Rucci tells us what the Crows need

[macca23]

Originally posted by Wayne's-World
Given that the removal of "average" players may take a short period, the areas you would address in order of preference currently would have the midfield as #1 priority.

Given Bode is a midfield player, he falls into the category of an area requiring immediate surgery.

How can we continue to accept mediocre players like Skippy, Bode, Shirley, Biglands...

Your point is right on the money. The mid-field has to be our #1 priority and we have to be aiming to get players with more grunt and pace rather than the small slows like Bode and Skippy for example.

We have many other needs such as a ruckman, a FB and another key forward, but the mid-fielders must come first.

The only way we're going to get them all is to draft them, and I agree with Stiffy's post earlier that to do the job properly would take 3 years.

Now I would call that rebuilding rather than renovating.

 

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by Wayne's-World
Given that the removal of "average" players may take a short period, the areas you would address in order of preference currently would have the midfield as #1 priority.

Given Bode is a midfield player, he falls into the category of an area requiring immediate surgery.

How can we continue to accept mediocre players like Skippy, Bode, Shirley, Biglands...

I would agree that midfielders would be our #1 priority but other weaknesses are not far behind. Hell our spine has more patches on it that my late grandpa's old jacket.

We need a FB, we need a ruckman, we need midfielders, we need another strong marking key forward and we sure as heel need some smart crumbers who kick goals.

As far as midfielders go we need guns who are quick, hunters, kick goals, use their possesions and are accountable.

The only way we can get those players is through rebuilding. We are all forgetting that the likes of Roo, McLeod and Goody are 28 and older and don't have more than 3-4 years left in the tank. Those players won't be around for eever and the only way to replace them is through rebuilding.

We need 3 years of rebuilding and thats with us making every post a winner when it comes to drafting and trading. Otherwise its longer. Anything less than 3 years of pain is nothing more than a patch up job in a hope to win a premiership but never really being in the hunt. We are alredy though 12 weeks of rebuilding process. 54 more rounds to go

If Gary is coach next year (which sounds like a possibility) Bode is gone. If its someone else then Bode might stay. My belief is that I am 80% sure that Bode is gone but I repeat he will NOT be delisted and nor should he.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
I would agree that midfielders would be our #1 priority but other weaknesses are not far behind. Hell our spine has more patches on it that my late grandpa's old jacket.

We need a FB, we need a ruckman, we need midfielders, we need another strong marking key forward and we sure as heel need some smart crumbers who kick goals.

As far as midfielders go we need guns who are quick, hunters, kick goals, use their possesions and are accountable.

The only way we can get those players is through rebuilding. We are all forgetting that the likes of Roo, McLeod and Goody are 28 and older and don't have more than 3-4 years left in the tank. Those players won't be around for eever and the only way to replace them is through rebuilding.

We need 3 years of rebuilding and thats with us making every post a winner when it comes to drafting and trading. Otherwise its longer. Anything less than 3 years of pain is nothing more than a patch up job in a hope to win a premiership but never really being in the hunt. We are alredy though 12 weeks of rebuilding process. 54 more rounds to go

If Gary is coach next year (which sounds like a possibility) Bode is gone. If its someone else then Bode might stay. My belief is that I am 80% sure that Bode is gone but I repeat he will NOT be delisted and nor should he.

IMO, Bode should be traded / delisted as he has gone backwards. Reckon the likes of Shirley & Doughty have been better value for us in the last year or so.

Not sure if I agree that it will take 3 years to rebuild. We still have a good core of senior players (ie. Roo, Macca, Goody, Hart & hopefully Stevo & Clarke stay on). Hard decisions need to be made on the middle age players (ie. draft/trade up to half of them) & bring though the youngsters, including probably the more-than-usual we probably will draft this year.

 

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by Kane McGoodwin
IMO, Bode should be traded / delisted as he has gone backwards. Reckon the likes of Shirley & Doughty have been better value for us in the last year or so.

