Certified Legendary Thread Roos lodge plans for massive Arden St upgrade

[ferball]

Why does the Andrews gov cop s**t for tearing up a road contract that would have cost Victorians more in the long term than the 600 odd million it finally cost, when the previous government (the one that screwed North out of Ballarat,) signed a contract incredibly close to an election they were predicted to lose on the back of terrible advice and poor costings while the basis of the contract (ie the actual road being built) was under a legal challenge?

Whinge about the cost all you like but surely one of the reasons the Vic Liberal party is cactus, still - nearly a decade later, is because voters remember that they left a financial bomb for tax payers on the basis of their s**t management and then hid from their responsibility for causing that situation.

 

[Zondor]

Have you ever used the City Loop?

LOL at Have you heard of the City Loop. You don't get it. You never will. Debt is O.K. when manageable. But when you go pissing away billions, and as a result the interest on your debt cripples your budget, then you're in trouble brother. And that's where we are at right now. :stern look

 

[ferball]

LOL at Have you heard of the City Loop. You don't get it. You never will. Debt is O.K. when manageable. But when you go pissing away billions, and as a result the interest on your debt cripples your budget, then you're in trouble brother. And that's where we are at right now. :stern look

Its a good thing youse didn't sign up for 20 billion dollar white elephant road project that would have cost users 15 bucks a ride in today's money to make it profitable and cost 3/4 of a billion pa in availability costs to the government (ie taxpayers,) then isn't it.

AFAIC all sides of politics are ****ed and only serve their own self interest but how is it the people who set this s**t show in motion cop none of the public criticism for it when they should be strung up by their toes and used as public urinals?

 

[Zondor]

Its a good thing youse didn't sign up for 20 billion dollar white elephant road project that would have cost users 15 bucks a ride in today's money to make it profitable and cost 3/4 of a billion pa in availability costs to the government (ie taxpayers,) then isn't it.

AFAIC all sides of politics are ****ed and only serve their own self interest but how is it the people who set this s**t show in motion cop none of the public criticism for it when they should be strung up by their toes and used as public urinals?

Rightio. Ferballs is on the Mushrooms and he can see the Future. :stern look

 

[ferball]

Rightio. Ferballs is on the Mushrooms and he can see the Future. :stern look

Those numbers are all projected (ie 17.8 - 18.3 billion for the construction costs for example, $10.50 a decade ago to make the tolls profitable,) but accepted as accurate by everyone but the government that proposed the idea.

BTW Mushrooms are way cool...



You should take mushrooms ... and maybe read up on MMT.

 

[Zondor]

Those numbers are all projected (ie 17.8 - 18.3 billion for the construction costs for example, $10.50 a decade ago to make the tolls profitable,) but accepted as accurate by everyone but the government that proposed the idea.

BTW Mushrooms are way cool...



You should take mushrooms ... and maybe read up on MMT.

All Projected. I am great with numbers. I see an alternate Universe. Believe me! :stern look

 

[ferball]

All Projected. I am great with numbers. I see an alternate Universe. Believe me! :stern look

Your support for the government that forced North South has been noted.

 

[Slamming Sam]

Its a good thing youse didn't sign up for 20 billion dollar white elephant road project that would have cost users 15 bucks a ride in today's money to make it profitable and cost 3/4 of a billion pa in availability costs to the government (ie taxpayers,) then isn't it.

AFAIC all sides of politics are ****ed and only serve their own self interest but how is it the people who set this s**t show in motion cop none of the public criticism for it when they should be strung up by their toes and used as public urinals?

I agree with your point that all sides of politics (in your words) are f*****. Do you live in Victoria? If you do, you'd be aware that the LNP have been in power for four years of the last 25. The ALP have been running the state for the other 21 years but somehow the billion dollar deficit is the LNP's creation? Jeepers!!!

 

[GoRoos2023]

This thread has turned into the comments section on the Herald Sun these last couple of pages

 

[year of the roo]

This thread has turned into the comments section on the Herald Sun these last couple of pages

A few posters in this thread if gun against their head would rather support their political party than their footy club. Pretty strange behavour really.

 

[The Warlord]

Why does the Andrews gov cop s**t for tearing up a road contract that would have cost Victorians more in the long term than the 600 odd million it finally cost, when the previous government (the one that screwed North out of Ballarat,) signed a contract incredibly close to an election they were predicted to lose on the back of terrible advice and poor costings while the basis of the contract (ie the actual road being built) was under a legal challenge?

Whinge about the cost all you like but surely one of the reasons the Vic Liberal party is cactus, still - nearly a decade later, is because voters remember that they left a financial bomb for tax payers on the basis of their s**t management and then hid from their responsibility for causing that situation.

Yes the side letter gets conveniently overlooked here

 

[Engimal v3]

LuvtheKangas > Warlords. :stern look

Warlords has no concept of how financial incompetence by Governments eventually leads to all of us suffering more. Be it directly or indirectly. Increased Taxes to pay back the debt. Taxes that add to costs. To Inflation. Plus as a result, less money spent on things that matter because the interest from the debt payable becomes increasingly difficult to manage. Economics aint his strong suit. He will never get why Government Debt is bad. :stern look

A big contributor to Victoria's debt has been expenditure on infrastructure, so you have to consider the economic impact of not pre-emptively spending heavily on infrastructure when the state's population is going to increase by 25% over 10 years. For comparison, NSW will only grow by about 15%.

I know being North supporters have made us very weary of debt, but let's not pretend it's as simple as debt being bad. Things like the Commonwealth Games were obviously a stuff up by the Labor Government, but its not representative of why Victoria is in debt.

