Autopsy Review Saints V Bulldogs 23 July

[CALL ME SNAKE]

Billings with 17 disposals and 3 tackles - & some claim he had a 'stinker'?

Truthfully, what are we expecting of him 2 or so games back from an injury?

Let's absolutely ignore the progress of Bont, it doesn't serve any purpose.

We have a potential blue-chip investment on our hands - I could not care less what any other board on BF says.

Let him have a good run with a solid pre-season and no injury niggles.

As Richo commented when Billings name was brought up in the Carlisle trade discussion last year - "get rid of Billings??, I want 3-4 Billings on our list!" (or words to that effect)

Give him time.

 

[t_94]

Was a way back but Choomah is absolutely hilarious. Will never get tired of his colourful ways of describing opposition players. "Peanut flog of a cabbage" lol

 

[Diehard Saint]

The next thing we need to work on is putting teams away when we have the chance earlier.

The last two weekends we've been well and truly on top of the other team by about half way through the 3rd quarter, or just before that (7 goals in a row to that point v Melbourne and 5 in a row to that point v WB), but on both occasions we just didn't follow-through and really finish them off (6 points in a row after kicking a couple of goals early in the 3rd v Melbourne and against WB I felt like we botched a few forwardline entires that could have seen us score and really put a gap on them that they wouldn't have been able to come back from with no forwardline) and that allowed both teams to mount a charge late in the respective 3rd quarters, once we'd tired from all our scoring chances- most/many of which didn't result in goals, which gets deflating after a while.

It was a somewhat similar story the game before against Essendon. We'd get out to a 3 goal lead, but then not go on with it and really put the hammer down and they'd catch up and we'd put the foot down again and that happened pretty much all game, with us pretty much just doing enough to win and that was it.

In our wins over Melbourne and Carlton earlier in the season we broke the game open in the 3rd quarters, but again, didn't really put the hammer down and blow them away (led Melbourne by 48 points before 3/4 time, but only ended up winning by 39, and against Carlton we got out to a 40 point lead, 10 mins into the 3rd quarter, but only ended up winning by 32).

Need to really start to get ruthless and bury teams when we have all the momentum and not be leaving the door open for them to get back into the game, like we have in each of the last 3 weeks.

It's been terrific that we've been able to respond so well and so coolly when each of those teams has come back and gotten within a goal (or in Essendon's case, 7 points up), but the next step in our progression is to not let them back in in the first place and to put them away when we have the chance.

Would be very good for the blood pressure as well

 

[Choomah]

Was a way back but Choomah is absolutely hilarious. Will never get tired of his colourful ways of describing opposition players. "Peanut flog of a cabbage" lol

Joffaboy tought me the ropes

 

[VDS66]

Jeez you blokes take chooey to seriously. Lighten up.

Love him as we do because he's family, so we have to.. rest assured that "serious" is the last thing most of us take him for... let alone overly.

 

[VDS66]

Joffaboy tought me the ropes

Just make sure you run when he suggests that he teach you the handcuffs... especially if he's wearing his Kimono.

 

[aussierulesrules]

Would be very good for the blood pressure as well

Leaving the door open for the other team to get back in was our big issue for so much of the time under Lyon of course, IMO. We'd get well on top in a game and start pulling away, but then all of a sudden, once we got out to about a 4 or 5 goal lead, we'd go right into our shells and try to protect the lead for the rest of the game and it would s**t me to tears, as the next 20, 30, 40 minutes would be boring as s**t, as we kicked it backwards and sideways and didn't bother trying to score, all the while the other team nudged closer and closer over that time, until they invariably eventually caught up again and then it would be an exciting last few mins and we would hold them off and win by a small margin.

Terrible way to go about things and I think playing that way probably cost us a flag (as we didn't have the comfortable and really fun thrashings that we could have had, or that say Geelong were having, which would have energised the group and made playing each game a lot more enjoyable and less draining).

Lyon did a lot of things right, but man I think that strategy was bloody terrible and nonsensical and I hope I never see a team I follow do that again (trying to protect leads from as far out as 45mins from the end on a regular basis).

 

[#gosaintas]

It seems to happen when Hickey goes off for a rest. Bruce is not a second ruckman and it really costs us. I don't think there's anything we can do about it though given neither Longer or Pierce can play fwd. The mids need to adjust to Bruce's rucking somehow

 

[aussierulesrules]

It seems to happen when Hickey goes off for a rest. Bruce is not a second ruckman and it really costs us. I don't think there's anything we can do about it though given neither Longer or Pierce can play fwd. The mids need to adjust to Bruce's rucking somehow

Yeah it certainly can cost us at times when Hickey goes off. The other issue may be that because we basically only play the 4 of Steven, Armo, Ross and Dunstan in the guts, they probably take the foot off the gas a bit once we get on top, just so they don't tire themselves out. If we had more depth in that area that we we backed in we'd probably be able to keep these runs of goals going for longer, as others could go in there to replace them and be just as effective.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Leaving the door open for the other team to get back in was our big issue for so much of the time under Lyon of course, IMO. We'd get well on top in a game and start pulling away, but then all of a sudden, once we got out to about a 4 or 5 goal lead, we'd go right into our shells and try to protect the lead for the rest of the game and it would s**t me to tears, as the next 20, 30, 40 minutes would be boring as s**t, as we kicked it backwards and sideways and didn't bother trying to score, all the while the other team nudged closer and closer over that time, until they invariably eventually caught up again and then it would be an exciting last few mins and we would hold them off and win by a small margin.