Not sure if I agree that it will take 3 years to rebuild. We still have a good core of senior players (ie. Roo, Macca, Goody, Hart & hopefully Stevo & Clarke stay on). Hard decisions need to be made on the middle age players (ie. draft/trade up to half of them) & bring though the youngsters, including probably the more-than-usual we probably will draft this year.

We are talking about entirely different types of players here. Shirley is a tagger who can also play as a defender on the right type of player. Doughty is an outside wingman who doesn't know the meaning of a hardball get. Bode is in and under midfielder who will get you the footy and is a handy crumbing forward. The fact is that apart from Bode we don't have a real in and under hunter who will get the hardball. Stenglein is once again a different cattle of fish and might not even be here next year. If Stenglein goes Bode becomes even more important than he is now.

Regarding rebuilding you are overlooking one extremely important fact. All those players that you mentioned as a core group are getting towards the end of their careers. Once the youngsters start developing those players will retire and you are still not a side capable of winning a premiership. Its not a matter of doing whatever it takes to make the finals ASAP. Its a matter of committing to a rebuilding phase of 3 years where win loss ratio is not important. Primiary objective of that period should be to assemble a strong spine and strong midfield that will see the club be a succesfull club for 10 years or so and win a premiership or 2 during that window.

Once you get that base to work with then its possible to be a stronly performing club year in year out by clever trading and drafting but unless you get that base you will always be plugging holes on your list.

St. Kilda is the prime example of what I am talking about. They started rebuilding at the right stage while their veterans still had something to offer and help develop their younger players. Now St. Kilda has the base. They have a powerhouse team for the next 10 years. What they can do now is keep adding pieces of the puzzle to that great list by clever drafting and trading. They can keep regenerating their list every year from now on without grately influencing their performances.

Port are following the smae pattern and will be a club that will be a top 8 material for the next x years.

If Adelaide don't go through a proper rebuilding process we will keep serving up more of the same and may even become the next melbourne where our perfomances will go up an down like a yo-yo.

 

[Stiffy_18]

Can I ask everyone here a hypothetical question.

If for the next 10 round Bode is given a fair opportunity to prove himself and he reproduced his 2002 form (and his first 6 rounds last year)would you all be calling for his head. Would you be talking about delisting him then??????

Bode is low on confidence and understandbly so. Kerls has not be overly happy with how he is being used and strongly believes that has shot Bode's confidence to pieces. I don't think Bode is as much of a lost cause as majority of this board believes.

 

[Mego Red]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
We need a FB, we need a ruckman, we need midfielders, we need another strong marking key forward and we sure as heel need some smart crumbers who kick goals.

Now, THAT sounds like rebuilding!

So what you're saying is - we're set for people to cut the oranges, we're set for, umm ...

Is there anything else we're set for? Mediocre taggers, maybe? Small defenders? Utilities?

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
Can I ask everyone here a hypothetical question.

If for the next 10 round Bode is given a fair opportunity to prove himself and he reproduced his 2002 form (and his first 6 rounds last year)would you all be calling for his head. Would you be talking about delisting him then??????

Bode is low on confidence and understandbly so. Kerls has not be overly happy with how he is being used and strongly believes that has shot Bode's confidence to pieces. I don't think Bode is as much of a lost cause as majority of this board believes.

Hypothetical really.
He's already had 12 rounds to do that.
What difference would another 10 make?
Might as well extend that to the next 20 rounds?

Enough is enough - too many defficiencies outweigh his strengths.
Only thing that will save him will be the mix of the list as you stated correctly all changes you would like can't be done immediately - or can they?? l

 

[spindoctor]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
Doughty is an outside wingman who doesn't know the meaning of a hardball get.

Not worried about the actual facts are we, Stiffy? Just slander a player because it fits your opinion of him?

 

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by spindoctor
Not worried about the actual facts are we, Stiffy? Just slander a player because it fits your opinion of him?

Care to provide some proof or are you shooting off the hip as usual.

