You can sledge by calling someone a weak or gutless so and so but if in the heat of the moment your chosen adjective is "black" then whether you consider yourself a racist or not it is clear that deep down, race is an issue.
Justin Sherman gets 4 weeks for vilification
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You can sledge by calling someone a weak or gutless so and so but if in the heat of the moment your chosen adjective is "black" then whether you consider yourself a racist or not it is clear that deep down, race is an issue.
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Stick and stones may break my bones but some people are thin skinned so you can't call them names.
ize_
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Yeah... So where is this anecdotal evidence? If it comes to light, then yes people may be able to assert that he is not a racist. At the moment, the only evidence is of him being racist. So as I said, the only inferences we can make from this are that he is a racist, or that there isn't enough evidence to make a decision on the matter. The people saying "he's not a racist," based on the one piece of evidence we have, actually do not make sense at all...
I know what your saying but it is a very different environment. Barry knocking out Staker as an example is something that would be treated very differently outside of an AFL field.
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Hill and Djerrkura are Aboriginal, Wilkinson is of Nigerian descent. So it depends on what Sherman said.
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His ex-captain, his ex-teammates, his manager and his current employers have noted that it is completely out of character for him to act in such a manner.
This is the counter evidence.
From these 'inferences', we can suggest that whilst the act was racist, it may well be an isolated incidence he is not a racist.
Such that being 'a racist' insists that there exists a belief of racial superiority, there exists as much evidence one way as the other.
Does he shake an Aboriginal opponent's hand following the match?
Does he pat his Italian teammate's back after he kicks a goal?
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The world has changed and racism is a no no. I am proud to say that I have never abused anyone in a racist way on the footy field or as a spectator at a game, even though I have seen the Hawks ripped to shreds by Winmar, Krakeours, Materas, etc.
However, I do still always find it bemusing when a villified person is said to be "devastated" and "distraught" by what was said to him.
Maybe I am wrong, but it actually makes me less sympathetic to the cause. Yeah, yeah, I am not in the position, but seriously, devastated???
Would rather a villified player said something like "In today's society with the amount of effort everyone has gone to to remove this sort of thing from our game and life in general, it is very disappointing that someone would continue to behave in this very poor manner...."
Am I a bit unsympathetic?
However, I do still always find it bemusing when a villified person is said to be "devastated" and "distraught" by what was said to him.
Maybe I am wrong, but it actually makes me less sympathetic to the cause. Yeah, yeah, I am not in the position, but seriously, devastated???
Would rather a villified player said something like "In today's society with the amount of effort everyone has gone to to remove this sort of thing from our game and life in general, it is very disappointing that someone would continue to behave in this very poor manner...."
Am I a bit unsympathetic?
I think we have to assume that it was a once off incident, and possibly a slip of the tongue kind of thing, e.g. the insult was something like "you're a piece of s**t" and added the racist word in somewhere as an adjective, e.g. "you're a piece of black / African s**t. That, to me, might be worth four weeks. And even then I think the penalty was light.
Now if the insult was based on making degrading remarks based on the ethnicity of the GC player that went beyond mere adjectives, say if the abuse centered around a racist stereotype then I'd sincerely hope he would have received a harsher penalty.
I think there is a difference between a slip of the tongue inside a generic insult and a deliberate attempt to racially abuse and degrade someone. Certainly both are racist. And you've got to be thinking something to say it. But if the abuse was more targeted then a slip of the tongue four weeks is weak and minuscule.
Based on the punishment, you have to hope and assume it was a slip of the tongue kind of insult and not targeted or repeated... I would be very disappointed in the punishment handed out by the club if this were the case.
Now if the insult was based on making degrading remarks based on the ethnicity of the GC player that went beyond mere adjectives, say if the abuse centered around a racist stereotype then I'd sincerely hope he would have received a harsher penalty.
I think there is a difference between a slip of the tongue inside a generic insult and a deliberate attempt to racially abuse and degrade someone. Certainly both are racist. And you've got to be thinking something to say it. But if the abuse was more targeted then a slip of the tongue four weeks is weak and minuscule.
Based on the punishment, you have to hope and assume it was a slip of the tongue kind of insult and not targeted or repeated... I would be very disappointed in the punishment handed out by the club if this were the case.
Ant_
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According to Brett Goodes it was a one off by Sherman.
