Jack Watts - A different perspective.

[DemonLord]

A lot of supporters both inside and outside Melbourne FC question whether we made the right draft pick 2008. Some think Watts hasn't come on quickly as we would of liked (The HUN article today re Watts VS Hurley is a prime example).

I like most believe he still has heaps of potential but wonder if he will ever achieve it.

Well I have been looking at his game of late and notcied a few things.

Quite often he beats his man, gets into space and we kick it at his feet, over his head or pick another option entirely - usually a player not in as good a position.

Now you could say that the players up the field do not have confidence in him. Well if they never use him how will we ever know what he has to offer.

And from his point of view if you lead up all day, did what you were supposed to then got ignored by team mates is it any wonder your confidence might not be as high as it should be.

For years Melbourne has been the master of bombing it long to contests hoping our forwards will beat the odds. Neitz was big enough to compete like that, Robbo had to jump over packs to try to get to the ball.

Whatever happened to kicking to space or at least to the advantage of your forward.

I am beginning to wonder whether if Watts was playing in another team - the Pies being the obvious example being the currenbt benchmark - how much further Watts would of developed.

Bottom line I still have faith we made the right choice - I am just vwondering if our playing style is helping him become as good as he can be.

Thoughts.

DL

 

[davey_magik]

Interesting post mate.

I think I'm one of his bigger supporters and have been since he was drafted. People forget he has only just turned 20 this year.

He is SLOWLY building confidence at this level, sure he makes mistakes still, but he has certainly improved on his 1st and 2nd year in terms of his workrate IMO. I still think he needs to work on that area though, and I'd like to see him look a bit more hungry for the ball, but I have faith that will come.

Rubbish article in the HS today from Robbo saying who would you rather out of Hurley and Watts, of course you would want Hurley, he's better now and unless Watts improves significantly (Which I think he will) Hurley will remain a long way ahead, but I don't see the point of comparing draft picks when we should just work with what we have.

 

[cannons]

Yeah, it's easy for Robbo to sit back and make idiotic 'who would you want?' articles, but I can guarantee that he would've picked Watts on draft day.

Let's be honest, in terms of skill and athletic ability alone, there's no contest, Watts makes Hurley look pretty average. Well, maybe footskills aside, as they are both very good off both sides of their body, with Hurley the longer kick, and Watts the more accurate one.

Hurley's major advantages, at this point, come pretty much from his size and his mental attributes.

On the point being made about his teammates not using him, I actually agree. Whilst watching the Hawks game from the higher levels, I saw Watts make some great runs to space only to be ignored. The issue is that, when you have the likes of Jones and Moloney in the midfield who not only get first hands on the ball, but also know no other way than to bomb the ball long, then subtle leads out to space on the flanks are often going to be ignored. For this reason, I think that until the likes of Scully and Trengove are strong and experienced enough to form the core of our midfield, our forward line will struggle, especially when you consider that they're, for the most part, the types who will beat their opponents with speed and guile, rather than with strength.

 

[WinmarToLockett]

I'm concerned the weekly specualtion concerning Jack Watts ever coming good will impact on his development. Surely constant negativity isn't a good thing for anyones confidence.

Having said, I have absolute faith in the Melbourne Football Club. Recent draft picks that have shown a lot in their early games- Tapscott, Gysberts, Frawley etc. are evidence of the club's excellent drafting, and Mark Jamar provides a wonderful exclamation point that shows we are able to spot a long-term prospect who has the abilities to be a star player.

Whatever anyone else thinks I don't really give a **** about. YMMV.

 

[W. Smithers]

Welcome to the Tambling/Buddy sledging us Tiger supporters have had to endure for years.

It won't stop until Watts becomes a star or the team as a whole is very successful ie. Hawks never cop any flak for Thorp or Dowler.

Why hasn't Robbo written an article about Frawley vs Gumbleton?

 

[Mightydees]

Robbo's article was terrible. Trying to say that our decision to pick Watts instead of Hurley was a blunder is absolutely ridiculous. Hurley wasn't even talked up as a top 3 draft pick and every club, expert and supporter acknowledged that it would be Watts, Rich or Naita as they were judged 'at the time' as being the best of the crop.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing when your a journo who has never played the game! Even then I think Watts will end up being better than Hurley.

