Richmond 2012

[Spudregus_87]

B: Grimes - Rance - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Moore - Russell
C: Newman - Tuck - Grigg
HF: Martin - Vickery - Nahas
F: Griffiths - Riewoldt - King
R: Maric - Cotchin - Deledio
I/C: Foley - Conca - Dea (Connors)

- Happy to give Moore first crack at CHB, as he's a bigger, maturer body than Astbury. I fear for his career though if another LTI gets the better of him.
- With Russell's recruitment, it's time to give Newman and Deledio more midfield time. We finally have guys who can use the ball, who aren't so lets use them.
- Hoping Derickx can really put Maric under pressure for our #1 ruck spot. Although big Eee-van was a solid recruit, I still feel Derickx holds the key to our future clearance/ruck success.
- I've got Connors as the sub, but obviously there are huge question marks over his on field future at the club. Hopefully he can get his attitude right and be the player we all know he can be.

 

[toptigers]

Here is how I would like to see the Tigers line up for Round 1 assuming that everyone is fit and obviously without knowing who we will be getting come draft time.

FB: Morris - Rance - Grimes
HB: Newman - Astbury - Batchelor
C: Deledio - Cotchin - Houli
HF: Nahas - Griffiths - Edwards
FF: Vickery - Riewoldt - King
R: Maric - Martin - Foley
INT: Grigg - Conca - Jackson
SUB: Dea

Think it would be a pretty handy side that while it will change throughout the year and hopefully someone pushes Jackson out of the side will win games. Would love to see Post come on and play a big role in the side as well

 

[Madtiger2006]

Jackson>Tuck>Grigg

Think we should only play 1 in the team on game day and Jacko is the one. His turnovers were less this year than last year and the year before. His composure and skill have improved and he hardly had a preseason either. Was in rehab for 2 months with hammy strain so he was pretty good in 2011 considering all this. Jacko will be an important player to our club from now on with his size and experience. He's becoming wiser with age on the field. I expect a more skilled and composed player from now on and a full preseason will do alot

 

[LOZWILDA]

FB: Morris - Rance - Grimes
HB: Newman -Post- Batchelor
C: Deledio - Cotchin - Conca
HF: Nahas - Vickery - Houli
FF: Griffiths- Riewoldt - King
R: Maric - Martin - Foley
INT: Helbig - Grigg - Dea
SUB: pick15
emerg...Astbury,Tuck,Connors,Webberley,Macdonald,Derickx,Jackson,Edwards

I would expect the club to make Jackson and Edwards earn their places this year and stop gifting games to the under-acheivers. There was next to no pressure being put on by our Coburg players last year!
Agree with 1 of Tuck,Jackson and Grigg to play in any one game.
More developement this year, but it is all looking so much better than the last 15 years!

 

[northeast tiger]

FB: Morris - Rance - Grimes
HB: Newman -Post- Batchelor
C: Deledio - Cotchin - Conca
HF: Nahas - Vickery - Houli
FF: Griffiths- Riewoldt - King
R: Maric - Martin - Foley
INT: Helbig - Grigg - Dea
SUB: pick15
emerg...Astbury,Tuck,Connors,Webberley,Macdonald,Derickx,Jackson,Edwards

I really like this team. The players in bold are the only ones I'm unsure about although I hope they do enough in pre season to warrant selection.

 

[folester41]

B: Morris Rance Grimes
HB:Newman Astbury Houli
C: Deledio Martin Conca
HF: Nahas Griffiths #15 Draft pick
F: King Jack Vickery
R: Maric Cotchin Foley
I:Batchelor Edwards Jackson #26 Draft pick
Emer: Grigg, Post, Connors

*Assuming Moore is not ready to go.

 

[Tiger Titus]

B: Newman - Rance - Grimes
HB: Dea - Astbury - Batchelor
C: Houli - Cotchin - Deledio
HF: Nahas - Riewoldt - Conca
F: Griffiths - Vickery - King
R: Maric - Martin - Foley
I: Tuck - Post - Morris
S: Edwards

I haven't included any prospective players from this years draft.

This is the team I would like to see, but I know Grigg and/or Jackson will get a game over Tuck. I would like to see Jack tried at CHF as his delivery into the F50 is immaculate and I think Ty can become a monster parked in the square. I would like to see a new draftee pushing King onto the bench or possibly sub, I just think we need some more quality in our smalls up forward.

