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Play Nice Random Chat Thread IV

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See y’all pricks don’t let the door hit you on the way out..



All 57 members of the Buffalo Police Department’s Emergency Response Team have resigned from their posts in the special unit.

The mass resignation is meant as a show of support for two fellow officers who were suspended without pay Thursday night after video of them shoving 75-year-old protester Martin Gugino went viral.
 

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Again, sticking to the racism topic -

Just because there are Black police officers, or Black congressmen, or Black senators, or Black governors, or one Black President out of 45 does not mean that systemic racism isn't alive and well in the US. If you believe that, then you well and truly have your head buried in the sand.

I think it is important to be clear about the words we use, especially something like racism. In terms of racism in this context I assume we mean in terms of racial prejudice or discrimination. Prejudice, meaning an irrational attitude of hostility directed against an individual, a group, a race, or their supposed characteristics and discrimination, the outlook, action or treatment of individuals or groups differently.

I know some people don't like it when I go back to the meaning of the words, but it is important we are on the same page.

Is a country overall racist? I think if they elect black presidents, black politicians, black judges, black leaders in community then I do not believe it to be so. I think the vast majority of people aren't racist, because if you are prepared to put minorities in positions of structural power, it doesn't make sense to do so if the nation is racist or it supports a racist system of control. I think black people are under represented in general, i think it is around 4% in the USA are black when they are about 13% of the population, but women are also under represented as well, being 24% as well. I do not think women are under represented because the USA is sexist... but some seem to think it is.

As i said earlier, I think there is a lot of soft racism which is due to due mostly to ignorance and lack of exposure to people of different ethnic groups, it was somethng I was exposed to growing up as well so I know it exists but for it to metastasise and become something cancerous is very extreme and I do not think that is a part of any large demographic unless it is openly encouraged. I think it is quite evident by how easily Darly Davis was able to get more than 200 people to leave the KKK without asking them to simply by engaging with them, he was the first black person they ever got to know and they realised their intolerance was born out of ignorance. The KKK of several generations ago was a very different beast. This organisation has basically becoming extinct with no real effort put in to get rid of them, I think that says a lot about how things have changed even in the short-term.

Likewise, if you think that a person from a minority background can't be a part of a system that targets their own.

I am not saying they can't, but if you are in a position of supreme authority of that police force and you were given that authority knowing the stance you had and the problems in the community and were empowered to make things better then why would think this person is some token appointment? I think that is a bit insulting to this person to make that presumption. It is insulting to the black people in the Democratic party to think they are too stupid to realise they are part of some white supremecy racket. If people on the right made such a derogatory generalisation of a black person or their community then they would be called racist. For some reason people on the left can degrade and insult black people without it being held to the same standard.

I think extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I am not saying it can't happen but I am not going to believe for a minute that black people in position of power in general are just white supremacy pupets. it belittles everything they have achieved through their hard work.

Policing in its historical evolution has always been deeply entrenched as itself a project of racial violence.

Historically it has, but it hasn't been like that for a long time. I think some police forces in rural southern states might still be backwards, but not police forces in large Democratic cities.

The policing of runaway slaves, the creation of the RCMP here in Canada, and the role it played in the displacement and genocide of Indigenous peoples, policing in all of its iterations has always been a form of harm against Black peoples, against Indigenous peoples, against any peoples who where racialized as not white, including Irish peoples, and peoples of lower social orders. In and of itself, its an institution that's not violent as an aberration, it's an institution that is grounded and embedded as violent. It's an institution that's functioning exactly as it was meant to do, which makes reforming it difficult.

So you think all police officers that go to academies now get the proud history lessons of policing runaway slaves?

All police around the world are institutionally violent. They are there to enforce the laws and to do so with force if that is what is required. I think the court system is more institutionally biased than the police force. We know black people are more commonly arrested for crimes like possession of pot, this can be explained as there being more police in black communities because there is a lot more violence and crimes committed in those communities so they are more likely to run into police, but that doesn't explain why courts give longer sentencing to black people for similar crimes. I do believe the court system is inherently biased, judges are a relatively small pool of people who are in their position a long period of time so they can hold on to outdated belief systems a lot longer, it is a lot harder to get rid of a judge than it is police officers. it isn't all down to racism though, they give women much more lenient sentences for serious crimes like murders than they do men, they are very slow when it comes to modernising.

