The Non-Essendon Thread

[Burzum]

I drifted off at work the other day, just for something different.

Started thinking that with our winning culture back, an envious coaching team, and brand new facilities on the way, how players will more than likely start eyeballing us during trade season.

Goddard looks disinterested, Dangerfield's being wasted away from Victoria for the Crows, Cyril's return to Essendon would be more likely with "the old Essendon" back.

Just imagine....

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[BOMBERS 4 LIFE!!!!]

Never fails to amuse me

 

[The House]

3rd after Round 7? Do we really care that much? I mean, really...

To put it into perspective Team Judd have the BYE next weekend followed by a meeting with Geelong. On tonight's evidence they probably should consider not rocking up.

Still can't believe how overrated Carton are - seems most experts think they're a lock for top 4 and will challenge come September.

My analysis on Carlton is this:

Very good at most things, and do so consistently....work rate, organisation structurally, and have made great strides to address SOME of the physical inferiority that they had in the forward and backlines by getting bigger bodies in there.....Duigan is a very impressive addition, and Jamison has improved yet again this year for example.

But reality is that now more than ever, decision making and skill execution is more important than it used to be, as the defensive organisation of the better sides demands it to be so.....Carlton are desperately lacking in this, the most important of areas, and this is exactly why Carlton will make up numbers in the 8 yet again despite their consitent dominance against the bottom 10 or so sides.

Again to reiterate, skill execution and decision making are key to complimenting a physically intense and well organised defensively structured side.....of course a good side can have a couple of blokes that primarily bring other talents to the table, but the stark reality is that as Carlton and the rest of the footy world will discover in time (despite popular opinion), is Carlton have FAR too many regular senior players that they rely on, that simply don't have good decision making or skill execution for this standard.

If you're unsure of what i'm getting at, pay close attention to the disposal and decisions made by the following for 3 or 4 weeks and get back to me

- namely: Carrazzo, Robinson, Simpson, O'Hailpen, Waite (again had 5 clangers by mid point of 3rd quarter to undoe his good work again), Armfield, Bower, Thornton, Henderson, Walker, Collins, Hampson and McLean all have sub standard consistency of what is considered to be basic skills, and yet are all almost certainly amongst their best 30 players, and in most cases regular senior players.

Yes they have enough positves including attitude, fitness, size and work rate/intensity to make the 8 and look impressive to most of the footy sheep who repeat each other's opinions ad nausiem at times, but if i'm positive about one thing in footy right now, it is that they simply do not have the polish amongst any realistic combination of their best 22 to actually challenge any of the top 6 sides come September - simply making up the numbers as they have the last 2 years, and will continue to do so until they somewhat turn over a fair portion of their less skilled players for some polish that will make thier 22 with some level of regularity.




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[Slattery_20]

The way I read it - 2nd and 4th last year were Dogs & Saints. Gawn and gawn.
Hawks (7th) are jogging on the spot, maybe a couple up, maybe a couple down.
Someone's gotta be top 4. It's not a question of "most elitest" it's a question of winning games.

Why not Blues? They've been more convincing - or rather, less unconvincing - than Freo so far, more wins on the board than all bar 2...

 

[Kong]

Carlton have impressed me once this year, and that was against Sydney.

At no other point have they looked a top four side

The thing is, as you say, it's Collingwood and Geelong, and then any two of Carlton, Essendon, Fremantle, Hawthorn, Sydney.

I've stated previously that 4th has basically made up the numbers for the last 4 or 5 years. I suspect that'll be the case again.

 

[lamaros]

Now why the hell would we do that?

The way I figure it, we have to give away our first pick pretty much to get him if we finish decently, as he is rated as a first rounder and someone else would put theirs forward. So if we could trade our first few picks for a genuine star then we'd get to pick him up with a 3rd or 4th rounder.

Of course, pretty sure you can't trade future draft picks, so it's all moot...

Regarding the top four. Carlton are decent and are clear top 6 material from what I have seen this year, and I have been watching a heap of games.

They can be very poor and very good, but they are good more often than other sides and they have some quality players. If they had kicked straight on Monday night they'd have demolished St. Kilda like we did.

That said, I think we're a better side with more positives. They rely more on individuals to get them over the line; when Judd, Gibbs, Murphy and Garlett don't fire they struggle. We are much more even, outside of (soon to be Brownlow medal winner) Jobe Watson. Plus we have more missing from out best side at the moment - Myers, Pears, Winderlich and Dempsey being genuine best 22 players for mine - and we have better depth.

We are also a much younger side overall. The side we played against GC had an average age of 23 years - most of our side is very young, and the out and out guns aren't much older. When you look at our best 22 we have:

NLM - Fringe player
McVeigh - Good, but a role player, not key player
Hille - Bellchambers is making him look less vital every week
Fletch - Big hole to replace, but we have defensive depth with Pears, Myers, Hurley, Dempsey, Hibberd all able to slot down there at the moment if he's out of the side.