 

[fargothegreat]

B: Grimes - Rance - Batchelor
HB: Houli - Moore - Russell
C: Newman - Tuck - Grigg
HF: Martin - Vickery - Nahas
F: Griffiths - Riewoldt - King
R: Maric - Cotchin - Deledio
I/C: Foley - Conca - Dea (Connors)

- Happy to give Moore first crack at CHB, as he's a bigger, maturer body than Astbury. I fear for his career though if another LTI gets the better of him.
- With Russell's recruitment, it's time to give Newman and Deledio more midfield time. We finally have guys who can use the ball, who aren't so lets use them.
- Hoping Derickx can really put Maric under pressure for our #1 ruck spot. Although big Eee-van was a solid recruit, I still feel Derickx holds the key to our future clearance/ruck success.
- I've got Connors as the sub, but obviously there are huge question marks over his on field future at the club. Hopefully he can get his attitude right and be the player we all know he can be.

Who's Russell???

 

[tigs2010]

Who's Russell???

Russell Morris?? Ex-Hawk and Saint

 

[In the Jungle]

Russell Morris?? Ex-Hawk and Saint

B: Morris Rance Grimes
HB:Batchelor Astbury Houli
C: Deledio Martin Conca
HF: Nahas Griffiths Grigg
F: #15 pick Draft Jack Vickery
R: Maric Cotchin Foley
I: From: Dea Tuck King Edwards Post Jackson
Sub:
Emer:Connors White Webberley ( these could be considered for sub, being able to hold down a variety of positions/ roles). They all posses good speed , which is imperative for a sub to make an impact;

It is a GREAT FEELING trying to pick a side, that finally has some depth, consideration & more importantly - ALOT OF THOUGHT & DISCUSSION

Although my side (is above for your perusal), its only my opinion. We all see players differently, rate them differently.

 

[RobsJourney]

The Starting 22

Hey guys, I'm not sure if it's been done yet though sure it has, but here's a thought for our starting 22 next year. I've got Kel Moore if he doesn't retire, put Post, Astbury (hoping you come real good son) or McGuane there if he does.

B/ Steve Morris - Alex Rance - Dylan Grimes
HB/ Chris Newman - Kelvin Moore - Jake Batchelor
C/ Brett Deledio - Trent Cotchin - Dustin Martin
HF/ Jake King - Brad Miller - Shaun Grigg
F/ Tyrone Vickery - Jack Riewoldt - Robin Nahas
R/ Ivan Maric - Shane Tuck - Nathan Foley
Int/ Reece Conca - Bachar Houli - Daniel Jackson - Draft Pick 15

emerg/ Shane Edwards - Jayden Post - Matt Dea

Hoping Griffiths can come on so to take over from Miller, and I still reckon we need another serious tall defender, and a midfielder or two, one heavy-inside, one inside/outside. I want a better fit than Dan Jackson, and Tuck isn't the cream, nor will he be around for a whole lot longer.

Thoughts?



ps. A side note that came to mind just before I posted. Although we're yet to see Morris, do we have one accountable small/medium defender who could stop a Milne or Betts? That kind of player has killed us for too many years.

 

[RobsJourney]

Re: The Starting 22

I wouldn't even mind seeing Deledio up forward. I remember him kicking 5 up there against the Pies a few years back. How often do you see him win an overhead mark in a one-on-one contest standing still? He does it nearly every time, it just sticks. Might be a potent and dangerous option for us.

 

[MR]

Re: The Starting 22

Hey guys, I'm not sure if it's been done yet though sure it has, but here's a thought for our starting 22 next year. I've got Kel Moore if he doesn't retire, put Post, Astbury (hoping you come real good son) or McGuane there if he does.

B/ Steve Morris - Alex Rance - Dylan Grimes
HB/ Chris Newman - David Astbury - Jake Batchelor
C/ Brett Deledio - Trent Cotchin - Reece Conca
HF/ Jake King - Ben Griffiths - Bachar Houli
F/ Tyrone Vickery - Jack Riewoldt - Robin Nahas
R/ Ivan Maric - Dustin Martin - Nathan Foley
Int/ Shane Tuck - Shaun Grigg - Matt Dea - Draft Pick 15

emerg/ Shane Edwards - Jayden Post - Daniel Jackson

Hoping Griffiths can come on so to take over from Miller, and I still reckon we need another serious tall defender, and a midfielder or two, one heavy-inside, one inside/outside. I want a better fit than Dan Jackson, and Tuck isn't the cream, nor will he be around for a whole lot longer.

Thoughts?

ps. A side note that came to mind just before I posted. Although we're yet to see Morris, do we have one accountable small/medium defender who could stop a Milne or Betts? That kind of player has killed us for too many years.