The police force changes a lot more rapidly. My cousin married a police officer and just from the conversations I have had with him it is pretty evident that the police force is radically different to what it was 10 or 20 years ago let alone a different generation.

Policing also historically avoids holding its colleagues accountable for their actions, and this also creates an environment for racism to thrive.

In America the District Attorney works with the police, it is difficult for them to prosecute police they actively work with, however, even when these cases go before a grand jury, they very rarely ever get indicted, the people are a lot less willing to prosecute police than the DA is. Even in the Floyd case, while they show the aftermath with the policeman on his neck (which is inexcusable), video evidence shows him resisting arrest and requiring four police officers to restrain him. Behaving in this manner is mostly likely going to result in a very negative outcome for the person in question and the public in general views people being violent with police dimly in general. If you struggle with police there is a high probability you are going to get your arse kicked and in extreme circumstances you may die.

This isn't about institutional racism, there are a lot more moronic white people than there are moronic black people and they die at the hands of police in far greater numbers. People on the left will say far more black people are kill pro rata and people on the right say black people have far higher rates of crime. To me the probome is that so many people die at all, regardless of skin colour. But context is important, we don't really know the circumstances in each case and context matters.

The police in Floyd's case were negligent and the DA has laid charges against all four of them. That isn't consistent with it being a racist institution protecting police officers who do the wrong thing. I think the public and the DA in general understand the nature of policing and people when faced with the potential consequences of their actions try and avoid being arrested. if you initiate something against a police officer, do not be surprised if they aren't charged, regardless what colour your skin is.

If you do not go out of your way to protect the police then you wont have police, life on the street will resort to mob rules. They already have enough problems with recruitment despite paying almost double what people in the military get. A lot of people have grand ideas what the police should be, but these are people who aren't prepared to put their life on the line to do the job.

Charles P. Wilson, a retired Black police Chief and President of the National Association of Black Law Enforcement Officers said this about George Floyd's death:

"What people have to recognize and accept [is] the institution of policing has been inherently biased against people of color and low income [people], and it was designed to be that way,” he says. “So the actions of the officers are not surprising"

"Wilson helped author a study published by the London School of Economics that found most black officers surveyed indicated that racial profiling does exist among police and that bias was condoned by their agencies."

https://www.wbur.org/hereandnow/2020/06/03/black-police-officers-protests

Police do not provide safety for Black communities or Indigenous communities or communities who are living in poverty, and there remains no accountability for the trauma caused by their actions. The persistent voice of mass protest is a mechanism of desperation to press for accountability, and has been for decades upon decades now. Our first step to finding solutions is to listen to these people's lived reality, not dismiss it as something that doesn't exist.

There is bias against black people, because they are massively over-represented in crimes, particularly violent crime.

The people who say police shouldn't racially profile will cross the street when someone who looks different is coming at them from the opposite direction. Trying to catch a plane as someone of middle-eastern appearance I am sure has become more of a hassle. One funny black comedian thanked Bin Laden for making it easier as a black man to get through customs. It is dark humour but it highlights inherit bias based on the probability of threat.

If you were appointed by politicians as chief of police to reduce rates of crimes and some sections of your city have low levels of crimes and violence and other sections have very high rates of crime and violence then how would you allocate resources? How would you instruct the police? Welcome to policing in the political correct era where you have to racially profile without making it obvious you racially profile and you have a bias because the distribution of crime is biased.

If you tried to be politically correct and deployed your forces evenly, not only would you fail at your duty to reduce crime, but being PC would casue a lot more black people to be victims of crime in cities with a high black population as the vast majority of black crime is black on black.
 
I think it is important to be clear about the words we use, especially something like racism. In terms of racism in this context I assume we mean in terms of racial prejudice or discrimination. Prejudice, meaning an irrational attitude of hostility directed against an individual, a group, a race, or their supposed characteristics and discrimination, the outlook, action or treatment of individuals or groups differently.

