What are we Missing

[beatlesmith]

What's the point of trading?

No point going after stop-gaps, and blue-chip mids would cost us too much.

Rebuilding through the draft is the way forward.

What about Wells?

 

[The Passenger]

i think we've got a good basis of youngsters with this group - our backline is looking very solid and should only get better.

we just need to keep pumping games and experience into our young midfielders - masten, ebert, s selwood, cockie, swift, shuey - too me they all look like they have the goods but it's just a matter of time and patience. it could take a few years.

i'm a bit concerned that in the midfield group it doesn't look like we have a pure A grade footballer - Kerr is on his day but it's clear he needs a bit of help around the packs. But the thing is players can develop at different rates and it's hard to know who will have a bit of development spurt around the age of 21, 22, 23 and take the step up to the top of the pack.

Our forward line is still disfunctional but the personnel (brown, kennedy, lecras) is there for the future.

McKinley is a concern for mine - mainly because he is so talented but he's so easy to stop. Small key forwards do not have history of success in the AFL. Russell Robertson would be the most succesful since i've been following the game and yet he averages just under 2 goals a game and has only had one 50-goal season. For all his talent and potential, that's not really that great of an output....

It seems a waste to have a guy of McKinley's talent on the sidelines but he, like robertson, is a small key forward (1.5 inches shorter actually), and likewise he can also go missing for big chunks of times (including upwards of 3 or 4 consecutive games with little output)

on the plus side mckinley's output at the same point of his career is far higher than Robertson's was (RR had 31 goals in 32 games in his first 3 seasons, BM is 61 from 29 in 2.5 seasons).

his is just a tricky situation for the match committee....

 

[BOND 007]

McKinley is tradeable and would perform OK in a team that has a reasonable support crew up forward. A straight swap for Jetta (@ Ess) would be a win-win for both clubs. If the eagles happen to win <2 more games I would also be open to moving pick 20 and Staker onto NM for Wells.
Whilst these trades would still mean another 3 player delistings (+ Fletcher), it would improve the midfield structure of the team. By keeping picks 2 and 4, it would also mean the Eagles would add 2 of Butcher, Lucas or Morabito to the squad.

 

[beatlesmith]

To answer the OP, i think the main need is experience through development, cohesion and a suitable game plan for our strengths, which we haven't worked out yet. These should all come in time.
In terms of personnel i think we lack outside polish, crumbing forwards and small stopping defenders. I am confident that Shuey, Swift and Masten, under Selwood, Priddis and Kerr will form a class inside unit.
I want to see youngstrs played in their proper positions. None of this Masten on a flank crap, i want to see his in and under work. I want to see swift in the middle weaving out of packs. I want to see hurn with some more freedom.

Going by the trend to suggest a draft/trade scheme, here it goes:
Trade Pick 36 + 52 + Staker to a retirement depleted Sydney for pick 23
Trade Mckinley + pick 23 to Carlton for pick 11
Trade Pick 11 + Pick 20 + 68 to Richmond for Deledio
Trade Seaby to Melbourne for pick 35
Trade Rosa + Pick 35 to North Melbourne for pick 25

Draft:
2- Butcher
4- Lucas
25- Jetta
PSD 2- Best available

In: Deledio (class, pace, goals), Butcher (contested marking), Lucas (kicking, goals), Jetta (crumbing), list space
Out: Mckinley, Seaby, Rosa, Fletcher (delist), Hansen (delist), Wilkes (delist)
5 out from main list, 5 in, 1 out from vets list gives us more rookie list room for crumbers and small defenders.

B: Waters-Mackenzie-Schofield
HB: Scooter-Brown-A.Selwood
C: Deledio-Masten- Hurn
HF: Lecras-Kennedy-Ebert
F: Jetta- Butcher-Naitanui

R: Cox, Lucas, Swift
INT: Kerr, Shuey, Notte, Mcginnity/Jones/Smith/Cockie (or new small defender/defensive mid)

Elaborate and incredibly unlikely, but gee that team looks good.

 

[Prem87]

Love that team. What a spectacular Midfield and Forward line!

The only problem with those trades is that Pick 11 + 20 wont be enough for Deledio. A top 5 pick would most likely be necessary.

 

[WCE2012]

Masten is a liability. Drunken disorderly behaviour at a popular Perth club..****ing witnessing it was such a disapointment. The apparent future midfield star is a thug and terribly over rated. If only he acted tough onfield, instead of picking fights with smaller blokes. What a disgrace he is, the senior players need to knock some sense into him.

