When will the Carlton FC Arrive?

[Chief]

Part 2 of this thread is here:

When will the Carlton FC Arrive? Part 2

PART 1 of this thread is here: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/when-will-the-carlton-fc-arrive.1259822/ ============= We're all thinking it. We're watching this story play out for the 4th time in the last 20 years and it's the same story every time. They have a great list of exciting...

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[Ambrosia]

Langford and Laverde looked like busts a couple of years ago too. You have to give players time, and not all first rounders are going to become star players either.

Reckon Dow and LOB will end up cementing spots in the 22, but won’t necessarily go on to be dominant players.

Stocker will be a very good player though IMO. Has all the tools, and just needs exposure in the midfield. His general and game sense is fantastic.

Langford and Laverde have excellent physical tools which helps a lot. I’d have Dow in that category as well maybe even a level ahead of those two so surely he can figure something out.

LOB would need to improve a lot to make it imo as he doesn’t really seem to have a stand out trait to seperate him from others at AFL level.

 

[La Dispute]

Langford and Laverde have excellent physical tools which helps a lot. I’d have Dow in that category as well maybe even a level ahead of those two so surely he can figure something out.

LOB would need to improve a lot to make it imo as he doesn’t really seem to have a stand out trait to seperate him from others at AFL level.

LOB is an exceptional long left foot kick and is pretty astute defensively for a guy who predominantly plays on a wing. His biggest issue is his output, and his ultra conservative running - which are partly interlinked.

If he’s coached properly he can be moulded into a decent defensive winger.

 

[CarnTheScray]

Yet if the side was in a good position to play finals (which they believed) Saad would have been a very good recruit and still might be

Also, as discussed numerous times it was Pick 8 for Saad and Durdin. I am still very comfortable with that deal

No, I don't think so. I don't see Saad as the equivalent of a Pick 8, wasn't at Essendon, isn't at Carlton. Not a player worth throwing away the future for.

 

[Soapy V]

No, I don't think so. I don't see Saad as the equivalent of a Pick 8, wasn't at Essendon, isn't at Carlton. Not a player worth throwing away the future for.

Trading pick 8 for Saad and a young player (Durdin) is throwing away our future?

 

[CarnTheScray]

Trading pick 8 for Saad and a young player (Durdin) is throwing away our future?

So Durdin is guaranteed to be as good as Nik Cox?

 

[Soapy V]

So Durdin is guaranteed to be as good as Nik Cox?

Who said we would have taken Nik Cox and who knows how good or what a career Durdin might have and seriously how many young players do we need? Plus it's not just Durdin it's Durdin AND Saad

It's half a season in.

 

[Robertio]

So Durdin is guaranteed to be as good as Nik Cox?

He could turn out to be just as valuable.

 

[La Dispute]

So Durdin is guaranteed to be as good as Nik Cox?

Think you mean Zach Reid, who is very raw and a high/risk reward prospect.

Saad has been a top 5 player for us this year, and the guys taken in the draft have looked good so far at reserves level. Should have pushed to bring in Saad for less, but the deal wasn’t bad.

 

[WillHayward]

For Carlton to succeed:

1. Do not change the coach. Since when has that ever been the formula for success. Give Teague a 10 year non-performance based contract.
2. Keep McKay, Walsh, Cripps at all costs. There is a lot of dead wood on their list. Trade Williams, Saad out for draft picks.

Replace Brendan McCartney = success.

But agree. Coach sacking isn't usually a formula for success.

Ask the Saints.

 

[Noidnadroj]

Think you mean Zach Reid, who is very raw and a high/risk reward prospect.

Saad has been a top 5 player for us this year, and the guys taken in the draft have looked good so far at reserves level. Should have pushed to bring in Saad for less, but the deal wasn’t bad.

I think the deal for a team in contention would be ok. For a team who blind Freddy could see ‘before’ this season started desperately needed more quality midfielders it didn’t make sense. Midfielders picked in the top-10 can have an impact immediately (they likely would have had Tom Powell at 8 and he had been superb in hjs first year), so it was never a good decision to spend pick-8 and $1.4m of the cap on 2 x HBF’ers.


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[La Dispute]

I think the deal for a team in contention would be ok. For a team who blind Freddy could see ‘before’ this season started desperately needed more quality midfielders it didn’t make sense. Midfielders picked in the top-10 can have an impact immediately (they likely would have had Tom Powell at 8 and he had been superb in hjs first year), so it was never a good decision to spend pick-8 and $1.4m of the cap on 2 x HBF’ers.


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Lucky he’s on our list for more than one season. Like all trades, looks worse in isolation and when the team is underperforming.

If our midfield develops some further depth and we rise up the ladder does it still look like a bad deal? Absolutely not.

We also needed to replace Simpson in the off-season, and Saad was the perfect trade target to add to our back 6.

 

[Daniltchenko You Beauty]

Stocker is a bust?

He’s played like 5 games and looked comfortable at AFL level. Far out.

This is the bloke you risked losing pick 1 for. A player you just had to have. He’s played five games halfway through his third year despite no significant injuries (to my knowledge). Now he is playing as a back pocket despite a total lack of midfield depth. Not a concern?

 

[PP34]

This is the bloke you risked losing pick 1 for. A player you just had to have. He’s played five games halfway through his third year despite no significant injuries (to my knowledge). Now he is playing as a back pocket despite a total lack of midfield depth. Not a concern?