Terrible way to go about things and I think playing that way probably cost us a flag (as we didn't have the comfortable and really fun thrashings that we could have had, or that say Geelong were having, which would have energised the group and made playing each game a lot more enjoyable and less draining).

Lyon did a lot of things right, but man I think that strategy was bloody terrible and nonsensical and I hope I never see a team I follow do that again (trying to protect leads from as far out as 45mins from the end on a regular basis).

I always used to be so envious of the style the Cats played as opposed to ours, even when we were winning. I'm just loving this fast, exciting, usually high scoring game style we have... with plenty of defensive pressure as well, rather than the dour lock down manner we played then. Will never forget the "blockbuster" we played against Sydney. ( shudder)

 

[Wooffa]

Would be very good for the blood pressure as well

Interesting comments Diehard. The main thing is you have responded to the challenges of other sides and still won. Sides like the dogs will always come back. You can say you should put them away but most decent teams will lift when they are behind and deserve credit for fighting back . Maybe when St. Kilda's list matures a bit they will start putting sides away, but at this stage with their young list, surely winning is enough. s**t, most sides will struggle to put teams way, because it so even you cant underestimate anyway.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Interesting comments Diehard. The main thing is you have responded to the challenges of other sides and still won. Sides like the dogs will always come back. You can say you should put them away but most decent teams will lift when they are behind and deserve credit for fighting back . Maybe when St. Kilda's list matures a bit they will start putting sides away, but at this stage with their young list, surely winning is enough. s**t, most sides will struggle to put teams way, because it so even you cant underestimate anyway.

I think maybe you quoted me but were referring to aussierulesrules post, but I do agree with him.

 

[aussierulesrules]

I think it's just the next step in our progression, especially against the lower ranked teams.

 

[aussierulesrules]

I always used to be so envious of the style the Cats played as opposed to ours, even when we were winning. I'm just loving this fast, exciting, usually high scoring game style we have... with plenty of defensive pressure as well, rather than the dour lock down manner we played then. Will never forget the "blockbuster" we played against Sydney. ( shudder)

The problem I had with it though was that we didn't play that way for the whole game, it was only once we got out to about a 4 or 5 goal lead that we'd go all negative and start kicking it sideways and backwards and clearly just started trying to protect the lead, instead of continuing to play that way that had gotten us well on top in the first place. Just made zero sense to me and I reckon it cost us a flag. It continually turned what ought to have been "party-time" games into snooze-fests that would give us heart-pulpitations by the end, as a result of the other team eventually catching us up, after we stopped trying to score.

I reckon we saw the remnants of that against Hawthorn earlier in the year, when we got in front early in the last, but then stopped taking the game on from that point and Hawthorn then got on top again and had a bunch of chances to score. Someone on their board then posted after the game that they were sitting near one of Hawthorn's coaching staff on the plane on the way home, who said that their players knew they would win during the last quarter, because our guys started to argue amongst themselves once we got in front, with the older brigade wanting us to go all negative and protect the lead (even though there was over 20 mins to go), while the younger ones supposedly wanted us to keep taking the game on and playing the way that got us the lead.

Hopefully Richo is getting that s**t out of the systems of the older ones. That's what you do in the last few mins when you have a lead, not when you still have 20 or more minutes to go in a game and you're only up by a goal!

 

[Joffaboy]

Just make sure you run when he suggests that he teach you the handcuffs... especially if he's wearing his Kimono.

One from the archives mate. Dearly departed Eastern from SS

 

[Joffaboy]

Was a way back but Choomah is absolutely hilarious. Will never get tired of his colourful ways of describing opposition players. "Peanut flog of a cabbage" lol

He stole that from me the plagerist cabbage of a flognut

 

[RoundCubic]

Leaving the door open for the other team to get back in was our big issue for so much of the time under Lyon of course, IMO. We'd get well on top in a game and start pulling away, but then all of a sudden, once we got out to about a 4 or 5 goal lead, we'd go right into our shells and try to protect the lead for the rest of the game and it would s**t me to tears, as the next 20, 30, 40 minutes would be boring as s**t, as we kicked it backwards and sideways and didn't bother trying to score, all the while the other team nudged closer and closer over that time, until they invariably eventually caught up again and then it would be an exciting last few mins and we would hold them off and win by a small margin.