 

[GO EAGLES]

Rebecca Twigley to inspire the players !!!

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

What about Wells?

Would probably cost us more than he's worth.

If he came cheap, I'd have him, but he won't.

 

[tesseract]

Rebecca Twigley to inspire the players !!!

Would she be inspirational or make our boys wanna go turncoat like Juddas?

 

[lewigie]

Masten is a liability. Drunken disorderly behaviour at a popular Perth club..****ing witnessing it was such a disapointment. The apparent future midfield star is a thug and terribly over rated. If only he acted tough onfield, instead of picking fights with smaller blokes. What a disgrace he is, the senior players need to knock some sense into him.

Wait when did this happen?

 

[bunsen burner]

Masten is a liability. Drunken disorderly behaviour at a popular Perth club..****ing witnessing it was such a disapointment. The apparent future midfield star is a thug and terribly over rated. If only he acted tough onfield, instead of picking fights with smaller blokes. What a disgrace he is, the senior players need to knock some sense into him.

1. This was 2 years or so ago
2. Who cares? He might be a knob? I don't think many of us have never been out, got blind, and made complete knobs of ourselves. This hardly makes him a liability.

Let's not worry about the off field stuff and see if he can play footy.

 

[bunsen burner]

Rebecca Twigley to inspire the players !!!

Gardy doesn't play for us anymore.

 

[WCE2012]

1. This was 2 years or so ago
2. Who cares? He might be a knob? I don't think many of us have never been out, got blind, and made complete knobs of ourselves. This hardly makes him a liability.

Let's not worry about the off field stuff and see if he can play footy.

No mate, not 2 yrs ago. Very recent. One off, fair enough. But its getting to be consistent and he's yet to play 50 games. We lose all the bad culture and experience over the past 2 years, then replace them with a junior version. Only difference is that the replacement is a rabble

 

[bunsen burner]

No mate, not 2 yrs ago. Very recent. One off, fair enough. But its getting to be consistent and he's yet to play 50 games. We lose all the bad culture and experience over the past 2 years, then replace them with a junior version. Only difference is that the replacement is a rabble

Is that really a bad culture though? One guy is a complete dick when he's pissed. He may even be an arrogant dick when he's sober. I don't think that's cause for concern just yet.

Jury is still out on his playing talents. He's certainly not Judd, Rioli, or Rich. But guys like Peter Bell took time to hit their straps. We need to give him a bit more time before writing him off.

 

[beatlesmith]

Love that team. What a spectacular Midfield and Forward line!

The only problem with those trades is that Pick 11 + 20 wont be enough for Deledio. A top 5 pick would most likely be necessary.

Yeah, probably true. Johnson is gone, Richo, bowden, simmonds and Cousins are maybes, and i can definitely see a new coach axing deadwood like JON and pettifer, so they may be after quantity in the last uncompromised draft.
This is under the assumption that Deledio wants to leave, and i can't imagine that many clubs in the bottom 6 or so would put themselves forward as suitors with what is being touted as a very strong top echelon, certainly the strongest for the next 4 years.
Perhaps, if sydney experience such a mass exodus, offer them 11+20 and some steak knives for 5. 11+20+Rosa might just get the deal done for Deledio if they need midfielders to replace some of their aging ranks, then just hope like hell that jetta slips to 35.

Alternatively:
Lynch to WB for 15 (Need KP forward if they are serious, little need for picks-topping up)
15+20+Mckinley+Staker to Sydney for 7+23 (need picks and forward options)
7+23 to Richmond for Deledio
Seaby+36 to Port for Pick 27 (need rucks to replace lade/brogan)
Rosa+52 to Melbourne for 35 (optional)

Draft:
2: Butcher
4: Lucas/Morabito
27: Jetta
35: (Best Small stopping defender)
PSD 2: (Best available)

Delist: Hansen, Wilkes, Fletcher
Upgrade: Davis, Wilson/Sullivan
Rookie: 3 spots; crumber, small defender, ruck/utility

 

[csmithrd]

I think with fantasy trading scenario's the simpler the better. A trade like McKinley -> Leroy Jetta is plausible, 2 players + picks for a pick upgrade really isn't.

 

[beatlesmith]

I think with fantasy trading scenario's the simpler the better. A trade like McKinley -> Leroy Jetta is plausible, 2 players + picks for a pick upgrade really isn't.

Historically yes. If there was to be a situation in which a team needed picks and young players to replace retiring senior players, i can't see why not.
It's all pie in the sky stuff. Just let us dream!

