Mark Blake - Nuts and Bolts

[Pure_Ownage]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

If 211 is fit, Ottens gets nowhere near him, and we don't play Freo every week,and we won a flag in 09, and how many games did Ottens play
? and Blake? All this "doom and gloom" is BF. We have what we have and the fact that Saints and Pies got the better of us 2010 had very little to do with Blake/Ottens/Gardiner/King/McEvoy/Jolley/Leroy.

While I agree (well now anyway, a few years ago I would have said Otto got quite close to him) I just thought the comment indicated that Scott really rates Ottens. I also noted his comments about Ottens playing forward, and while I don't think Otto can do that well unless he's found more speed and fitness from what he had this year, I think it's a hint that Scott is planning with this new rule to play two ruckmen who are both capable of spending a fair bit of time forward when the other one is rucking. Which is very much a doom and gloom scenario with Blake, because I can't see him being anywhere near competent in a forward line (even a slow Otto is much more competent there, and West Vardy etc are better options within the forward 50).

 

[darren forssman]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

Since when has Blake ever been a forward? Might be worth a few matches as a trial, but I can only recall him being a ruck. He hardly even rests down there. Pretty sure your point is he would be useless if played there, pretty sure that may be correct. But we don't really know for sure.

he has played sporadically there, i do remember a pies game last year when he lasted all but 5 mins there.

he isnt quick, isnt a great contested mark and his kicking isnt great. i dont see how he could rest in the forward line and be effective.

 

[David the Cat]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

To say " if 211 ( Simpson ) is fit Ottens will get nowhere near him" is..in my view...absolute rubbish.

Simpson is a VFL player who has proved nothing to date in the big league. Ottens is a premiership player...multiple all Australian...and clearly our #1 ruck man in most people's eyes and it appears in the coaching staff's eyes as well. He is also far more effective up forward and has better hands than Simpson by a country mile. This is blowing Simpson's trumpet wayyyyyyy too loud,

Simpson has a long way to go....and multiple top performances before he can be mentioned in the same breath as a fit Brad Ottens.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

he has played sporadically there, i do remember a pies game last year when he lasted all but 5 mins there.

he isnt quick, isnt a great contested mark and his kicking isnt great. i dont see how he could rest in the forward line and be effective.

Which is precisely the problem, because he will have to now everyone will have to stay longer on the ground.

This is the reason why he can't play ahead of West Vardy or Simpson even if he's a better ruckman than all of them (personally I don't think he is, but I'm simply pointing out that even if was he still can't fill the forward/ruck role we will need).

It's pretty simple to me, Blake spends the entire year in the VFL unless Ottens gets injured.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

To say " if 211 ( Simpson ) is fit Ottens will get nowhere near him" is..in my view...absolute rubbish.

Simpson is a VFL player who has proved nothing to date in the big league. Ottens is a premiership player...multiple all Australian...and clearly our #1 ruck man in most people's eyes and it appears in the coaching staff's eyes as well. He is also far more effective up forward and has better hands than Simpson by a country mile. This is blowing Simpson's trumpet wayyyyyyy too loud,

Simpson has a long way to go....and multiple top performances before he can be mentioned in the same breath as a fit Brad Ottens.

By 211, VEEDUBS meant Sandilands, not Simpson.

That said, I agree with your post.

 

[Vdubs]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

By 211, VEEDUBS meant Sandilands, not Simpson.

That said, I agree with your post.

Bizarre comment. 211 is Sandilands, so the post is meaningless, so what do you agree with? That Ottens is better than Simpson?

 

[Vdubs]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

To say " if 211 ( Simpson ) is fit Ottens will get nowhere near him" is..in my view...absolute rubbish.

Simpson is a VFL player who has proved nothing to date in the big league. Ottens is a premiership player...multiple all Australian...and clearly our #1 ruck man in most people's eyes and it appears in the coaching staff's eyes as well. He is also far more effective up forward and has better hands than Simpson by a country mile. This is blowing Simpson's trumpet wayyyyyyy too loud,

Simpson has a long way to go....and multiple top performances before he can be mentioned in the same breath as a fit Brad Ottens.

Hey, hold on for a breath, 211 is SANDILANDS

 

[David the Cat]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

Hey, hold on for a breath, 211 is SANDILANDS

Oooops.......sorry ... lol...



That being the case, spot on. I don't think I have seen a better more mobile player of even close to his size since Gary Dempsey.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

Bizarre comment. 211 is Sandilands, so the post is meaningless, so what do you agree with? That Ottens is better than Simpson?

Yes. That and DTC's general comments about Ottens.

While he might be slowing down now, he has been a fantastic player for us and our #1 ruck for a long time, deservedly so.

 

[Vdubs]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

Yes. That and DTC's general comments about Ottens.

While he might be slowing down now, he has been a fantastic player for us and our #1 ruck for a long time, deservedly so.

