He gets a mulligan imo if he plays footy like he has been this year.
He's got more discipline on field than any underrated player I've seen in a long time . And obviously has worked super hard because he was nowhere near as good as he is now.
Preview Round 4 -Brisbane Lions v Collingwood Magpies.
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He's got more discipline on field than any underrated player I've seen in a long time . And obviously has worked super hard because he was nowhere near as good as he is now.
Really hope the Lions give it to the Pies. Want to see Magpies bodies flying all over the ground.
I don't mind Prior in but probably would prefer another two blokes 'rested'.
I don't mind Prior in but probably would prefer another two blokes 'rested'.
The Flying Belgian
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You're at least here win or lose. Some only show up when we lose to whinge. Sure, there's no rule to say you need to be balanced, but jesus it's boring.
The days of dropping players to "put a rocket up them" for the most part look to have gone as society appreciates the differing mental makeup of people. Sure there are some who react to that, but I get the feeling that mostly the selectors are trying to put the best team on the park. They don't have the luxury of emotional kneejerk (and sometimes vindictive) reactions.
If you go back to 2001 you'll find the same emotional reactions to the side's inconsistent start to the year. I'm not saying that 2001 = 2023. Life is rarely that simplistic. I'm saying that despite the calls for heads to roll, the selectors mostly stuck with the same side.
TBH, I'm bored with windbags who think their opinions are fact and are only interested in people who are reinforcing them, rather than those who at least look for a level of discourse and are prepared to backtrack or change their thinking (again at least you're willing to discuss an opposite viewpoint). I'm also bored with the level of discourse on this board - I feel like I see this same pattern of negative posting every year. Thinking it might not be a bad time for a hiatus.
sorry to bold that part out... but it should always be the corporation comes before any single person. I think Martensen was referring to out of form blokes getting dropped as they 1. deserve to reward performing reserves players, 2. they can find form in a lesser quality league to earn there way back and 3. (most important) for the greater good of the team.
No point carrying blokes like who are out of form blind fully wishing that miracles happen and they find form and or start to reach their long said potential. Most of the time it's best to just drop them and bring in someone who, whilst lesser talented, has a crack and plays their role.
maybe a little to flog the poor performing individual as well.
On the quiet
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Na. Every blog on everything has people whinging. For the most part I think this blog is reasonably balanced. There isn't that much negative posting overall. People had high expectations that currently aren't being fulfilled, that's all.
It's just my view but society ,or if you want to get specific , footy coaches have always appreciated the differing mental makeup of people . In fact I would say moreso back in the day when the game wasn't professional and you had to use different tools for different people to get the most out of them.
Sometimes putting your best team on the park isn't the answer. Paying players lots of money hasn't made them any more motivated. In fact in some cases it makes them less motivated.
To say we sometimes should be more proactive in sending a direct message to a player (s) isn't calling for heads to roll. We haven't seen a head roll in 4 years.
In 2001 we didn't know we were any good really. In 2023 we think we are or thought we were.
3KZ is Football
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Amongst all this, I haven't heard anyone mount a compelling argument for why the team that put in an appallingly bad performance and were beaten by Footscray, should go in largely unchanged. Have at it Mulligan Brigade. What is the game plan? Why will this team as selected beat a RED HOT Collingwood, when last week they were publicly dacked by a TEPID Footscray?
The Flying Belgian
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If player x who has a ceiling/floor of 60-90 is close to his floor than ceiling and player y is a 45-75 player and playing closer to their ceiling, 9 times out of 10 they're going to go with the guy with the higher ceiling. while the temptation is there to drop player x because they're not fulfilling their potential, the reality is they're still a better bet than player y.
One thing that drives me a little batty is people who judge by stats and don't recognise the less tangible things a player can bring to the field. A couple of years ago I saw Cal Ah Chee play one of the better 3 possession game you're likely to see, but people were crying out for him to be dropped because he didn't light it up on the stats sheet. So what you might call underperforming is only a point of view. I have players I don't really rate, that the coaches do. But I don't go around calling them clueless. I, at least know that I have no real knowledge of what it's like to coach a football team and most definitely not one on a professional basis.
The Flying Belgian
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Why would any of us have a compelling argument either way? Virtually none of us know what it takes to coach a professional sports team.
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I think Ah Chee is a gun. Just my view on the things he does. Most of them unnoticed.
Others who have a good knowledge of the game think he's a low possession gap filler who'll never amount to much.
It's all subjective isn't it.
Your point on coaching a footy team on a professional basis is valid but I've seen plenty lose all sense of judgement when they're in the cauldron and things aren't gong well.
They're human like the rest of us. Obviously they're not clueless.
I'd say you're right on the bolded in comparing our club forum to others on BF. From my time having a look at other clubs forums there's certainly a lot more vitriol.
But no, in terms of not a lot of negative posting, on that I disagree. I remember when I first joined there were so many posters i enjoyed hearing from, and one by one, so many of them disappeared and stopped posting. Posters that had been on here for 10+ years before me. I kind of get it now.
Just the way public forums & social media goes I guess. People with negative things to say are more inclined to need their opinions to be heard.
I won't be going anywhere, I still enjoy being here. The only feelings I have are sleepy & hungry.
The Flying Belgian
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In 2001 we'd come off 3rd and 5th place the previous two years. We had a reasonable idea we were thereabouts.
At the risk of playing the veteran card, I think I've seen too many years on this place. You think it would get better, but it never does.
Subjective. Exactly. I just know who out of us mugs or professional coaches is more likely to be correct and keep that in mind.
Agree wholeheartedly on the stats front. Irks me when stats are pulled into the discussion. Like you said the intangibles… things that aren’t covered in stats that are more important than a possession. A block or tap on, running with your opponent nullifying an easy opposition out, even taking space in a dangerous area of the field can be the difference between an opposition goal and a turnover.
