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Toast Lyons

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jangofett said:
Hey, First time poster but long time viewer. I like Lyons a lot, but who goes out for crouch when hes fit? Kerridge is ahead of Lyons atm
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I think Crouch and Hendo to come back into the best 22 - will then get pretty tight for spots with Porps, McKernan, Lyons, Laird/Brown, and then back to Mackay/Kerridge/Wright closest to the drop.

PS Welcome aboard jangofett!
 
Drugs Are Bad Mackay? said:
Everyone looks at what Geelong does now.

We should be looking at what they did 2001-06 and replicating that. What they did after they'd assembled a premiership squad isn't relevant to us (yet).
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We should be looking at what ever successful club is doing and we should be adopting the practises if we feel they are relevent to our club. Take in everything that is good no matter which club is involved, analyse it and implement what we need. We dont have to reinvent the wheel.....sure if we have something that we have developed use it but lets not be too proud to use other clubs initiatives.
 

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Once all our midfield is available, we should consider rotating players out with niggles to keep everyone fresh.

Also, more use of the red vest like we did with Rutten against GWS, when games are in control.
 
BrissyCrow said:
So would I. Iam a fan of Hendo he just needs to cement a spot in the team and not be moved around all over the place.
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Not if it means keeping one of those young lads out the team... He has had enough time now to cement a spot..Personally, I think he will make it anyway
 
jangofett said:
Hey, First time poster but long time viewer. I like Lyons a lot, but who goes out for crouch when hes fit? Kerridge is ahead of Lyons atm
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What Lyons showed against GWS eclipses anything Crouch has done so far.

I don't think it matters though, you can fit both in the same side.
 
Freddy Bassett said:
Lyons, Laird, Brown, Kerridge and Smith all need to be picked every game they are fit. The likes of Hendo, Mackay, Johncock, Vince, Porps can make way unless they are in sparkling form.
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I would have thought Hendo, Mackay and Lynch are in the former group also. Mackay has to play, when the teams going good, Mackays run is important
 
Kane McGoodwin said:
Also, more use of the red vest like we did with Rutten against GWS, when games are in control.
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Still think its the #1 flaw of Sando. Isn't quick enough to pull the trigger on the sub. Had the game won at half time. Why risk Rutten for an extra quarter? Should have brought Lyons on at Half time.
 
jangofett said:
I would have thought Hendo, Mackay and Lynch are in the former group also. Mackay has to play, when the teams going good, Mackays run is important
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I am a fan of both Mackay and Hendo... Both have had more than enough time to take their game from a C grade level up to a solid B. I think at their best they are B graders. There comes a time when you need to start investing games into young players with potential to be A graders.
I am not saying drop either but if they are not in top form they cant keep a youngster out the team
 

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Wood_Duck said:
Definitely. This is the point people have been missing. Much easier to bring youngsters into a champion team. You put Christensen, Smedts, Horlin-Smith, Hunt any of them in the Melbourne team at the moment and they would play like Melbourne players.
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I was more thinking that it's easier to have a strict "only get games when they've absolutely earned it" policy when you've already got a gun team and only have a couple of spots for youngsters available (if that).
 
BrissyCrow said:
We should be looking at what ever successful club is doing and we should be adopting the practises if we feel they are relevent to our club. Take in everything that is good no matter which club is involved, analyse it and implement what we need. We dont have to reinvent the wheel.....sure if we have something that we have developed use it but lets not be too proud to use other clubs initiatives.
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I don't think you understand the point I'm making.

We shouldn't be copying Sydney/Geelong are doing now, because they're at a different level/stage to us.

We should be looking at what they did prior to their premierships and replicating that.
 
Freddy Bassett said:
I am a fan of both Mackay and Hendo... Both have had more than enough time to take their game from a C grade level up to a solid B. I think at their best they are B graders. There comes a time when you need to start investing games into young players with potential to be A graders.
I am not saying drop either but if they are not in top form they cant keep a youngster out the team
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Hendo seems to be able to play anywhere though. Hes a perfect sub i think, but obviously cant play there every week. He should be used on a HBF full time maybe
 
Drugs Are Bad Mackay? said:
I was more thinking that it's easier to have a strict "only get games when they've absolutely earned it" policy when you've already got a gun team and only have a couple of spots for youngsters available (if that).
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Yep OK. I get what you are saying. Its very much the chicken and egg scenario, as you said.
 
BACCS said:
Ok then, when we were on a dream run with injuries and playing some of our best footy in a long time, who would you have dropped?

