News The future of FootyJumpers.com?

[CollarJazzKnee]

I only use bigfooty to talk about jumpers and aesthetics. What's the point arguing with some flog on the net about how your team is going?
I'm flat!
#standbymero

 

[El_Scorcho]

It seems like a massive waste of money and effort to do it without your assistance Mero

Most of the hard work is done and done well. There would be stuff that you researched and discovered and got on your site that is no-longer available to anyone bar the research you've done. The AFL definitely isn't going to commit the time that's already been committed. If they are going to do it, just get Mero involved and do it properly.

 

[Silent Alarm]

It seems like a massive waste of money and effort to do it without your assistance Mero

Most of the hard work is done and done well. There would be stuff that you researched and discovered and got on your site that is no-longer available to anyone bar the research you've done. The AFL definitely isn't going to commit the time that's already been committed. If they are going to do it, just get Mero involved and do it properly.

Basically the AFL see that as submitting to someone; admitting they don't know everything and trying to offshoot the chance someone else can tell history. That is despite the fact absolutely no one except 14 people on here would know or care. It's just another version of their pointless arrogance. They don't want to use Mero's research because they see that as helping him, or trusting someone they think they can't.

It is just so typical AFL but ya know. Aw well.

 

[IQ3]

#standbymero

 

[MKMatty]

This is absolute rubbish. I posted this in the other thread, but without Meros website I wouldn't have followed my interest in footy jumpers, in history and in design. Typical arrogance move by the AFL. We need a petition ASAP. #standbymero

 

[wizardwaffle]

There are two things about the AFLs move here. With this they control the history of the AFL (in this case the history of the jumpers) and they are doing it for the least money it will cost them. At the present time the most reliable history of the jumpers of the AFL is www.footyjumpers.com. This is something that the AFL would not like, someone outside the AFL in control of the history of the AFL. They probably want to put something like this on a subscriber paid part of the AFL website. Mero does live in Canada which the AFL would see as a problem if he was to work for them.

However, I would like to see www.footyjumpers.com continue on in some form. Some others have said how they might alter the history if they controlled it. If the history on the site was kept, say on this website, and updated by Mero or other designers at least we know that what we see on the internet and what our children will see on the internet is the actual history of the jumpers and not what is best for the AFL.

 

[Rainier Wolfcastle]

Aaah yes, the AFL - self-appointed guardians of the game's history... when there's a dollar to be had.

They really have no shame; back in the early days of footyjumpers.com they tried the bully-boy tactics, demanding Mero stop using their IP and threatening further action, eventually backing down because a) it's a not-for-profit, historical site, and b) at that time the site didn't actually feature any of their logos or trademarks.

Mero was allowed to continue and the site grew into what we know today. What he wasn't told was that the AFL now saw the site as a free resource they could exploit as they wished; the AFL marketing department even advised a researcher to go through FJ.com and take whatever pics he needed!

Now they've decided to step it up and lock in all club jumpers since establishment as part of their retro licencing campaign.

The latest insult? The Heritage Style Guide issued to the clubs features numerous images from FootyJumpers.com - all uncredited of course...





(notice they are too lazy - or is that arrogant? - to even change the numbers from the 22 that appears on every jumper on FootyJumpers.com)

-------------------------

Mero's images go uncredited and yet they credit EVERY other source used in the style guide...






This is just the latest example of the AFL exploiting the history of the game for their financial gain, lazily cherry-picking the parts they can squeeze dollars out of while ignoring anything non-AFL... you know, all that stuff that tells the full story of our game and reminds future footy fans that our game didn't just start in 1897 when the VFL was formed and that the SANFL, WAFL, VFA and Tassie leagues were all a key part of footy's history, not just the AFL feeder comps they've become today.

While Mero (footyjumpers.com), John Devaney (fullpointsfooty.net / footyflashbacks.com), Jeff Hulls (afltables.com), Adam Cardosi, Andrew Gigacz and co. (australianfootball.com), the team at blueseum.org, Supermercado (demonwiki.org), Ric Gauci (waflfootyfacts.com), Ken Mansell & Michael Riley (boylesfootballphotos.net.au), Damien Green, Col Hutchison, Michael Roberts, James Hothersall, Ross Smith, yours truly (hardballget.net) and many others passionately research the game, the AFL licensing department swoops and plunders.

The AFL loves to trot out their slogan "Australia's Game" - their Heritage Style Guide shown above is plastered with it - and yet their behaviour towards Mero reveals their true motivation.

