Proposal to include premierships dating back to 1870 gathering pace

[beema limapep]

I’m concerned too. Geelong have won 17 flags, should it matter to you, or any other Richmond fan? No.
It clearly does, I just can’t work out why.

Your flags aren’t devalued, you’ve won either more or less than 17 (I honestly don’t care which and I won’t look it up). Have some pride in your own club, don’t focus on the history of other clubs because their success makes you feel small.

Peak cringe right here.

 

[FourthTimeAround]

Wrong.
The SANFL didn't invite interstate sides to join their comp and rebrand itself as the AFL.
VFL = AFL
VFA =/= VFL
SANFL =/= VFL
SANFL =/= AFL

As a competition measuring its own history, you are 100% correct.

But on a sport wide scale, it’s clear that SANFL premierships must have been greater value than VFL premierships.

We’ve had the word National in our league name. You were just a little Victorian state league with money, who put the name Australian in their name 90 years after we were National.

Thats how the arguments are on here, right? Whatever we say, must be correct.

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

No need to be embarrassed. How ever many flags Richmond has won is a great effort.

Us Cats fans are super proud.

We’ve won 17 flags as a point of reference.

I think your missing one flag.
In 1863, 8 boys from Geelong challenged the McBride family ftom St Leonards to a game using a possum skin stuffed with cabbage leaves.
After 4 hours of play, the ball burst and upon seeing this the local butcher Reginald O'Shannessy and Captain Thunderbolt, who was passing through, declared the Geelong boys were the better team and declared Geelong Premiers of the Colony for that year, 1863.
Add that to the list. I'll try and dig some more up to get you to 27 Premierships.

 

[kickazz]

Not many people other than Colin are even interested in this. I mean who cares where that line is. Though it might be worth reading the history - but my understanding always was that 1897 was a clear 'breakaway to a different league' year.

Geelong rightly recognise all 17 premiership years on the Premiership Stand at Kardinia Park. One, they were won in the competition Geelong played in at the time. Two, it was the highest standard competition available to paly in at the time. So why would you ignore the old ones.

Other sides are free to do similar.

As for an all time list of most flags? It's becoming less and less relevant as the competition expands. Bit of a VicBias circle jerk to be honest.

 

[beema limapep]

I think your missing one flag.
In 1863, 8 boys from Geelong challenged the McBride family ftom St Leonards to a game using a possum skin stuffed with cabbage leaves.
After 4 hours of play, the ball burst and upon seeing this the local butcher Reginald O'Shannessy and Captain Thunderbolt, who was passing through, declared the Geelong boys were the better team and declared Geelong Premiers of the Colony for that year, 1863.
Add that to the list. I'll try and dig some more up to get you to 27 Premierships.

I actually hope the AFL acknowledges those years they want to turn into premierships as premierships. It will be even more pathetic

 

[Sttew]

Nope. The vfl was no better than the SANFL or WAFL before becoming the AFL.

Saying your the premier means your the best. Theres no way of knowing who was prior to the creation of the AFL.

But player traffic was generally one-way, from SA & WA to VIC. Players only headed from VIC to SA & WA if they couldn't make it in VIC. So I'd argue VFL was superior ONLY by virtue of the influx of SA & WA stars who made the journey, e.g., Polly Farmer, Denis Marshall, Barry Cable, Malcolm Blight, etc.

 

[Cripps 'n' Blue Bloods]

Nope. The vfl was no better than the SANFL or WAFL before becoming the AFL.

Saying your the premier means your the best. Theres no way of knowing who was prior to the creation of the AFL.

It literally has NOTHING to do with one being better than the other and EVERYTHING to do with them being the same entity.
Hence the use equals/does not equal, instead of < or >.

 

[sherb]

Yep. They are.

And no, the VFA and the VFL-AFL should not have their records merged. They were two different leagues.

Each club can count their VFA premierships in their individual club records.

Exactly, that's the simple answer every time this hare-brained suggestion comes up.

 

[Kwality]

Not many people other than Colin are even interested in this. I mean who cares where that line is. Though it might be worth reading the history - but my understanding always was that 1897 was a clear 'breakaway to a different league' year.

Geelong rightly recognise all 17 premiership years on the Premiership Stand at Kardinia Park. One, they were won in the competition Geelong played in at the time. Two, it was the highest standard competition available to paly in at the time. So why would you ignore the old ones.

Other sides are free to do similar.

As for an all time list of most flags? It's becoming less and less relevant as the competition expands. Bit of a VicBias circle jerk to be honest.

Problem is Port are the most successful club pre AFL. They arent a Vic club.

 

[FourthTimeAround]

But player traffic was generally one-way, from SA & WA to VIC. Players only headed from VIC to SA & WA if they couldn't make it in VIC. So I'd argue VFL was superior ONLY by virtue of the influx of SA & WA stars who made the journey, e.g., Polly Farmer, Denis Marshall, Barry Cable, Malcolm Blight, etc.