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While I do agree with your last part that it is being removed from general society, insults which are said to you in an offhand matter - of any nature - racist, sexist or about your character; those stick with you for life. This is going to sound very woe-is-me but I can still remember insults said to me when I was in year 2. That sort of stuff sticks. Maybe I'm just being precious, but I doubt it. This sort of stuff builds up a pretty hard exterior and makes you conscious of your actions in the future.
ize_
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That's good to hear. I still don't buy the argument though. As I've said, you've either got it in you or you don't IMO. If you're categorically NOT racist, you just wouldn't ever vilify a person of another colour under any circumstances. Sherman did, so it doesn't really leave much to the imagination.
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When I came to Australia and started playing Aussie Rules as a kid I copped heaps of abuse because I had a broad Irish accent when I was younger.
Never in all that time though did I sook and carry on like some of these grown adults do.
If someone gave me a spray because of my ethnicity I gave it back every bit as good as I got it.
If people don't like you because of your enthnicity big ****ing deal, get the **** over it and move on.
To make it front page news of a major paper is laughable.
Never in all that time though did I sook and carry on like some of these grown adults do.
If someone gave me a spray because of my ethnicity I gave it back every bit as good as I got it.
If people don't like you because of your enthnicity big ****ing deal, get the **** over it and move on.
To make it front page news of a major paper is laughable.
Wow, do you have an axe to grind? It's a terribly narrow way to look at it.
Ant_
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Perhaps, but I would say the brother of Adam Goodes who is also a welfare officer and who knows Sherman in real life, who looked him in the eyes would know better.
My opinion, Sherman is an idiot, don't know if he harbours those thoughts for real or not.
ize_
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Why? Why would you say something racist if you weren't racist. Maybe it's a narrow way to look at it but that's the way I see it. Also, yes I obviously do have an axe to grind, against racist people... That's hardly the point.
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The thing that sanctimonious idiots don't get is that in the heat of the battle you often point out a physical trait of someone thats blatantly obvious which is why it springs to mind quickest.
Take 3 different people with 3 different distinguishing features.
You could call someone...
A ranga ****
A jugeared ****
A black bastard
All point out simply a physical trait that is obvious.
Drawing the moronic assumpions some people do one can deduce that whoever hurled insults hate red heads (racism) hate big eared people (bigotry) hate black people (racism).
Stating the obvious doesnt make someone racist nor does it mean you dislike every single person with that physical trait.
Take 3 different people with 3 different distinguishing features.
You could call someone...
A ranga ****
A jugeared ****
A black bastard
All point out simply a physical trait that is obvious.
Drawing the moronic assumpions some people do one can deduce that whoever hurled insults hate red heads (racism) hate big eared people (bigotry) hate black people (racism).
Stating the obvious doesnt make someone racist nor does it mean you dislike every single person with that physical trait.
It depends on the circumstances of course, but I wouldn't hold it against someone forever if they racially abused me. It's just abuse, people have done more and and no be considered racist.
I heard on the radio last night that Sherman's greatest punishment will be that he carries the "life sentence" of being labelled a racist. I found this bewildering.
I can't believe people will remember this in another year, let alone the rest of his life. In addition to this, I don't believe this is such a horrendous crime that Sherman will not be able to redeem himself if he wanted to.
No doubt, racism should not be tolerated and Sherman deserved to be punished, but it's hardly the end of the world for him. Is it?
Maybe this is irrelevant, but I'm reminded of Clint Eastwood's character in Gran Torino. He played an out and out racist and was proud of it. Yet despite a life of of handing out racial abuse, he was able to redeem himself in the eyes of the viewers. Surely Sherman is not in the racist league of Clint Eastwood's character in this film, and therefore just as surely, talk of this offence shaming him for the rest of his life is ridiculous.
I can't believe people will remember this in another year, let alone the rest of his life. In addition to this, I don't believe this is such a horrendous crime that Sherman will not be able to redeem himself if he wanted to.
No doubt, racism should not be tolerated and Sherman deserved to be punished, but it's hardly the end of the world for him. Is it?
Maybe this is irrelevant, but I'm reminded of Clint Eastwood's character in Gran Torino. He played an out and out racist and was proud of it. Yet despite a life of of handing out racial abuse, he was able to redeem himself in the eyes of the viewers. Surely Sherman is not in the racist league of Clint Eastwood's character in this film, and therefore just as surely, talk of this offence shaming him for the rest of his life is ridiculous.
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