 

[ferball]

I agree with your point that all sides of politics (in your words) are f*****. Do you live in Victoria? If you do, you'd be aware that the LNP have been in power for four years of the last 25. The ALP have been running the state for the other 21 years but somehow the billion dollar deficit is the LNP's creation? Jeepers!!!

I'm just talking about one specific thing - $600 million + that was the responsibility of the government during those four years of liberal Government and why everyone blames the Andrews gov in isolation without considering the whole situation that led to that payout.

Mostly I think economics is bullshit, especially this neoliberal version we've been following for nearly half a century. But this is hardly the thread for that discussion.

 

[ChairmanZia]

Likely to be replaced by apartment buildings and housing which means less FIFO types coming into Arden for work then buggering off to wherever else they live. Permanent residents will need local facilities to accommodate their needs and wants.

May assist us in our search for additional government funds for facility expansion and development.

Yes, correct, Arden is one of the 10 priority development spots in vic for high density residence. We have a lot of real estate related stuff in chinese news as its a big thing in our culture.

I am not able to put it into words to describe how that will impact us, would like someone with greater insight to describe how this kinda stuff works.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

This doesn't make sense.



Again man, wait until you hear about the Brisbane Olympics.

1. Read it again, it makes perfect sense.

2. Yeah, something to discuss at the appropriate time. If it's a Liberal government issue and they f-up, I'm more than happy to criticise them.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Why does the Andrews gov cop s**t for tearing up a road contract that would have cost Victorians more in the long term than the 600 odd million it finally cost,

The answer to that bit is simple, even using your numbers. Spend $1.6b and have a significant piece of revenue-generating infrastructure, vs spend $1b (it was actually more) for nothing. Zero. F*** all. But we still paid that amount.

Edit - I'm not ignoring the point about the Liberals' cynical negligence in signing the contract and holding us to ransom. That has been raised and acknowledged every time we have this discussion. But Andrews rode to power on the issue and then dealt with it in the worst way possible.

 

[ferball]

The answer to that bit is simple, even using your numbers. Spend $1.6b and have a significant piece of revenue-generating infrastructure, vs spend $1b (it was actually more) for nothing. Zero. F*** all. But we still paid that amount.

Supposedly after assets that were purchased for the road were sold off the loss was in the $600 million range (wish i had that much money to blow) but that aside I have seen a bit of discussion about this over the years cos its been an interesting thing to read about. $1.6 billion seems like just the beginning of the cost over a long period.

Why tunnel vision will cost all Victorians, big time

The cost of the east-west road tunnel will cripple the state's fiscal position

www.theage.com.au

Edit - I'm not ignoring the point about the Liberals' cynical negligence in signing the contract and holding us to ransom. That has been raised and acknowledged every time we have this discussion. But Andrews rode to power on the issue and then dealt with it in the worst way possible.

Okay fair enough.

What else could he have done? Aside from build it.

 

[SpiderBurton22]

True story.,

Denis Napthine once handed me a pen with his name on it at the Warrnambool races.

I took it but told him to stop wasting tax payers money.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Supposedly after assets that were purchased for the road were sold off the loss was in the $600 million range (wish i had that much money to blow) but that aside I have seen a bit of discussion about this over the years cos its been an interesting thing to read about. $1.6 billion seems like just the beginning of the cost over a long period.

Why tunnel vision will cost all Victorians, big time

The cost of the east-west road tunnel will cripple the state's fiscal position

www.theage.com.au

Okay fair enough.

What else could he have done? Aside from build it.

Yeah. Build it.

Building a road, even if it required updated configuration / technical modifications, shits all over the other option of not building anything and paying massive penalties.

 

[Zondor]

Your support for the government that forced North South has been noted.

I don’t support any Government. I have voted for King Kong Bundy for a number of years. So try again Ferballs. :stern look

 

[ferball]

Yeah. Build it.

Building a road, even if it required updated configuration / technical modifications, shits all over the other option of not building anything and paying massive penalties.

Even tho building that road may have cost more in the long run than the pay out and may have caused more problems and congestion than doing nothing?

 

[ferball]

I don’t support any Government. I have voted for King Kong Bundy for a number of years. So try again Ferballs. :stern look

I vote for the mushroom party. Mushroom parties go off.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Even tho building that road may have cost more in the long run than the pay out and may have caused more problems and congestion than doing nothing?

Highly unlikely. That's just a convenient argument that the Andrews supporters ran.

Why the F would a new road, planned from scratch to take into account existing and forecast traffic conditions, end up leading to more congestion? That argument is a nonsense. The congestion has worsened because we have one less road to carry the traffic - that's the 'do nothing' outcome.

 

[sheridan]

True story.,

Denis Napthine once handed me a pen with his name on it at the Warrnambool races.

I took it but told him to stop wasting tax payers money.

only time ‘The Bool’ and Sth. West Vic got any money when he was in power.

 

[Slamming Sam]

I'm just talking about one specific thing - $600 million + that was the responsibility of the government during those four years of liberal Government and why everyone blames the Andrews gov in isolation without considering the whole situation that led to that payout.

Mostly I think economics is bullshit, especially this neoliberal version we've been following for nearly half a century. But this is hardly the thread for that discussion.

Who takes responsibility for the other 21 years? This ALP Government certainly haven't and continue, to duck, dodge and evade criticism, whilst blaming the Opposition, its the fault of Victorian taxpayers, its the fault of unions, literally anyone else, to take the heat off them.