Politics Should Australia become a Republic?

[Roylion]

Your ability to turn the phrase 'the royal family wasn't that inbred' into a win is simply astonishing. If argument was a sport, you'd be olympic.

Are they that 'inbred'?

 

[Gethelred]

Are they that 'inbred'?

Sorry, but I was making an observation, not expressing disagreement.

I have no desire to waste my time and yours on something this fruitless.

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

Are they that 'inbred'?

They're not quite the Habsburgs, true!

Distinctive 'Habsburg Jaw' Came From Centuries of Inbreeding

Many of the kings and queens of the Spanish Habsburg dynasty had a distinctive facial malady known as the Habsburg jaw. What caused it?

history.howstuffworks.com

 

[Roylion]

They're not quite the Habsburgs, true!

Now they, like many of the ancient dynasties of pharoahs of Egypt, were inbred. Fathers marrying daughters, uncles marrying nieces and so on.

The early Catholic church tried to reduce inbreeding amongst royal and noble families by prohibiting marriage within four degrees of consanguinity, later on increasing it to seven degrees (effectively seventh cousins) before moving it back to four in the 13th century. However the church often gave dispensations to this requirement and after the Reformation, many just ignored it.

 

[Reg Grundy35]

What 'consequences' are to referring to?

well they seem to have a high proportion of ****wits dont they?

 

[Roylion]

well they seem to have a high proportion of ****wits dont they?

Do they? Do tell.

 

[The Punter]

If argument was a sport, you'd be olympic.

I would have thought that was kind of the point of the entire forum.

 

[Gethelred]

I would have thought that was kind of the point of the entire forum.

I don't know about you, Punter, but I think a forum like this is among the greatest resources for learning that has ever been conceived.

If only that were the majority of what happened on here.

 

[The Punter]

I don't know about you, Punter, but I think a forum like this is among the greatest resources for learning that has ever been conceived.

If only that were the majority of what happened on here.

To be fair, I think that can be this forum as well. But honing an argument and developing a high-level rhetorical skill is also the point. I'm on here to learn, to argue, but also because I truly believe everyone needs to hear a counter argument and if it wasn't me, then I'm not sure who it would come from a lot of the time.

On this topic, you have one poster who isn't going to soften his hatred for the monarchy and one poster who isn't going to let anything go by without a detail-filled rebuttal. I understand there is an issue for moderation on here to ensure threads don't simply become the posting of the same things, but I think there are more pressing moderation issues around these parts.

 

[evolved2]

I don't know about you, Punter, but I think a forum like this is among the greatest resources for learning that has ever been conceived.

If only that were the majority of what happened on here.

Viewing debates and arguments from opposing positions is one of the best ways to learn.

My favourite bible verse is "The first one to plead his cause seems right until his neighbor comes and examines him." Proverbs 18:17 NKJV

 

[Episode IV]

I don't know about you, Punter, but I think a forum like this is among the greatest resources for learning that has ever been conceived.

If only that were the majority of what happened on here.

Whose fault do you think that is?

I agree in principle, but I've seen plenty of forums come and go, and much bigger ones... always for the same reasons.

 

[Mitcham VIC 3132]

Of the main "vote 'No' and a real republic referendum will happen soon after" figures, only Phil Cleary is still alive. Mack and Jones have long since died (and Turnbull tried to warn Jones about exactly that in '99)

 

[Episode IV]

Of the main "vote 'No' and a real republic referendum will happen soon after" figures, only Phil Cleary is still alive. Mack and Jones have long since died (and Turnbull tried to warn Jones about exactly that in '99)

It really doesn't matter.
The proportion of Australians who are descended from anyone who have any ties or loyalty to the UK and its monarchy decrease every year.

The greatest strength of a democracy is that it caters to what the majority want.
The greatest flaw of democracy is that it caters to who the majority are.

It's only a matter of time.

 

[Mitcham VIC 3132]

It really doesn't matter.
The proportion of Australians who are descended from anyone who have any ties or loyalty to the UK and its monarchy decrease every year.

The greatest strength of a democracy is that it caters to what the majority want.
The greatest flaw of democracy is that it caters to who the majority are.

It's only a matter of time.

Which is why Thorpe and co. calling modern non-ATSI Australians "settlers" is an abuse of both language and history.

 

[Gethelred]

Whose fault do you think that is?

I agree in principle, but I've seen plenty of forums come and go, and much bigger ones... always for the same reasons.

It depends on what you think the purpose of a forum is, and what you think that forum is for.

This forum is ostensibly about a national sport in Australia. It's occupied by Australians predominantly, and footy fans pretty much ubiquitously. As such, there are levels of inherent tribalism and adversarialism built into this forum just as deeply as the URL, and there's no getting around that. Any given forum is also completely at the mercy of those who exist within it; they represent both the highest bar conversation can reach, but also the lowest bar the forum can reach.