Hey, I really like the look of your team but there are a few changes that I would make.

Miller is only an insurance player, if Griffiths is injured can't play CHF, then most likely Astbury will take his role. Not until both of them are unable to play that role will Miller get a senior call.

Moore will not likely be playing next year, he had 8 operations on his hips. It would be a miracle for him to be back playing next year but he would never be back at his former best. After him in the priority order would be Astbury then Post.

I would also put Martin in ruck rover position, resulting in Tuck to the bench and Conca on the wing. Houli should be swapped with Grigg on the interchange bench too.

Dea doesn't get much love from supporters but he is highly rated by our coaching staff and by myself too. He will be a permanent starting 22 next year.

And to answer your p.s, we've had some players play that lock-down position on those quick small forward types such as Houli, Batchelor and Conca. However, none of them have looked comfortable in that role and also is not their prime position either. Morris was a fine acquisition to our side and will be that lock-down player which we have desperately needed.

 

[RobsJourney]

Re: The Starting 22

Cheers mate, appreciate the link, and definitely agree with your post.
Shame about Moore, he played some great games for us.

 

[Madtiger2006]

Re: The Starting 22

I'd prefer to not have Tuck, Grigg, Miller and Moore in the side. These are last resort players. For Round 1 I'd have Webberley replacing the suspended King.

FB batchelor rance newman
HB grimes post deledio
C edwards cotchin conca
HF houli griffiths webberley
FF nahas reiwoldt vickery
FOLL maric martin foley
INT jackson helbig morris sub: pick 15
EMER browne astbury mcguane

 

[juss]

Jackson>Tuck>Grigg

Think we should only play 1 in the team on game day and Jacko is the one. His turnovers were less this year than last year and the year before. His composure and skill have improved and he hardly had a preseason either. Was in rehab for 2 months with hammy strain so he was pretty good in 2011 considering all this. Jacko will be an important player to our club from now on with his size and experience. He's becoming wiser with age on the field. I expect a more skilled and composed player from now on and a full preseason will do alot

Oh no... surely not?

Tuck >>>> Grigg >>>>>>>> Jackson.

Jackson is a VFL standard footballer. Between his free kicks, suspensions and turnovers he is a liability at AFL level. Big body and has balls I'l give him that but simply not good enough. Grigg's not great either, but he's younger and a better athlete. Tuck is by far better than those 2, though probably we'd hope he'l be overtaken in the next year or so.

 

[ize_]

Agree. I'd play Tuck off the pine/in the guts next year and Grigg using his left hoof off half forward and the wing. Not interested in playing Jackson unless he seriously improves. 2013, Grigg is our inside mid of choice.

 

[Madtiger2006]

Oh no... surely not?

Tuck >>>> Grigg >>>>>>>> Jackson.

Jackson is a VFL standard footballer. Between his free kicks, suspensions and turnovers he is a liability at AFL level. Big body and has balls I'l give him that but simply not good enough. Grigg's not great either, but he's younger and a better athlete. Tuck is by far better than those 2, though probably we'd hope he'l be overtaken in the next year or so.

Nah sorry. Tuck was pretty disappointing this season. Made some poor decision and some bad disposal. Grigg is deplorable by foot pretty often. Jacko has improved his composure and kicking this season with no preseason either. He provides size and grunt and shows leadership. Grigg never goes in btw

 

[THE THIN MAN]

Nah sorry. Tuck was pretty disappointing this season. Made some poor decision and some bad disposal. Grigg is deplorable by foot pretty often. Jacko has improved his composure and kicking this season with no preseason either. He provides size and grunt and shows leadership. Grigg never goes in btw

How does he show leadership by getting suspended?

 

[Filthy Sanchez]

How does he show leadership by getting suspended?

My god he does some stupid things.
He really annoyed me in alot of areas this year. Just doesn't contribute like a senior big bodied player should. Grigg will be much better than Jackson long term.

I really don't see the point of giving Tuck an extension. Oldest player on the list and not in the best 22. I'd only play him in wet conditions and after guys like Helbig and Dea.

Our 25+ players from next year really let us down.

The good :
Newman
Foley
Deledio

The average:
Maric
King
Nahas
Moore
Miller
Derickx

The Bad
Jackson
Tuck
Graham
White
Mcguane


Out of that list of 14 only 5 players (the good including king and nahas) will be in our top 10 players, with Deledio probably the only one in the top 5 players. If we're to make finals in 2012 the improvement needs to come from these blokes. We know youngsters like Martin, Cotchin and Rance will continue to get better but they need support from the older guys. Pressure for spots should be on next year and if we don't see improvement these are the guys who we should be putting the blame on.

