Roast The worst sub performance of all time?

[Cleric]

The problem is that we've pretty much run out of decent young kids to bring in. Grigg is still kicking around in the SANFL and doing well - but he's probably tracking for a 2014 breakout season, the same as Kerridge, Lyons & Laird have enjoyed this year. It's all very well to say "revoke the gold passes", but who do you replace them with? Quite frankly, I'd rather see an out of form Reilly, Mackay and VB over an in-form Martin, Riley or Tambling.

Our lack of recruitment over the last 4 years means that we now have only 1 decent youngster left to try. The rest of them are already in the team. The alternatives are already proven failures, so bringing them in is about as effective as rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

We still have Crouch who could come in, Aiden Riley is deserving of more chances, and I really, really want to see CEY get a go. We have a number of young quality players on the edge of kicking on but the way our side is atm its hard to say "here you go Aiden, you are going to get 5 games so do your best". Its in for one game, then sub, then out.

 

[Vader]

We still have Crouch who could come in, Aiden Riley is deserving of more chances, and I really, really want to see CEY get a go. We have a number of young quality players on the edge of kicking on but the way our side is atm its hard to say "here you go Aiden, you are going to get 5 games so do your best". Its in for one game, then sub, then out.

I must admit that I forgot about Crouch. He and Grigg are the two players we have currently waiting in the wings.

CEY may yet turn out to be a good one too, but he's a long way off in the future. We all got excited by what we saw in the MMC, but the reality is that he won't be ready for an AFL debut until next year - and probably won't be ready for anything more than that until 2015 at the earliest.

I don't see Riley making it, unfortunately. He does have his strengths, but he also has his limitations. I think his limitations will mean that his AFL career is a fairly short one. Still, he's come a long way since we signed him as a NSW Scholarship holder from Wollongong all those years ago.

 

[macca23]

I agree with those who thought that Martin was a bad choice for the sub today. He's an outside running mid-fielder unsuited IMO to playing in wet slippery conditions against the intense physical game that Freo bring. Wright would have been a much better selection IMO.

He did get an acceptable amount of the ball but his disposal in general was shit.

Not his fault though - that lies with the selectors.

Unless a miracle happens between now and the end of the year, he's a likely candidate to be clipped at the end of the year IMO.

 

[weirdtim]

Who cares what you're sending it from?

Many machines automatically, and honestly put in that bit of subtext. You can delete it, but you often forget its even there.

Sent from the orgy suite of the playboy mansion using at least 10 women in despicable ways.

 

[Ravenous Crow]

This is such a harsh thread. The guy's ushered in last minute after a long absence from the AFL and given the vest of doom - tough enough having to pick up the pace of the game in the third quarter, try doing it in the middle of a tight wet and wild contest against a Ross Lyon side.

I feel like the howlers he did make were due to a lack of confidence more to a lack of skill. He actually did some good stuff too, like that mark going back with the flight (admittedly this was immediately preceding a Brent Reilly-esque howler) and I'm sure if the toepoke he did at the end rolled the other way people would see his game differently.

So no way was this the worst sub performance of all time. He wasn't even close to our worst on the day, there are far more worthy contenders in Reilly, Kerridge, Mackay, vB, Jenkins, Otten, Porps etc.

 

[Bulldocker]

Where the feck is Crouch you guys? Saw him early in the season and thought he was a gun.

 

[Kickin_Goals]

Where the feck is Crouch you guys? Saw him early in the season and thought he was a gun.

Scenic route back from hamstring injury

 

[Team DJ]

Dont shoot the golden boy Martin. At 25 he has heaps of improvement left in him

 

[King Elvis]

He might if they actually played him.

Took us 10 years to find a spot for Reilly, Doughty was average for most of his career.

Still has a chance

 

[beartoo]

Martin had 9 possessions in about 30% game time. Extrapolate that to 100% game time and he has around 30 possessions and is no doubt in our best players. His disposal efficiency was at 44.4%, Porps was at 26.7, Jenkins, Reilly and Kerridge around 50%. The conditions were bad and this bloke comes on in the third after many months out of AFL, and the BF 'experts' give him a spray.
Haters gotta hate.

 

[King Elvis]

Strong rebuttal bear, agreed.

