Unsuccessful Freo people in charge of Freo

[The Feeder Club]

The landscape has changed, the quick turn arounds don't happen anymore unless you get extremely lucky and have a solid older core. 3 experienced players is not enough, you need 7-10.

We make top 4 in 2024 + win a flag in 2025. The main and most important target is reached. If we make finals consistently and then win a flag in 2027 no one will be complaining that it took a bit longer except the sad sacks who just whine about life in general.

It's that sneaky changing landscape's fault that we're off track, got it.

 

[Purple Suit]

It's that sneaky changing landscape's fault that we're off track, got it.

It's what happens when you miss a target, you make a new one and go for that. Their main target is still achievable so we stay the course while not trading everything to try and get a flag by 2025. I hope we go to the draft with 3 firsts next season because Amiss, Jackson and Treacy all fire.

Keep drafting, keep the core, trade players who want to leave. Since our drafting and development is A grade, we are slowly getting better while losing players and gaining more currency, we're the John West of the AFL but the ones we have kept haven't hit their prime yet.

 

[The Feeder Club]

It's what happens when you miss a target, you make a new one and go for that. Their main target is still achievable so we stay the course while not trading everything to try and get a flag by 2025. I hope we go to the draft with 3 firsts next season because Amiss, Jackson and Treacy all fire.

Keep drafting, keep the core, trade players who want to leave. Since our drafting and development is A grade, we are slowly getting better while losing players and gaining more currency, we're the John West of the AFL but the ones we have kept haven't hit their prime yet.

Can agree on drafting being our strength and therefore let's keep the three firsts for next year, unless live on draft night this year there is a player we really rate that somehow slips into the range where we can trade for that pick live. Do not trade them before draft night.

 

[anchor man]

I know I bang on about us being the only club not wanted by all that we affect, like the AFL, the WAFL the WAFC.
Even though we have people that get appointed to our board etc, they have to be okayed by the WAFC. They dictate.
But to me the one thing we lack or have lacked is a mast head,a person that will stand up and be seen as being on the front foot for the club, all the time.The Melbourne based clubs are always whinging and bitching to the AFL for extras. They beat the drum all the time.There was no greater moaner or whinger than Eddie for Collingwood.We need someone like that to beat our drum.
We are in no worse or better situation than Melbourne were for the last 25 years before the AFL stepped in, appointed a head of football, appointed a coach. All free of charge to the MFC.
North Melbourne have been on the teat of the VFL/AFL since before the start of what was supposed to be the Australian Rules Football league.
Look at them now, a coach that the entire AFL see as the Messiah. They have been handed yet another raft of choice selections to do what ever they want to do with them. And all this is without asking, Just getting the Messiah to coach them.IF, they did not do that, the AFL, I mean, maybe just maybe , The Messiah may just not be as good as everyone says he is.
Oh for Fremantle to have that sort of priveledge.
We have a vision , a vision that ever so many of our "supporters have laughed at. We need some form of way out of where we are as a club. A club that everyone, including ever so many of our supporters, see us as being a drop kick club to be laughed at.
Maybe our vision will not work out, but we could not and can not continue to go down the path when we get close to making finals, we are never allowed to use the F word.
A drum banger who is constantly pounding and berating the AFL and WAFC for a decent shot at being a football club that all will respect.
Who that is, I have no idea, but we need to be heard, not just now and then, but at every turn of the clock. Become a club of whingers if necessary to gain success.
Silence ain't golden in the world of the Boys Club of the AFL.

 

[Halfbaked]

https://archive.li/9Zf94#selection-1377.0-1385.109

At least Dale Alcock is gone now. God knows how anyone would side with him over Ross Lyon when it comes to football.
Dale Alcock isn't an elite home builder. He builds basic, easy houses for the masses. It's no wonder we've gotten rid of players like Hogan, Matera, Mccarty etc. If they were brickies, Alcock wouldn't give a rats that they might be the best, he wants easy to deal with brickies not champions.


How will Alcock be remembered as a Freo president? What has he achieved?

You do realise ABN is was the second biggest house builder in Australia in 2021 and had a slight drop to the 4th biggest in 2022.
He also has a successful construction company.
I'm not sure what type of housing he builds has to do with being a good at running a business. However he does have company that sells up market housing as well.

(It's no wonder we've gotten rid of players like Hogan, Matera, Mccarty.) Maybe if we didn't employ self entitled *wicks like Hogan and Mccarty in the first place life would be better.
Edit: the ABN GROUP turned over 966 million last year.
When get someone of Alcock's standing into your club we as supporters should embrace his efforts .
Off field we were/are in very good financial position.