Just read how Kerls' rating of Doughty this year. I sure as hell rate him as a better judge of football than you are.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
Care to provide some proof or are you shooting off the hip as usual.

Just read how Kerls' rating of Doughty this year. I sure as hell rate him as a better judge of football than you are.

Kerls isn't correct 100% of the time Stiffy.

Dogga has had a better year than Bode. Showed to today that he can also play a running backman's role & made some desperate spoils - certainly not soft by any means. Having said that, it was good too see Bodey get a full game & play well. Hopefully he can repeat it next week.

 

[jc67]

Originally posted by Kane McGoodwin
Hopefully he can repeat it next week.

If he's picked that is

 

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by Kane McGoodwin
Kerls isn't correct 100% of the time Stiffy.

Dogga has had a better year than Bode. Showed to today that he can also play a running backman's role & made some desperate spoils - certainly not soft by any means. Having said that, it was good too see Bodey get a full game & play well. Hopefully he can repeat it next week.

HIs ratings of the idividuals today was pretty good I reckon especially when it came to Doughty and Burton. He hit the nail on the head.


I have said before that Doughty has good skills, good pace and good size but what my pet hate is with players is when they come "off line" and Doughty is doing that. Thats something thats unforgiveable in my books.

Doughty has had a decent season so far this year but there is a flaw in his game that I hate and until he corrects it he will continue to cop flak from my side. People treat him like he is a 20 year old with 10 odd games under his belt. He is a 25 year old with close to 50 games. He should be pencilled in as a regular year by year now. He hasn't consolidated. He is having a decent season but nowhere near the season he had in 2002.

I keep saying if Bode gets the fair opportunity he is still a very important piece of the puzzle. There is no other midfielder on our squad that throws their body around like Bode does. The bloke has no fear and his running with the flight of the ball into the pack today in the 2nd quarter was a typical Bode thing to do.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18

I keep saying if Bode gets the fair opportunity he is still a very important piece of the puzzle. There is no other midfielder on our squad that throws their body around like Bode does. The bloke has no fear and his running with the flight of the ball into the pack today in the 2nd quarter was a typical Bode thing to do.

If someone is looking at the game again on tape, just count how many effective disposals Bode had today.

Again if we're consistent on the Burton disposal issue, many of Bodes possessions were ineffectual, or wrong decisions.
Can be masked by the manner in which he gathered his possessions.

 

[jc67]

Originally posted by Wayne's-World
If someone is looking at the game again on tape, just count how many effective disposals Bode had today.

Again if we're consistent on the Burton disposal issue, many of Bodes possessions were ineffectual, or wrong decisions.
Can be masked by the manner in which he gathered his possessions.

Thats genrally my critisism of him also. BUT he was bloody good today.
Alghough I havn't seen the game on tv yet.
IMO he was simply effective in every sense (changed my opinion of him after todays effort, joined the BF bandwagon so to speak)

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Originally posted by jc67
Thats genrally my critisism of him also. BUT he was bloody good today.
Alghough I havn't seen the game on tv yet.
IMO he was simply effective in every sense (changed my opinion of him after todays effort, joined the BF bandwagon so to speak)

I'm afraid nothing I saw today that would have changed my opinion or that, I would suggest, of the match committee.

May have increased his trade value however.

 

[macca23]

Originally posted by Wayne's-World
I'm afraid nothing I saw today that would have changed my opinion or that, I would suggest, of the match committee.

May have increased his trade value however.

You're a hard man WW!!

I thought his work ethic was impeccable today.

His disposal is still sub-par overall though. Definitely needs work.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by macca23
His disposal is still sub-par overall though. Definitely needs work.

Leopards don't change their spots, just like the Tiger Tin Man is still without a heart.

 

[bigman]

Stiffy you need to reasses your opinion of Dogga, he made three or four efforts today that required great courage - please give credit where credit is due and give michael credit for being one of more consistent players this year.

