Voss On Vlastuin

[sabso]

No name player from a non vic club was always going to be 3 weeks

Betcha if it was a big vic player its 0 weeks

Big vic tom lynch got a week for getting pushed into shoulder contact with tom de koning

 

[Bald]

3 is correct.

 

[Tony_Clifton]

3 is correct.

If 3 is correct but the match review panel is always wrong, what ere they doing? Trolling us

 

[Bald]

If 3 is correct but the match review panel is always wrong, what ere they doing? Trolling us

I think you'd be surprised with how often people confuse how much they think the MRO is wrong, with how much they disagree with what the matrix spits out. The MRO doesn't control the parameters he must work within. There are a few unique scenarios where he is able to not grade an incident and instead send it straight to the tribunal as it goes beyond the scope of the guidelines, but I don't think that's appropriate in the Voss case.

 

[Tony_Clifton]

The system works! Huzzah

 

[My_Username]

Vlastuin confirmed broken nose.

That being the case, should be 4 to 6 weeks for Voss.

Depends on the nature of the break.

Could be a relatively minor inconvenience, or it could have him out for months.

 

[Altum Volantes]

3 is right, I doubt Freo challenge.

Wasn’t his intention but he totally clattered the guy in the face and broke his nose, so fair enough of a penalty.

 

[banzai]

I think its harsh, 2 would have been fine but id have given 1. What would they have given then if Vlastuin was concussed? 6-8? Deserves a suspension but surely it wasnt that bad.

 

[s_wd6]

It was either intentional or the guy is clumsy to the point where he should actually think about giving the game away.

3 weeks was the absolute minimum here.

He almost blinded Josh Treacy celebrating another players goal. He needs to slow down his tempo a bit. It is entertaining watching him go about it but he’s gonna find himself in trouble if he doesn’t tone it down in play.

He’s like 100kg of pure muscle. There was twice on the weekend where players tried to tackle him and he just shrugged them off his body like it was no big deal. Can’t be throwing that weight around so carelessly.

 

[BF Tiger]

So should we plan it for during the week sometime or save it up for during the return match?

Return match, but has to be first quarter.

 

[Tony_Clifton]

Return match, but has to be first quarter.

i would have gone with "expect when you least expect it" but sure 1st quarter is fine

 

[SplintWhisky]

Pretty disappointed with 3 weeks. If you've watched Freo games or know what Vossy is like there's 0 intention there to cause harm he's just looking to make a strong tackle. Voss doesn't have much going on upstairs. Thoughts with Vlaustin on the broken nose, poor bugger

I would've thought 2 down to 1 was more appropriate

Potential to cause Injury and the optics of it.

If the situation was exact same, but Voss had an open hand rather than closed fist, I would be furious if he got cited. It is literally just the balled fist that does it and for the life of me, I really don't understand why it was balled, especially as he was about to tackle.

 

[s_wd6]

Potential to cause Injury and the optics of it.

If the situation was exact same, but Voss had an open hand rather than closed fist, I would be furious if he got cited. It is literally just the balled fist that does it and for the life of me, I really don't understand why it was balled, especially as he was about to tackle.

Looks pretty open to Me. I mean the fact that he grabbed the jumper in the same motion is a good indicator it was open to start with, but this picture is very clearly an open hand.

 

[SplintWhisky]

View attachment 2283657

Looks pretty open to Me. I mean the fact that he grabbed the jumper in the same motion is a good indicator it was open to start with, but this picture is very clearly an open hand.

That is good shot. Is open hand, from what I saw on the fox footage, to me it looked like there was a fist in the beginning and that was followed all the way through.

If that was the only vision, I would say, shouldnt be suspended. I would love to see if they had video at this angle.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

That is good shot. Is open hand, from what I saw on the fox footage, to me it looked like there was a fist in the beginning and that was followed all the way through.

If that was the only vision, I would say, shouldnt be suspended. I would love to see if they had video at this angle.

Shouldn’t be suspended? You are fine with a full force swinging arm to the face of an oncoming player as long as the hand is open?

That is a suspension every day of the week, always has been, and always will be. It needs to be. You can’t allow players a free swing at an opponent’s head so long as they can say whoops, I accidentally got him a bit high. It is a classic 1970’s coat hanger. Open hand or closed fist only makes a material difference to intent. If it was deemed deliberate rather than careless the penalty would be bigger.

 

[Freddy Swift]

I’m sure there was no intended malice but it is the epitome of carelessness in my view. Three weeks might be slightly on the harsh side. I thought two would suffice.

 

[s_wd6]

I’m sure there was no intended malice but it is the epitome of carelessness in my view. Three weeks might be slightly on the harsh side. I thought two would suffice.

The grading of severe is based on the potential to cause injury rather than the actual injury in this case. Again, not sure how they decide when to use potential and when to use actual result.

Like why is Houston, throwing an elbow with his entire body weight behind him into a guys head, deemed as High impact when it has much more potential to cause a concussion than an open handed forearm to the nose/mouth?

Been seeing mixed reports on whether there was a broken nose. On the AFL site they’re saying he stayed off because of blood rule only, but on fox footy they say it was a broken nose.

Either way, judge it on the result not the potential unless you’re going to judge everything by potential, and then any hits to the head are severe.

 

[SplintWhisky]

Shouldn’t be suspended? You are fine with a full force swinging arm to the face of an oncoming player as long as the hand is open?