EVERYBODY here that has seen the 2 would agree with that fact, there is no comparison at present, but it's the comparison between 211 and Ottens that is relevant and interesting.

 

[Boxhead_31]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

he has played sporadically there, i do remember a pies game last year when he lasted all but 5 mins there.

he isnt quick, isnt a great contested mark and his kicking isnt great. i dont see how he could rest in the forward line and be effective.

Thats why he should be played off the wing Richo style, could turn his whole career around playing as a tall roaming link man hurting teams with his damaging disposal into our forward 50

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

westy showed some real good signs today.should play round one rather than blake

 

[you pick one]

Re: Blake Nuts and Bolts

westy showed some real good signs today.should play round one rather than blake

You would struggle to make one decent ruckman out of the three on yesterdays effort.

If they were working dogs they would most likely be getting a lead breakfast this morning.

Still it's a long time since we have seen Otto this early in the season and Wests 2 Marks should have Blake covered for the season.
If West could get a hand to it in the ruck contest I would agree on round 1 but he can't ,had his chance to shut the door on Simpson and may be Vardy yesterday and never took full advantage IMO.

Ruck spots still wide open I reckon.

 

[hamG]

I felt Blake did the best tap work out of all the ruckmen yesterday. He played exactly like Blake does.

Scott said Vardy will play next week and mentioned how impressive he had been in the pre season.

Odd we no longer appear to have a stand out #1 ruckmen. We have five #2 ruckmen. Old Otto is old and rusty.

 

[Partridge]

I felt Blake did the best tap work out of all the ruckmen yesterday. He played exactly like Blake does.

Scott said Vardy will play next week and mentioned how impressive he had been in the pre season.

Odd we no longer appear to have a stand out #1 ruckmen. We have five #2 ruckmen. Old Otto is old and rusty.

Ottens looked ok, so did West. Blake won hitouts but predictably did nothing else.

As long as Ottens is not played up forward ever again, I'll be happy.

 

[Turbocat]

Ottens looked ok, so did West. Blake won hitouts but predictably did nothing else.

As long as Ottens is not played up forward ever again, I'll be happy.

Ottens looked ordinary. He had no spring. So did Blake , Blake was Blake. So did West but he at least did a bit around the ground in game 1. So on the whole , the only saving grace for West is he MAY have upside if he is played.And we must find out this year. We must not go into a game this year without one of West, Vardy or Daw because must find out if we need to go shopping for for someone who has enough talent to match the outstanding group of mids we have.

Actually , it worried me that we lost Pods and we didn't even see if one of them could go forward. If Blake is that much of a handicap he should placed in the two till he learns to mark and kick goals.West must run himself into the ground and never stop moving so he gets more ball. And Ottens , if thats all he's got then its time for him to become our ruck coach.

 

[Farmer2Goggin]

I felt Blake did the best tap work out of all the ruckmen yesterday. He played exactly like Blake does.

Scott said Vardy will play next week and mentioned how impressive he had been in the pre season.

Odd we no longer appear to have a stand out #1 ruckmen. We have five #2 ruckmen. Old Otto is old and rusty.

If we aren't careful the Ruck could become our achilles heel. There are a lot of emerging or potential athletic big men coming through - Tippett, Leunberger, Kreuzer , Natanui, Majak ( scary), Warnock, Ryder,Clark, Clarke, Mumford. Add this to Jolly , Sandilands, Jamar, Hille, Cox and the future could be bleak.
We know what we have got with Ottens and Blake and it is no longer good enough.
We desperately need West , Vardy, Dawson or Bathie to come through - otherwise we need to find one in the draft or trade.

 

[noclashjumpers]

What's happened to Simpson? Is he injured? He seems never to be mentioned ...coach included. Surely Vardy can't be ahead of him?

 

[catswhiskers]

Simpson is a big chance.
He went on mission impossible last year playing that 211 bloke on a ground that looks like a cigar from the top of the stands (pushes ruckmen to their limit). He didn't win but he didn't lower his colours either.

Much better form than any NAB cup for me.

 

[maxy87]

If we aren't careful the Ruck could become our achilles heel. There are a lot of emerging or potential athletic big men coming through - Tippett, Leunberger, Kreuzer , Natanui, Majak ( scary), Warnock, Ryder,Clark, Clarke, Mumford. Add this to Jolly , Sandilands, Jamar, Hille, Cox and the future could be bleak.
We know what we have got with Ottens and Blake and it is no longer good enough.
We desperately need West , Vardy, Dawson or Bathie to come through - otherwise we need to find one in the draft or trade.

I think it already is our Achilles heel, mate. I say this because we really get Ottens in the side and firing on all cylinders. If we didn't have such an elite midfield this ruck situation would be a much larger issue but at the moment were good enough (most of the time) to cover it.