Apologies to Skippy 14, I have been critical of his/her posts due to a lack of objectivity wr to one Hayden Skipworth. I still have reservations about his pace for a player of this size, but he showed much more today and for the first time did not look out of his league.

The Mattner train continues to gather speed. For those people who said that he cannot hit targets, please watch the tape.

The game today showed those doomsdayers that things are not bad as they seem. We have a number of good players who are young and will play over 100 games for the Crows. Of course, not all will make it but as I have said all year - put Hentschell, Watts, Kenny, Stevo, and possibly Krueger and Rutten down the spine and we start to have an imposing look. Throw Mattner and Begley across half back and we have pace, height and good rebound from this line. Then have Hart and Bassett in the pockets and you have a very, very good backline.

Stiffy one other thing - Jonathan Brown played in a permiership at CHF when he was 19. Give Watts an opportunity there next year and you may be surprised what you will find. Certainly play him in the pocket for the remainder of the year when the king and Stevo gets back - to take some off the pressure of the kid and to give him the summer to bulk up.

Congratulations selectors this week for having the balls to go with the young. Except for the dropping of Horney Torney i agreed with every change you made.

 

[Stiffy_18]

Originally posted by bigman
Stiffy you need to reasses your opinion of Dogga, he made three or four efforts today that required great courage - please give credit where credit is due and give michael credit for being one of more consistent players this year.

I have said a number of times that he has all the skill, pace and build to be a very good AFL player. However, one thing I hate most is players getting off line so they avoid the body. Doughty has his good games and I acknoledge those. I give him votes when he deserves it but people carry on about him as he is a 20 year old and expect him to improve. I reckon he doesn't have a great scope for improvement left and will always be a depth player. If he can address that part of his game and put the body on the line CONSISTENTLY I will jump aboard the bandwagon. He has had years to correct that yet he hasn't.

Stiffy one other thing - Jonathan Brown played in a permiership at CHF when he was 19. Give Watts an opportunity there next year and you may be surprised what you will find. Certainly play him in the pocket for the remainder of the year when the king and Stevo gets back - to take some off the pressure of the kid and to give him the summer to bulk up.

Jonathan Brown at 19 was build like a brick ****house. Watts is a sinny fella who is 2 good years in the gym away from getting his body big enough for CHF. You are also forgeting that Brown had Lynch and Bradshaw as the bigger bodies tot ake away the heat from him. As things stand now both Stevens and Carey will retire so Watts would carry that forward line alone and not even Jonathan Brown at 19 would have been able to do that.

We need to recruit agressively and wel this year.

 

[bigman]

Stiffy and others who fail to see the light with respect to Michael Doughty. Look at the following:

This comes from the Advertiser today.

"The Dogs were headed goalward again when Crows Michael Doughty and Nathan Bassett put their bodies on the line to help turn the game.

With the Bulldogs on the march, Doughty cut across a pack to courageously spoil a menacing forward thrust and then Bassett hit Johnson with a fierce hip-and-shoulder bump which jolted the ball free and saw the Crows run the footy downfield and goal through Hentschel.

It signalled the start of a four-goal burst which sparked the Crows to just their fourth victory of the season and saw them rise from 15th to 12th – two games clear of bottom-placed Hawthorn.

"That sort of stuff is inspirational," Ayres said of Doughty and Bassett's courageous acts.

"That sort of stuff, when players see that, it becomes infectious.

"There were a lot of selfless acts I thought today which, they started the link in the chain if you like, and then it resulted in goals.

"Even though the goal might be given to Scott Welsh (for instance), it was the person who starts the play, in my mind, who contributes a helluva lot."

Come on fellas, give the bloke a break and admit he is starting to rebuild his AFL career.

 

[Tyson20]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
Can I ask everyone here a hypothetical question.

If for the next 10 round Bode is given a fair opportunity to prove himself and he reproduced his 2002 form (and his first 6 rounds last year)would you all be calling for his head. Would you be talking about delisting him then??????