And I love how the Herald Sun have only put up 2 comments on the story and both back what Robbo has said about Watts. I have written a couple of comments very early this morning which were pro Watts but the Herald Sun seem happy with the two supportive comments they have received to date. Boo to the Herald Sun and Boo to Robbo

Oh and Demonlord, excellent post - spot on in my opinion!

 

[Carusiii]

Hey guys first post on these boards.

I'm like the original poster, big fan of Watts i reckon he has potential to become a good solid player, and i agree that we still need to give him time to adapt in playing his role.

There are times where he shows he's going to be able to compete, i mean look at the mark he took against Hawthorn in round 2 and he finished it off with a goal, its moments like that where you feel he's coming along nicely but also it does look like we aren't kicking into space for him to lead into and at his feet so of course he isn't going to provide that spark.

Not a fan of Robbo at all, his article in the HS was pretty crap, but i agree we need to give him more time and he will get there i reckon

 

[Supermercado]

Robbo's article was terrible. Trying to say that our decision to pick Watts instead of Hurley was a blunder is absolutely ridiculous. Hurley wasn't even talked up as a top 3 draft pick and every club, expert and supporter acknowledged that it would be Watts, Rich or Naita as they were judged 'at the time' as being the best of the crop.

Exactly 100% correct. If Natanui or Rich were flying and destroying the competition that would be an accurate comparison.

He may as well write an article sledging every team in the competition for letting Dane Swan go pick #58 in the '01 draft (where he then, let's not forget, proceeded to do nothing for three years).

Or what about us picking Aaron Rodgers in that draft before Campbell Brown, Sam Mitchell and Leigh Montagna? Completely pointless to pluck out players who weren't even in the mix and try to compare them. Stupid article.

 

[Chip_]

All of the points have in this thread have been mentioned recently over various threads involving Jack. (lack of confidence from team mates, development impacted from our playing style, tambling like scrutiny (which has gone from it being NikNat good form pressure to Hurley), etc) Glad someone gave it's own thread.

The one plaudit I'll give the coaching staff regarding Jack is persisting to give him games when his form waivers a little, if they start dropping him then his slow development will largely in their hands.

Surely the points mentioned have been noticed by the coaching staff, they notice & comment on that he works hard & leads well, surely they can see the delivery is a big problem. It needs to be addressed, not just for the sake of Jack's development but for the general improvement of our team. Another issue is our half-back counter-attack style doesn't really suit a tall marking option, as half the time we win the ball there's no one in our half of the ground as they're all made to push up.

"Super-sub" is probably #1, but next to that it seems like this year's most popular saying from commentators is "They need to lower their eyes." Our midfield needs a lesson on how to do this, Gys could probably give it after the way he played on the weekend

 

[Biffinator]

Watts should never have been played in 2009. Those photos from Queen's Birthday are just horrendous - a boy playing against men. Thankfully there was no lasting damage . . . . . . .

 

[ThePuppetMaster]

poor article, stating it is 'just' too early to call it a draft blunder was woeful from robinson, sure hurley looks to be a star in the making, but we drafted watts for the 'complete package' he provided

speed, skill, height, you name it

whether he will fulfill his potential is another thing, but i think he will

with his gifts it would be amazing if he didn't at least become a good player

the thing is, all he needs to click is that ONE game where he takes a couple of big marks and kicks 3-4 goals

i thought hawthorn was going to be that game, until our midfield got dominated in the second half!!!


Edit-

i agree completely Biff

 

[Pecker]

Welcome to the Tambling/Buddy sledging us Tiger supporters have had to endure for years.

It won't stop until Watts becomes a star or the team as a whole is very successful ie. Hawks never cop any flak for Thorp or Dowler.

Why hasn't Robbo written an article about Frawley vs Gumbleton?

Yeah spot on champ! It comes under what Chris Judd once said about there being too much drivel being written and said by the media on AFL. Its a joke how many so called journalists cover footy nowdays.

 

[Crimson Azure]

Very good thread guys, every post has added to the discussion, except for this one.

I for one see a couple of issues that need to be address to help with Watts game.