Looool. Risked losing pick 1 for. If we’re going to use that logic with future pick trading nobody will ever be a trade winner.

Stocker missed all of last year after leaving the hub due to personal issues.

Maybe do some research before potting blokes.

 

[Soapy V]

This is the bloke you risked losing pick 1 for. A player you just had to have. He’s played five games halfway through his third year despite no significant injuries (to my knowledge). Now he is playing as a back pocket despite a total lack of midfield depth. Not a concern?

Check you facts before commenting. He missed all of last year. Started this season very well in the reserves as a mid and then promoted. Then for some strange reason which defies logic Teague plays him in defence.

He needs to go into the middle ASAP

 

[La Dispute]

This is the bloke you risked losing pick 1 for. A player you just had to have. He’s played five games halfway through his third year despite no significant injuries (to my knowledge). Now he is playing as a back pocket despite a total lack of midfield depth. Not a concern?

Risked pick 1 for?

Clearly the club backed themselves to improve, and predicted Adelaide would slide. Both of those things happened.

The net trade was:

Stocker, Kemp and Philp for McAsey and Pedlar

(As an aside, where’s the scrutiny on Adelaide for trading 2x first rounders for an SANFL player?)

Who cares where he is playing? He’s now bedded in the best 22, and improving each week. The plan is to move him in the midfield, but we had our preferred lineup set at the start of the year and he’s had to start in defence while he gets fitness and exposure. It didn’t kill Andrew McGrath spending his first 3 years in defence.

 

[Daniltchenko You Beauty]

Check you facts before commenting. He missed all of last year. Started the season very well in the reserves as a mid and then promoted. Then for some strange reason which defies logic Teague plays him in defence.

He needs to go into the middle ASAP

He left after round 12 in late July? And didn’t play before?

Check your facts.

 

[Soapy V]

He left after round 12 in late July? And didn’t play before?

Check your facts.

He didn’t play at all last year. Fact

 

[Daniltchenko You Beauty]

He didn’t play at all last year. Fact

So why didn’t he play seniors before round 12 if he was playing reserves? In a team desperate for more quality mids?

Anyway, clearly not going to change any minds here. If you guys are content with the development of your top 20 picks over the last five or so years then I’m happy for you. But in my opinion, your club is developing a serious issue with bringing in highly rated midfielders and them not cutting it. To me, it’s why your team has completely stagnated.

 

[branedotorg]

Stocker, Kemp and Philp for McAsey and Pedlar

That's a trade impossible to judge as yet, I think around ten matches in total between them?

 

[La Dispute]

That's a trade impossible to judge as yet, I think around ten matches in total between them?

Agreed, but it goes to show a lot of the discussion around Stocker and that trade itself is completely overblown.

FWIW I’d take Kemp over any player in that set.

 

[Soapy V]

So why didn’t he play seniors before round 12 if he was playing reserves? In a team desperate for more quality mids?

Anyway, clearly not going to change any minds here. If you guys are content with the development of your top 20 picks over the last five or so years then I’m happy for you. But in my opinion, your club is developing a serious issue with bringing in highly rated midfielders and them not cutting it. To me, it’s why your team has completely stagnated.

He wasn’t playing Reserves? He didn’t play at all last year because of personal issues. He went with the team into the hub but returned home early for further treatment. Like has been said Check your facts

 

[Soapy V]

That's a trade impossible to judge as yet, I think around ten matches in total between them?

True. I must say Kemp excites me more than any other on our list and Stocker looks very good and gets better each week

 

[00Stinger]

Can't wait for the great grub Liddle to gut that place looking for answers

Best thing Carlton can do is give Teague time to get that team operating well and he will given time

But this has Carlton of 9 years ago written all over it where they will get spooked into sacking the coach looking for a big name again. History repeats

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

I think the deal for a team in contention would be ok. For a team who blind Freddy could see ‘before’ this season started desperately needed more quality midfielders it didn’t make sense. Midfielders picked in the top-10 can have an impact immediately (they likely would have had Tom Powell at 8 and he had been superb in hjs first year), so it was never a good decision to spend pick-8 and $1.4m of the cap on 2 x HBF’ers.


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Along with Williams I think we were somewhat backing in our top 10 pick midfielders in LOB, Dow, SPS and Setterfield to become good 4th-6th midfielders behind Cripps, Walsh and Curnow. Unfortunately that hasn’t happened but we do have other first round midfielders in Kemp, Philp and Stocker who may possibly.

We haven’t neglected our midfield. we may have more busts looking for them but it has never been ignored. I imagine we will turn our pick ~6 this year into another one too.

 

[hk89]

No, I don't think so. I don't see Saad as the equivalent of a Pick 8, wasn't at Essendon, isn't at Carlton. Not a player worth throwing away the future for.

People are saying Hawthorn will not get a top 10 pick for Tom Mitchell who can still rack up 40+ post-leg break. Tom Mitchell has probably racked up more Brownlow votes in 3 good weeks than Saad has in his entire career. If you use Saad as the barometer, surely we'd be looking at 2 first rounders for Mitchell. Sadly Saad isn't the barometer of what a first rounder is worth, he's just the barometer for how dumb Carlton's list management team are.