Bode is low on confidence and understandbly so. Kerls has not be overly happy with how he is being used and strongly believes that has shot Bode's confidence to pieces. I don't think Bode is as much of a lost cause as majority of this board believes.

if he does in fact recapture some form and perform for the AFC in the next 9 weeks (a positive start Sunday), then the AFC would have something to go to the table with come trade time...may get a bite, may not, but Bode should realise he isnt just playing for a spot on the AFC list...if Ayres stays then Bode is primarily playing for a spot on every other AFL Clubs list as well...

for the first time in months i went to AAMI yesterday slightly excited and left slightly even more excited...it will take 2-3 yrs to "renovate" our list but by the looks of things so far this year we have some good youngsters to work with, a core of senior players that are qulaity...just need to work on our middle of the road players....

certainly aggressive trading and having some luck in the draft will help!

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
I have said a number of times that he has all the skill, pace and build to be a very good AFL player. However, one thing I hate most is players getting off line so they avoid the body. Doughty has his good games and I acknoledge those. I give him votes when he deserves it but people carry on about him as he is a 20 year old and expect him to improve. I reckon he doesn't have a great scope for improvement left and will always be a depth player. If he can address that part of his game and put the body on the line CONSISTENTLY I will jump aboard the bandwagon. He has had years to correct that yet he hasn't.

Reckon Dogga has consistently put his body on the line of late. He got a huge wake-up call & was rightly dropped earlier in the season after that soft game. However, he seems to be on the right track now. Rightly deserves his place in the team IMO.

 

[macca23]

Originally posted by bigman


This comes from the Advertiser today.

"The Dogs were headed goalward again when Crows Michael Doughty and Nathan Bassett put their bodies on the line to help turn the game.

With the Bulldogs on the march, Doughty cut across a pack to courageously spoil a menacing forward thrust and then Bassett hit Johnson with a fierce hip-and-shoulder bump which jolted the ball free and saw the Crows run the footy downfield and goal through Hentschel.

I have to admit, as one of those who have correctly criticized Doughty in the past for shortening stride on various occasions (a polite way of saying piked it), I was absolutely wrapped with that effort from Doughty.

He put his body in a position where he could have been half killed, and I thought he took a giant step forward in his career with that action yesterday.

But Stiffy is right when he says that Doughty has to do that consistently, not just once, to earn total respect.

I actually like Doughty on a HBF as he uses his pace and skills to give good run and delivery from defence.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Originally posted by macca23

I actually like Doughty on a HBF as he uses his pace and skills to give good run and delivery from defence.

Doggas been tried in defense B4 with little success.
Has not got a strong defensive side to his game, may have changed ???

 

[Macca19]

Originally posted by Stiffy_18
All this talk that Johncock wants to go to port is the biggest load of crap I have ever heard. That rumour has been going around since 2001 and cannot be further from the truth. Johncock has stated millions of times before that he is happy at the Crows, wants to play out his career at the crows and was a crows supporter growing up. All this crap we have been hearing in the last few years is getting a bit thin.

Last year it was Johncock to Port for Lade (or was that a year before)

Johncock is NOT going anywhere and as DaveW said he is our best proven youngster and as such is just about untouchable.

I have to say I havent heard many rumours about him coming ot Port at all. Dont know where they are coming from.

Johncock would be nice at Port but Id say the Crows would want a fair bit more than his actual worth. Truth be told he hasnt set the world on fire this year, has played some very average games, his disposal has started to falter a bit and he hasnt come close to becoming this superstar midfiedler he was meant to this year.

Quite simply, for who the Crows would want for him Port would most likely not want to give up, and who Port would want to give up the Crows most likely wouldnt take.

Johnc*ck is a good young player with the talent to be a great one down the track but yet another forward pocket/back pocket, altho good, is not something we need.

Therefore I agree with Stiffy that these rumours are false and are just another typical 'Port player out of contract so he must want to go back there' rumour.