 

["The Roar Is Back"]

Nah sorry. Tuck was pretty disappointing this season. Made some poor decision and some bad disposal. Grigg is deplorable by foot pretty often. Jacko has improved his composure and kicking this season with no preseason either. He provides size and grunt and shows leadership. Grigg never goes in btw

Playing Jackson severly effects flexibility . He hasnt shown any ability to play anywhere else or in any other role than as a inside mid. His clearance work isn't great , for a bloke who contributes in no other manner/role . He can't tag , he has been smashed in the past two years ! Needs to re-invent himself within another role or shouldn't play !

 

[juss]

Nah sorry. Tuck was pretty disappointing this season. Made some poor decision and some bad disposal. Grigg is deplorable by foot pretty often. Jacko has improved his composure and kicking this season with no preseason either. He provides size and grunt and shows leadership. Grigg never goes in btw

Jackson is an average kick/decision maker, no two ways about it. Tuck isn't much better, but he is twice the footballer Jackson is.

Leadership? The guy gives away silly free kicks and has issues with the tribunal. That's not leadership, just because he's been around a while doesn't mean he's a leader.

Cotchin, Newman, Foley these guys are leaders.

I don't really rate Grigg either, but would prefer him to Jackson.

Jackson does provide grunt though I'l pay you that, he just is limited in most other areas of his game. Doesn't win it as much as Tuck, his clearance work is nowhere near Tuck's either, doesn't hit the scoreboard, not great overhead, not the best user of the footy, gives away free kicks and his tagging isn't too flash either.

He's an average footballer getting a game because he's "shielding" the young guys. I would hope he plays VFL in 2012.

 

[santa claws]

i will play as im bored.
assuming both maric and morris were drafted because they are ready to go.

B/ Morris 23yo 185/84 0gms - rance 22yo 194/93 44gms - grimes 20yo 193/87 8gms

hb/ deledio 24yo 188/88 150gms - post 22yo 195/93 22gms - dea 20yo 186/84 7gms

c/ batchelor 20yo 188/78 16gms - martin 20yo 187/86 43gms - newman 29yo 183/82 192 gms

hf/ houli 23yo 180/82 48gms - astbury 21yo 195/92 22gms - conca 19yo 185/78 17gms

f/ vickery 22yo 200/95 45gms - riewoldt 23yo 195/93 90gms - king 28yo 178/80 75gms.

r/ maric 26yo 200/102 77gms - cotchin 22yo 185/83 64gms - foley 26yo 178/80 110gms

int/ tuck 30yo 189/92 140gms - helbig 20yo 185/77 10gms - grigg 24yo 190/84 64gms nahas 24yo 176/70 55gms

hmm i put batchelor on a wing because i think he has all the attributes to play as a mid. i placed dea down back in his place because i think hes a natural defender.
i have moved newman onto a wing as well as i think pace has become a big issue with him of course morris gets his spot supposedly a very accountable medium sized defender.

ive put conca and houli in the forward line as they are simply better options than others here. of course both will be part of midfield rotations. with houli in particular ive taken him out of the backline because hes taking the spot of morris and dea. houli should be capable of playing elsewhere atm im not sure dea and morris can, also defence accountability tackling etc come into it i dont consider houli a genuine defender.

astbury to chf i think hes a genuine hit up forward. post to chb because thats his position.

vickery in a fp because i really believe it is time for him to start assuming a reasonable amount of the ruck duties he is the most ideal player we have on the list to play 60% - 70% forward 30% 40% ruckman.

looking at games played, age, and body size across the board of the above 22 it will very much be another developing yr.
only 4 with 100 games and only another 6 with more than 50 games, with over half the team aged 22 or under. and still one or two shoddy kicks too many but at least its manageable.
hopefully there is improvement in most of them and most manage to put on more size and improve core strength.
talent wise it must be very close to the best side we can muster its flexible has plenty of height and the size is okay. its when we cop just a few injuries that it will all go to the dogs there is no depth there are few truly proven players and there is an awful lot of faith in players improving.

just want to put up the coburg team im going to assume that give or take 2 or 3 players my side is the 22. i mean to say jackson may get a gig edwards may get a spot griffiths may get a go in front of post or astbury. but in the main wwe are all picking basically the same 25 or so players.

b/ rookie pick - gourdis 193/91 - rookie pick
hb/ heslin r - mcguane 192/91 - webberley 182/78
c/ pick 15 - jackson 188/91 - edwards 182/78
hf/ connors 186/84 - miller 194/96 - macdonald 184/87
f/ white 180/82 - griffiths 198/99 - derickx 201/99
r/ browne 203/105 - pick 26 - pick 55
int/ rookie - rookie - rookie - rookie.

