The Law The 120 hours learning to drive scheme needs to be extended

[Herne Hill Hammer]

One dumb thing that they had in Vic around the time that I got my licence in the mid 80s was that you could do the driving part of your test in an automatic and if you passed you could drive a manual or auto Luckily after about a year, the powers that be realised how dumb that was and changed it back to what it was. As it is now, my sister in law got her Ps about 4 or 5 years ago in an auto and as soon as she had finished her 3 years probation her licence then became an open one, she could drive auto or manual, again stupid.

 

[DardySingh360]

It's still 25 hours here in WA

 

[shurg123]

The number of hours of practice before getting your license is nowhere near as important as the quality of the instruction given during these hours. 'Practice makes perfect' is an incorrect statement, only 'perfect practice makes perfect'. 120 hours of practice with a parent who is most likely a terrible driver and can't remember most of the road rules or any that have changed since they took the test is a bad idea. 20-30 hours of instruction from a qualified driving instructor, with advanced/defensive driving skills added in towards the latter few hours would be far more beneficial. This should include things such as how to read the flow of traffic ahead of you, leaving enough room to react accordingly given the conditions etc. The moronic 'speed kills' mantra means that regardless of the situation, your average driver will react to any potential accident situation by braking as hard as they can, regardless of whether this actually helps them avoid an accident.

 

[Dont be a lemon]

I'm concerned about improperly attached horse trailers.

 

[Eastern Rangers]

The funniest thing about getting your drivers license is how quickly people change once they're on the open road with nobody next to them.

I wanted to be a good citizen and do the speed limit and stay left up Greenmount hill (renowned for it's semi trailers) in peak hour but it was suicide. It was 15km/h in the right hand lane after two weeks. I had a few minor prangs in my early years, both at low speed and both fatigue related.

Changing the culture that already exists on our roads is the biggest issue and stemming the number of bad drivers needs to be the main issue, unfortunately the quality of driver education and poor driving culture is endemic. We have such low standards on our roads.

Removing the obsession about low level speeding would be a good start. Emphasis should be placed on awareness, signalling, space and why these things are important.

 

[swingdog]

Changing the culture that already exists on our roads is the biggest issue and stemming the number of bad drivers needs to be the main issue, unfortunately the quality of driver education and poor driving culture is endemic. We have such low standards on our roads.

In a lot of European countries, you can only learn to drive with an accredited driving school and they decide when you're ready to sit the test. It costs a lot more but it makes for better drivers.

 

[Bosun]

I have always thought than rather have a fixed time that somehow driving conditions are taken into account, there's not much point in doing 200 hours let alone 120 if your just going to spend it driving around easy roads and environments in nice weather, farken hell drive any wet day on a Vic freeway and you can tell people that have been driving for 10+ years are still shitting their pants and they inevitably **** up.

Same goes for open outback freeways, I got my licence in Darwin at 16, drove some heavy trucks (illegally as I didn't have the proper licence) knew how they worked then after a few months drove from Darwin to Melbourne. From what I saw there are many people that don't know how to overtake a road train and when it's safe to do so. I bet Mr Supra in Chapel st would end up dead.

 

[Bardo State]

My parents both work full time and my mother isn't overly comfortable with me driving her, not that I'm a deplorable driver, she just gets nervous. I also have a sister who has many sporting and extra commitments. I also have school requirements which can get hectic at times. I've managed about 40 hours in a year and honestly, I can't see how the next 80 are going to make me much of a better driver than I already am.

Most hoons are very confident drivers with lots of experience on the road, not people still uncomfortable with being behind the wheel.

 

[UmpiringFooty]

Here is an example of what can go wrong in a car when a hoon is driving.
Something that you might be fully surprised at daannn277
Inexperienced drivers do this all the time and they aren't at all confident. They are just stupid. They need to be educated properly. That's why the 120 hours that the TAC has got at the moment needs to go in favour of a 5 year course that starts at age 16 when the drivers are in school. They get as many lessons as possible right up until they finish school. By that time they might even have their Green P's. Then with the 3 years left of the course (the participants get their Red P's on their 21st birthday). Then when they turn 25 they are fully licenced drivers.

