List Balance

[Crow Magnum Man]

How many players can we play as big forwards at once, We now have
Tippett
Sellar
Hentschell
Walker
Davis
McKernan
Gill
Lee
Stevens
As well resting ruckmen
Maric
Griffin
Moran

The list is only 38 players long and with balance needed we can only play realistically 3 at a time, have we already crossed some names off for next year. I would have liked to seen another midfielder.

 

[cmndstab]

If you do a similar list for midfielders, assuming we can only play eight at the same time, you will find a similar overflow.


Personally I'm rapt that we took a bunch of KPPs. If we end up with four or five KPPs and we can't play them all, that's not a bad situation to be in!

 

[Ticktak]

Personally I'm rapt that we took a bunch of KPPs. If we end up with four or five KPPs and we can't play them all, that's not a bad situation to be in!

I totally agree.

Half of those players mentioned by CMM could also play down back. Plus it's not like those 12 players are all the same age.

 

[Geoffa32]

2009 is Sellars and Hentchel's last chance.

Sellar to be at least playing and dominating Glenelg 1s

Hentchell to be a Crow regular and live up to the potential tag.

 

[Jetwa5h]

2009 is Sellars and Hentchel's last chance.

Sellar to be at least playing and dominating Glenelg 1s

Hentchell to be a Crow regular and live up to the potential tag.

I would also suggest Gill and to a lesser extent Stevens may be a touch shakey also, plus the possibility of Tippett going home and a remote possibility of Moran doing the same culls that list some

 

[KUNG FU]

Most of that list are developing. About half of those won't make it. The rest is depth.

 

[ltdamn]

Not every KPP we draft will cut the mustard though.

Also seems Craigy and Rendell are targeting specific KPP types who like to run and play on at every opportunity, judging from the videos. Suits his style of play enormously.

And, I think it's the first time I can ever recall us having an overflow of KPP's as opposed to a severe shortage in the last 18 years!!

We've come long way from the day we had to play Trent Ormond-Allen in the ruck against the Saints at Waverly.

 

[The Crows Truth]

How many players can we play as big forwards at once, We now have
Tippett
Sellar
Hentschell
Walker
Davis
McKernan
Gill
Lee
Stevens
As well resting ruckmen
Maric
Griffin
Moran

The list is only 38 players long and with balance needed we can only play realistically 3 at a time, have we already crossed some names off for next year. I would have liked to seen another midfielder.

at this stage tippett is gone in 2011
sellar - 50/50 to survive this year
burton - gone by 2011
gill/hentschel - one or both possibly gone by 2010 due to injuries

you have listed all 4 ruckmen also
and the rest are all unproven - we have drafted many key forwards due to the issues identified above - fast forward 2 years and the cupboard was looking pretty bare until today

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Surely it is admission that we are so bad at identifying, developing and promoting key forwards that we have taken a shotgun approach - pick enough of them and surely one of them will come good.

Or that the task of identifying, developing and promoting key forwards is so difficult that we haven't given it due consideration in the past.

 

[Mismatched]

Surely it is admission that we are so bad at identifying, developing and promoting key forwards that we have taken a shotgun approach - pick enough of them and surely one of them will come good.

Or that the task of identifying, developing and promoting key forwards is so difficult that we haven't given it due consideration in the past.

I think all of the above has some merit. There's also the fact that the delistees/retirees were generally taller types, ie Biglands, Mcgregor, Basset, Jericho and Massie, with Campbell being the only one really below 6'2. If you look at what's replaced them, we got 2 195cm+ players, 2 190ish players and 2 smaller players (inc Petrenko), a lot of like for like there. I guess we felt that if we didn't pick tall we might leave ourselves very much on the short side in terms of depth.

 

[Elite Crow]

I cant complain about going for forwards considering thats been our downfall since Modra and Jars but I would have liked a class crumber.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

I cant complain about going for forwards considering thats been our downfall since Modra and Jars but I would have liked a class crumber.

Good point.

The missing link.

In hindsight, Matthew Bode gets better by the day.

 

[Mismatched]

Good point.

The missing link.

In hindsight, Matthew Bode gets better by the day.

Unfortunately 1 good year in 3 injury wise and getting close to 30 in a very old list didn't do him any favours.