Other than a few truly committed individuals within the league offices who see the bigger picture, the rest are marketing and PR types with an eye on the next big TV deal - they have no real interest in the history of "Australia's Game".

So, it's time AFL. You wanted to be the guardians of our great game's history - this is the perfect time to prove it. Forget marketing spin such as "the year of the fan" or "improved matchday experience" and join forces with the fans that are actually doing the historical research you are not interested in doing yourself.

You can start by purchasing Mero's site then using the material there to truly promote the game. If you can't bring yourself to do that, at least acknowledge him as the source of 'your' research.

I'd like to see that...

 

[TheLoungeLizard]

Hopefully this doesn't sound daft but is there any ground for Mero to sue the AFL back?
Taking his images (I assume he owns the images he makes for the site) and not giving him credit?

I assume anything on FJ.com is Mero's IP, unless he puts official logos on?

 

[Mero]

I must confess to not knowing the IP laws well enough. I think it would be an argument for lawyers.

 

[Gibbsy]

I must confess to not knowing the IP laws well enough. I think it would be an argument for lawyers.

Mr Eagle – come in, spinner

 

[Mr Eagle]

Mr Eagle – come in, spinner

Time to get a real lawyer!

 

[Gibbsy]

Time to get a real lawyer!

Haha, I knew you were going to say something like that!

philcara16 you're a law student who's into footy jumpers... no idea how much stuff on IP you've done though

 

[Hank93]

Aaah yes, the AFL - self-appointed guardians of the game's history... when there's a dollar to be had.

They really have no shame; back in the early days of footyjumpers.com they tried the bully-boy tactics, demanding Mero stop using their IP and threatening further action, eventually backing down because a) it's a not-for-profit, historical site, and b) at that time the site didn't actually feature any of their logos or trademarks.

Mero was allowed to continue and the site grew into what we know today. What he wasn't told was that the AFL now saw the site as a free resource they could exploit as they wished; the AFL marketing department even advised a researcher to go through FJ.com and take whatever pics he needed!

Now they've decided to step it up and lock in all club jumpers since establishment as part of their retro licencing campaign.

The latest insult? The Heritage Style Guide issued to the clubs features numerous images from FootyJumpers.com - all uncredited of course...

View attachment 247805

View attachment 247808

(notice they are too lazy - or is that arrogant? - to even change the numbers from the 22 that appears on every jumper on FootyJumpers.com)

-------------------------

Mero's images go uncredited and yet they credit EVERY other source used in the style guide...

View attachment 247812


View attachment 247813
View attachment 247815
This is just the latest example of the AFL exploiting the history of the game for their financial gain, lazily cherry-picking the parts they can squeeze dollars out of while ignoring anything non-AFL... you know, all that stuff that tells the full story of our game and reminds future footy fans that our game didn't just start in 1897 when the VFL was formed and that the SANFL, WAFL, VFA and Tassie leagues were all a key part of footy's history, not just the AFL feeder comps they've become today.

While Mero (footyjumpers.com), John Devaney (fullpointsfooty.net / footyflashbacks.com), Jeff Hulls (afltables.com), Adam Cardosi, Andrew Gigacz and co. (australianfootball.com), the team at blueseum.org, Supermercado (demonwiki.org), Ric Gauci (waflfootyfacts.com), Ken Mansell & Michael Riley (boylesfootballphotos.net.au), Damien Green, Col Hutchison, Michael Roberts, James Hothersall, Ross Smith, yours truly (hardballget.net) and many others passionately research the game, the AFL licensing department swoops and plunders.

The AFL loves to trot out their slogan "Australia's Game" - their Heritage Style Guide shown above is plastered with it - and yet their behaviour towards Mero reveals their true motivation.

Other than a few truly committed individuals within the league offices who see the bigger picture, the rest are marketing and PR types with an eye on the next big TV deal - they have no real interest in the history of "Australia's Game".

So, it's time AFL. You wanted to be the guardians of our great game's history - this is the perfect time to prove it. Forget marketing spin such as "the year of the fan" or "improved matchday experience" and join forces with the fans that are actually doing the historical research you are not interested in doing yourself.

You can start by purchasing Mero's site then using the material there to truly promote the game. If you can't bring yourself to do that, at least acknowledge him as the source of 'your' research.

I'd like to see that...

Wow. So not only are they blocking people like Mero from gaining info from clubs to draw up jumpers, they're stealing all his images too.

Staggering.

 

[Full Wingspan]

Haha, I knew you were going to say something like that!

philcara16 you're a law student who's into footy jumpers... no idea how much stuff on IP you've done though

I enrolled in IP this year but I am not due to start it yet!