 

[TigersMan4]

Here is an example of what can go wrong in a car when a hoon is driving.
Something that you might be fully surprised at daannn277
Inexperienced drivers do this all the time and they aren't at all confident. They are just stupid. They need to be educated properly. That's why the 120 hours that the TAC has got at the moment needs to go in favour of a 5 year course that starts at age 16 when the drivers are in school. They get as many lessons as possible right up until they finish school. By that time they might even have their Green P's. Then with the 3 years left of the course (the participants get their Red P's on their 21st birthday). Then when they turn 25 they are fully licenced drivers.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

You really have no idea what you're on about.

 

[Bardo State]

Here is an example of what can go wrong in a car when a hoon is driving.
Something that you might be fully surprised at daannn277
Inexperienced drivers do this all the time and they aren't at all confident. They are just stupid. They need to be educated properly. That's why the 120 hours that the TAC has got at the moment needs to go in favour of a 5 year course that starts at age 16 when the drivers are in school. They get as many lessons as possible right up until they finish school. By that time they might even have their Green P's. Then with the 3 years left of the course (the participants get their Red P's on their 21st birthday). Then when they turn 25 they are fully licenced drivers.

You used a Today Tonight clip as evidence for your argument. Therefore, I'm not going to give much credence to said argument.

I still maintain that most hoons and people who drive while under the influence have probably got their 120 hours up as they would drive for fun and have access to cars and that a 'safe driving course' wouldn't stop them from behaving in the manner they do. Upping the hours won't change anything, people will just forge more hours than they do currently, then people wouldn't even bother attempting to drive that many hours. 120 is already borderline ridiculous.

Just as a question, how did you attain your own licence? What kind of training did you recieve and did you feel it left you prepared as a driver.

 

[hawks realist]

You can be certain umpiringfooty does not have a license since he/she needs to sook about hoons on a forum

 

[kfc1]

One particular accident happened to the neighbours over the road from me. They were too busy hooning around and they were coming back from a party. They decided to hoon as there were only metres to their place and the driver ended up with some life threatening injuries. He was left a quadrapligic.
What are your thoughts on this?

Sounds like a good outcome to me

 

[kfc1]

Can't work out if op is trolling.

OP is Sooz; enough said

 

[Slax]

120 hours is complete BS, it doesn't deal with the main issues about driver education. You can do 120 hours in good conditions are have no experience of driving at times when accidents are more like like:

• Dusk/dawn
• Night-time
• Heavy rain
• Fog
• Peak hour traffic
• even reverse parking on a busy road

Instead of 120 hours I'd be happier to see it drop to 40 hours and have a compulsory defensive driving course added to it. This would actually teach learners some skills that will help them immediately and will help avoid far more accidents than the extra 80 hours with a parent who in some cases is such a poor driver that they should have to be learning to drive again.

 

[Power Raid]

Some people are ready to drive after 10 hours whilst others can't after 1,000 hours.

May be we we should not only do an initial test but another twelve or twenty four months later.

We should be must stricter in the second test and expect a much higher standard from our drivers.

 

[hawks realist]

Some people are ready to drive after 10 hours whilst others can't after 1,000 hours.

May be we we should not only do an initial test but another twelve or twenty four months later.

We should be must stricter in the second test and expect a much higher standard from our drivers.

Op falls under the 1000 hours category

 

[Impunity!]

OP has in fact failed the hazard perception test more than once, if I recall correctly.

In 1995 when I got mine, I just did my Ls, had about 5 or 6 lessons, then sat the test. 1 year Ps, full licence on 18th birthday.

I have managed to avoid driving like a hoon or mowing down schoolchildren since then

 

[Requiem]

120 hours is complete BS, it doesn't deal with the main issues about driver education. You can do 120 hours in good conditions are have no experience of driving at times when accidents are more like like:

• Dusk/dawn
• Night-time
• Heavy rain
• Fog
• Peak hour traffic
• even reverse parking on a busy road

Instead of 120 hours I'd be happier to see it drop to 40 hours and have a compulsory defensive driving course added to it. This would actually teach learners some skills that will help them immediately and will help avoid far more accidents than the extra 80 hours with a parent who in some cases is such a poor driver that they should have to be learning to drive again.