I know some people don't like it when I go back to the meaning of the words, but it is important we are on the same page.

Is a country overall racist? I think if they elect black presidents, black politicians, black judges, black leaders in community then I do not believe it to be so. I think the vast majority of people aren't racist, because if you are prepared to put minorities in positions of structural power, it doesn't make sense to do so if the nation is racist or it supports a racist system of control. I think black people are under represented in general, i think it is around 4% in the USA are black when they are about 13% of the population, but women are also under represented as well, being 24% as well. I do not think women are under represented because the USA is sexist... but some seem to think it is.

As i said earlier, I think there is a lot of soft racism which is due to due mostly to ignorance and lack of exposure to people of different ethnic groups, it was somethng I was exposed to growing up as well so I know it exists but for it to metastasise and become something cancerous is very extreme and I do not think that is a part of any large demographic unless it is openly encouraged. I think it is quite evident by how easily Darly Davis was able to get more than 200 people to leave the KKK without asking them to simply by engaging with them, he was the first black person they ever got to know and they realised their intolerance was born out of ignorance. The KKK of several generations ago was a very different beast. This organisation has basically becoming extinct with no real effort put in to get rid of them, I think that says a lot about how things have changed even in the short-term.



I am not saying they can't, but if you are in a position of supreme authority of that police force and you were given that authority knowing the stance you had and the problems in the community and were empowered to make things better then why would think this person is some token appointment? I think that is a bit insulting to this person to make that presumption. It is insulting to the black people in the Democratic party to think they are too stupid to realise they are part of some white supremecy racket. If people on the right made such a derogatory generalisation of a black person or their community then they would be called racist. For some reason people on the left can degrade and insult black people without it being held to the same standard.

I think extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I am not saying it can't happen but I am not going to believe for a minute that black people in position of power in general are just white supremacy pupets. it belittles everything they have achieved through their hard work.



Historically it has, but it hasn't been like that for a long time. I think some police forces in rural southern states might still be backwards, but not police forces in large Democratic cities.



So you think all police officers that go to academies now get the proud history lessons of policing runaway slaves?

All police around the world are institutionally violent. They are there to enforce the laws and to do so with force if that is what is required. I think the court system is more institutionally biased than the police force. We know black people are more commonly arrested for crimes like possession of pot, this can be explained as there being more police in black communities because there is a lot more violence and crimes committed in those communities so they are more likely to run into police, but that doesn't explain why courts give longer sentencing to black people for similar crimes. I do believe the court system is inherently biased, judges are a relatively small pool of people who are in their position a long period of time so they can hold on to outdated belief systems a lot longer, it is a lot harder to get rid of a judge than it is police officers. it isn't all down to racism though, they give women much more lenient sentences for serious crimes like murders than they do men, they are very slow when it comes to modernising.

The police force changes a lot more rapidly. My cousin married a police officer and just from the conversations I have had with him it is pretty evident that the police force is radically different to what it was 10 or 20 years ago let alone a different generation.



In America the District Attorney works with the police, it is difficult for them to prosecute police they actively work with, however, even when these cases go before a grand jury, they very rarely ever get indicted, the people are a lot less willing to prosecute police than the DA is. Even in the Floyd case, while they show the aftermath with the policeman on his neck (which is inexcusable), video evidence shows him resisting arrest and requiring four police officers to restrain him. Behaving in this manner is mostly likely going to result in a very negative outcome for the person in question and the public in general views people being violent with police dimly in general. If you struggle with police there is a high probability you are going to get your arse kicked and in extreme circumstances you may die.

This isn't about institutional racism, there are a lot more moronic white people than there are moronic black people and they die at the hands of police in far greater numbers. People on the left will say far more black people are kill pro rata and people on the right say black people have far higher rates of crime. To me the probome is that so many people die at all, regardless of skin colour. But context is important, we don't really know the circumstances in each case and context matters.