It is a relatively modern area of law and is very difficult.

If my studies to date serve any usefulness, the first step would be to remove any sources of profit that are derivitive of IP that is not yours.

 

[TheLoungeLizard]

I enrolled in IP this year but I am not due to start it yet!

It is a relatively modern area of law and is very difficult.

If my studies to date serve any usefulness, the first step would be to remove any sources of profit that are derivitive of IP that is not yours.

DO you think, with your basic knowledge, that Mero could have a case against the AFL?

 

[Full Wingspan]

DO you think, with your basic knowledge, that Mero could have a case against the AFL?

No idea to be honest. IP law is a very complex and dynamic area of law.

What could tell you is that there would probably be no litigation. The AFL with its large financial resources would just about force Mero to succumb to their demands.

Hopefully the common sense result prevails and people power wins. Petitioning and publicity is probably the only thing in his favour - get a petition signed, send the story to news outlets and hope the media go for the David v Goliath angle and pressure the AFL to work with him rather than against him.

 

[Gibbsy]

Any update on this Mero? I've been trawling old threads ahead of the upcoming board awards and this one piqued my interest. I hope the AFL have backed off.

 

[Mero]

Any update on this Mero? I've been trawling old threads ahead of the upcoming board awards and this one piqued my interest. I hope the AFL have backed off.

The lady who was driving it is off on maternity leave, though clubs are supposed to have their information back to the AFL by the beginning of next season.
So far, Collingwood, Brisbane, Essendon and North have contacted me to discuss the research Rainier Wolfcastle and I have done for the site.
It's definitely proceeding, but I'm not sure how quickly.

 

[SFgiant]

The lady who was driving it is off on maternity leave, though clubs are supposed to have their information back to the AFL by the beginning of next season.
So far, Collingwood, Brisbane, Essendon and North have contacted me to discuss the research Rainier Wolfcastle and I have done for the site.
It's definitely proceeding, but I'm not sure how quickly.

Do we know the AFL's motivations? Is it purely for selling merchandise or are they also putting together their own website?

They have included heaps of Ebbets Field Flannels pictures in that 'mood board', so it looks as if they've taken a leaf from their book. What's mildly infuriating for me is that the AFL has decided to ditch the whole idea of accurately replicating the old jumper designs, something Ebbets Field is crazy about. Just take a look at this Guernsey, there is nothing vintage about it. It looks like something from Bali with its lack of pinstripes and the inclusion of stickman.

 

[Mero]

Do we know the AFL's motivations? Is it purely for selling merchandise or are they also putting together their own website?

They have included heaps of Ebbets Field Flannels pictures in that 'mood board', so it looks as if they've taken a leaf from their book. What's mildly infuriating for me is that the AFL has decided to ditch the whole idea of accurately replicating the old jumper designs, something Ebbets Field is crazy about. Just take a look at this Guernsey, there is nothing vintage about it. It looks like something from Bali with its lack of pinstripes and the inclusion of stickman.

I think they've noticed a few people have set up stores on CafePress and similar websites and there's an interest in old logos.
Realistically they don't own the actual logo, but they own the association with the club.
So they have them taken down, however this would mean they collect all the logos, copyright them, and probably give access to them to their existing manufacturers.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Heard anything post the new year break Mero ?

 

[SgtSchulz]

I sense a whitewash of Port's SANFL guernseys.

Port Powa 1997 tm AFL

 

[Mero]

Heard anything post the new year break Mero ?

No.
I imagine it will be a gradual process.

 

[JD Tomahawk]

Can't believe this. So typical of people in power. I remember scrolling through the fj website years before I signed up to big footy thinking how the hell did people do all this. At the time I thought maybe the images were just taken from various sights. Since joining BF I've come to realise how hard Mero and others have worked to create these guernseys and logos and protect the history of our great game! Whatever happens people who know won't forget. A job well done mate.

 

[wizardwaffle]

Whatever the AFL does, footyjumpers.com has to survive. Just for the reason that the AFL may put their spin on the history of the game, we should keep it as a record what "Really" happened.

With the pictures of jumpers on the site, I would place a watermark on all of them so that every image that Mero has done can be linked to back to Mero. The fact that all the images on the Heritage Style Guide provided by Rainier Wolfcastle has Mero's number 22, it isn't something that will stop them. A watermark on the jumper would make it hard for them to copy what is on the site without having someone having to remove the watermark. They should at least acknowledge the work that Mero has done on these images over the years that he has done it.