 

[Bud]

Dale Alcock is a grubby little man who has sought the position of President to further his own ambition and status.. if you reflect on his legacy.. very poor .. limited finals .. lost a lot of good players.. to let Lachie Neale

9

Lachie Neale

Age

30

Ht

178cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

27.0

5star

K

11.5

4star

HB

15.5

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

3.7

5star

CL

5.9

5star

D

28.3

5star

K

13.9

5star

HB

14.4

5star

M

4.6

4star

T

4.0

5star

CL

5.9

5star

D

12.0

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

7.4

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

1.0

3star

CL

0.4

3star

leave and win two brownlows as well as the other countless players.. he never played football at any level .. has no sense of what makes a good football club great..go back to bricklaying.. happy to see the back of him

 

[Halfbaked]

Dale Alcock is a grubby little man who has sought the position of President to further his own ambition and status.. if you reflect on his legacy.. very poor .. limited finals .. lost a lot of good players.. to let Lachie Neale leave and win two brownlows as well as the other countless players.. he never played football at any level .. has no sense of what makes a good football club great..go back to bricklaying.. happy to see the back of him

 

[ubiquitous226]

Dale Alcock is a grubby little man who has sought the position of President to further his own ambition and status.. if you reflect on his legacy.. very poor .. limited finals .. lost a lot of good players.. to let Lachie Neale leave and win two brownlows as well as the other countless players.. he never played football at any level .. has no sense of what makes a good football club great..go back to bricklaying.. happy to see the back of him

Yeah can't believe he let Lachie Neale win two brownlows, what a grub.

 

[sumavich]

Harsh on Dale Alcock there!
I'm more talking about Peter Bell, successful at Norf, not at Freo, made a Prelim but got beat.
Longmuir, hugely talented, but injuries ruined his career.
Unfortunately, Freo has only been moderately successful when outsiders were in control. Rosich was originally from West Coast, and Ross was from everywhere else. I liked he hated West Coast too

 

[poshman]

Murphy has top be looked at and another line coach brought in.

JL is under pressure going into the season and based on results Bell has had one good year in his time here. The CEO, Board and new president need to look at him very closely this season.

 

[Dockeroo]

Saw this clip recently and it just reminded me of freo and the dynamic right now between the FFC and the big eastern states clubs. No one takes Freo seriously for a reason - we have done nothing in a very long time to indicate we should be taken anyway seriously.

We are a long way off in my opinion, despite the young talent we have accumulated. It’s a good starting point but That’s only about 10% of the total equation. What about the other 90?

 

[anchor man]

You do realise ABN is was the second biggest house builder in Australia in 2021 and had a slight drop to the 4th biggest in 2022.
He also has a successful construction company.
I'm not sure what type of housing he builds has to do with being a good at running a business. However he does have company that sells up market housing as well.

(It's no wonder we've gotten rid of players like Hogan, Matera, Mccarty.) Maybe if we didn't employ self entitled *wicks like Hogan and Mccarty in the first place life would be better.
Edit: the ABN GROUP turned over 966 million last year.
When get someone of Alcock's standing into your club we as supporters should embrace his efforts .
Off field we were/are in very good financial position.

Totally agree. We have build one of his homes and are more than happy with what we built over 20 years ago.
Some people will moan for the sake of moaning and whinge because they can.
Some are still stuck back in the early days of our club and will, never wish us a winning year.

 

[Freomaniac]

I don't like to make excuses BUT, FACT, we are a young, inexperienced team. No-one can dispute that in 2023 we have shown good signs of what we are capable of but just can't string it together.
SO, we have to give the Bell/Longmuir team 2024.
If we are still shite this time next year then it is right that we should be looking for a new coach and Belly should probably put his hand up to say he shouldn't be in charge of the looking.

The young and experience player excuse can only be used for so long.

We just endured a 6 year period of no finals from 2016-21. Unfortunately this is the dockers. All teams will have down periods.

I am a dockers fan since late 2001 to early 2002 and I am realistic.

I get copped a lot for saying this. If the dockers mens side ever have a sustained finals run or at least make finals for 2 years in a row... it should be celebrated as an accomplishment like winning a flag or making a grand final.

That is how low my bar and expectation is.

Look at freos history from 1995-2023: of the 29 years freo has been in the AFL, only 8 of those years have made finals: 2003, 2006, 2010, 2012, 2013, 2014 , 2015 and 2022. Only once has freo had a sustained run of finals or at least 2 years in a row. That was 2012-15 under Ross Lyon.

I wished freo make finals in 1997, 2004, 2005 and 2021. That would of meant 3 things....

1. Instead of waiting until 2003 or in our 9th season of the AFL, had we made it in 1997, it would be in our only 3rd year in the comp. Just like the crows in 1993 and Port in 1999. Had we made finals in 1997, Neesham might of still got sacked in 1998 anyway with that 5 win season.