The police in Floyd's case were negligent and the DA has laid charges against all four of them. That isn't consistent with it being a racist institution protecting police officers who do the wrong thing. I think the public and the DA in general understand the nature of policing and people when faced with the potential consequences of their actions try and avoid being arrested. if you initiate something against a police officer, do not be surprised if they aren't charged, regardless what colour your skin is.

If you do not go out of your way to protect the police then you wont have police, life on the street will resort to mob rules. They already have enough problems with recruitment despite paying almost double what people in the military get. A lot of people have grand ideas what the police should be, but these are people who aren't prepared to put their life on the line to do the job.



There is bias against black people, because they are massively over-represented in crimes, particularly violent crime.

The people who say police shouldn't racially profile will cross the street when someone who looks different is coming at them from the opposite direction. Trying to catch a plane as someone of middle-eastern appearance I am sure has become more of a hassle. One funny black comedian thanked Bin Laden for making it easier as a black man to get through customs. It is dark humour but it highlights inherit bias based on the probability of threat.

If you were appointed by politicians as chief of police to reduce rates of crimes and some sections of your city have low levels of crimes and violence and other sections have very high rates of crime and violence then how would you allocate resources? How would you instruct the police? Welcome to policing in the political correct era where you have to racially profile without making it obvious you racially profile and you have a bias because the distribution of crime is biased.

If you tried to be politically correct and deployed your forces evenly, not only would you fail at your duty to reduce crime, but being PC would casue a lot more black people to be victims of crime in cities with a high black population as the vast majority of black crime is black on black.



Institutionalised racism can and does exist when minorities are employed within that system. Again, to think that it doesn't is just naïve head in the sand stuff.

And I never said that any minorites were "token" hires either. They're not. But it's neither possible, nor should it be incumbent upon, these minority employees to reform the system. The most power they would have as individuals to do this would be to hold each other accountable, but policing is a brotherhood all of its own, and holding each other to account has never been a strong suit.

Police are generally only held to account for their actions after mass protest forces it. Which is what we're witnessing right now. And is what we'll likely witness, to some degree or other, until the officers are convicted on those charges. If they're not convicted, the protests will go on. And as long as more and more officers are recorded assaulting peaceful citizens, there is likely going to be some form of protest. Which in my opinion, is a good thing. This is how systemic reform is brought about. You literally have to hold feet to the fire until change is forced.

It's encouraging to hear your cousin's perspective. It's what MLK, Malcolm X, Rodney King, and now George Floyd are about. Systemic change is painfully, painfully slow. Black individuals hired within it though, whether it be government or police, or education, or prison systems, are not an indicator that there's no longer anything to see here.

I do believe that far too much is asked of police officers as individuals, who are ill-equipped when it comes to managing societal trauma and safety. This is the inherent flaw that allows for a result where everyone has essentially been set up to fail. the big lebowski was upset by my comment about police not providing safety to minority communities. The organisations that exist and are trained to provide safety for these citizens are social workers, community housing and health care workers, shelters for victims of violence, safe injection sites, etc. It's not police. And yet, they're the ones who get called out to a person having a mental health crisis in the middle of the night, armed, and without adequate training. In the US, a significant number of these officers are ex-military with PTSD and other mental health issues of their own. If we want a police force that provides safety, then we have to train them how to provide safety. We don't do that. We train them how to enforce and detain using physical restraint and weapons. So as I see it, we can either upend the way the system trains its officers, or we can go the defunding route and start putting more of that policing money into meaningful community support mechanisms with more appropriately trained workers at hand.

The problems are institutional and systemic all across the board. Covid, rampant neglect being exposed in nursing homes and how we care for our elders, George Floyd, these are such interesting times. A lot of rocks being flipped over for a good long look in the sunshine right now.
 
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I think it is important to be clear about the words we use, especially something like racism. In terms of racism in this context I assume we mean in terms of racial prejudice or discrimination. Prejudice, meaning an irrational attitude of hostility directed against an individual, a group, a race, or their supposed characteristics and discrimination, the outlook, action or treatment of individuals or groups differently.

I know some people don't like it when I go back to the meaning of the words, but it is important we are on the same page.

