Vote #1 Beazley!

[Mags]

God Dam It Didnt Work!

Carry On...

 

[TasSaint]

Originally posted by eastaugh36:
if it wasnt for morons like hawke and keating then I probably wouldnt have it in for labour as much, but the party would want to be alot better than it was with those turkeys in charge before I would ever consider voting for them. Uncle Buck has no idea either, Bob hawke , wasnt he the same guy in tears on tv ! lol

The funny thing about this debate is how people are devided by clubs. On a whole it seems that the melbourne essendon type supporters are real liberal lovers whats the bet they got that attitude listening to their daddys bussiness chats while wearining their little kiddy cravats. As for the Quote above. It shows just how much this country has forgotten about the other roles a leader should have. Economic policy is not the only thing a countries leader should have to offer. At least Bob showed shome passion about his job. Bob was someone who all could admire. People need to be lead, not just given the correct set of numbers to be happy.

 

[BUBBALOUIS]

At least (like the Nationals) they are honest about what they stand for.

[/B][/QUOTE]
You do make some good points, however you wont convince me about the above. What is the Nationals official policy on Telstra?

 

[TigerTank]

Bubba,

As far as I can tell, the National Party opposes the sell-off of the remainder of Telstra unless quality of service to regional Australia can be guaranteed.

But I admit I don't know all the details.


------------------
TT - Obligatory bad-tempered Richmond supporter

 

[goatmaster]

Now you can see why we need to have the principality (& Tax Haven - no millionaires just the workers) of Mooball.
The current situation of politics is deciding you like one better because they will use vaseline before they anally rape the country.

------------------
Goatmaster
the prime minister of the principality of Mooball

 

[Pessimistic]

The problem is the Press and everyone else have the mindset that liberals/conservatives are automatially good with the economy.

If labour was in power all the current dollar problems (which are mainly caused overseas anyway) would have been hung up to dry for the government.

And they have the nerve to tell us that food is cheaper - it was for about 7 days after the GST then it went up

 

[eastaugh36]

john howard is good, better than keating or hawke

 

[Same Old's]

Good at what, though.

 

[eastaugh36]

good at alot of things, such as his stance on reconciliation

 

[Danni]

His stance on reconciliation???

His stuborness is more like it....and that particular 'stance' has certainly not endeared him to millions of ppl around the country...not a very good example.

Personally, Beazley and Howard, don't endear themselves to me at all. It is almost a choice of the lesser evil, from my point of view. Tho that may be because I am very cynical about politics these days.

TigerTank, one good reason that I could never vote National, is that I have lived thru the 'Joe' years here in QLD and the aftermath of the National led National/Liberal coalition up here. It was a pure disaster.

The one thing about Labour's probs in QLD at the moment is that to many they still pale in comparision to the 30 yrs of corruption under the National/Liberal rule.

The scariest things about all the 'factionalism' and the corruption/criminal activities of the major parties, is that it opens the doors to the crack pots, like Ms Hanson and her party.

To many ppl who are disillusioned by the major parties, chose to vote for the relative unknowns without learning to much about them, now that could end up putting our country in a worse position than it is now.

 

[Frodo]

It would be nice if people started to think about political issues instead of writing copies of the verbal diahorrea we hear from left and right wing propagandists.

In February WA goes to the polls. The liberals have brought WA out of an economic mess in their 8 years and have produced great results on road developments. Their record is remarkably good. However, another issue has reared it's head. WA does not have a true democracy where each persons votes are about equal. Country people have three times the voting power of city people. Labour is promising to change this. I expect to vote Labour for this reason.