2. Adding 2004, 2005 and 2021 finals means it wont be just 2012-15 we made finals. That means we would of had a sustained finals run in 2003-6 and 2021-22 as well. So instead of 8 years out of 29 years of finals, it would of been 10 or 11 or 12 years instead.

3. had we made finals in 2021, I think some things could of changed. Yeah it would only be 5 years of no finals from 2016-20. I think some players would of got extensions at the end of 2021 like Griffin Logue if he thought sustained finals success was close.

 

[poshman]

Bell being moved out of football is good news imo.

2024 shapes as our most interesting season since 2015. No more excuses with the midfield and we can expect growth from Amiss, Jackson and Treacy up front.

Less than 12 wins and we need to move Longmuir on.
More than 3 losses at home and we need to move him on.

 

[CapitalA]

The club has three distinct eras:

• Lots of poor decisions era
• Steve Harris era
• Lots of poor decisions era Mk II

Edit - didn't realise I was bumping an old thread. it came up as a thread title on bottom of screen.

Pretty sure the lots of poor decisions era mkII is also the Steve Harris era (the end of it).

 

[Paracleet]

Bell being moved out of football is good news imo.

2024 shapes as our most interesting season since 2015. No more excuses with the midfield and we can expect growth from Amiss, Jackson and Treacy up front.

Less than 12 wins and we need to move Longmuir on.
More than 3 losses at home and we need to move him on.

Wins is a bit binary. What happens if we finish 11 - 12, but with a % of 110 and three losses by a point after kicking 12.25? Is that really worse than 12 - 11 and a percentage of 90?

To my mind the former would indicate a stronger trajectory.

 

[poshman]

Wins is a bit binary. What happens if we finish 11 - 12, but with a % of 110 and three losses by a point after kicking 12.25? Is that really worse than 12 - 11 and a percentage of 90?

To my mind the former would indicate a stronger trajectory.

I think the home record is also an important input.

Sure - there may be outlying exemptions that can be discussed on review. The stated minimum aim should be clear and easy to understand.

If we finish with 9 wins and 3 draws would also be a possible exception. The review should be informed by outliers but the goals shouldn't.

 

[Freomaniac]

Not sure what you are on about. It's already failed. The strategy commenced in 2016 was to rebuild/restructure the list around a generational talent in Fyfe so that we could compete again whilst he was still a force. Hence 'no reason not to win a flag by 2020', and then 'three prelims and a flag by 2025'. It's dead, this year was the nail in the coffin and we're in post fail mode, which god knows if we manage to keep all the young talent and get a proper coach might just work in the end, but it isn't the strategy we had in 2016. That one is deader than a dodo.
Fyfe lucked out, sure he was handsomely rewarded financially but I bet he's looking back wistfully on 2017 when he re-signed because he was sold a pup

I knew when the Freo board Said the dockers mens side had to make 3 prelims and a flag by 2025, I knew that was either unrealistic or next to impossible. Consider this.... From 1995-2023, dockers only made 3 prelim finals in that 29 year stretch: 2006, 2013 and 2015.

Had it included the Docker ladies side, I would of thought that was more realistic. I half expected the Dockers AFLW side to make 2 out of those 3 prelims by 2025 off the back of their decent 2020 season in which the Ladies were robbed of a home prelim and possibly even a Flag in the AFLW.

 

[Dormammu]

The CEO, Board and new president need to look at him very closely this season.

First they'll need to get some proper fitting spectacles. And then an intensive course on corporate governance.

Because a chronic, debilitating cause of our problems stem from the quality of our board. Some have been passionate but incompetent, others skilled but uncommitted as they sought the limelight rather than doing the hard yards. There's been sycophants and lone wolves, and most have been unwilling to challenge the dominant, usually wealthy alpha-dogs (Hart, Schwab, Harris, Alcock, Rosich) as they freely breached their remits.

Aside from Grist and Hall (and possibly Mann) the current batch is particularly disheartening, with Alcock having successfully achieved his goals of divesity and inclusiveness instead of the meritocracy that characterises successful sporting clubs.

Yet it gets worse, for then he and the grossly inexperienced Bell combined to kill off the members right to vote in two of their own members. Not only was this right the only key defining characteristic of Fremantle to all other clubs (often poorly exercised, as evidenced by Bell's successful candidancy, but better than nothing), but it was accompanied by the announcement that existing directors (no doubt with a little help from our Programmed sponsors) would be the ones selecting their mates any new board members.

So now we have our own Purple Circle, with no chance of independent thinkers or fresh views; no hard questions, zero accountability and absolutely no transparency.

sumavich is very, very close to, but not quite on the money.

 

[poshman]

First they'll need to get some proper fitting spectacles. And then an intensive course on corporate governance.