emg/ graham
that people is effectively our depth it does not make for easy reading.

the thing that hits me straight away is theres just 2 GENUINE mids jackson and edwards sheesh what will happen if we cop injury to what good mids we have. imo one way or another we need to take 3 or 4 mids this draft and rookie darft.
back up key forwards realistically long term there is just one in griffiths yes we have some flexability with post and astbury in the senior side but just a few injuries and the bottom of the barrell is reached. bloody hell we need to look at least two tall forwards in the nd/rookie drafts.

tall backs just gourdis and mcguane in reserve neither may make it in fact if the list was well balanced mcguane would not be on it. again we need to look at a couple of tall defenders.
personally if the 8 was the aim this yr id be looking for a mature big bodied player like wilkes.
ruckmen sheesh we have the numbers but do we have the quality. imo either 26 if bolger is available or 55 should be used on a ruckman if one is available worthy of the picks. if we get one this yr he may be ready to make a decent contibution by 2015 2016.

ive read on these boards that top 8 should be the aim this yr i dont agree but if it is we need to find some depth that is ready to go.better depth than we currently have. upgrades if you like who themselves may need upgrading down the track some might call it value adding.

how much better would the situation look with nick carnell on the list and in the centre. or kyle horsley on ball. or how about tom lee at chb these blokes could be obtained with late picks and psd.

now i know people will say just rookie them but i think theres a chance they will go in the nd there are other players like them that could be taken.
we cut hicks theres a kid like wheeler at coburg who shows heaps. do we need a small forward or what.

when one looks at the quality of the backup it wont take too many injuries to derail the season.

when i look at the make up of the second side i shake my head we wont to hope the footy gods keep on smiling on us when it comes to injuries or there could be real carnage in 2012.

 

[_RT_]

List breakdown as at 1/11/11.

Rucks:
Andrew Browne 21 203cm 105kg 12 games
Angus Graham 24 201cm 102kg 47 games
Tom Derickx 23 201cm 99kg 0 games
Ivan Maric 25 200cm 102kg 77 games

Tall Forwards:
Tyrone Vickery 21 200cm 95kg 45 games
Ben Griffiths 20 198cm 99kg 9 games
Jack Riewoldt 23 195cm 93kg 90 games
Brad Miller 28 194cm 96kg 147 games

Tall Defenders:
Alex Rance 22 194cm 93kg 44 games
David Gourdis 22 193cm 91kg 4 games
Dylan Grimes 20 193cm 87kg 8 games
Luke McGuane 24 192cm 91kg 84 games

Tall Utilities: forward/back
Jayden Post 21 195cm 93kg 22 games
David Astbury 20 195cm 92kg 22 games

Medium/Small Forwards:
Dean MacDonald 19 184cm 87kg 0 games
Robin Nahas 23 176cm 70kg 55 games
Jake King 27 178cm 80kg 75 games
Brad Helbig 19 185cm 77kg 10 games
Matt White 24 180cm 82kg 82 games

Medium/Small Defenders:
Kelvin Moore 27 190cm 90kg 84 games
Jake Batchelor 19 188cm 78kg 16 games
Chris Newman 29 183cm 82kg 192 games
Steven Morris 22 185cm 84kg 0 games
Matt Dea 20 186cm 84kg 7 games
Jeromey Webberley 23 182cm 78kg 15 games

Midfielders:
Daniel Connors 23 186cm 84kg 27 games
Brett Deledio 24 188cm 88 kg 150 games
Shane Edwards 23 182cm 78kg 89 games
Nathan Foley 26 178cm 80kg 110 games
Reece Conca 19 185cm 78kg 17 games
Daniel Jackson 25 188cm 91kg 104 games
Shane Tuck 29 189cm 92kg 140 games
Bachar Houli 23 180cm 82kg 48 games
Trent Cotchin 21 185cm 83kg 61 games
Dustin Martin 20 187cm 86kg 43 games
Shaun Grigg 23 190cm 84kg 64 games


Looking at the list like that its not that bad for depth. There is plenty of cover in each position albeit not that highly skilled in some cases, but its still there. That is why we need to ensure that come draft night we pretty much nail it.

 

[deledio7]

Our midfield depth is a serious concern.

Proven
Cotchin
Martin
Deledio
Foley

Unproven
Conca

The rest we pretty much know what we are going to get which isn't of optimal standard.