Which new recruit are you most excited about?

[Bard]

Voted for Freeman for some reason. Just have a really good feeling about him.

 

[Chilli Con Incarnate]

Its funny, people tend to equate 'potential' and 'upside' with speed.

If someone has speed, they are generally said to have potential or upside. Do you ever hear of slow players having great potential or upside?

It is interesting.

Mark McGough?

 

[Knightmare]

I agree with Jelly Bean on athleticism not equating to potential.

Jobe Watson and Josh Kennedy (Syd) are examples of why it doesn't matter.

In evaluating upside a better measure is looking at improvement from season to season. Are their numbers increasing? Have they added or improved elements of their games with each season?

Height is the other measure I look at from an upside standpoint. If you're sub 175cm then generally you're taking the guy on who he is today and what they're doing now with upside other than a few rare cases minimal (Brent Harvey is the only current player this rule doesn't apply to).
Whereas those taller mids or taller key forwards typically continue to develop their games deeper into their 20s and experience greater growth from year to year which is what you weigh up.

Upside isn't everything. If the guy is a project and hasn't shown anything on field then you simply shouldn't draft them because that is probably unlikely to change against better competition. But it can be something you look at when seperating some relatively similar level talents.

In the case of Marsh specifically he's someone who I would say has big upside to his game because he's someone who has shown on field that he can take over games and dominant and exert his influence and sway the outcome of games. He does some Buddy type things when within range from goal with his ground level skills and his movement with ball in hand as good as you'll find in the entire competition at his size. He's a freak. Just lacks consistency and a complete game which is what he'll need to develop.

 

[Pies12]

Snore with some of the over-analysed, length of posts by some! Its pretty simple that we have some very talented kids all with different body types, ceilings etc. But I must say they seem to currently be going in the right direction.

Its an exciting time in general, really looking forward to 2014 and beyond.

 

[soreplums]

If Clinton young was included, I'll put him down

 

[jmac70]

Snore with some of the over-analysed, length of posts by some! Its pretty simple that we have some very talented kids all with different body types, ceilings etc. But I must say they seem to currently be going in the right direction.

Its an exciting time in general, really looking forward to 2014 and beyond.

Just don't read the ones that bore you, pretty simple.

 

[jonbe54]

Adams and White should have immediate impacts, White especially as was drafted to fill needs and Adams is needed to help Ball out in the clearances.

 

[TradeDraft]

If Clinton young was included, I'll put him down

He would almost be one as I think he spent 90% of last season Injured and going from reports he is back in Full Training since coming back from New Years Break

 

[TradeDraft]

In the case of Marsh specifically he's someone who I would say has big upside to his game because he's someone who has shown on field that he can take over games and dominant and exert his influence and sway the outcome of games. He does some Buddy type things when within range from goal with his ground level skills and his movement with ball in hand as good as you'll find in the entire competition at his size. He's a freak. Just lacks consistency and a complete game which is what he'll need to develop.

I think that how I sum him up to. At his Best he can be good as Buddy but He hardly touches the Ball and Because everything is go, go, go with Marsh, he can do a lot of things in a rush and lack some composure. His kicking is also very hit-or-miss, as seen in his goalkicking numbers for East Fremantle, where he kicked 20 goals and 37 behinds in 13 games.

He is very Raw but I say great selection for your Last Pick in the National Draft in the 5th Round. You get a Player who upside could mean he can come a Real Star of the Comp and can Win Games off his own feet but Also is so Raw that he could be a Total Bust.

But I think a 5th Round(Pick 77) is worth the Shot. He would of gone very High in the Rookie Draft IF he got there. Top 3 with the Upside he has.

 

[TradeDraft]

Freeman can debut next year and with the way we give first year players games so easily he may well debut by round 5. Probably more like Kennedy last year he'd likely also be used as an energy sub with his running to be injected into games here and there as required but wouldn't think he'd be a regular and more likely someone who if going well has the opportunity to get a taste for senior football.