Terrible way to go about things and I think playing that way probably cost us a flag (as we didn't have the comfortable and really fun thrashings that we could have had, or that say Geelong were having, which would have energised the group and made playing each game a lot more enjoyable and less draining).

Lyon did a lot of things right, but man I think that strategy was bloody terrible and nonsensical and I hope I never see a team I follow do that again (trying to protect leads from as far out as 45mins from the end on a regular basis).

Right now its more a fitness youth confidence issue we just fell away at the start of the year so thats improvement

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Right now its more a fitness youth confidence issue we just fell away at the start of the year so thats improvement

I'm sort of wondering if the guys were training heavily right up to the start of the season, and now , after the midyear, they are a bit better.

 

[aussierulesrules]

Right now its more a fitness youth confidence issue we just fell away at the start of the year so thats improvement

Yeah I don't think we're deliberately doing it like we obviously were under Lyon. There's no noticeable change in the way we're playing in these games like there was under Ross.

It would probably be partly physical and personnel (eg, Hickey going off, the midfield possibly coasting for a while, to keep some fuel in the tank), but it's also a mental thing IMO, just having that "lets bury them" type attitude. Hopefully it won't take long to develop that.

 

[Defacto]

I thought choomah was chris mayne

 

[aussierulesrules]

I'm sort of wondering if the guys were training heavily right up to the start of the season, and now , after the midyear, they are a bit better.

Really hoping that Paddy is doing a bit of a mini-preseason while he's out. I think they probably made the call to not play him for a while as soon as he got his last concussion, so it wouldn't surprise me if they took that opportunity to get a lot of running into him while they had the chance. Could finish the year off pretty strongly if he plays the last 2 or 3 games if they did.

 

[SAINTsincebirth]

i know you are referring to me and so does everyone else so i'll just address it. if you really think i took any enjoyment out of seeing two serious injuries then you are wrong, if you think i go into a game hoping opposition players end up injured then again you are wrong. if you think that then you probably believe my other post where i stated i'd set up a go fund me account for the awareness and prevention of all things western bulldogs, now do you really believe that (i know right, what a brilliant idea)? of course not, it's not going to happen...

its disappointing to see two young players go down like that. especially for someone like redpath who has done an ACL before

but lets be clear here. i was posting on my own teams board after a win in jest, i didnt go onto your board and start injury trolling, because that would be an assholish thing to do. team boards will always have a fair bit of tribalism on them and posts will be in poor taste, but i didnt force your supporters to come here and read it. going back to "assholish things to do", i wasnt the one on your board defaming another poster, you know the thing you guys were doing on your board that i was alerted to. yeap thats a prick of a thing to do, but you arent going to be up in arms about that... funny that. good to see our mods dont get involved in that crap, can you say the same thing? over here they're actually the mature more level headed ones...

so cut the crap. i'm sorry two of your players went down with injury. but that doesnt mean i have to like your club, its supporters or not take enjoyment out of the win. cause you know what, I BLOODY ENJOYED IT!!!! i cant wait for the next time we beat you, especially now that its obvious your supporters absolutely hate losing to us, more than any other side

so dont expect me not to enjoy the win because of some unfortunate injuries. just like i didnt expect adelaide supporters to be in morning when hugh goddard went down. just like i didnt expect it when goose mcguire broke his leg (significantly more serious than the one wallis suffered)

EDIT: so i did some searching and it turns out you've previously hoped hodge ends up injured/hurt. you're a hypocrit, then I did some more digging and suddenly the offended in your post makes sense:








"eats them up so much" "havent got a lot to show for it"

geeze this win must really hit you where it hurts. the funny thing is it seems to eat you up more than anyone else on here and it seems all we have to show for it is beating your mob again.

ENJOY

I don't normally get involved in Defacto's direction of Posts, but that reply is Gold.....Remind me not to say anything against you. Made me nearly p#ss my pants.

 

[crasha301]

Yeah it certainly can cost us at times when Hickey goes off. The other issue may be that because we basically only play the 4 of Steven, Armo, Ross and Dunstan in the guts, they probably take the foot off the gas a bit once we get on top, just so they don't tire themselves out. If we had more depth in that area that we we backed in we'd probably be able to keep these runs of goals going for longer, as others could go in there to replace them and be just as effective.

Gresh went in the mid a fair bit after HT and weller played mostly up the ground to. But i do understand what you are saying, we need more rotations in the first half so steven ect dont run out of gas

 

[crasha301]

Interesting comments Diehard. The main thing is you have responded to the challenges of other sides and still won. Sides like the dogs will always come back. You can say you should put them away but most decent teams will lift when they are behind and deserve credit for fighting back . Maybe when St. Kilda's list matures a bit they will start putting sides away, but at this stage with their young list, surely winning is enough. s**t, most sides will struggle to put teams way, because it so even you cant underestimate anyway.

Na mate apparently we have an old list and all our good players a 30+.

 

[gringo2011]

He stole that from me the plagerist cabbage of a flognut

Did you come up with head like half sucked mangoe or initiate a Maine campaign though Joffa?