Everyone else is 26 or younger, often much younger.

 

[Kong]

Carlton have impressed me once this year, and that was against Sydney.

At no other point have they looked a top four side

The thing is, as you say, it's Collingwood and Geelong, and then any two of Carlton, Essendon, Fremantle, Hawthorn, Sydney.

I've stated previously that 4th has basically made up the numbers for the last 4 or 5 years. I suspect that'll be the case again.

Wow, I've started posting like yaco.

 

[Slattery_20]

The way I figure it, we have to give away our first pick pretty much to get him if we finish decently, as he is rated as a first rounder and someone else would put theirs forward. So if we could trade our first few picks for a genuine star then we'd get to pick him up with a 3rd or 4th rounder.

No, you can't do that. The F/S bidding is done before trade week, for one, you can't subsequently trade those picks once they are locked in. I really don't think the AFL are that stupid.

 

[Slattery_20]

Wow, I've started posting like yaco.

You're right Whomb, now you just a sidekick to agree with everything you post.... WAIT A MINUTE!!!!!

 

[lamaros]

No, you can't do that. The F/S bidding is done before trade week, for one, you can't subsequently trade those picks once they are locked in. I really don't think the AFL are that stupid.

Aye, that's why I meant future trading.

So we would go in this year at trade week to, say, Adelaide, and offer them our first and second round picks in 2012 in exchange for Dangerfield.

Then in 2012 our first pick prior to trade week would be round three, which we would use on Daniher.

Which you can't do, obviously. But I was just dreaming... I had the impression that in the past you could trade future picks? Wrong?

 

[Slattery_20]

Aye, that's why I meant future trading.

So we would go in this year at trade week to, say, Adelaide, and offer them our first and second round picks in 2012 in exchange for Dangerfield.

Then in 2012 our first pick prior to trade week would be round three, which we would use on Daniher.

Which you can't do, obviously. But I was just dreaming... I had the impression that in the past you could trade future picks? Wrong?

I'm pretty sure that even if that were the case (I think it was canvassed but didn't get up); all any club would have to do would be 'bid' a better pick (ie 1st rounder of any sort) and they'd get him under the current F/S system.

 

[Ben the Gooner]

I'm pretty sure that even if that were the case (I think it was canvassed but didn't get up); all any club would have to do would be 'bid' a better pick (ie 1st rounder of any sort) and they'd get him under the current F/S system.

Nah, we have right of reply. Look at what happened at the Dogs last year - they got Libba with a second rounder even though a first rounder was bid.

Hypothetically, if a club had their first 3 round picks stripped for cap breaches for example, and someone bid a 1st rounder for a F/S, they have the right to use their next pick - in this case a 4th rounder.

Moot point though.

 

[Slattery_20]

Nah, we have right of reply. Look at what happened at the Dogs last year - they got Libba with a second rounder even though a first rounder was bid.

Only because they had 2, that's part of the rules that they have to use their next one.
I don't think not having that pick is included in the rules and it makes some sort of sense when you think about it.

Hypothetically, if a club had their first 3 round picks stripped for cap breaches for example, and someone bid a 1st rounder for a F/S, they have the right to use their next pick - in this case a 4th rounder.

In that situation I cannot imagine that being allowed. Why would it make any sense for the AFL to take an opportunity off a club then give it straight back via the back door?
I think it'd be 'tough bikkies' in either hypothetical.

 

[yaco55]

Wow, I've started posting like yaco.

Doubt it.

Seeing that you complain about the umpires every other week.

 

[Kong]

Was referring to my posting style, rather than topic.

I was only having a laugh though.

 

[Kong]

Do umpires just refuse to call holding the ball on Harry O?

Varcoe caugh him dead and nothing. Again.

Disgraceful.

 

[Phone]

Harry O is our god silly. he can do no wrong.

 

[Colin D'Cops]

Ahh shit don't get Phone started haha.

As a side-note, I noticed Mick giving Thomas a solid spray. Probably told him, without beating around the bush, to win some contested football.

 

[Kong]

And Thomas lifts.

Selwood dominated early, Thomas on top at the moment.

Cats' early misses were always going to hurt.

 

[Burzum]

Selwood will tie with Watson for the Brownlow.

 

[Phone]

harry o will win it by 36 votes.

 

[Kong]

And then give a pretentious, self important nonsensical acceptance speech.

 

[Kong]

Well what do you know, they do call holding the ball with Harry.




When he's the tackler.

 

[Phone]

did i just see what i think i see

 

[Burzum]

menzel own swan?