 

[xchadders]

i dont blame him totally for his bad performance. tough game to come into. he had the chance to stand up though and didnt grasp it.

that said, the whole sub thing is rough on the player coming on. everyone spends have the game calling for player x,y,z to get subbed off due to poor performance, then when it happens everyone spends the next half of the game complaining about the subbed on player. its lose-lose unless they give an amazing half game.

 

[Mr_Moogle]

Martin had 9 possessions in about 30% game time. Extrapolate that to 100% game time and he has around 30 possessions and is no doubt in our best players. His disposal efficiency was at 44.4%, Porps was at 26.7, Jenkins, Reilly and Kerridge around 50%. The conditions were bad and this bloke comes on in the third after many months out of AFL, and the BF 'experts' give him a spray.
Haters gotta hate.

Agreed. We should only drop players who have had a good run of games and keep delivering sub standard performances. Martin doesn't fall into that category. He's been given very few opportunities.

 

[CrowCro]

Martin had 9 possessions in about 30% game time. Extrapolate that to 100% game time and he has around 30 possessions and is no doubt in our best players. His disposal efficiency was at 44.4%, Porps was at 26.7, Jenkins, Reilly and Kerridge around 50%. The conditions were bad and this bloke comes on in the third after many months out of AFL, and the BF 'experts' give him a spray.
Haters gotta hate.

As everyone knows I am a fan of martin and this is based on SANFL games I have seen him play, training and early Crows games when he was shown some faith and played in right position.

Todays performance was not a good one for Martin as people will only remember his disposal errors although we had Brown kick two out on the full and Lyons and Thommo had some terrible kicks today. But once again Martin is the sacrificial lamb of the interchange bench and once again he is put ion the back lines- his style of play has a degree of risk taking about it thats why I have always said he is a mid or a forward, but he needs to play a whole game. Yesterday he played a quarter and seven mins to be exact and as with reilly when disposal errors are made in defensive half people are more critical.

I would rather he not play than constantly play in this role, it only serves to ruin a players confidence and nothing more. A player needs four quarters to be able to redeem himself etc. His third quarter he had 2 touches at 100% kicking efficiency and then last quater two of his disposals were not good although the second one Thommo thought the ball was going to travel further than it did against the wind thus did not go up for the contest and Fyfe judged the flight alot better. Martin has good attributes but just needs to learn to take more safe options and kick long to a contest rather than trying to pinpoint players with precise passes especially in wet weather. He did however have two clearances from the centre , one shot at goal and a strong mark in defence in a quarter of football and nine disposals, however he will be remembered for two poor kicks (which didnt result in goals) much like Brent Reilly always is regardless of all the releiving marks he takes for us in defence. Kerridge , Brown, Porps played whole games and other than one quarter could not even get near the ball so this is what I mean players need to be given a chance of successive games and minutes to make an impact and find their feet.

 

[amer]

Substitution is not a natural football role. Very artificial and many players would not perform if asked. Not a relevant measure of a player.

 

[TheLeftFist8]

With Mackay likely an out, Martin should get a crack at his role for a fortnight.

 

[FR0GGY]

I fail to see the logic for posters that keep stating he isn't suited to these conditions?

Football is a winter sport, its likely during winter it will rain and be windy, do we only pick him when we play at the dome?

Do we list on the team sheets

Late Out: B.Martin (Weather)

Stop making excuses...

Isn't that what it would have shown last week? Mckernan (weather)
Also you can turn that shitty message off, from tapatalk.

 

[Thylacinus]

With Mackay likely an out, Martin should get a crack at his role for a fortnight.

No, spare us please!

 

[Thylacinus]

I agree with those who thought that Martin was a bad choice for the sub today. He's an outside running mid-fielder unsuited IMO to playing in wet slippery conditions against the intense physical game that Freo bring. Wright would have been a much better selection IMO.

He did get an acceptable amount of the ball but his disposal in general was shit.

Not his fault though - that lies with the selectors.

Unless a miracle happens between now and the end of the year, he's a likely candidate to be clipped at the end of the year IMO.

This is exactly how I see th ings. Why on earth did Martin come in to a game in these conditions ahead of Wright who is made for them. Sando definitely showing he is human after all.

 

[Godallblighty]

Martin offers little and always will.

