Peter Dutton - How Long?

[Kwality]

Whilst I am hesitant to quote the AFR, here are the 15 questions and potential answers based on publically available info and statements. Except for q3 and q6, most seem to have answers.

Q3 opens the door to a very tough discussion and is the "trap" but eventually we are going to have to discuss it if compensation etc is talked about.

Answers to Dutton’s 15 questions on the Voice

The Coalition says the points Opposition Leader Peter Dutton has asked about the Voice ‘won’t go away’. Here are some answers using input from all sides.

www.afr.com

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its Albo's answers that will fill the bill, IF uncommitted voters are to join the cause.

 

[Kwality]

It really does depend on the question. Some questions are designed as traps, impossible to answer in a way that a sound bite can't be misused to make you look silly, and aren't genuine in nature.

So say that in the answer. It is not hard, & in writing if the sound bite is problematic.

 

[Crankyhawk]

So say that in the answer. It is not hard, & in writing if the sound bite is problematic.

Then Dutton will whinge “says my question is a trap what’s he trying to hide” ie spreading the same bullshit designed only to confuse not enlighten.
You perhaps are attributing higher more noble motives to Dutton than what I see. Dutton has already stated he has no policy ready to show the Australian people and no plan other than “we aren’t labor”. It’s only been 10 months since the election ffs - 30% of the electoral cycle.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

I'm just pointing out that breaking up MNEs would result in creating inefficiencies which would translate to price increases.

I think a lot of people are fine with that.

 

[FredLeDeux]

Poor Dutton,

Even the Fin can/has answer those questions. Dutton doesn't really want answers (anyone with half a brain could have found the answers themselves, especially if you're the leader of a political party with an upcoming referendum, you should take a glance at the material).

He wants it to look like there's not enough detail. After these 15 questions have been answered, he'll ask another 15, and another 15, all equally inane and answerable. But the point is to ask questions, not the substance of the questions.


The Fin is a good example of the schism in the Conservative side of politics. The AFR is the bastion of the upper-financial-class (inner-city Libs). And on this and other social issues, the Fin is aligned against the Liberals. Or, more accurately, the LNP are aligning themselves against readers of the AFR. The Teals now represent readers of the Fin, hence they have very few inner-city seats left. All so they can pretend to be dumb for their socially conservative members.

Answers to Dutton’s 15 questions on the Voice

The Coalition says the points Opposition Leader Peter Dutton has asked about the Voice ‘won’t go away’. Here are some answers using input from all sides.

www.afr.com

Classic, and obvious, sealioning by Dutton

 

[Kwality]

Then Dutton will whinge “says my question is a trap what’s he trying to hide” ie spreading the same bullshit designed only to confuse not enlighten.
You perhaps are attributing higher more noble motives to Dutton than what I see. Dutton has already stated he has no policy ready to show the Australian people and no plan other than “we aren’t labor”. It’s only been 10 months since the election ffs - 30% of the electoral cycle.

Depends IF winning the referendum is the main game.
Perhaps you think its game, set & match.

As for Dutton he needs wait to hit the bottom before he does anything. See Pesutto in the week leading up to the Aston by election. The Libs are on the nose everywhere, not just the Feds, or just Victoria ...

Future opportunities: the cost of living, the price of fuel/OPEC, the budget, the east coast power SNAFU scenario.

The small target strategy worked for Albo, Dutton would be crazy to do anything different with 70% of the electoral cycle in front of him.

 

[JackOutback]

Depends IF winning the referendum is the main game.
Perhaps you think its game, set & match.

As for Dutton he needs wait to hit the bottom before he does anything. See Pesutto in the week leading up to the Aston by election. The Libs are on the nose everywhere, not just the Feds, or just Victoria ...

Future opportunities: the cost of living, the price of fuel/OPEC, the budget, the east coast power SNAFU scenario.

The small target strategy worked for Albo, Dutton would be crazy to do anything different with 70% of the electoral cycle in front of him.

The thing about Albo's strategy is he didn't oppose a lot of Liberal policy because he didn't want to be seen as overly negative and starting unnecessary fights that might be lost. He focused in on what he thought were the most important issues to the most number of voters. If Dutton wants a small target strategy, manufacturing fights on issues that have a lot of support and could do reputational damage (ala walking out of the Stolen Generations apology) seems counter-intuitive.

 

[Saint]

Depends IF winning the referendum is the main game.
Perhaps you think its game, set & match.