Is a country overall racist? I think if they elect black presidents, black politicians, black judges, black leaders in community then I do not believe it to be so. I think the vast majority of people aren't racist, because if you are prepared to put minorities in positions of structural power, it doesn't make sense to do so if the nation is racist or it supports a racist system of control. I think black people are under represented in general, i think it is around 4% in the USA are black when they are about 13% of the population, but women are also under represented as well, being 24% as well. I do not think women are under represented because the USA is sexist... but some seem to think it is.

As i said earlier, I think there is a lot of soft racism which is due to due mostly to ignorance and lack of exposure to people of different ethnic groups, it was somethng I was exposed to growing up as well so I know it exists but for it to metastasise and become something cancerous is very extreme and I do not think that is a part of any large demographic unless it is openly encouraged. I think it is quite evident by how easily Darly Davis was able to get more than 200 people to leave the KKK without asking them to simply by engaging with them, he was the first black person they ever got to know and they realised their intolerance was born out of ignorance. The KKK of several generations ago was a very different beast. This organisation has basically becoming extinct with no real effort put in to get rid of them, I think that says a lot about how things have changed even in the short-term.



I am not saying they can't, but if you are in a position of supreme authority of that police force and you were given that authority knowing the stance you had and the problems in the community and were empowered to make things better then why would think this person is some token appointment? I think that is a bit insulting to this person to make that presumption. It is insulting to the black people in the Democratic party to think they are too stupid to realise they are part of some white supremecy racket. If people on the right made such a derogatory generalisation of a black person or their community then they would be called racist. For some reason people on the left can degrade and insult black people without it being held to the same standard.

I think extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I am not saying it can't happen but I am not going to believe for a minute that black people in position of power in general are just white supremacy pupets. it belittles everything they have achieved through their hard work.



Historically it has, but it hasn't been like that for a long time. I think some police forces in rural southern states might still be backwards, but not police forces in large Democratic cities.



So you think all police officers that go to academies now get the proud history lessons of policing runaway slaves?

All police around the world are institutionally violent. They are there to enforce the laws and to do so with force if that is what is required. I think the court system is more institutionally biased than the police force. We know black people are more commonly arrested for crimes like possession of pot, this can be explained as there being more police in black communities because there is a lot more violence and crimes committed in those communities so they are more likely to run into police, but that doesn't explain why courts give longer sentencing to black people for similar crimes. I do believe the court system is inherently biased, judges are a relatively small pool of people who are in their position a long period of time so they can hold on to outdated belief systems a lot longer, it is a lot harder to get rid of a judge than it is police officers. it isn't all down to racism though, they give women much more lenient sentences for serious crimes like murders than they do men, they are very slow when it comes to modernising.

The police force changes a lot more rapidly. My cousin married a police officer and just from the conversations I have had with him it is pretty evident that the police force is radically different to what it was 10 or 20 years ago let alone a different generation.



In America the District Attorney works with the police, it is difficult for them to prosecute police they actively work with, however, even when these cases go before a grand jury, they very rarely ever get indicted, the people are a lot less willing to prosecute police than the DA is. Even in the Floyd case, while they show the aftermath with the policeman on his neck (which is inexcusable), video evidence shows him resisting arrest and requiring four police officers to restrain him. Behaving in this manner is mostly likely going to result in a very negative outcome for the person in question and the public in general views people being violent with police dimly in general. If you struggle with police there is a high probability you are going to get your arse kicked and in extreme circumstances you may die.

This isn't about institutional racism, there are a lot more moronic white people than there are moronic black people and they die at the hands of police in far greater numbers. People on the left will say far more black people are kill pro rata and people on the right say black people have far higher rates of crime. To me the probome is that so many people die at all, regardless of skin colour. But context is important, we don't really know the circumstances in each case and context matters.

The police in Floyd's case were negligent and the DA has laid charges against all four of them. That isn't consistent with it being a racist institution protecting police officers who do the wrong thing. I think the public and the DA in general understand the nature of policing and people when faced with the potential consequences of their actions try and avoid being arrested. if you initiate something against a police officer, do not be surprised if they aren't charged, regardless what colour your skin is.

