Analysis Ross Lyon

[Dirty_banchez]

Judging by the presser he didn't plan to win this game .... Part of the master plan

I got that impression as well. Damian Barrett was alluding to it on AAA as well. I do question our ability to counter the Hawks/Eagles/Tigers game plan.

 

[TheMcManusNose]

All very correct and observant points. We simply don't have another 2-3 skilled players on our list (I blame our recent failure on first round draft picks) that are in the 3-5 year player range.
Lyon makes up for it by 'positioning' his players. I've no doubt that what we saw yesterday had mini-trial tactics throughout the game. I'd almost bet that he wants them entering that QF hungry rather than rested.

Yep. Simpson, Morabito and even Pitt would probably be best-22 right now. None is the fault of the club IMO, it is simply terrible luck and a backfired gamble.

It is made worse because we have gone for 'BPA' over the much needed talls and circumstances have meant we have none of the BPAs, or the talls. We have been saved by our ability to pull gems out of the late rounds and rookie drafts, but you do not generally get elite kicks and marks down there, more honest toilers - and here is the crux of the criticisms of Ross.

 

[theGav56]

We have also had the worst luck regarding first round picks possible. I think that has something to do with it as well.

We have had some bad luck but our early round drafting has also been below ordinary with the failure to select Darling and the decision to take Simpson as a first round pick.

 

[theGav56]

This is why no team can win every game they play. No game plan is perfect.

And thank goodness for that.

 

[Swan Districts Kid]

or that even the best sides will lose a few games a season. I liked the wrap up on afl.com.au
Fremantle
In hindsight, the Dockers were always going to lose at least once more before the end of the home and away season. Teams just so rarely go through the home and away season with just two losses, so 19-3 or perhaps 18-4 will likely be a truer indication of Freo's home and away season

An interesting observation I made at the game was the fact that we didn't respond to West Coast's obvious run on of goals in Qtr1. Normally when the opposition gets a 2-3 goal lead, Rosco makes the players man up, yet on this occasion it appeared to me that the team just continued to play 'zone defense'.

This was similar to QTR1 of the Richmond match, after which, Rosco said at the presser something along the lines of "I normally would have changed play to arrest Richmond's run, but I wanted to see how the players reacted (sic)". I've always thought Rosco as a pretty good game day tactician, & it seems to me that he could have done more to stop WCE's run, but didn't - I'm hoping that his was a conscious Ross decision. I may be very naive.

Also, why didn't Fyfe get involved until late in the 3rd - was he being played out of position? (I can't remember).

& as for him being overly-defensive in his game plan, history shows that this has been true at both at St Kilda & Freo. But as far as I can recall, he hasn't ever been blessed with an abundance of dangerous tall forwards at either club - Riewoldt & Koshitske was a bit like Pavlich & Clarke. Maybe he just plays to his squad strengths?

 

[theGav56]

if we make the GF and lose

he has lost 5x grand finals?


would he need to walk and have a break. I think very possible?


of course ross would get another job after a break... he could cherry pick which one too




Bomber Thompson, I think it would be a job he would be interested in??

Thankfully our club doesn't seem to make mad decisions like this any more.

 

[Marty Whitelaw]

& as for him being overly-defensive in his game plan, history shows that this has been true at both at St Kilda & Freo. But as far as I can recall, he hasn't ever been blessed with an abundance of dangerous tall forwards at either club - Riewoldt & Koshitske was a bit like Pavlich & Clarke. Maybe he just plays to his squad strengths?[/QUOTE]

Agree with this. The game plan needs to suit the squad of players you have at your disposal.

The Saints of 2009/2010 were similar to us....5/6 gun players and then a large number of fairly mediocre role players. They came up against the Cats who had gun forwards in Mooney, Hawkins & Stevie J and an amazing midfield full of elite ball users & runners. Similar with the Pies the following year. No point trying to engage in a free flowing shoot out when you are clearly going to get blown out of the water.

No doubt there are aspects of our game plan which require tweaking to match it with the Hawks but Ross surely knows the strengths/weaknesses of our playing group and designs a game plan to suit that.

 

[silverscope]

Also, why didn't Fyfe get involved until late in the 3rd - was he being played out of position? (I can't remember).

Played forward a lot in the first half, even starting the game there instead of the middle.

 

[E Shed]

Ohh there will still be some who will still whinge lol

What could there be left to whinge about? Anyone

But E Shed the only side that has dominated us this season is the Hawks.We have beaten every one else .Maybe we just have to get used to the idea that the Hawks are a better side .

Thats kind of the nub of the argument. I thought we were trying to beat them, hence looking for improvement.

 

[Mogumber]

They might be a better side, doesn't mean we can't beat them.

 

[Sully90]

Jesus anyone would think we were bottom 4 in the middle of a rebuild.

 

[Silent Alarm]

Jesus anyone would think we were bottom 4 in the middle of a rebuild.

People don't care and let a lot go when you're in that position.

Freo are literally in the best seat to win the flag – no better spot than top. But you really need to take your chances, and so far Freo haven't. There's been two genuine shots at the big one and you can blame inexperience, nerves, injuries, whatever... but the reality is that Fremantle has pissed chances against the wall, and no one wants to see us go to our final finals series as genuine contenders and not be equipped to go the whole way.

Fans are rightfully worried about the team repeating the same mistakes and not being up to Hawthorn. It's not negativity. People get angrier when you're doing well because there's so much more to lose.