I think it's time to make a decision and stick with it for a while. Either west or vardy gets put at 1st ruck and plays consecutive games to develop. Sure they'll get beaten a fair bit but they'll be better players for it in the longer term. Ottens doesn't need to play 23 games this year even if fit. He needs to be managed carefully.

This would be the only time I'd endorse playing someone just for the sake of development and not necessarily merit. That said, our 2nd tier ricks aren't exactly banging down the selection door anyway and Blake needs to lift dramatically so it would make the decision somewhat easier IMO.

If west and or vardy/Simpson get injured or tire, then we have a pretty servicable and experienced Blake to fill the void but surely he can't be number 1 this year

 

[Partridge]

I think it already is our Achilles heel, mate. I say this because we really get Ottens in the side and firing on all cylinders. If we didn't have such an elite midfield this ruck situation would be a much larger issue but at the moment were good enough (most of the time) to cover it.

I think it's time to make a decision and stick with it for a while. Either west or vardy gets put at 1st ruck and plays consecutive games to develop. Sure they'll get beaten a fair bit but they'll be better players for it in the longer term. Ottens doesn't need to play 23 games this year even if fit. He needs to be managed carefully.

I disagree. We tried that policy last year and it backfired spectacularly. This isn't the bush league. You don't get to pick and choose. If Ottens is our number one ruckman, then he plays when fit. If his body can't handle playing every week, then he isn't our number one ruckman anymore. I don't see a spot for Blake unless there's an injury.

Part of me would like to see say West and Simpson in Round 1, and left that way for 10 games. If they can hold their own at ruck contests, and get enough of the ball around the ground to make a contribution, we could do far worse. You could throw Vardy into that also perhaps. Scott seems to be speaking highly of him. Such a combination (with a fit Ottens and Blake) would send a very clear message that past accomplishments mean nothing. Not the worst idea.

 

[Ty-Land]

I thought Blake was his usual self on the weekend, but with one minor difference. On a couple of plays he actually threw his weight around, which he hardly ever does. I remember him crashing a pack on the premiership stand wing early on and I thought, haven't seen Blake do that before. So maybe he knows his job is well and truly on the line and he is trying to do some of the little things.

In saying all that, I thought West clearly outplayed him. But all 3 rucks were very mediocre on the day

 

[maxy87]

I disagree. We tried that policy last year and it backfired spectacularly. This isn't the bush league. You don't get to pick and choose. If Ottens is our number one ruckman, then he plays when fit. If his body can't handle playing every week, then he isn't our number one ruckman anymore. I don't see a spot for Blake unless there's an injury.

The fundamental principle of last years approach was allowing players such as Ottens an extended break over summer and then upon return, a light pre season in order to have older players peaking by September. We all know this did backfire to a fair degree (still finished top 4).

What I'm suggesting is that Ottens does a full pre season and trains as hard as anyone but doesn't play 23 games. He won't last the distance and despite how good Vardy or West MAY become, he is still our best ruckman and if fit, the best option to go up against Sandilands, Jolly, Gardiner types. There's nothing to prove by playing him against cellar dwellers but he'd obviously need to string a few games together to get match conditioned

 

[darren forssman]

I thought Blake was his usual self on the weekend, but with one minor difference. On a couple of plays he actually threw his weight around, which he hardly ever does. I remember him crashing a pack on the premiership stand wing early on and I thought, haven't seen Blake do that before. So maybe he knows his job is well and truly on the line and he is trying to do some of the little things.

the thing that stood out is that a raw but highly promising daw made him look like a dinosaur at times. daw even outmarked him on one occasion.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

I think it already is our Achilles heel, mate. I say this because we really get Ottens in the side and firing on all cylinders. If we didn't have such an elite midfield this ruck situation would be a much larger issue but at the moment were good enough (most of the time) to cover it.

I think it's time to make a decision and stick with it for a while. Either west or vardy gets put at 1st ruck and plays consecutive games to develop. Sure they'll get beaten a fair bit but they'll be better players for it in the longer term. Ottens doesn't need to play 23 games this year even if fit. He needs to be managed carefully.

This would be the only time I'd endorse playing someone just for the sake of development and not necessarily merit. That said, our 2nd tier ricks aren't exactly banging down the selection door anyway and Blake needs to lift dramatically so it would make the decision somewhat easier IMO.

If west and or vardy/Simpson get injured or tire, then we have a pretty servicable and experienced Blake to fill the void but surely he can't be number 1 this year

They'd get killed, particularly Vardy. I'm reasonably confident both West and Vardy could be good supporting #2 ruckmen (particularly Vardy who I have high hopes for) but I don't think either of them are the right physical specimen for the #1 ruck week in week out. Based on his size Dawson is probably the best go for the role, in tandem with either of the more mobile rucks.

Realistically both Ottens and Blake will be off the list at the end of the year, so unless Dawson can make some strides to the extent where the club feels he can take on that role in 2012 and the three young ruckmen can carry it in 2012, then a shopping trip may need to be considered.