On a federal note the Ligeral Party was voted in on the GST mandate. It delivered despite the democrats getting food excluded and causing administrative burden in doing so. From a Company perspective GST is fantastic. The simplification in tax collection works like a dream. Employees can also work overtime or get promotions without having to incurr 47% tax. They actually want to do overtime and want promotion for the first time I can remember. The employees too have been wrapped in the extra money in their wage packets from tax cuts that more than offset the GST. Many countries have a GST. None have ever scrapped it. A consumption tax is good for any country, just ask Paul Keating who wanted to introduce GST years ago.
John Howard has been honest and kept his promises. We can ask no more of a politician.
Kim Beazley on the other hand has no charisma and depends upon his masters who run the trade unions. Until the Federal labour party breaks from Trade union dictatorship I cannot see anyone other than a political socialist, a gullible person, a communist, a dole bludger, lesbian, homosexual, greenie or intellectually disabled person voting for them.

 

[Danni]

Frodo - I work for a 'company' if you will, and all the GST has done for me has tri-fold the administration paperwork. On top of that, the tax concessions/rebates I used to receive have been withdrawn under the new system and replaced by a payment in the 'family payment' I recieve once a fortnight. The only thing is that I am $8 per week better off in my paypacket (I work partime), but even after the new payment in my family payment, still $27 down per week in my rebates and concessions, and now paying more for 90% of the 'services' I use.

The GST certainly hasn't had me 'wrapped in extra money' at all!

 

[Frodo]

Originally posted by Danni:
Frodo - I work for a 'company' if you will, and all the GST has done for me has tri-fold the administration paperwork. On top of that, the tax concessions/rebates I used to receive have been withdrawn under the new system and replaced by a payment in the 'family payment' I recieve once a fortnight. The only thing is that I am $8 per week better off in my paypacket (I work partime), but even after the new payment in my family payment, still $27 down per week in my rebates and concessions, and now paying more for 90% of the 'services' I use.

The GST certainly hasn't had me 'wrapped in extra money' at all!

Danni,
The beaty is that there is no paperwork. I fill in my BAS monthly. It is calculated by a standard cheap business package. I type in the figures and electronically pay my tax and that is it. Ten minutes a month maximum.

Now it may be that those who are supported by the Australian taxpayer (eg pensioners, on the dole, single parent, child care, etc) are not as well off, I don't know, but they need to remember that they are relying on charity and complaining that the charity is not as much as it used to be may not be a very persuasive argument. For example, I would heartily contribute to a person unfortunate enough to have a disability preventing them from work (such as no legs and not bad back syndrome) but I would not be happygive a cent to a single parent. ie the unfortunate are worthy, the stupid are not.

 

[Same Old's]

Originally posted by Frodo:
Kim Beazley on the other hand has no charisma

And John Howard has charisma, then.

 

[Carey_is_King]

Frodo,
You are the man !
I have a feeling we are going to be hearing from Alf "Social welfare for all" Andrews though.

------------------
Trample the Weak,
Hurdle the Dead.

 

[Carey_is_King]

Originally posted by Same Old's:
And John Howard has charisma, then.

Wake up Same Old's, it's not a popularity contest !!


------------------
Trample the Weak,
Hurdle the Dead.

 

[Same Old's]

Originally posted by Carey_is_King:
Wake up Same Old's, it's not a popularity contest !!

If you read this page correctly, Frodo was comparing Howard with Beazley. He stated that "Beazley has no charisma" and I responded by saying that neither has Howard.

 

[Danni]

Thankyou for candor Frodo.....

I am a single parent. But I am offended by the fact that you term single parents as 'stupid'.

I also work, and pay taxes. I work the equivialent of 3 full days a week, but spread the hours over 5 days so that I can take my child to school and pick him up afterwards. As he is not well and prone to stays in hospital, fulltime work is not an option for me.

I work for the State Government and the GST and the associated paperwork has trippled in the work I do. Where as I used to be able to assess an application for re-imbursment of funds to the applicant, I now have to get them to fill in a tax file number declaration, or an ABN form, as well as creating individual vendor numbers for each applicant. If I don't recieve their paperwork I then have to 'withold' a percentage of their funds and do more paperwork to send those funds to the Fed Govt. Where as before I was able to use a generic number. Each application used to take 2 weeks to from reciept of it to the cheque being sent out, now it takes about 5 - 6 weeks. That makes my life more difficult.