Because a chronic, debilitating cause of our problems stem from the quality of our board. Some have been passionate but incompetent, others skilled but uncommitted as they sought the limelight rather than doing the hard yards. There's been sycophants and lone wolves, and most have been unwilling to challenge the dominant, usually wealthy alpha-dogs (Hart, Schwab, Harris, Alcock, Rosich) as they freely breached their remits.

Aside from Grist and Hall (and possibly Mann) the current batch is particularly disheartening, with Alcock having successfully achieved his goals of divesity and inclusiveness instead of the meritocracy that characterises successful sporting clubs.

Yet it gets worse, for then he and the grossly inexperienced Bell combined to kill off the members right to vote in two of their own members. Not only was this right the only key defining characteristic of Fremantle to all other clubs (often poorly exercised, as evidenced by Bell's successful candidancy, but better than nothing), but it was accompanied by the announcement that existing directors (no doubt with a little help from our Programmed sponsors) would be the ones selecting their mates any new board members.

So now we have our own Purple Circle, with no chance of independent thinkers or fresh views; no hard questions, zero accountability and absolutely no transparency.

sumavich is very, very close to, but not quite on the money.

I agree regarding the parasitic DEI garbage. However, are there boards you look at around the league and rate?

 

[Dormammu]

I agree regarding the parasitic DEI garbage. However, are there boards you look at around the league and rate?

Good question.

Richmond. Sure, they had a bloody civil war that almost got Hardwick fired, but from the chaos they emerged with 3 flags.

Naturally, no one wants boardroom infighting like this, the results are too unpredictable, and Richmond could easily have turned out like Carlton did with their debilitating, decades-long struggle between the Mathieson and Pratt families.

But atrophy is equally fatal.

It's about balance, and this comes from good corporate govenance, which is impossible without some shareholder (fan) oversight and input. Richmond had to address this because the board contendors needed public validation from their fans, which the media willingly facilitated.

 

[Dockeroo]

Wins is a bit binary. What happens if we finish 11 - 12, but with a % of 110 and three losses by a point after kicking 12.25? Is that really worse than 12 - 11 and a percentage of 90?

To my mind the former would indicate a stronger trajectory.

I’d agree wins alone are too simplistic but poshman is correct overall. It will be pretty clear what the overall vibe is by then end of the season even if the W:L ratio looks ok on paper.
For example - if we are out of contention for finals by Round 15 or so like this year and win a few games late in the season when there’s no pressure on to fluff up our overall season record, that could create a potentially fake illusion we are going places.
I want to see this team winning important high pressure games that matter. Early and mid season, when everyone is still in strong contention.
Games we expect to win - we need to show up with a professional mindset and win, the classic old freo mentality of shitting the bed the moment that any sense of expectation arises, and then going away to opposition that are superior on paper for surprise wins when no one expects it (like Melbourne, Sydney and Geelong last year for example) - that is fine to a degree but we need to get beyond that as a club.
We can’t win anything meaningful or be taken seriously if we don’t put away teams that we are $1:50 to beat in Perth. Teams like Richmond and North last season as just two examples.

 

[Tonga Bob]

I'm just thankful y'all aren't talking about Snuffaluphagus Van_Dyke & I here. I'd be airing grievances like a fiend if you were.

Anyhoo, vote for your favourite game preview.

 

[MadMundy]

We'll see how things go this season, I don't think that it is time to call it a write off just yet.

 

[Freomaniac]

We'll see how things go this season, I don't think that it is time to call it a write off just yet.

2024 will be an interesting season regardless.


If Justin Longmuir and Freo doesnt make finals in 2024, Likely Justin Longmuir will be sacked. I also see the dockers got 0-5 next season too in 2024.

If Longmuir is sacked, he will be another statistic when it comes to Freo coaches. I have said the average stint or period for a freo mens coach is 5 seasons. And if you look at Freos coaches in their history, its very Accurate.

Neesham was out 1st coach that last 4 years from 1995-98.

Drum lasted 2 and a half seasons from 1999-mid 2001.

Ben Allan was an interim coach that lasted 10-12 games. So that does not count.

Chris Connolly lasted 5 and a half seasons from early 2002 to mid 2007.

Mark Harvey took over in mid 2007, got the job full time at the end of 2007 and was sacked at the end of 2011. So thats 4 and a half years there.

Ross Lyon lasted 8 seasons from 2012-19.

Justin Longmuir has been out coach since the 2nd of 2019, he has been out coach since 2020. So 2024 is his 5th season.


Its crazy that 1999-2019 stint. Drum was our worst coach and he only lasted 2 and half seasons. Ross Lyon is our best ever coach and he lasted 8 years. So thats 10 and a half years between them 2 blokes.

Then we had 2002-2011. Connolly lasted 5 and half seasons, Harvey lasted 4 and half seasons. So 10 years with them 2 blokes as well.