Geez, wouldn’t want to make that comparison for first class cricket.

EVERYONE played English County Cricket for a while there.
Dont tell me we should consider English first class achievements to be a higher quality than Australian first class achievements over that time?
id rather get a Crows membership.

 

[Kwality]

But player traffic was generally one-way, from SA & WA to VIC. Players only headed from VIC to SA & WA if they couldn't make it in VIC. So I'd argue VFL was superior ONLY by virtue of the influx of SA & WA stars who made the journey, e.g., Polly Farmer, Denis Marshall, Barry Cable, Malcolm Blight, etc.

Polly was the only indigenous player to go East of the 4 indigenous players in the East Perth premiership teams of the 50s.

 

[Sentinel]

Hypothetically (because Carter's dumb idea will never actually happen), if pre-1897 non-VFL premierships are to be included in official tally, why would it be limited to the VFA and not also SANFL, WAFL etc? Since its inception the VFL has been considered the premier league, and its obviously the competition which has morphed into the current AFL so makes sense to have a continuous record, but what puts early VFA premierships of that time ahead against other state competitions?

 

[Dazb86]

I'd prefer AFL only premierships tbh.

 

[terrybull]

You forgot
Hawthorn- Mayblooms

Box Hill Mustangs for now till they get their own VFL team.

Same for St.Kilda Seagulls and Melbourne Fuchias

 

[terrybull]

Box Hill Mustangs for now till they get their own VFL team.

Same for St.Kilda Seagulls and Melbourne Fuchias

Or maybe we can’t have two Seagulls… maybe Panthers?

or just St.Kilda Wooden spooners, it’s a big deal of their history.

 

[Sully90]

This is basically the equivalent of trying to pump up your CV with high school achievements. Good for you and I'm sure you made your parents proud, but everyone else finds it cringe when you're bringing it up in your 30s.

 

[Noidnadroj]

Geez, wouldn’t want to make that comparison for first class cricket.

EVERYONE played English County Cricket for a while there.
Dont tell me we should consider English first class achievements to be a higher quality than Australian first class achievements over that time?
id rather get a Crows membership.

County Cricket was in our winter, that’s why they played.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Farang83150]

Colin Carter has proposed in his book launch (where attendees included the AFL Chairman and the AFL CEO) that the premiership tally be recalculated to include VFA and Victorian premierships from 1870 (Debate raging over ‘wrong’ AFL date that’s shortchanged Geelong and Sydney’s flags)

Sure it wasn't Colin Carpenter proposing it....

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

Colin Carter has proposed in his book launch (where attendees included the AFL Chairman and the AFL CEO) that the premiership tally be recalculated to include VFA and Victorian premierships from 1870 (Debate raging over ‘wrong’ AFL date that’s shortchanged Geelong and Sydney’s flags)

Click bait from the boys club in the offseason.

 

[FourthTimeAround]

But player traffic was generally one-way, from SA & WA to VIC. Players only headed from VIC to SA & WA if they couldn't make it in VIC. So I'd argue VFL was superior ONLY by virtue of the influx of SA & WA stars who made the journey, e.g., Polly Farmer, Denis Marshall, Barry Cable, Malcolm Blight, etc.

Yeah and Bradman came to SA from NSW because we were the premier cricket competition with the best players .......

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Threepeat?

Minnow

We're currently in the middle of contesting the 1881 premiership on the grounds South Melbourne were poopy heads.
When they gets ratified, as it will, bow down to your SEVEN-PEATERS!

 

[Ricky Vaughn]

I think your missing one flag.
In 1863, 8 boys from Geelong challenged the McBride family ftom St Leonards to a game using a possum skin stuffed with cabbage leaves.
After 4 hours of play, the ball burst and upon seeing this the local butcher Reginald O'Shannessy and Captain Thunderbolt, who was passing through, declared the Geelong boys were the better team and declared Geelong Premiers of the Colony for that year, 1863.
Add that to the list. I'll try and dig some more up to get you to 27 Premierships.

That’s the spirit! A rising tide lifts all boats.

 

[Leon]

This proposal does not lift my club above 2 premierships, therefore I am opposed to it.


Damn, damn, damn opposed!!

 

[Ricky Vaughn]

Peak cringe right here.

Don’t cringe, embrace.

Richmond are an amazing club, who in their own right have done incredible things. They just haven’t won 17 flags like Geelong.

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

Don’t cringe, embrace.

Richmond are an amazing club, who in their own right have done incredible things. They just haven’t won 17 flags like Geelong.

There was no flag, no grand final, no finals and no declaration of a best team apart from the equivalent of Robbo or Tom Brown saying it.