As for Dutton he needs wait to hit the bottom before he does anything. See Pesutto in the week leading up to the Aston by election. The Libs are on the nose everywhere, not just the Feds, or just Victoria ...

Future opportunities: the cost of living, the price of fuel/OPEC, the budget, the east coast power SNAFU scenario.

The small target strategy worked for Albo, Dutton would be crazy to do anything different with 70% of the electoral cycle in front of him.

I think it's going to take more than a dead-running campaign to turn the Libs from being almost universally hated in every city to being a potential Government. They're not just running against the ALP, they lost as many seats to independents in cities.

If anything, that strategy is a continuation of their current trajectory. They'll lose even more voters to fiscally conservative Independents who believe in climate change and aren't religious nutters. Sukkar's essentially 5% down already in his seat (very similar to Aston).

If the Libs don't start showing that their ship is turning or that they've got policies, they'll continue to be seen how they're currently seen and how the fringes of their party and supporter base are trying to drag them.

I don't think they'll be able to drag the ALP as low as they themselves have sunk as purely an attacking campaign.

This kind of campaign would work for me, though. It'll introduce more independents (Greens taking ALP seats and Indies taking Liberal seats) and hopefully draw a hung parliament, which, history has shown, are the best types of Government.

 

[Kwality]

This kind of campaign would work for me, though. It'll introduce more independents (Greens taking ALP seats and Indies taking Liberal seats) and hopefully draw a hung parliament, which, history has shown, are the best types of Government.

Design by committee:​

Design by committee is a pejorative term for a project that has many designers involved but no unifying plan or vision.

 

[Crankyhawk]

Depends IF winning the referendum is the main game.
Perhaps you think its game, set & match.

As for Dutton he needs wait to hit the bottom before he does anything. See Pesutto in the week leading up to the Aston by election. The Libs are on the nose everywhere, not just the Feds, or just Victoria ...

Future opportunities: the cost of living, the price of fuel/OPEC, the budget, the east coast power SNAFU scenario.

The small target strategy worked for Albo, Dutton would be crazy to do anything different with 70% of the electoral cycle in front of him.

Dutton is possibly running a small target strategy. He has the baggage of being part of the do nothing (apart from multiple perceived rorts and waste) Scomo government; which means he starts off much further behind than where Albo is.
At the moment the voice referendum is the main game (and no I don't think it is game set and match) - because there will be some sort of upcoming vote which will "show" the relative political capital. Dutton is certainly playing it as a main game because by confusing the issues he maximises the no vote and therefore hurts Albo. I don't think he really gives a rats tossbag one way or another about the voice

TLDR dutton is playing political games with the referendum and hence his questions can be dismissed as irrelevant games.

 

[Saint]

Design by committee:​

Design by committee is a pejorative term for a project that has many designers involved but no unifying plan or vision.

I think it works here when it's two parties because they negotiate for their most important priorities and have to make trade-offs on others.

I'd take the best policies of the ALP as well as the best policies of the Greens.

 

[Kwality]

Dutton is possibly running a small target strategy. He has the baggage of being part of the do nothing (apart from multiple perceived rorts and waste) Scomo government; which means he starts off much further behind than where Albo is.
At the moment the voice referendum is the main game (and no I don't think it is game set and match) - because there will be some sort of upcoming vote which will "show" the relative political capital. Dutton is certainly playing it as a main game because by confusing the issues he maximises the no vote and therefore hurts Albo. I don't think he really gives a rats tossbag one way or another about the voice

TLDR dutton is playing political games with the referendum and hence his questions can be dismissed as irrelevant games.

All of which goes back to, do you want to win the referendum, or play political footsies ?
Not everyone has made up their mind & they have the right to question.
The reality is some do give a rats tossbag, for & against.

 

[Kwality]

I think it works here when it's two parties because they negotiate for their most important priorities and have to make trade-offs on others.

I'd take the best policies of the ALP as well as the best policies of the Greens.

Libs/Nats style.

 

[Saint]

Libs/Nats style.

A bit different since the Libs and Nats work out their platform together and take it to the election. They're rarely competing.

(And honestly, when was the last time the Nats had a policy other than "Here's the policies the Minerals Council told us we have"?)

Whereas the Greens and ALP often have differences of policy.

 

[Crankyhawk]

All of which goes back to, do you want to win the referendum, or play political footsies ?
Not everyone has made up their mind & they have the right to question.
The reality is some do give a rats tossbag, for & against.

