Sheedy's advice - do it harvey

[sumavich]

Harvey must be ruthless - Sheeds

By Sam Lienert
May 05, 2008
FORMER Essendon coach Kevin Sheedy says Fremantle coach Mark Harvey must be ruthless with the underperforming Dockers and weed out players who lack the hunger to perform.
Harvey, who was both a premiership player and assistant coach under Sheedy at the Bombers, is having a tough initiation to his senior coaching career.
After taking over the Fremantle reins from Chris Connolly late last season, he has guided the Dockers to just one win in the first seven rounds this year.
They hit their lowest point when they gave up a 51-point lead to lose to bottom-placed Melbourne on Sunday.
But four-time premiership coach Sheedy said his own experience showed a slow start to a coaching career did not necessarily mean much.
“I lost five of my first six games, all I know is I had a fairly good career after I lost five of my first six,” Sheedy said.
“I didn't get off to a really good percentage win-loss ratio. All you do is say to the young coaches coming into their first year or two, hang in there.”
He said Harvey and other new coaches should not be shy about booting players out if they did not have the necessary competitive traits.
“If you've got to make tough, ruthless, hard decisions then don't hesitate,” Sheedy said.
“You want a hungry team, then go for the hungriest players you've got in your club.
“Anyone else, either lift your performance, not only Fremantle but any club, put your best performance up or you won't have a long career, simple as that.”
AAP

 

[Memories]

You have to give any coach 2-3 years minimum before canning them, unless there are extraordinary circumstances. We have a lot of yoyo players in our team that we need to get rid of before accurately measuring Harvey's coaching ability. He will get better with time.

 

[sumavich]

You have to give any coach 2-3 years minimum before canning them, unless there are extraordinary circumstances. We have a lot of yoyo players in our team that we need to get rid of before accurately measuring Harvey's coaching ability. He will get better with time.

I'm a fan, but he's got to get rid of the gutless squibs that are holding us back.
I've mentioned four of them on other posts, so I won't do it again. But Harvs needs to bite the bullett and get the hungry ones in there.
The ones that I mentioned are going through the motions a bit, and I say Off with Their Heads !!!!

 

[Docker Clint]

He recruited Mark Johnson and Kepler Bradley.

 

[sumavich]

He recruited Mark Johnson and Kepler Bradley.

Yeah but they cost us nothing, Johnson was a fourth round pick FFS !!
The only one lately we've been pineappled on is Tazza, and I'm not willing to right him off just yet. The kids that they've picked are going well, and will continue to do so I reckon. Mayne still to come in as well.

 

[Memories]

I'm a fan, but he's got to get rid of the gutless squibs that are holding us back.
I've mentioned four of them on other posts, so I won't do it again. But Harvs needs to bite the bullett and get the hungry ones in there.
The ones that I mentioned are going through the motions a bit, and I say Off with Their Heads !!!!

Aye, that's fair criticism I think. My suspicion, and I cannot state that clearly enough, is that there might be one or two... A to B+ class players who are ring leaders within the group. They might have to get rid of a few players that we as supporters think are great players, but who knows for sure.

Harvey has shown a few tactical errors on game day that I'm sure he will address going forward, generally he's been fairly good. He at least has the attributes you can respect as a leader so he's worth sticking with to give him what most would consider enough time.

 

[ImperialPurple]

He recruited Mark Johnson and Kepler Bradley.

While these are not great decisions in terms of what they actually offer the club, there can't be any question over their hunger.

MaJ is as "hungry" as they come, and Kepler is on his last chance, so you'd assume there's a fair bit of hunger on his part too - both as an individual, but also to show what he can offer the team.

The fact that MaJ is old and slow, and Kepler is a crab are different issues from their being "hungry".

 

[Memories]

He recruited Mark Johnson and Kepler Bradley.

Kepler's only young and isn't quite up to AFL scratch yet, but he has shown some improvement this season from my limited opportunities to see him.

Mark Johnson was probably just brought along for depth if we made the finals. Since we are bombing so badly (pun intended) he does seem rather useless to us now if we go the youth route. But at this stage I'd even say Mark Johnson is in our best non injured 22... should he play considering we are pretty much gone? No.

 

[walken79]

He recruited Mark Johnson and Kepler Bradley.

I'm so sick of people pointing the finger at people like Mark Johnson- he cost us nothing and really puts in a huge effort when he's on the park. Far from our worst player when he gets a game too....
This is far from the real problem here.

 

[Sman-21]

Im sure he will do it to.

Hes already shown he will drop players after 2 - 3 performances that used to never get dropped when their on there last chance he starts them on the bench an im sure they will be getting told perform this week opr its back to the wafl.

Just needs time though cant change a culture of lazy players living in the comfort zone in a few games.
Could take all year but i have faith it will happen.

 

[Belnakor]

If he is serious he should drop everyone who was seen walking/jogging in the last quarter instead of running.

 

[Memories]

While these are not great decisions in terms of what they actually offer the club, there can't be any question over their hunger.

Exactly, it's all about the hunger. Watching the Hawks game I saw 22 players who all HUNGER for the ball and/or protecting their team mate with the ball. It's like watching a net ball team with Freo a lot of the time, too afraid to bump players, wanting someone else to get the hard ball, not chasing hard enough, etc.

That's why Palmer is so exciting for us, a midfielder who so far every game has HUNGERED for the ball, where is his support though? We should demand every player to aggressively want the ball and aggressively protect their team mates who have the ball. The entire game, not in purple patches throughout.

