willing to wait that long.

Just on Crackers - Given he correctly called the Leigh Brown to Collingwood before anyone else I won't write it off even though probably he's wrong. I remember that coming out and many of us (me included) calling him a fool and now we've got him on our list. He does get the occasional one right.

 

[HFF]

Willing to give him some slack because of his preseason surgery, but how long can you keep using that excuse?

I'm going to say the next 2 weeks, with Cloke out of the side could make or break Jacks career. He has an opportunity now to fill the gap if Mick moves Dawes to CHF, which seems the obvious option. If he can make the most of this chance he can hang on, if not then I wonder whether he'll have a place on the list next year.

It's not an excuse, it is fact. He is well and truly underdone. Look at how long it took Daisy to build his tank and add some size to his frame and he hasn't missed a pre-season since being drafted. Shoulder surgery prevented Jack from bulking up and becoming stronger which has hurt his fitness base. He needs a full pre-season leading into 2011 and you will see the difference.

As for your ending to the post, surely you are taking the piss? I mean, seriously, this is a bloke who kicked 50 goals last year. The next two weeks are far from "make or break". He has plenty of time to develop his game. What happens if Dawes goes backwards from this point on and next season? Do we doubt "his place on the list" next season? Please, spare us the crap.

 

[Zahki]

It's not an excuse, it is fact. He is well and truly underdone. Look at how long it took Daisy to build his tank and add some size to his frame and he hasn't missed a pre-season since being drafted. Shoulder surgery prevented Jack from bulking up and becoming stronger which has hurt his fitness base. He needs a full pre-season leading into 2011 and you will see the difference.

At this point, yes, it's an excuse. We're 15 weeks into the season now, pointing back to preseason and saying that is why he can't mark, or why he's making dumb decisions? That's a crock. If it really is having this big an impact on him then surely you would agree that he shouldn't be playing, period? But given your history of apologism for him I don't think you're exactly the most objective person to be talking to anyway.

As for your ending to the post, surely you are taking the piss? I mean, seriously, this is a bloke who kicked 50 goals last year. The next two weeks are far from "make or break". He has plenty of time to develop his game. What happens if Dawes goes backwards from this point on and next season? Do we doubt "his place on the list" next season? Please, spare us the crap.

Dawes is the reason that he may be in strife. Anthony has gone backwards, Dawes has surpassed him snatched his spot and now Anthony either has to seriously improve or try to get a spot in an already full backline. Anthony doesn't want to play in the VFL for the rest of his career so he has a choice, carve a niche for himself in the best 22 or be a backup for Dawes and Cloke.

Anyway I look forward to next year when your argument about why Anthony should be in the side is "But he kicked 50 goals two years ago!". To hell with current form!

 

[HFF]

At this point, yes, it's an excuse. We're 15 weeks into the season now, pointing back to preseason and saying that is why he can't mark, or why he's making dumb decisions? That's a crock. If it really is having this big an impact on him then surely you would agree that he shouldn't be playing, period? But given your history of apologism for him I don't think you're exactly the most objective person to be talking to anyway.

I have been a very strong defender of Jack, I make no secret of it, simply because he is an extremely talented youngster who has been condemned by many Collingwood posters on this board. Your suggestion that the next two games are "make or break/career defining", shows your ignorance towards Jack, considering the career he has had to date. His form is wavering and has been well below his best but as Malthouse said, he is too good to be playing VFL footy, just as Dawes is. I am not going to defend his "stupid decisions" with the footy, that is something he needs to get better at because it bugs the shit out of me too seeing it but his dropping of marks is simply a lack of strength at the moment having been unable to bulk up this season because of his off-season shoulder surgery, whilst everyone else has become stronger. This is common knowledge. His direct opponents are actually stronger than him as it stands. Watch some tapes of Jack last year and you will see he was ranked in the top 10 of the comp for contested marks and goals.

Dawes is the reason that he may be in strife. Anthony has gone backwards, Dawes has surpassed him snatched his spot and now Anthony either has to seriously improve or try to get a spot in an already full backline. Anthony doesn't want to play in the VFL for the rest of his career so he has a choice, carve a niche for himself in the best 22 or be a backup for Dawes and Cloke.

It's a fine line to suggest a player has gone "backwards" when injury has had a significant impact on their season. Dawes has improved out of sight and that only makes our football club stronger. It is great that he has been able to come on in the absence of Jack because we would be in the shit if nobody else stood up.

Anyway I look forward to next year when your argument about why Anthony should be in the side is "But he kicked 50 goals two years ago!". To hell with current form!