 

[Elite Crow]

Good point.

The missing link.

In hindsight, Matthew Bode gets better by the day.

If only Rioli loved churches, 5AA and pie floaters our problems would be solved.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Unfortunately 1 good year in 3 injury wise and getting close to 30 in a very old list didn't do him any favours.

Sorry, I don't mean we should have kept him. I'm saying that it is only as time goes by and our forward line crumbing woes reach crisis/comedy level that we realise just how good a player Bode was, how difficult these players are to replace and just how unique and important their particular skill is.

 

[Mismatched]

Sorry, I don't mean we should have kept him. I'm saying that it is only as time goes by and our forward line crumbing woes reach crisis/comedy level that we realise just how good a player Bode was, how difficult these players are to replace and just how unique and important their particular skill is.

Oh yeah, I totally agree, Bode's 2006 was an amazing season and very much under-rated by most if not all supporters. I remember watching him in '07 in his only game for us, he made some match winning efforts which just highlighted his importance to our side, shame it was one of these efforts that probably ended his career.

FWIW I wouldn't give up on Jacky yet, struggled with injury for much of last year and from what I saw in his 3rd game for us, he was definitely starting to adjust to the speed and bigger bodies in the AFL. In hindsight we probably brought him in too early, but I'm sure after another preseason he'll be much better prepared with a stronger body.

Also as much as he is maligned and will probably move into the midfield, 1 goal and 3 tackles a game from Douglas isn't exactly a poor performance as a goal sneak. I also wouldn't be averse to letting Thompson spend more time up forward, yes he's very damaging at the clearances and around packs, but I think he could also be very damaging up forward. Dangerfield is another, who whilst not short, could come in and play a similar role, Edwards I think might too for next year.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Also as much as he is maligned and will probably move into the midfield, 1 goal and 3 tackles a game from Douglas isn't exactly a poor performance as a goal sneak. I also wouldn't be averse to letting Thompson spend more time up forward, yes he's very damaging at the clearances and around packs, but I think he could also be very damaging up forward. Dangerfield is another, who whilst not short, could come in and play a similar role, Edwards I think might too for next year.

Just on Edwards, it seemed to me that very early in the 2008 season we had him playing predominantly as a small forward. He kicked a goal or two but it struck me that he didn't seem to be exuding enthusiasm for the role. Looking from the outside it almost seemed as he resented being taken out of the midfield. As the season wore on he returned to the midfield and eventually started playing some very good football but it remains one of my big disappointments from 2008 as, like yourself, I see it as a role he is well suited to and fits the AFC timeline perfectly.

 

[cmndstab]

I always loved Bode, and the Crows did too, they just didn't love his continuous run of injuries

The rookie draft will hopefully address the imbalance. I would dearly love to see Rockliff picked up in the rookie draft, think he's exactly what we need. of course, being that he lacks fitness, it's hard to imagine Craig giving it the nod.

 

[Mismatched]

Just on Edwards, it seemed to me that very early in the 2008 season we had him playing predominantly as a small forward. He kicked a goal or two but it struck me that he didn't seem to be exuding enthusiasm for the role. Looking from the outside it almost seemed as he resented being taken out of the midfield. As the season wore on he returned to the midfield and eventually started playing some very good football but it remains one of my big disappointments from 2008 as, like yourself, I see it as a role he is well suited to and fits the AFC timeline perfectly.

Yeah, I think he returned there towards the end of the season though with a bit more success, IIRC he kicked 3 on Acker playing as a small forward. Will be interesting to see where he plays next year, he played a lot as a small defender and forward early in his career under Ayres as a Mr. Fixit, before finally settling as a midfielder under Craig, I think its still worth him spending a little time in the midfield, a bit of leadership around the stoppages never hurt anyone, but I think him and Goodwin need to work on providing some much needed leadership and guidance to our very young forward line, even if all they do is take some of the more credentialed defenders away from our young forwards.