I can see your Thinking. As same as Kennedy can come on late in a game and make a Impact with his Explosive Pace. Though I also see him Starting some games as well

 

[Knightmare]

I can see your Thinking. As same as Kennedy can come on late in a game and make a Impact with his Explosive Pace. Though I also see him Starting some games as well

Freeman's game isn't as advanced as Kennedy coming in last year.

Kennedy as a 16 year old was ready to play. Freeman while his running game from sprinting, to repeat speed to endurance is elite in every category his game still has some further developing is required before he becomes AFL quality as someone who still lacks consistency and can struggle to find the footy at times both inside and outside the contest unless you really feed him.

As a sub because most everyone on the field is totaled by 3/4 time he can just gut run and gut run and gut run which are probably the circumstances where he can at this point anyway most influence games with the way he can take on the game if you feed him enough cheap ball.

 

[TradeDraft]

Freeman's game isn't as advanced as Kennedy coming in last year.

Kennedy as a 16 year old was ready to play. Freeman while his running game from sprinting, to repeat speed to endurance is elite in every category his game still has some further developing is required before he becomes AFL quality as someone who still lacks consistency and can struggle to find the footy at times both inside and outside the contest unless you really feed him.

As a sub because most everyone on the field is totaled by 3/4 time he can just gut run and gut run and gut run which are probably the circumstances where he can at this point anyway most influence games with the way he can take on the game if you feed him enough cheap ball.

Yeah after his Underage Year Kennedy was seen as a Possible Top 10 Pick.

Freeman's Body is more AFL Ready Though. 10 CM's Taller and a Bigger Build on him.

Both should be very exciting players for us, both have X-Factor about them too

 

[Knightmare]

Yeah after his Underage Year Kennedy was seen as a Possible Top 10 Pick.

Freeman's Body is more AFL Ready Though. 10 CM's Taller and a Bigger Build on him.

Both should be very exciting players for us, both have X-Factor about them too

It's 174cm 76kg v 181cm 85kg. Height and weight measurements don't always tell the whole story.

Freeman while he's AFL weight for someone his height he doesn't have an AFL ready game. He's not coming in and impacting games from round one. Jaeger O'Meara and Chris Judd were but they're the exceptions to the rule as the rare freaks.

Kennedy from a younger age played like he can play at AFL level because there was zero growing into his body factor as a sub 175cm guy. He could win the contested ball easily and that ability converted to AFL level. His game hasn't changed or really improved since he was 16 mostly because as a super small unless you're an incredibly smart runner as only Brent Harvey is at that height you're not going to be of any usefulness outside the contest.

Freeman while a good contested ball winner isn't dominant at this as Kennedy is and doesn't share the same consistency in his game either. He can have some really quiet games (many games of sub 15 disposals in the TAC with even a sub 10 disposal game) and that's something he'll need to work on before becoming AFL relevant.

 

[JA27]

Adams: we all know the story about his in and under work but I believe from watching the GWS replays that he will surprise with his ability to spread from the contest and run to the right areas. at the giants nearly every chain of kicks/handballs resulted in a turnover but here he will be able to put more faith in his team mates and will result in him playing equal times in the centre on the wings and as a forward flanker.

 

[TradeDraft]

It's 174cm 76kg v 181cm 85kg. Height and weight measurements don't always tell the whole story.

Freeman while he's AFL weight for someone his height he doesn't have an AFL ready game. He's not coming in and impacting games from round one. Jaeger O'Meara and Chris Judd were but they're the exceptions to the rule as the rare freaks.

Kennedy from a younger age played like he can play at AFL level because there was zero growing into his body factor as a sub 175cm guy. He could win the contested ball easily and that ability converted to AFL level. His game hasn't changed or really improved since he was 16 mostly because as a super small unless you're an incredibly smart runner as only Brent Harvey is at that height you're not going to be of any usefulness outside the contest.