 

[Freo Dr]

The two keys things I keep thinking about is this:

1) We have pretty a week list as noted for top end talent. We have not bottomed out in a long time or been able to successfully trade in former high picks from other clubs (Keps was one success there for a while) plus missed on a few first round selections. Going into this finals series we will have the highest average draft pick and lowest number of top 10/20 picks of any club in contention. It is both a credit to our coaches and a problem against the best teams.

2) During the home and away series it is about position. Have we held various things about our tactics and gameplan in reserve against WC knowing it was not 'must win' and that means we will be in a better position come the real stuff? Hope so, time will tell especially against Hawthorn/WC/Richmond and maybe WB.

 

[TheMcManusNose]

2) During the home and away series it is about position. Have we held various things about our tactics and gameplan in reserve against WC knowing it was not 'must win' and that means we will be in a better position come the real stuff? Hope so, time will tell especially against Hawthorn/WC/Richmond and maybe WB.

I agree wholeheartedly with your other point, but this one does make me nervous.

I really struggle to think of teams who have coasted in to finals only to witness a dramatic turnaround in terms of form. It's a seriously difficult thing to accomplish if you haven't refined it in the weeks previous. Yes, we've done it before resting players. However we've had some decidedly average performances recently with a near full strength squad. Resting is a different kettle of fish to playing average footy.

That said, I am encouraged by the last quarter in particular, and it is not long ago that we beat Richmond (an undeniably good side) at the G without Fyfe.

 

[malpaso]

That said, I am encouraged by the last quarter in particular, and it is not long ago that we beat Richmond (an undeniably good side) at the G without Fyfe.

Fyfe played in that win albeit hampered.

 

[salim malik]

What could there be left to whinge about? Anyone

Thats kind of the nub of the argument. I thought we were trying to beat them, hence looking for improvement.

Agreed with looking at ways to beat Hawthorn and its possible but we have been able to deal with all of the other sides.We worked out Richmond and have beaten the other top 4 teams.

 

[Steinfreo]

I agree wholeheartedly with your other point, but this one does make me nervous.

I really struggle to think of teams who have coasted in to finals only to witness a dramatic turnaround in terms of form. It's a seriously difficult thing to accomplish if you haven't refined it in the weeks previous. Yes, we've done it before resting players. However we've had some decidedly average performances recently with a near full strength squad. Resting is a different kettle of fish to playing average footy.

That said, I am encouraged by the last quarter in particular, and it is not long ago that we beat Richmond (an undeniably good side) at the G without Fyfe.

We sort of did it in 13

 

[TheMcManusNose]

Fyfe played in that win albeit hampered.

Ah well that shows you how hungover I am today. Sort of still stands though given how down he was.

We sort of did it in 13

Sort of yes. But I think a lot of that was being in decent nick and then resting rather than stepping up in terms of skills and game plan. Intensity, yes, perhaps we did.

 

[blue shark]

I honestly think we need to upgrade our coaching list, there are too many similar types in the box,
wouldn't mind seeing us poach one from hawks. A contingency plan wouldn't go astray either.

 

[Freo Dr]

I honestly think we need to upgrade our coaching list, there are too many similar types in the box,
wouldn't mind seeing us poach one from hawks. A contingency plan wouldn't go astray either.

Depending on the wash-up of this year I think could be looked at certainly. Somebody like JLo back from the slime and having been exposed to Simpsons learnings from Hawthorn would be another option.

 

[Freo Dr]

I agree wholeheartedly with your other point, but this one does make me nervous.

I really struggle to think of teams who have coasted in to finals only to witness a dramatic turnaround in terms of form. It's a seriously difficult thing to accomplish if you haven't refined it in the weeks previous. Yes, we've done it before resting players. However we've had some decidedly average performances recently with a near full strength squad. Resting is a different kettle of fish to playing average footy.

That said, I am encouraged by the last quarter in particular, and it is not long ago that we beat Richmond (an undeniably good side) at the G without Fyfe.

Didn't say I was confident that is what is happening but it is something I keep thinking about, not showing all your aces against certain opponents at least too far out from finals so they get time to counter it. The next two games are where we might get an idea, if we suddenly pull out the 'A' game (especially against North in the first half) - then I will have more confidence that it is about RTB timing his run and not all over poor form.

Eagles for example have no aces left up their sleeve now - must win every game and we will know exactly what we are up against (although players like NN and Lecras come back in).

 

[E Shed]

Agreed with looking at ways to beat Hawthorn and its possible but we have been able to deal with all of the other sides.We worked out Richmond and have beaten the other top 4 teams.

We were very lucky to get past Richmond after they were (I thought) the better side on the day.
The Hawks annihilated us.
The Eagles beat us with 3 of their best players out and their last tall defender missing for most of the second half.

Fair enough if you think thats good form to take into finals. I haven't been very impressed with our recent outings against better sides.

 

[Lach72]

People kidding themselves

 

[salim malik]

We were very lucky to get past Richmond after they were (I thought) the better side on the day.
The Hawks annihilated us.
The Eagles beat us with 3 of their best players out and their last tall defender missing for most of the second half.

Fair enough if you think thats good form to take into finals. I haven't been very impressed with our recent outings against better sides.

We also had three of our top players out.Luke,Balla and Zac D.Our defence was way undermanned against WC.If Richmond were the better team on the day they would have the 4 points.We were also missing our best player. We don't play the Hawks in Tasmania come finals.

 

[Kram]

Seriously sick of people saying how 'lucky' we were to win that Richmond game.