1. Kick the ball to him! It has been mentioned but he gets ignored so much its not funny, I have noticed this since early last season but now with his ability to present much more it is more highlighted. 2. his own decision making & the time it takes. This is something I posted regarding Watts in another thread:

It has been happening all this year including the preseason where he is wide open & they have ignored him (It did happen last year too but it has become more noticeable this year). I know he needs to move the ball a lot quicker when he gets it but if a player is open I don't care if its Spencer, kick it to him! Particularly if they’re in the forward pocket with 15-20 meters space. But due to his form we did become a little Jurrahcentric yesterday.

I've said this already but I would like to see Watts used heavily this week against the gold coast & have him spend the entire first half leading out of the square. This is a chance for him to see how he matches up against similar bodies to his. Jurrah should have Bock on him but if he went to watts put Jamar forward, not moving from the square so Watts can still lead out from the square & allow Martin to do the ruck work.

One reason other players overlooking him may be when the ball is up the ground. The time he is taking to make a decision seems like an eon at times. As an example, in the last minute of the game against Brisbane he took 5-10 seconds to move the ball on (which may have had something to do with running down the clock too) then proceed to try to pinpoint a player in the centre, turned it over & almost cost us a goal. I can see what he is trying to do - not make a mistake, but he needs to back himself a little more.

I think the coaching staff need to make decision making a focus for all players, this will help develop Watts ability to identify an option & back himself to take it. It will also help our HB line & mids to look for the right option not just “an” option.

 

[RandB]

Watts should never have been played in 2009. Those photos from Queen's Birthday are just horrendous - a boy playing against men.

Completely agree. It was like an unveiling of him against the Pies. A very rare club/FD stuffup.

Thankfully there was no lasting damage . . . . . . .

Perhaps, but you've got to question what kind of signals it sent to both Watts and the whole playing group at the time and whether they continue to permeate today.

 

[eskimo]

I mentioned this in another thread -

As far as I can see Jack has 2 distinct problems at the moment

1) He plays too much time on the wing/floating across half forward. If we drafted him as a forward, which according to the Jack Watts dosier thread we did, then play him as a forward. Teach him to be a forward. He often looks confused as to where he should be. I think this is a result of mixed messages fromt he coaching staff.

2) When he leads, he leads a little to early. I watched him a few times against Brisbane, and he would take off for his lead just as our player marked the ball. He needs to hold his lead for a couple fo seconds, and give our player a chance to turn and weigh up the options. When he leads he goes to the right spot, and usually puts space between him and his opponent, but he takes off to early.

If he can start to hold his lead ever so slightly he will instantly become a better player. He will be used more often, and his confidence will sky-rocket.

I still have no doubts that he will become a very valuable player, and I think the expectations of him are far too high. He just played his 21st game. If we are still saying these things after his 51st game then it might be cause for concern, but if he can show some gradual improvement between now and then he will be well on his way.

 

[Headless]

1) He plays too much time on the wing/floating across half forward. If we drafted him as a forward, which according to the Jack Watts dosier thread we did, then play him as a forward. Teach him to be a forward. He often looks confused as to where he should be. I think this is a result of mixed messages fromt he coaching staff.

I agree, but it would be hard to play Jack at full-forward without support. At present, we have no player with a big presence in the forward line (unless we play Jamar or Martin out of the square), a la Chris Dawes or Jarryd Roughead.

It's very debatable where Watts should be playing at this stage of his career. Ideally, I would be using him as the third tall, but we don't have the depth or resources to do so at this point in time.

 

[eskimo]

Agree with that Headless, and throughout last year I could understand not wanting to throw him in there on his own. However, he has put on a bit of bulk over summer, and whilst he might not be able to outmuscle his opponents, he could hold his own against quite a few. He is also quicker than most full backs would be, so if he gets part 2 of my assesment right, and we create the space in front of him, then he can burn them on the lead.

 

[Chip_]

I mentioned this in another thread -

As far as I can see Jack has 2 distinct problems at the moment

1) He plays too much time on the wing/floating across half forward. If we drafted him as a forward, which according to the Jack Watts dosier thread we did, then play him as a forward. Teach him to be a forward. He often looks confused as to where he should be. I think this is a result of mixed messages fromt he coaching staff.