So, fair to say it wasn't exactly this game that determined your opinion of him?

 

[Mattrox]

This is exactly how I see th ings. Why on earth did Martin come in to a game in these conditions ahead of Wright who is made for them. Sando definitely showing he is human after all.

Not exactly a fair comment. Plenty (2 or 3 but it seems like more) have been pushing heavily to see Martin play.

I'm really surprised he did so badly, I think he is a better player than that, but I think he might have just confirmed he is a depth player.

 

[Vader]

Not exactly a fair comment. Plenty (2 or 3 but it seems like more) have been pushing heavily to see Martin play.

I'm really surprised he did so badly, I think he is a better player than that, but I think he might have just confirmed he is a depth player.

There are plenty of things to be said in Martin's defence.

Firstly, he was only called up at the last minute, when the weather made McKernan's selection untenable. Mentally he would have been preparing for a very different contest - Sturt vs Norwood. Do not underestimate how much of the game is played above the shoulders.

Secondly, this was his first game at the AFL level in more than 2 months. It takes most players a while to adjust to the increased tempo of AFL football, particularly when coming up from the lower leagues.

Thirdly, he came into the game relatively late (just before 3/4 time). He was expected to fire from the first minute he hit the ground, without having time to work himself into the game as the other players had. Reilly didn't have a touch in the first quarter, Martin had 9 in the short period of time that he was on the ground.

Finally, Martin is just flat out unsuited to both the Freo game plan and the weather conditions. He's an outside runner, playing in a game where the ball moved only grudgingly from one contest to the next and clean skills counted less than determination and willingness to get one's hands dirty.

Don't get me wrong - I still think he's nothing more than a depth player, who will never be a "best 22" player. I just don't think he should be judged based solely on his performance last Saturday.

 

[Godallblighty]

Wow, Vader, given how disparaging you have been of Martin, that is an outstandingly fair-minded post.

 

[AFC979810]

There are plenty of things to be said in Martin's defence.

Firstly, he was only called up at the last minute, when the weather made McKernan's selection untenable. Mentally he would have been preparing for a very different contest - Sturt vs Norwood. Do not underestimate how much of the game is played above the shoulders.

Secondly, this was his first game at the AFL level in more than 2 months. It takes most players a while to adjust to the increased tempo of AFL football, particularly when coming up from the lower leagues.

Thirdly, he came into the game relatively late (just before 3/4 time). He was expected to fire from the first minute he hit the ground, without having time to work himself into the game as the other players had. Reilly didn't have a touch in the first quarter, Martin had 9 in the short period of time that he was on the ground.

Finally, Martin is just flat out unsuited to both the Freo game plan and the weather conditions. He's an outside runner, playing in a game where the ball moved only grudgingly from one contest to the next and clean skills counted less than determination and willingness to get one's hands dirty.

Don't get me wrong - I still think he's nothing more than a depth player, who will never be a "best 22" player. I just don't think he should be judged based solely on his performance last Saturday.

Agree with most of your post, but disagree with the bolded bits. Feel he would have known he was a genuine chance to play from about Wednesday onwards (he definitely knew he wasn't playing for Sturt when they announced him as an out on Thursday). The weather was forecast to be wet and windy all week and you would (or should) think the coaches would have told him he was a good chance to come in. This wasn't a last minute call up - he would have had, at absolute minimum, 48 hours to mentally prepare.

 

[Vader]

Agree with most of your post, but disagree with the bolded bits. Feel he would have known he was a genuine chance to play from about Wednesday onwards (he definitely knew he wasn't playing for Sturt when they announced him as an out on Thursday). The weather was forecast to be wet and windy all week and you would (or should) think the coaches would have told him he was a good chance to come in. This wasn't a last minute call up - he would have had, at absolute minimum, 48 hours to mentally prepare.

McKernan was named in the 22 as of last Thursday. That means that Martin had less than 48hrs notice. He may have been told that there was a chance he'd play, if the weather turned out to be as bad as was forecast, but I doubt they made the final decision until Friday afternoon at the earliest - giving him a maximum of 24hrs to prepare. The rest of the team would have been preparing mentally, knowing roughly who their opponents would have been and what sort of game to expect, from the moment that the North Melbourne autopsy was completed.