And pls - don't tar us all with the same brush......

 

[eastaugh36]

frodo, grow a frigging brain. Just because someone is a single parent doesnt mean they are stupid, and people who come from average families and not rich families are more often than not alot better all round people than those from rich families

 

[Frodo]

Originally posted by Danni:
Thankyou for candor Frodo.....

I am a single parent. But I am offended by the fact that you term single parents as 'stupid'.

And pls - don't tar us all with the same brush......

I'm afraid that tarring with the same brush is a fact of life!

Let's consider a single parent. There are two reasons for this normally.

1) a single girl gets pregnant.

In this day and age that is just plain stupid unless it was rape and that would be very unfortunate. I know of single girls that have got pregnant just for the pension because they don't want to work.

2) Divorce or partner seperation.

If you want children then it is your duty to prepare a good life with them. Having children without the commitment of marriage is stupid. Divorce is so often the remedy without really trying for the marriage and in particular the children. Without single parent support many more marriages would last. If the husband leaves he needs to pay for the upbringing and tot the public. If the husband dies then that is a different matter. The one thing that is for sure is that a balanced child comes from a balanced family and children of single parent upbringings are disadvantaged.

 

[Frodo]

Originally posted by Same Old's:
And John Howard has charisma, then.

Yes, I think compared to Kim Beazley he has charisma and is a leader we can be proud of.
I thought Bob Hawke had some charisma and was a leader that commanded respect worldwide as does Howard. on the other hand Keating was considered distasteful by most of the world.

 

[Ally]

Frodo, just because someone is a single parent, regardless of the circumstances doesn't mean they all get charity or want it for that matter. I am a widow and am trying the best i can to bring up my 2 children. I work for less than the minimum wage and get no help from the government whatsoever, they couldn't even get child support out of my partner, so don't try telling us life's rosey!

 

[Danni]

So are you saying that because my long term partner screwed around then left me just before the baby was born, that I should have had an abortion? stayed with him and made it work(not an option in the real world)? given the child up for adoption?

Or do the best I can by this child, by working, paying for a nice house in a good neighbourhood, sending him to private school, and raising him to be a good person?

There are no guarentees in life Frodo, except that one day we will die.

Tarring by the same brush is not a fact of life, it is a choice of ignoring the individual and remaining blissfully ignorant of what and who ppl are, just keeping them as a statistic.

Are you one who would also subscribe to the "All Aboriginals are bums and drunks", "All homosexuals are that buy choice and have aids"?, " All diabled babies should be killed at births cause they eat up the public dollars in their care"??

And just to enlighten you here are some facts:

Friend one: single parent of 1 child, she earns $37k per year and bought her own house. She gets less 'family payment' (ie govenment funds) than my neighbour whose hubby works and she stays home to look after the baby.

Friend two: single parent of 2 Children, she works 3 days per week, and also is at University, as well as volunteering at the local community centre to help those less fortunate.

Friend three: single parent of one child, she earns $32k per annum, pays full child care fees (she earns too much to get the rebate) bought her new car outright, and is in the process of applying for a home loan.

If you want someone to blame, look toward the 'absentee' parent....make them accountable for the 'use of your tax dollars', instead of the parent who is taking responsibility for their child/children, and sometimes, due to unforseen circumstances, need to rely on the welfare assistance.

Just because you know of a couple of 'cases' of what you may term abuse of the system, doesn't mean the majority are that way.

 

[Ally]

WELL SAID DANNI, U ARE AN ABSOLUTE LEGEND!!!!!!!

 

[Danni]

Oh and just to clarify a point under your beloved GST.....

It isn't the single parent's who rely on welfare that are worse off....infact they got a marked increase in their payments under the new tax system...they are up by up to $40 a week in some cases.

It is those of us who get off our butts and work instead of sitting at home collecting a full pension that are worse off with the loss of certain tax rebates.