This.

Attitudes regarding road rules can be far too conservative, like you've said we should be teaching drivers to handle the dangerous aspects of driving, not fear them.

People freeze up with fear, it's a natural biological reaction when our minds are deciding what to do, teach them to handle the situation and more likely than not the accident can be avoided.

 

[telsor]

Make kids get a motorbike licence first.

Being on a bike is like an advanced course in defensive driving (riding), and teaches you a lot of respect for other road users.

Short term I imagine the road toll would rise, but it would decline again and in the longer term end up lower.

 

[DrKrieger]

Make kids get a motorbike licence first.

Being on a bike is like an advanced course in defensive driving (riding), and teaches you a lot of respect for other road users.

Short term I imagine the road toll would rise, but it would decline again and in the longer term end up lower.

This. This. So much this.

 

[PP34]

This thread is a ****ing joke. So according to the great s00z all young people are hoons without 120+ hours of driving + other training.

I'm currently on my L's and still yet to get started properly. 120 hours is ridiculous especially when most on their L's are in VCE trying to study for a good score. It's not as though 120 hours is so beneficial either.

Perhaps OP you should do more research into why young people are involved in accidents on the road. It's mostly to do with alcohol, drugs and fatigue.

Personally I'd like to see the government make it mandatory for new drivers to receive some kind of free training to help give them better driving skills because the roads are just a disgrace.

I've been car racing a few times with guys that all have their racing licences and at anywhere from 120-260 kilometres an hour they safely navigate a narrow racetrack around corners, with cars just inches from them and they all know when to get out of each others ways. Going from that to the normal roads afterwards and you feel much safer on the racetrack.

There are terrible drivers in all age brackets and I'd probably blame the older methods of getting a license plus the lack of training required to get a license.

In an ideal world we'd all be able to comfortably drive at 80+ with competent skills and ability to follow road rules. Society is full of bad drivers though. Everybody believes they're the perfect driver, it's just crap.

Stop acting like a know all on a subject you have no idea about.

 

[telsor]

This thread is a ******* joke. So according to the great s00z all young people are hoons without 120+ hours of driving + other training.

I'm currently on my L's and still yet to get started properly. 120 hours is ridiculous especially when most on their L's are in VCE trying to study for a good score. It's not as though 120 hours is so beneficial either.

Perhaps OP you should do more research into why young people are involved in accidents on the road. It's mostly to do with alcohol, drugs and fatigue.

Which to a large degree comes down to inexperience. If I'm 10% off my game due to fatigue, then I've got thousands of hours of practice to fall back on. I'll see the dangers sooner and/or react 'correctly' because I've quite simply been there and done that before (or something similar).

I don't necessarily agree with more than 120 hours ( I know it can be a burden to some ), but the idea is to just get new drivers more experience.

Personally I'd like to see the government make it mandatory for new drivers to receive some kind of free training to help give them better driving skills because the roads are just a disgrace.

The issue here is 'free'...Someone, somewhere needs to pay for it. It's for the individual drivers benefit, so while I'd certainly agree that such behavior should be encouraged (subsidies, rego & insurance rebates) making it free just wouldn't fly.

I've been car racing a few times with guys that all have their racing licences and at anywhere from 120-260 kilometres an hour they safely navigate a narrow racetrack around corners, with cars just inches from them and they all know when to get out of each others ways. Going from that to the normal roads afterwards and you feel much safer on the racetrack.

Yeah, flat track, cars of similar size and power all going the same way, no stops, everything predictable...and I dare say they still have more crashes per KM driven than the roads generally. Fewer casualties perhaps, but that's likely to be the safety gear.

Thing is, that's just never going to happen on the public roads. Whatever the skills of the drivers, there will be trucks blocking your view, bumps in the road, traffic lights, etc.

There are terrible drivers in all age brackets and I'd probably blame the older methods of getting a license plus the lack of training required to get a license.