Freeman while a good contested ball winner isn't dominant at this as Kennedy is and doesn't share the same consistency in his game either. He can have some really quiet games (many games of sub 15 disposals in the TAC with even a sub 10 disposal game) and that's something he'll need to work on before becoming AFL relevant.

Well Kennedy did not Dominate any games last season. Had Great Patches in Games.

Well I am not saying Freeman would Dominate but I think he can have moments in game where he can make a Difference. Also Freeman just kept improving last season.

Be Interesting how both will play in the Pre-Season games and then we can see where they are

 

[Knightmare]

Well Kennedy did not Dominate any games last season. Had Great Patches in Games.

Well I am not saying Freeman would Dominate but I think he can have moments in game where he can make a Difference. Also Freeman just kept improving last season.

Be Interesting how both will play in the Pre-Season games and then we can see where they are

I'm not calling Kennedy a star. He's not inside my best 22 either but he also had a number of 30+ disposal game and almost all 20+ disposal games in the VFL where he played full games.

At AFL level Kennedy played sufficiently well to warrant selection but I'm not seeing Freeman who had worse numbers in the TAC do better than Kennedy who had most consistent numbers in the VFL.

 

[rustyg70]

Yes the kicking is an area that will require much work (from reports) but even if it could be raised to average disposal by foot combined with height and speed we would have a real weapon.

The kicking is what tempers my expectations, he's still young enough for it to be improved it remains to be seen if he has the application and desire to do it.

I see Steve Malaxos, Ken Judge and all of the East Freo coaching staff all the time.
I'll ask them about their thoughts on Marsh next time I see them.
I'll keep you informed mate.

 

[TradeDraft]

I am fan both Kennedy and Freeman of the Pace they give the Side.

Could they both play in the Same Side?

 

[Hinequarters]

Davoren​

 

[Jelly Bean]

I am fan both Kennedy and Freeman of the Pace they give the Side.

Could they both play in the Same Side?

Freeman and Kennedy in the same side...? Ummm, yes...

There is a much higher limit on the number of medium/smalls you can have in the side than key position players (obvioulsy).

Freeman and Kennedy can both ultimately go through the midfield, and play on the forward flanks / pockets, with Freeman probably having potential as a small defender as well. With the interchange (and the sub position) typically also filled up with these types of player, that means that there are potentially 14-17 positions available for running players like them.

So yes, if both are good enough, you could play them in the same side...

 

[TradeDraft]

Freeman and Kennedy in the same side...? Ummm, yes...

There is a much higher limit on the number of medium/smalls you can have in the side than key position players (obvioulsy).

Freeman and Kennedy can both ultimately go through the midfield, and play on the forward flanks / pockets, with Freeman probably having potential as a small defender as well. With the interchange (and the sub position) typically also filled up with these types of player, that means that there are potentially 14-17 positions available for running players like them.

So yes, if both are good enough, you could play them in the same side...

Also they give the team what has lacked for awhile. Actual Leg Speed, Yes we move the Ball Quick but we have lacked leg speed in the Midfield for quite awhile

 

[jmac70]

Freeman can debut next year and with the way we give first year players games so easily he may well debut by round 5. Probably more like Kennedy last year he'd likely also be used as an energy sub with his running to be injected into games here and there as required but wouldn't think he'd be a regular and more likely someone who if going well has the opportunity to get a taste for senior football.

Easily? Do you think that the club have made a mistake blooding so many players?

 

[Knightmare]

Easily? Do you think that the club have made a mistake blooding so many players?

I have no issue with the club giving the young senior opportunities early. In fact I encourage Collingwood to continue on as they have done.

 

[TradeDraft]

I have no issue with the club giving the young senior opportunities early. In fact I encourage Collingwood to continue on as they have done.

Worked in the Past.

In 2010 many Seasoned players where Replaced with Kids and we went on to win the Flag

Adelaide did it in 1997 when the Cleared out the Older Player so the Kids could Play and they Won The Flag

 

[TheFreshBanana]

May have worked in the past, but doesn't necessarily mean it is the most efficient way to win a premiership.