2) When he leads, he leads a little to early. I watched him a few times against Brisbane, and he would take off for his lead just as our player marked the ball. He needs to hold his lead for a couple fo seconds, and give our player a chance to turn and weigh up the options. When he leads he goes to the right spot, and usually puts space between him and his opponent, but he takes off to early.

If he can start to hold his lead ever so slightly he will instantly become a better player. He will be used more often, and his confidence will sky-rocket.

I still have no doubts that he will become a very valuable player, and I think the expectations of him are far too high. He just played his 21st game. If we are still saying these things after his 51st game then it might be cause for concern, but if he can show some gradual improvement between now and then he will be well on his way.

I think this may be not entirely of his own fault & him doing this to try to fit in to the Melbourne "style" of play. We often play at break-neck speed & play on at all costs, so Watts may be leading too early but it could be that he's been told to lead immediately when someone mark's as they're meant to play on, or he's mis-reading when someone's going to play-on or not because they do more often than not.

I heard a commentator say something about us regarding this, against hawthorn I think, that we often don't push back from the man on the mark far enough before kicking because we're too worried about playing on, which leads to a higher amount of kicks smothers.

 

[Mightydees]

One reason other players overlooking him may be when the ball is up the ground. The time he is taking to make a decision seems like an eon at times. As an example, in the last minute of the game against Brisbane he took 5-10 seconds to move the ball on (which may have had something to do with running down the clock too) then proceed to try to pinpoint a player in the centre, turned it over & almost cost us a goal. I can see what he is trying to do - not make a mistake, but he needs to back himself a little more.

I think the coaching staff need to make decision making a focus for all players, this will help develop Watts ability to identify an option & back himself to take it. It will also help our HB line & mids to look for the right option not just “an” option.

I actually think that with some players you have to let them use their natural instincts rather than over coach them. Watts has great instincts and normally makes good decisions when under pressure but I agree that recently he has appeared more concerned with doing the 'expected' thing as opposed to the 'instinctual' thing and that has made him look slower. There is no doubt in my mind that in close he is very good under pressure because he has no option but to do the instinctual thing.

 

[RandB]

I heard a commentator say something about us regarding this, against hawthorn I think, that we often don't push back from the man on the mark far enough before kicking because we're too worried about playing on, which leads to a higher amount of kicks smothers.

He might be on to something there.

 

[DemonLord]

Odd - I actually hesitated to start this thread thinking it would go the way of "not another Watts thread". Glad to see it has sparked some interesting discussion.

One thing I meant to add to the original post was that at least he has other high draft picks around him in the same team. Always good to have someone in the same boat to get support from.

DL.

 

[jonesy86]

You guys just need patience.

Have a look at Reid and Dawes who were 1st and 2nd round picks in 2006.

They basically spent their first 3 years at the club developing in the VFL, only playing a total of 8 AFL games each from '07-'09. Then they had their breakout years in their 4th season playing 15-17 games each.

 

[demons64]

You guys just need patience.

Have a look at Reid and Dawes who were 1st and 2nd round picks in 2006.

They basically spent their first 3 years at the club developing in the VFL, only playing a total of 8 AFL games each from '07-'09. Then they had their breakout years in their 4th season playing 15-17 games each.

Well said..!!

 

[Biffinator]

One thing I noticed at the Swans game is that Jurrah is only a little bit shorter than Jack Watts, whom we know to be 196cm (they stood next to one another). Jurrah's infamous 188cm is a furphy. Anyway, I don't know what this has got to do with the discussion but why not post it here.

 

[THE STING2]

Robbo's article was terrible. Trying to say that our decision to pick Watts instead of Hurley was a blunder is absolutely ridiculous. Hurley wasn't even talked up as a top 3 draft pick and every club, expert and supporter acknowledged that it would be Watts, Rich or Naita as they were judged 'at the time' as being the best of the crop.

Essendon hid Hurley at full back, paying off the Northern Knights knowing we were after a full forward.

Essendon are known for this. They done it with Heppell, they spread a rumour that he had OP but he hasn't missed a game and a while ago we wanted to look at this unknown who ended up never making it but we weren't allowed because he said he was going to Essendon before the draft. We also know how dodgy the Thompson debacle was.

That's my conspiracy theory, Essendon should be investigated.