In an ideal world we'd all be able to comfortably drive at 80+ with competent skills and ability to follow road rules. Society is full of bad drivers though. Everybody believes they're the perfect driver, it's just crap.

It's not an ideal world.

In a perfect world, speed limits would adjust to weather and traffic conditions, hell, they could adjust for the skill and distraction levels of the driver, but as it is, they need to go with lowest common denominator...What speed is safest in wet weather, in fairly busy traffic.

It's also not all about speed...Speed rarely causes accidents, what it does is give you less time to fix it when something goes wrong (not necessarily your doing).

Stop acting like a know all on a subject you have no idea about.

Says the guy on his Ls telling everyone how the roads work. Mate, I'd probably got at least ten thousands of hours of driving (and motorbike riding) on you, and I'm not even close to knowing it all....Actually, that's probably the biggest lesson young people need to learn...Humility on the roads. I really think the best drivers/riders have all been in a crash they know was their fault (either because their mistake caused it, or their mistake meant they couldn't get out of it).

 

[PP34]

Which to a large degree comes down to inexperience. If I'm 10% off my game due to fatigue, then I've got thousands of hours of practice to fall back on. I'll see the dangers sooner and/or react 'correctly' because I've quite simply been there and done that before (or something similar).

I don't necessarily agree with more than 120 hours ( I know it can be a burden to some ), but the idea is to just get new drivers more experience.



The issue here is 'free'...Someone, somewhere needs to pay for it. It's for the individual drivers benefit, so while I'd certainly agree that such behavior should be encouraged (subsidies, rego & insurance rebates) making it free just wouldn't fly.



Yeah, flat track, cars of similar size and power all going the same way, no stops, everything predictable...and I dare say they still have more crashes per KM driven than the roads generally. Fewer casualties perhaps, but that's likely to be the safety gear.

Thing is, that's just never going to happen on the public roads. Whatever the skills of the drivers, there will be trucks blocking your view, bumps in the road, traffic lights, etc.



It's not an ideal world.

In a perfect world, speed limits would adjust to weather and traffic conditions, hell, they could adjust for the skill and distraction levels of the driver, but as it is, they need to go with lowest common denominator...What speed is safest in wet weather, in fairly busy traffic.

It's also not all about speed...Speed rarely causes accidents, what it does is give you less time to fix it when something goes wrong (not necessarily your doing).



Says the guy on his Ls telling everyone how the roads work. Mate, I'd probably got at least ten thousands of hours of driving (and motorbike riding) on you, and I'm not even close to knowing it all....Actually, that's probably the biggest lesson young people need to learn...Humility on the roads. I really think the best drivers/riders have all been in a crash they know was their fault (either because their mistake caused it, or their mistake meant they couldn't get out of it).

I'm not claiming I know it all, I definitely don't but the OP seems to think that she knows plenty about how young people use the roads and how they think.

I'd like to think I have a fair bit of knowledge as I'm in the age bracket she is talking about. I'm just giving some suggestions, even with little road experience I believe I have a fair idea about how roads work. Any person who is old enough to understand the roads at their most basic level can see when someone is in the wrong. I also know people who work in the industry.

Plus if I recall correctly alcohol is involved in most accidents related to young people. It's got nothing to do with this 120 hours not being enough notion.

 

[telsor]

I'm not claiming I know it all, I definitely don't but the OP seems to think that she knows plenty about how young people use the roads and how they think.

I'd like to think I have a fair bit of knowledge as I'm in the age bracket she is talking about. I'm just giving some suggestions, even with little road experience I believe I have a fair idea about how roads work. Any person who is old enough to understand the roads at their most basic level can see when someone is in the wrong. I also know people who work in the industry.

Plus if I recall correctly alcohol is involved in most accidents related to young people. It's got nothing to do with this 120 hours not being enough notion.

That's more an argument for breaking the dates up between qualifying then...Don't really care which one gets moved, but that the same day you can get your licence is the same day you can walk into a pub has never seemed right to me.

Mind you, it also backs my argument for making people use motorbikes first...When your balance and coordination is that important, you realise quickly that drinking and riding don't mix well.