 

[no1bankteller]

He's probably one of those nuffies who think Rowan Jones was more important than Chris Judd.

Since Rowan has retired I am starting to appreciate him a great deal more though as I find that our midfield players do not work for each other a great deal. (I accept that this is a product of inexperience and will come with maturity and time.)

Additional thought on taggers is that in my view no team goes out to specifically draft a tagger. It is just that over time certain players, usually those less talented/creative, or those that take longer to develop or those that have lost an edge and are still determined to be a part of best 22 (i.e. Libratore) are given the tagging roles.

 

[bunsen burner]

Since Rowan has retired I am starting to appreciate him a great deal more though as I find that our midfield players do not work for each other a great deal. (I accept that this is a product of inexperience and will come with maturity and time.)

Additional thought on taggers is that in my view no team goes out to specifically draft a tagger. It is just that over time certain players, usually those less talented/creative, or those that take longer to develop or those that have lost an edge and are still determined to be a part of best 22 (i.e. Libratore) are given the tagging roles.

I agree. Rowan Jones was a total hack of a footballer, but did the job of blocking in stoppages to allow ball players like Judd to run at the footy. When the time comes we'll probably have another Rowan Jones.

 

[keviewiggle]

Adam Selwood is playing that roll.
But we lack a midfielder that is good in traffic like judd or cousins.
Kerr is not great in traffic.
He excelled in the past where he was able to use his trademark double backwards circle to get into space and then run.
That space has disappeared with the advent of the defensive zone and he has nowhere to run.

 

[tesseract]

We're missing a CHB for the future when Glass retires.

Spangher - I doubt will make the grade at AFL let alone put on the bulk required to hold down CHB.
Schofield - It's not his game to be a CHB.
Wilkes - Depth player, there in case of injuries.
Wilson - Is better as a forward and we already have enough of those.
Hunter - Will be in retirement in the not to distant future.
Lynch - Will be very senior in a few years and not a long term prospect.
J. Jones - Is a third tall, ala Bones.
Brown - Wants to play forward as he was drafted to do.

Of those players, I can only see Brown being able to hold down the CHB position long term. If that role is assigned to him permanently, I wonder if he'll remain happy to stay at the Eagles.
If we draft Butcher this year, where does that leave Brown? Kennedy, Notte and Butcher are not backmen. That only leaves Brown because he's the only one of them versatile enough to do the job down back. I think the job at CHB may leave him disgruntled and perhaps wanting out.

Do we need to draft a promising CHB now to give him time to mature before Glass retires and McKenzie makes the move to FB?

 

[Woosh24]

I think you are discounting the ability of Jordan Jones a little too much.

He's a very polished young backman who has been holding down CHB and FB for Peel.

 

[bodazoka]

What's the point of trading?

No point going after stop-gaps, and blue-chip mids would cost us too much.

Rebuilding through the draft is the way forward.

So that Cox, Kerr and Glass can be part of our next premiership success. If we let things evolve naturally those players as well as Embley and Hunter will be retired (Kerr may not be) before we even hit top 4. I dont think we need much, one A grade midfielder and mabye one of our kids to come on quickly (looking at Shuey).

 

[Prem87]

Only problem is that JJ is only 188-9cm

 

[keviewiggle]

We're missing a CHB for the future when Glass retires.

Spangher - I doubt will make the grade at AFL let alone put on the bulk required to hold down CHB.
Schofield - It's not his game to be a CHB.
Wilkes - Depth player, there in case of injuries.
Wilson - Is better as a forward and we already have enough of those.
Hunter - Will be in retirement in the not to distant future.
Lynch - Will be very senior in a few years and not a long term prospect.
J. Jones - Is a third tall, ala Bones.
Brown - Wants to play forward as he was drafted to do.

Of those players, I can only see Brown being able to hold down the CHB position long term. If that role is assigned to him permanently, I wonder if he'll remain happy to stay at the Eagles.
If we draft Butcher this year, where does that leave Brown? Kennedy, Notte and Butcher are not backmen. That only leaves Brown because he's the only one of them versatile enough to do the job down back. I think the job at CHB may leave him disgruntled and perhaps wanting out.

Do we need to draft a promising CHB now to give him time to mature before Glass retires and McKenzie makes the move to FB?

Sounds a bit stupid to play a player in the position he wants just to avoid him getting upset.
You play where you are best suited and where the team needs you.
Jackovic & McIntost were both recruited as forwards and ended up champion backmen. Brown & McKenzie are the future of the backline.