 

[Eastern Crow]

How many players can we play as big forwards at once, We now have
Tippett
Sellar
Hentschell
Walker
Davis
McKernan
Gill
Lee
Stevens
As well resting ruckmen
Maric
Griffin
Moran

The list is only 38 players long and with balance needed we can only play realistically 3 at a time, have we already crossed some names off for next year. I would have liked to seen another midfielder.

you need to take into consideration the risks with some current players like Sellar and Hentchel and maybe Gill

also need to consider that out of all the boys drafted yesterday ,McKernan may be the only lad ready to play in 2009

The players the crows have drafted offer versitility, yes we have drafted heavily looking for a forward, however they all can play other roles

IMO the crows finally have a young balanced list to start to build a ptrmiership assault and have covered risks with current players

 

[Johnny Rutten]

On the surface, our squad looks a little top-heavy.

16 talls and 24 utilities. The general average in the AFL is 14 talls/26 utilities.

However, with the uncertain futures of Sellar, Gill & Hentschel (Griffin & Moran will also be under pressure to keep improving) our 2009 squad balance makes perfect sense. Added to this, many of our talls can play on flanks (Stevens, Kite, Young, Bock, etc).

I think the AFC have got it right.

Expect us to go small in next year's draft, especially with the impending retirements of 2 of Macca/Goody/Edwards.

 

[Stiffy_18]

No doubt some of those guys will not make it for what ever reason. Some might leave so really we are just covering our bases. In the very small chance that all of them come good then we have some great trading chips to get some other talent in to address our needs in a time when drafts will be compromised and the team that trades well will get ahead of the pack.

While overall, we might be a touch too top heavy at the moment, its won't be the case in a couple of years time. I think its a given that some of those kids will not make it, some like Gill will be shown the door because those coming through will offer more than he does.

But if Davis and McKernan pan out, Tippett and Walker develop as expected and they all stick around, **** me thats one mean forward line. Then you look down the spine and it becomes even more impressive.

Rutten - Bock - Dangerfield - Davis/McKernan - Tippett/Walker

And with Maric, Griffin, Tippett, Moran and McKernan/Sellar to rotate through the ruck if needed, that one mean looking outfit.

On reflection, this was a good year to go tall. One we are going with the strength of the draft and two, with the next few draft being compromised, it is going to be just about impossible to pick up a quality tall in the draft. Gold Coast and West Sydney would raid the draft looking for talls to build their team around.

 

[ManInTheArena]

How many players can we play as big forwards at once, We now have
Tippett
Sellar
Hentschell
Walker
Davis
McKernan
Gill
Lee
Stevens
As well resting ruckmen
Maric
Griffin
Moran

Too many good tall forwards, thats a great problem to have and not a concern at all considering we have a enough young midfield to cover us. Worst case scenario is we will have to trade some... and my oh my don't good tall forwards command good draft picks in trades. We were the smartest club by exploiting a once in a lifetime draft for tall talent and it happened at just the right time in our list development lifecycle. I'm sure we can find a couple of good midfielders in and around the Gold Coast's picks next year, or we may trade some talls to the Gold Coast for lower picks, which may have been the backup plan all along.

 

[Campbell's Chunky]

I think we've picked assuming that 1 or 2 dont turn out, so effectively we're putting our eggs in plenty of KPP baskets with no real cost since we don't have a major midfield deficiency (and mids will be drafted in the new few years and usually only take 1 or 2 years to be able to play a proper role anyway).

 

[cmndstab]

I agree with the assessment that we now have the right balance of mids and talls. Assuming a fair number of them come up, the only areas I feel we are now deficient in are small forwards/crumbers and ruckmen.

With ruckmen, I would like to see a developing ruckman on our list, even our rookie list. I believe Maric is here to stay as our #1 ruckman, and Moran/Tippett can do the rucking at either end of the ground (assuming they stay with the Crows once GC17 come in, which I personally believe they will) and Griffin has what it takes to be a good ruckman too, but we don't have any other ruckmen available. I'd really rather not see Shaun McKernan become a ruckman through lack of options. We doin't need a ruckman now, but we likely will within a few years.

With the crumbers, Jacky is touted for that role and 2009 is his year to prove he can do it, but we really don't have anyone for that position other than Porplyzia. Again, we have youngsters who can pinch hit in the role (I wouldn't be surprised to see Dangerfield down there doing it next year, or even Petrenko given a run there) but nobody who is likely to spend their career there. I really want to see Rockliff given a chance.