That is a suspension every day of the week, always has been, and always will be. It needs to be. You can’t allow players a free swing at an opponent’s head so long as they can say whoops, I accidentally got him a bit high. It is a classic 1970’s coat hanger. Open hand or closed fist only makes a material difference to intent. If it was deemed deliberate rather than careless the penalty would be bigger.

IF, IF that footage/image was the only footage that existed then I would say he shouldnt he suspended. You need to read and comprehend instead of seeing red and going off.

The totality of the video isn’t a good look as there was the hook in the arm which makes it look like a punch/strike. If he had an open palm all the way through and less of a bend in the arm then it should just be a football incident/accident and a fine or 1 week to make the statement to not do swinging arms in a tackling attempt.

 

[bzparkes]

Dunno why any footballer would be dumb enough to throw a swinging arm near the vicinity of another player's head, regardless of intention.

Pretty much exactly the same thing Scrimshaw got suspended for, for the same length.

Seems fair. One player got concussed(Scrimshaw's action) and the other had his nose plastered across his face.

 

[sherb]

Even Rugby League frowns on hits like that (swinging arm to the head). That would be sin bin minimum. (Not that RL is a guide to AFL sanctions of course).

I've got no issue with the three week penalty.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

Should have king hit the bloke then continued to pummel him whilst on his knees.
Would have got an extra week but atleast the penalty would fit the crime..

 

[Meteoric Rise]

IF, IF that footage/image was the only footage that existed then I would say he shouldnt he suspended. You need to read and comprehend instead of seeing red and going off.

The totality of the video isn’t a good look as there was the hook in the arm which makes it look like a punch/strike. If he had an open palm all the way through and less of a bend in the arm then it should just be a football incident/accident and a fine or 1 week to make the statement to not do swinging arms in a tackling attempt.

Absolutely perplexing by you SW.

That is all I will say this time.

 

[SplintWhisky]

Absolutely perplexing by you SW.

That is all I will say this time.

Do you understand thought experiments? Like at all? Are you able to understand that people are able to look at the totality of an incident and say, "If this factor was different, I think X?"

I am seriously asking because all you seem to do is see the Richmond jumper and any intellectual honesty is thrown out the window and anyone that doesn't show full throated, on the knees support for Richmond is interpreted in the least charitable way.

Lets see if this helps you understand that I am talking about a fictional scenario that add nuance to my opinion. IF Luke Skywalker initiated the tackle on Gandalf without
1. The bend in his arm; and
2. The balled fist in the beginning

I would say that it is unfortunate that Gandalf is left with a broken nose but sometimes accidents can happen and at most it would deserve something between a fine and 1 week suspension.

NOW in this situation, I think Voss having a what appears to be
1. A balled fist as the arm is swinging; and
2. A bend in the arm

It makes it look like, optically, this was an attempt at hiding a strike with a tackle. Now since I like to give players some benefit of the doubt, I will say there wasnt any malace in it. HOWEVER, I don't believe 3 is warranted. This feels like it should be a 3 down to 2 with a memo to clubs saying, "Hey, we gave some leeway on this one, but from now on, anything that looks like you tried to disguise a strike with a tackle, we will punish at 1 week minimum and then go from there, case by case."

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Do you understand thought experiments? Like at all? Are you able to understand that people are able to look at the totality of an incident and say, "If this factor was different, I think X?"

I am seriously asking because all you seem to do is see the Richmond jumper and any intellectual honesty is thrown out the window and anyone that doesn't show full throated, on the knees support for Richmond is interpreted in the least charitable way.

Lets see if this helps you understand that I am talking about a fictional scenario that add nuance to my opinion. IF Luke Skywalker initiated the tackle on Gandalf without
1. The bend in his arm; and
2. The balled fist in the beginning

I would say that it is unfortunate that Gandalf is left with a broken nose but sometimes accidents can happen and at most it would deserve something between a fine and 1 week suspension.

NOW in this situation, I think Voss having a what appears to be
1. A balled fist as the arm is swinging; and
2. A bend in the arm

It makes it look like, optically, this was an attempt at hiding a strike with a tackle. Now since I like to give players some benefit of the doubt, I will say there wasnt any malace in it. HOWEVER, I don't believe 3 is warranted. This feels like it should be a 3 down to 2 with a memo to clubs saying, "Hey, we gave some leeway on this one, but from now on, anything that looks like you tried to disguise a strike with a tackle, we will punish at 1 week minimum and then go from there, case by case."

You seem to be saying the actual incident that occurred only warrants a fine or 1 week suspension because it wasn’t something else. And it was an accident.

I disagree with both your reasoning and your recommended penalty. Careless forceful contact to the head is something the game needs to eradicate. In the event of the forceful contact not resulting from an intent to injure, don’t you think the next thing to consider is whether the player initiating that forceful contact to head could have reasonably shown more care so as to avoid the accident he caused to happen?

This is not a Richmond v the world argument. More or less everyone here is agreed bar you, even the majority of Fremantle supporters. You seemed to paint yourself into a corner with the clenched fist v open hand issue. Then when you were shown the hand was clearly open at the point of contact you appear to have felt you had to define this as some sort of acceptable football accident. It is forceful contact to the face with a swinging arm causing a blood nose/broken nose and felling the opponent. With respect, Luke Skywalker belting 7 bells out of Gandalf’s Chevy Chase has nowt to do with it.

Your position and imagery both seem odd to me.

 

[Pomsta]

Should have king hit the bloke then continued to pummel him whilst on his knees.
Would have got an extra week but atleast the penalty would fit the crime..

The funny thing is that this is the definition of a king hit (swinging a fist from behind and hitting a guy in the head) whereas the other incident wasn't.