I will be a keen observer in Jack's development during the off-season. If he is able to avoid major off-season surgeries and have a full pre-season, it will only benefit him and the club further because as you say, he does not want to play VFL footy for the rest of his career. Ditto for Dawes, Nathan Brown, Goldsack etc. These types of players need to keep improving if we are to become better each year. I just don't appreciate all the negativity on this board in regards to Jack's future, when the facts are, no young key forward on our list or on many lists in the comp boasts an output record equal to that of Jack.

 

[Quicky]

dt has covered it pretty well. He didn't have the ideal preparation and since Dawes has made the second KPF post his own he's being played in a position which doesn't suit him.

 

[Pie eyed]

Jack now has a chance to show some form and I hope he takes the opportunity with both hands, preferably 40 out, dead in front, several times.

I still think the Pies are a big chance to beat the Saints this week.
If Jack can get a couple of goals he could go from zero to hero.....again.

 

[shawthing09]

I am extremely interested into how the Jack / Dawes combo works. Jack is the truest full foward we have and Dawes and Cloke are both more center half types. Cloke out puts a lot of responsibility on Dawes shoulders to get the linking ball and be a go to target on the wing if we get bogged down with our ball movement. It's worrying for mine but I think if he can manage it the partnership should work well. Dawes is a much better field kick then Cloke and and so Dawes on the flank with Anthony leading towards him is actually a pretty good prospect. It will be the first time this year that Anthony has had the chance to play like a key foward and I am hoping he shows that he is capable of doing so, although it would have been nice if it wasn't against st kilda first up.

 

[Quicky]

Is anyone else looking forward to having two KPF's that are actually reliable shots on goal?? Can anyone else remember the last time this happened

 

[The Dawes]

Is anyone else looking forward to having two KPF's that are actually reliable shots on goal?? Can anyone else remember the last time this happened

Why do many people assume JA will hold his spot even with out Cloke?

Reckon there's a good chance of Leroy playing permanent forward and bringing Medhurst in for Jack.

 

[shawthing09]

Why do many people assume JA will hold his spot even with out Cloke?

Reckon there's a good chance of Leroy playing permanent forward and bringing Medhurst in for Jack.

If Leroy plays purely foward we'd need someone to chop out in the ruck no? I think people assume Jack will retain his spot because since returning from injury this year he is yet to be used in the fashion he was last year I.E at FF as a key target in a more open foward line. He has been used more as a 3rd option in a more congested foward line Cloke being out certainly creates a the oppertunity for him in that role. That being said Anthony was not called up when Dawes was dropped so who knows.

 

[The Dawes]

If Leroy plays purely foward we'd need someone to chop out in the ruck no? I think people assume Jack will retain his spot because since returning from injury this year he is yet to be used in the fashion he was last year I.E at FF as a key target in a more open foward line. He has been used more as a 3rd option in a more congested foward line Cloke being out certainly creates a the oppertunity for him in that role. That being said Anthony was not called up when Dawes was dropped so who knows.

If Medhurst comes in for JA then Fraser comes in for Cloke. If we ask Leroy to play forward then clearly we will need another ruck option.

I'm not convinced that the JA/Dawes key forward combo is likely to be a winning one against the Saints. Relying on one out of form forward & a 20 game veteran is asking a lot against a hardened defensive unit.

 

[Quicky]

I'd prefer to back Anthony who has shown that he can be a very good FF last year but hasn't had the chance in that role this year. I'd much prefer him than cobbling together some patchwork KPF setup with Fraser and Brown. I could buy the argument if you were going in with Dawes with an otherwise small forward set-up as that has worked against the Saints before and defensive pressure will be important against them. I blows my mind how reactive people are over Anthony because of a half year of ordinary football when there are clear reasons for it.

 

[The Dawes]

I'd prefer to back Anthony who has shown that he can be a very good FF last year but hasn't had the chance in that role this year. I'd much prefer him than cobbling together some patchwork KPF setup with Fraser and Brown. I could buy the argument if you were going in with Dawes with an otherwise small forward set-up as that has worked against the Saints before and defensive pressure will be important against them. I blows my mind how reactive people are over Anthony because of a half year of ordinary football when there are clear reasons for it.

Didn't say anything about playing Fraser as a forward, just a relieving ruck.

A bit off-topic so I apologise, but a forward line with Dawes and Brown (who has looked better up forward this year compared to last) as KP's and Jolly at times, plus Medhurst, Sidebottom & maybe Leon as well, gives us a dangerous look, plus more experience.

I would be very supportive of JA playing FF if he was in better touch, but he doesn't look in great nick at present.