If you do not go out of your way to protect the police then you wont have police, life on the street will resort to mob rules. They already have enough problems with recruitment despite paying almost double what people in the military get. A lot of people have grand ideas what the police should be, but these are people who aren't prepared to put their life on the line to do the job.



There is bias against black people, because they are massively over-represented in crimes, particularly violent crime.

The people who say police shouldn't racially profile will cross the street when someone who looks different is coming at them from the opposite direction. Trying to catch a plane as someone of middle-eastern appearance I am sure has become more of a hassle. One funny black comedian thanked Bin Laden for making it easier as a black man to get through customs. It is dark humour but it highlights inherit bias based on the probability of threat.

If you were appointed by politicians as chief of police to reduce rates of crimes and some sections of your city have low levels of crimes and violence and other sections have very high rates of crime and violence then how would you allocate resources? How would you instruct the police? Welcome to policing in the political correct era where you have to racially profile without making it obvious you racially profile and you have a bias because the distribution of crime is biased.

If you tried to be politically correct and deployed your forces evenly, not only would you fail at your duty to reduce crime, but being PC would casue a lot more black people to be victims of crime in cities with a high black population as the vast majority of black crime is black on black.

Tas, you are dealing with a cult.


SDS & Sopwiths have already fallen under it's influence.
 

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As i said earlier, I think there is a lot of soft racism which is due to due mostly to ignorance and lack of exposure to people of different ethnic groups,



The police in Floyd's case were negligent and the DA has laid charges against all four of themThat isn't consistent with it being a racist institution protecting police officers who do the wrong thing..

On these 2 points. In Georgia, they had video of 3 yeehaws running a guy down, killing him, filming it and they didn’t prosecute until it went public. Floyd’s murderers would be on duty if not for public pressure.

And historically, segregationist parties have performed much better in areas of majority black populations. Once the South industrialised, they’ve fled to segregated suburbs where they don’t need offical Jim Crow. If you want to see institutional racism, go see how electoral boundaries are Gerry mandered. It’s wild.
 
Hey it’s working.

They’re simultaneously a bunch of weak soyboys and a dangerous threat to western institutions. Please donate. purchase the advertised products.

EFA.

Your disingenuous attempts to parochially politicize what is basically a corporate phenomena, is duly noted.

Cult of wokeness tactical response 101.
 
Basically some activists and the young & impressionable.

Doesn’t matter why they’re there. There comes a point where it’s too many for the police to stop and they’ll have to let them go. The heavy handed tactics aren’t working, they’re having the opposite effect.
 

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Doesn’t matter why they’re there. There comes a point where it’s too many for the police to stop and they’ll have to let them go. The heavy handed tactics aren’t working, they’re having the opposite effect.

Yeah?

Last I looked nothing has changed in the U.S.
 
Looking at the mixture of the ethnicity in the protests I’d say a lot is changing, but we won’t really know for another 20 years


If there is a U.S. in 20 years time.

The cult of woke has no destination. It is doomed to fail.
 
EFA.

Your disingenuous attempts to parochially politicize what is basically a corporate phenomena, is duly noted.

Cult of wokeness tactical response 101.

Snake I blocked you a month or so ago because the board would tired of us arguing.someone pmed to say you have replied to me essentially saying I’m mentally ill. I’ve looked back a few pages and sure enough you only get personal.

Pull you head in.

Also the Denver antifa thing is fake. and if you posted about the head shaving, so was that.
 
Snake I blocked you a month or so ago because the board would tired of us arguing.someone pmed to say you have replied to me essentially saying I’m mentally ill. I’ve looked back a few pages and sure enough you only get personal.

Pull you head in.

"Mentally ill" is open to question, but you are indoctrinated in to what is basically a cult. The blinkers are locked in place.

I have also openly stated that you are very intelligent, but compromised philosophically, and it appears that currently you are sinking even deeper in to that rabbit hole.

Also the Denver antifa thing is fake. and if you posted about the head shaving, so was that.

It's a ****ing laugh mate. Do you even remember when we used to share a laugh?
 
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