It’s how I read the game… others read the stat book to form opinions. Each to their own I guess and no right or wrong.
3KZ is Football
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You are on fire tonight. Ah Chee is a gun!
Think we are a chance as it’s at the Gabba. But god we are going to have to play the most selfless game of footy we can muster. I want to see blokes playing their role, busting their gut to get back and defend either through taking space or being accountable, not flopping and no miracle four man deep speccy attempts that result in opposition free kicks.
We have it in us clearly but it will need to be a whole team effort. From fagan to prior and finally the lions fans. Want to hear what a packed Gabba crowd can do.
Funny you should say that though. I've seen plenty of coaches get ideas off supporters or people close to the club. Coaches hear a lot of things from a lot of people. Especially when you lose. Sometimes it interests them. Generally they want to know what supporters think.
The one thing the vast majority of supporters don't know are the internal ructions in the playing group , how certain players are viewed by the coaches as far as team performance goes and what happens behind the scenes, at training ,in group meetings ,innumerable things that we are not privy to.
Nothing would make me happier than to trounce the Pies or even better beat them by a point or two ,when they're on a roll thinking they're invincible with thousands making the trek up from Melbourne
3KZ is Football
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True, very few of us have coached a professional sports team, but that can’t be a prerequisite for having an opinion about selection or the direction of our club. Using your logic, the football media is not in a position to mount an argument or question the performance of a team or coach.
I base most of what I post on about 55 years of closely observing football and footballers and coaches as a passionate Fitzroy and Lions supporter. I pay my membership each season, which means I am commenting on a club I belong to.
Then there are the MIGHTY UNDER 11’s! We kept our opponents goalless after half time and had an impressive ‘away’ win last week, which is is more than I can say for Fagan.
Without your inspiration 3KZ I couldn't have picked it up tonight and gone on.
You know that snowy haired bloke the Swans have behind the goals ? You should be our facsimile.
You and Phil in your beanies.
Swanny needs to make it happen.
Here's an anecdote about a coach which I'll share since he's long gone
Fitzroy was playing Richmond at the MCG . Graeme Donaldson was coaching us . He'd had a lot of success at Carlton as a player and Assistant to Barassi.
Richmond absolutely murdered us. I went into the rooms and you could've heard a pin drop. Graeme was on his own sitting on a rub down table. He smelt like he'd just downed a Jim Beam and looked like he'd been to his mum's funeral. I was the only one near him and he looked at me and was almost crying, said 'why don't they do what I tell them , they never do what I tell them '
I blurted a few reassuring words and thought they're just no good mate, who'd want this coaching gig. Worst job in the world.
So spare a thought for Fages . It's often a lonely gig when you lose.
Fitzroy was playing Richmond at the MCG . Graeme Donaldson was coaching us . He'd had a lot of success at Carlton as a player and Assistant to Barassi.
Richmond absolutely murdered us. I went into the rooms and you could've heard a pin drop. Graeme was on his own sitting on a rub down table. He smelt like he'd just downed a Jim Beam and looked like he'd been to his mum's funeral. I was the only one near him and he looked at me and was almost crying, said 'why don't they do what I tell them , they never do what I tell them '
I blurted a few reassuring words and thought they're just no good mate, who'd want this coaching gig. Worst job in the world.
So spare a thought for Fages . It's often a lonely gig when you lose.
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There seems to be a few posts alluding to some underlying issues in the team/staff or something. Is there something I've missed here?
3KZ is Football
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I liked Donaldson. 1971 was his year, but when the wheels fell off they sure did fall off. We attended the famous FOG GAME against Carlton at the Junction Oval which was in his first year as coach. We finished that year with a BANG, knocking the previous years Premiers out of finals contention in Rd 21 and the next week we beat Essendon in Rd 22 at Windy Hill. We actually won our last four games.
1971 Ladder
| Pos | Team | Pld | W | L | D | PF | PA | PP | Pts | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | Hawthorn (P) | 22 | 19 | 3 | 0 | 2460 | 1601 | 153.7 | 76 | Finals |
| 2 | St Kilda | 22 | 16 | 6 | 0 | 2176 | 1554 | 140.0 | 64 | |
| 3 | Richmond | 22 | 16 | 6 | 0 | 2318 | 1890 | 122.6 | 64 | |
| 4 | Collingwood | 22 | 14 | 7 | 1 | 2331 | 1840 | 126.7 | 58 | |
| 5 | Carlton | 22 | 14 | 8 | 0 | 2103 | 2014 | 104.4 | 56 | |
| 6 | Fitzroy | 22 | 12 | 10 | 0 | 2047 | 1915 | 106.9 | 48 | |
| 7 | Melbourne | 22 | 11 | 10 | 1 | 1962 | 1791 | 109.5 | 46 | |
| 8 | Footscray | 22 | 11 | 11 | 0 | 1966 | 2217 | 88.7 | 44 | |
| 9 | North Melbourne | 22 | 5 | 16 | 1 | 1705 | 2551 | 66.8 | 22 | |
| 10 | Geelong | 22 | 5 | 17 | 0 | 2072 | 2523 | 82.1 | 20 | |
| 11 | Essendon | 22 | 4 | 17 | 1 | 1705 | 2252 | 75.7 | 18 | |
| 12 | South Melbourne | 22 | 3 | 19 | 0 | 1618 | 2315 | 69.9 | 12 |
I remember David Parkin being interviewed about his time at Fitzroy and he mentioned the unsolicited mail he would get. Most of it he ignored, but on occasion he said he took the advice that was offered.
Gadzorks
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There are people who are generally at least a little in the know saying they'd heard some things about problems that will be impacting relationships but no one is prepared to give details. Probably a good thing.
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