Brown over Dogga? Come off it, Dogga was brilliant last season. Brown looked like a deer in headlights, but it got him the taste of it.
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Dogga was solid without being great for most of last year. Brown may have adjusted to the level better if he had played a little more. We could have got away with resting Doughty in more games than we did.

As far as other people who could have got dropped, Vince and Douglas could have made way on more than one occasion. Also the kids could have been brought in for more games at the expense of people like Jaensch, Symes and Knights.

BACCS said:
Lyons got a couple of little chances (and played ok), but he was never gonna get an extended run when our midfield was the best in the competition last year.
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He showed a fair bit in the limited time that he had. Repeated subbing didn't really help his case either.

BACCS said:
Same with Kerridge.
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I'm surprised that you could tell so much from the one quarter that he played. Kerrdige came into the team with AFL level fitness and an AFL ready body. I don't see why he couldn't have stayed in the team the entire season.

BACCS said:
They were unlucky, but that's what happens when the side has no injuries, is sitting in the top 2 for a fair amount of the season, and has the number one clearance and contested ball combination.
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The selection panel makes their luck for them.

BACCS said:
Lyons probably could have come in earlier this season, but it's not the end of the world as you are making it out to be.
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I didn't say that it was the end of the world. What I did say is that we have a shortfall of AFL experience with our key younger players that could have been reduced if we had taken some more calculated chances with our selection process last year.
 
PyroCrow said:
Dogga was solid without being great for most of last year. Brown may have adjusted to the level better if he had played a little more. We could have got away with resting Doughty in more games than we did.
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The fact that we were contending for a flag obviously escaped your attention...
PyroCrow said:
As far as other people who could have got dropped, Vince and Douglas could have made way on more than one occasion. Also the kids could have been brought in for more games at the expense of people like Jaensch, Symes and Knights.
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Vince & Douglas were never going to be dropped while they were performing to an acceptable standard and we were contending for a flag. Yes, Douglas has lifted his game this year - but his game last year was nowhere near the standard required for him to be dropped.

Jaensch played so many games because they knew Doughty was going to retire and they were grooming him as the replacement - an experiment which has now failed twice (hopefully Sando has learned his lesson this time). Symes & Knights were played so that the new coach could make an informed decision regarding their long-term futures; they played as many games as that required and not one game more.
PyroCrow said:
I'm surprised that you could tell so much from the one quarter that he played. Kerrdige came into the team with AFL level fitness and an AFL ready body. I don't see why he couldn't have stayed in the team the entire season.
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There's a lot more to gaining AFL selection than just being a super fit man-child. Form & skills just may have had a say in his non-selection last year?
 

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Godallblighty said:
Doughty is becoming a better player in retirement than he ever was in actuality.
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If you were to ask Brown right now if he'd like to have the career Dogga had, he'd take it in a heart beat. I'll put it to you that some people, like yourself, don't give anywhere near the credit he deserves. I felt a lot safer with Dogga playing down back last year than I did with Brown or any other of our small defenders.

I'm not sure why we are crticising selections last year anyway when our side was 5 points off a GF and practically had zero injuries all season. Sure, there were form dips for certain players, but when the team is flying and still winning why should the selectors change anything?
 
BACCS said:
If you were to ask Brown right now if he'd like to have the career Dogga had, he'd take it in a heart beat. I'll put it to you that some people, like yourself, don't give anywhere near the credit he deserves. I felt a lot safer with Dogga playing down back last year than I did with Brown or any other of our small defenders.

I'm not sure why we are crticising selections last year anyway when our side was 5 points off a GF and practically had zero injuries all season. Sure, there were form dips for certain players, but when the team is flying and still winning why should the selectors change anything?
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How has what you have written supported your opinion Doughty was brilliant last year? Because you felt safer doesn't equate to brilliance.
 
BACCS said:
If you were to ask Brown right now if he'd like to have the career Dogga had, he'd take it in a heart beat. I'll put it to you that some people, like yourself, don't give anywhere near the credit he deserves. I felt a lot safer with Dogga playing down back last year than I did with Brown or any other of our small defenders.
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There's a big difference between denigrating a player and simply not pumping him up to be something he wasn't. Doughty was a solid player who played dependable defense for a long time. I admire him for that and also for the fact that he seemed a pretty decent bloke. But he was never 'brilliant' and he was a shocking momentum killer more often than not. We may miss him as a club man but we are not missing him in any significant way on the field.
 

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