Then pose your question if you have one.
If it is the “detail” the response is the rest of the constitution also lacks detail, constitution is about guiding principles not detail

(Btw while I will vote yes i have no skin in game so if referendum fails it fails - so I may not be the best to answer harder questions)

 

[Over The Post]

Liberal Party confirms opposition to Voice to Parliament

Opposition Leader Peter Dutton announces the Liberals' formal opposition to the federal government's model for an Indigenous Voice to Parliament, after a party room meeting in Canberra.

www.abc.net.au

Completely cooked. Scomo and Spud sinking the libs without trace.

 

[Aristotle Pickett the3rd]

Dutton walked out of the apology, Dutton trying to sabotage the Voice. Dutton is a far-right racist scumbag.
Their excuse and alternstive is the biggest load of bullshit I've ever heard.

 

[GreyWind]

Dutton walked out of the apology, Dutton trying to sabotage the Voice. Dutton is a far-right racist scumbag.
Their excuse and alternstive is the biggest load of bullshit I've ever heard.

Agree.
All this talk about helping Indigenous communities, yet his party was in charge for 9 years and did SFA.

 

[Gough]

Still spinning the Solicitor General line despite Spears calling him out on it. F*** me he really is just a disgusting, greasy liar.

 

[Millky95]

Liberal Party confirms opposition to Voice to Parliament

Opposition Leader Peter Dutton announces the Liberals' formal opposition to the federal government's model for an Indigenous Voice to Parliament, after a party room meeting in Canberra.

www.abc.net.au

Completely cooked. Scomo and Spud sinking the libs without trace.

I am as surprised about this as I am about the sun coming up every day

 

[Kwality]

Then pose your question if you have one.
If it is the “detail” the response is the rest of the constitution also lacks detail, constitution is about guiding principles not detail

(Btw while I will vote yes i have no skin in game so if referendum fails it fails - so I may not be the best to answer harder questions)

I am referring to Duttons questions that Albo chooses to ignore, not mine. I say again, if you want to win the referendum, answer his questions.

As far as the Constitution goes, I was most influenced by Bob Frenchs op ed in The Australian :

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/commentary/benefits-of-the-voice-will-far-outweigh-risks/news-story/aa752c3d9ac7a9f4ec6d70f1fc7b872d

Benefits of Indigenous voice to parliament far outweigh risks, writes former chief justice Robert French

'The voice will derive its moral authority from its constitutional status. That does not require that it have legal authority to bind the parliament or executive to give effect to its representations. The risk that advice from the voice could have that effect is non-existent.'


'Nor can the voice bind the parliament to have regard to its representations before a law is enacted. That would be a limitation on the lawmaking power of parliament which, if intended, would have to be spelt out in the Constitution. The amendment does not do that. The implication is not open.'

'The remaining area of debated risk is that the executive might be legally required to have regard to representations made to it. Absent a law of the parliament to that effect, that would have to be a constitutional implication. If such an implication was drawn it could apply only to actual specific exercises of statutory or non-statutory executive power.'

'It cannot be said that the risk is non-existent. And if it eventuated, it might mean that in certain decisions an executive decision-maker would have to consider a representation before making the decision to which it relates. That is a far cry from being required to comply with the proposals or advice contained in the representation.'

Thats the guts of what the op ed discusses, though there is plenty more there.
I have no concerns about the Constitution, but clearly others do. Address them as Bob French has.

 

[peetoo]

The thing about Albo's strategy is he didn't oppose a lot of Liberal policy because he didn't want to be seen as overly negative and starting unnecessary fights that might be lost. He focused in on what he thought were the most important issues to the most number of voters. If Dutton wants a small target strategy, manufacturing fights on issues that have a lot of support and could do reputational damage (ala walking out of the Stolen Generations apology) seems counter-intuitive.

For the election lead up the only policy to oppose was the religious discrimination, which no one understood

 

[QuietB]

I am referring to Duttons questions that Albo chooses to ignore

Everyone ignores Dutton and the rest of the raving lunatic Liberals. Get used to it.

 

[Aristotle Pickett the3rd]

My God ,Sussan Ley, what a disgraceful liar.

 

[Al Heimer]

Dutton walked out of the apology, Dutton trying to sabotage the Voice. Dutton is a far-right racist scumbag.
Their excuse and alternstive is the biggest load of bullshit I've ever heard.

Well the charming Queenslanders of Dickson think he knows best.

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