 

[poshman]

ease up on Kep, i don't like him, but would he be worse than some have been thus far?

He has been in good form in the wafl, and should deserve a go soon, although i cannot say that i look forward to it much.

 

[Belnakor]

Yeah Kep definately has worked hard enough for a game with us. Plus he could be the second ruck option.

 

[The Night Shift]

Do It
two words...
something like this ??
[youtube]Qfz92rxvCao[/youtube]

 

[Moo]

He recruited Mark Johnson and Kepler Bradley.

If the new law at Freo is use our first 3 round picks and then piss the rest up against the wall ....3 hearty cheers and drinks all around (and throw in a hellelujah!).

Harvey is still learning but as I have stated before ...no coach we have ever had has been willing to throw guys back into the WAFL - I mean it is round 7 and already Black, Taz, Peake ...bravo.

Also thanks to Harvey we have some early round draft picks to play early and so bloody double bravo.

Harvey is learning but our problem against the Dees was all player generated and hopefully Harvey found out a lot about the list.

 

[sumavich]

If the new law at Freo is use our first 3 round picks and then piss the rest up against the wall ....3 hearty cheers and drinks all around (and throw in a hellelujah!).

Harvey is still learning but as I have stated before ...no coach we have ever had has been willing to throw guys back into the WAFL - I mean it is round 7 and already Black, Taz, Peake ...bravo.

Also thanks to Harvey we have some early round draft picks to play early and so bloody double bravo.

Harvey is learning but our problem against the Dees was all player generated and hopefully Harvey found out a lot about the list.

Yep, agree completely !!!

 

[Eagle87]

Yeah but they cost us nothing, Johnson was a fourth round pick FFS !!
The only one lately we've been pineappled on is Tazza, and I'm not willing to right him off just yet. The kids that they've picked are going well, and will continue to do so I reckon. Mayne still to come in as well.

I'm so sick of people pointing the finger at people like Mark Johnson- he cost us nothing and really puts in a huge effort when he's on the park. Far from our worst player when he gets a game too....
This is far from the real problem here.

They cost you picks 55 & 69

Picks of that range or lower from previous 5 drafts:


2006: Lindsay Thomas, Brock O'Brien, Josh Hill, Tyson Goldsack, Justin Westhoff, Aaron Edwards

2005: Clint Bartram, Mathew Stokes, Joel Patfull, Sam Lonergan,

2004: Jayden Attard, Simon Taylor, Chris Knights, Matthew Egan, Brad Moran, Daniel Pratt,

2003: Sam Fisher, Ben Hudson, Michael Rischitelli, Jordan Bannister, Shane Tuck, Andrew Raines, Daniel Jackson

2002: Tim Boyle, Adam Selwood, Ryan Crowley, Robert Shirley, Nick Malceski, Ryan Ferguson, James Begley, Brad Fisher....

So, they potentially cost you something and you also didnt use your last pick - your list was full - so thats 3 kids you didnt take instead adding more age to an old list.

Regardless of whether or not they are good pick ups (and the evidence suggests not), they did cost you something - 2 or 3 more kids with a chance to be as good as some of the players I have listed.

 

[Cameron_K]

Who is to say Kepler is going to amount to nothing at all?

Sorry I must have missed the press release telling us the guys career is over.

 

[Eagle87]

Who is to say Kepler is going to amount to nothing at all?

Sorry I must have missed the press release telling us the guys career is over.

What do you reckon the odds are that he will be a good to very good long term contributor at Freo?

Be honest.

 

[Latro]

I think he has odds at least as good as anyone who would of been picked in his place. Obviously they didnt have anyone available at that spot that they wanted.

 

[Cameron_K]

The same as most recruits picked in the 40's or above actually.

 

[sumavich]

What do you reckon the odds are that he will be a good to very good long term contributor at Freo?

Be honest.

Same could be said about Palmer vs Masten !!
I know which one has gone the best so far !
Be Honest.
Also, those late picks are a lottery at best, and you've done well naming players that suit your argument.
I could just as easily read off a number that haven't made it.
Bradley & Johnson were not the reasons we lost yesterday so back to the topic please.
Otherwise, bugger off and try and salvage something for Chad Fletcher !!

 

[chook2734]

Im sure he will do it to.

Hes already shown he will drop players after 2 - 3 performances that used to never get dropped when their on there last chance he starts them on the bench an im sure they will be getting told perform this week opr its back to the wafl.

Just needs time though cant change a culture of lazy players living in the comfort zone in a few games.
Could take all year but i have faith it will happen.

Spot on Sman. They have the ability, but they are lazy. The senior guys give their all, the kids give their all and the middle tier just do what they have to to stay in the team. When McPharlin went down yesterday, it showed them up for what they are. As much as it hurts, it may be the year we had to have.

 

[PapaJ]

I couldn't agree more with Sheedy, and I suspect Harvey will be on the same page. But hungry to perform isn't just tirelessly going for the ball, playing tough and the like (alhtough it includes that obviously), its being hungry enough to stick to the game plan. Against Melbourne and Richmond, it wasn't just lack of effort as such (especially Melbourne), its lack of ability to play as team and give it you're all for the team - it was just disorganised.

The other thing to consider is this approach takes time. It takes time to work out who the real workers are and who are just along for the ride. It takes time to replace them and it takes time to get them all playing together as a team ... but I'll do the time if the end product is a mentally solid team where the Richomd type performances are once a season at most. Where one wake up call every couple of years is all that is needed, not regular fade outs and half efforts being the norm.