Whose fault is it that a forum is not always an implement of learning? Why, it's always the people, EIV. You can constrain them, you can moderate their views via rulesets and standards for debate, but ultimately a forum is a place of utter democracy: the loudest voice is usually the one magnified.

It feels a copout to say it, though. As someone who moderates different parts of this thing, it's not really on us to be thought leaders - to lead by example, as it were - as doing so would contravene other's free use of the thing. You cannot really funnel expression of thought outside of the use of the rules, and then those rules exist to be skirted, stayed just one side of, stretched. It's not a clean cut thing but as complex a series of interactions as anything that involves other humans.

Is it my fault? Possibly; hell, even probably. But that's the price you pay for allowing free speech, isn't it?

 

[Episode IV]

It depends on what you think the purpose of a forum is, and what you think that forum is for.

This forum is ostensibly about a national sport in Australia. It's occupied by Australians predominantly, and footy fans pretty much ubiquitously. As such, there are levels of inherent tribalism and adversarialism built into this forum just as deeply as the URL, and there's no getting around that. Any given forum is also completely at the mercy of those who exist within it; they represent both the highest bar conversation can reach, but also the lowest bar the forum can reach.

Quite a decent response. I like this bit in particular; I've gone so far in the past as to look a little bit into the national sports of different countries and compare them to national character and how government operates.

Whose fault is it that a forum is not always an implement of learning? Why, it's always the people, EIV. You can constrain them, you can moderate their views via rulesets and standards for debate, but ultimately a forum is a place of utter democracy: the loudest voice is usually the one magnified.

It feels a copout to say it, though. As someone who moderates different parts of this thing, it's not really on us to be thought leaders - to lead by example, as it were - as doing so would contravene other's free use of the thing. You cannot really funnel expression of thought outside of the use of the rules, and then those rules exist to be skirted, stayed just one side of, stretched. It's not a clean cut thing but as complex a series of interactions as anything that involves other humans.

Is it my fault? Possibly; hell, even probably. But that's the price you pay for allowing free speech, isn't it?

Again, well said, but at the end of the day there is always an inherent conflict between the idea or philosophy of a thing and its execution, particularly with reference to the free speech bit.

I do tend to hang around on forums as much as to observe the mechanics, and the refinement of public opinion (and to compare that internal, local refinement of opinion to wider society in general) as for any other reason.

It's an interesting gedanken, in the context of this thread (and this forum in general), to be able to see what an eventual Australian republic might look like, particularly in comparison to those currently operating in the USA and in Europe.

To say I'm not overly optimistic would be somewhat an understatement.

 

[Gough]

I wonder whether Brenda's long reign will be ultimately viewed as a good thing in history? Did the much vaunted stability of the monarchy actually disguise inertia and allow delusions like Brexit where Brits still thought it was the 1960s to infect their society?

 

[Episode IV]

I wonder whether Brenda's long reign will be ultimately viewed as a good thing in history? Did the much vaunted stability of the monarchy actually disguise inertia and allow delusions like Brexit where Brits still thought it was the 1960s to infect their society?

I think about the Roman Empire at least once a day.

 

[Mitcham VIC 3132]

The Voice also showed that Thorpe and others on the far left didn't know when it is smarter to shut the freak up.

 

[Gough]

Andy dePrinced, he must be really hurting the brand.

 

[Ghost Patrol]

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

Andy dePrinced, he must be really hurting the brand.

Not the Mountbatten brand - Randy Andy's upholding tradition!!!

New claims Mountbatten sexually abused children from notorious Belfast boys' home

A new book, ‘Kincora: Britain’s Shame’, alleges that MI5 and the British political establishment covered up abuse that took place at Kincora.

www.thejournal.ie

 

[kalex6251]

abc newsradio was interviewing someone about the randy andy fallout earlier this morning (might have even been a member of virginia giuffres family ..... dont quote me)

anyhoo, he was banging on about tampon charlie doing the honourable thing and setting behavioural standards - what standards could he possibly set?

 

[Wallaby]

Oh dear, how sad - he can't call himself Prince anymore.

Pathetic. I can call myself Prince - so can you. There was a pop star named Prince. If Andrew really thinks he's innocent, he should demand everyone stills calls him Prince.

If you want to do something - make him answer questions about the Epstein files.

The British Royal family is a f****** stupid idea that should have been binned 150 years ago.

 

[Frank Bunn]

He's still Prince Andrew and has his titles until the process goes through Parliament.

There's a question whether his entitlement for 8th in line for the UK monarchy will be removed. It has ramifications for countries, including Australia, where the UK monarch is head of state.