Society/Culture Why Australia needs to lower its immigration intake

[Gethelred]

This thread is about a lot of things, but one of the things it is not about is crime.

The next person who seeks to make a connection between violent crime and immigration by posting about it in here will receive a threadban and an infraction equivalent to the racism it portrays.

Should you want to talk about violent crime, the 'African gangs' thread is both thataway:

Vic - Melbourne's Sudanese gangs

The Victorian government and police management have finally been shamed into admitting there's a problems with African gangs. On 20th December, after eight police were overpowered by a gang of 100 mainly South Sudanese youths who trashed a Werribee Airbnb-rented property, smashing car...

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Let's stay on topic from here.

 

[RupieDupie]

I'm driving a mack truck through your argument based on a stupid comment you made. Kind of renders anything you say on the subject useless.

Hate to break it to you, on Easter Eve and all, but the Easter Bunny doesn’t exist, it’s exactly the same as the myth that people who get paid a lot, actually do any work, Plebism I’m afraid. You need to face reality.

 

[11sjw]

Hate to break it to you, on Easter Eve and all, but the Easter Bunny doesn’t exist, it’s exactly the same as the myth that people who get paid a lot, actually do any work, Plebism I’m afraid. You need to face reality.

Reality? Perhaps in your little safe space that is the case.

F**k me our CEO completed a last minute request FRP design, for a contractor we do regular work with, Thursday just gone. Sure it isn't his day to day role but he can drop down to do it when needed.

They carry responsibility for technical/professional development of their engineering staff as well. The senior can drop down to fill in but rarely, without the development that the senior will put into their team, can a junior step up to cover the more senior position.

 

[RupieDupie]

Reality? Perhaps in your little safe space that is the case.

F**k me our CEO completed a last minute request FRP design, for a contractor we do regular work with, Thursday just gone. Sure it isn't his day to day role but he can drop down to do it when needed.

They carry responsibility for technical/professional development of their engineering staff as well. The senior can drop down to fill in but rarely, without the development that the senior will put into their team, can a junior step up to cover the more senior position.

Well, what’s your answer to the question then?

 

[11sjw]

Well, what’s your answer to the question then?

That one can't do without the other.

 

[RupieDupie]

That one can't do without the other.

Plebism. I bet the engineers can play golf also.

 

[11sjw]

Plebism. I bet the engineers can play golf also.

Again with the dumb assumptions/stereotypes. Are you stubborn or just stupid?

 

[RupieDupie]

Again with the dumb assumptions/stereotypes. Are you stubborn or just stupid?

Just waiting for you to answer the question, why don’t you want to buy your own argument for? When you do answer the question honestly you’ll find I’m right.

 

[Jello_B]

Sorry ‘bro, can’t help that you’ve been plebbed, the truth is hard to handle.

But let’s say you are the CEO of a company and you have the option to swap ten of your engineers for one senior manager, or swap your one senior manager for ten engineers (salary ~=), which would you choose? If you prefer the latter, you’re demonstrating that even you don’t buy your own argument.

Your argument is so easily dismantled. For one, a senior managers salary at an engineering company is likely ~ $200k and an engineer is around $100k. Disregarding the math than, if you look at the work they do, there is no company with the 10 engineers. The engineers don’t win work, they do work. The manager establishes and maintains the client relationships to generate work. The manager also normally comes from an engineering background so they can do both. So:
10 Engineers = $1M expense no revenue.
1 Manager = $200k expense, 0.5FTE winning work, 0.5FTE producing work at around $200 p/h will give you a revenue of around ~$100k.
Apologies, but this whole position around the financial value of leadership in a company is not correct.

 

[RupieDupie]

Your argument is so easily dismantled. For one, a senior managers salary at an engineering company is likely ~ $200k and an engineer is around $100k. Disregarding the math than, if you look at the work they do, there is no company with the 10 engineers. The engineers don’t win work, they do work. The manager establishes and maintains the client relationships to generate work. The manager also normally comes from an engineering background so they can do both. So:
10 Engineers = $1M expense no revenue.
1 Manager = $200k expense, 0.5FTE winning work, 0.5FTE producing work at around $200 p/h will give you a revenue of around ~$100k.
Apologies, but this whole position around the financial value of leadership in a company is not correct.

So if you went to Australia Post, ATO etc and you check out an executive salary, we are talking millions, so yes you are right, 10x salary isn’t quite enough. So what’s your choice?

 

[Jello_B]

So if you went to Australia Post, ATO etc and you check out an executive salary, we are talking millions, so yes you are right, 10x salary isn’t quite enough. So what’s your choice?

Choice of what. I gave you the answer. Manager of engineering company, or 10 engineers, I’ll take the manager thanks. I’m also an owner of an engineering company.

 

[RupieDupie]

Choice of what. I gave you the answer. Manager of engineering company, or 10 engineers, I’ll take the manager thanks. I’m also an owner of an engineering company.

First you changed the maths though, it will be $2M vs $2M

2 x $1M senior managers
vs
20 x 100K engineers

 

[Tandy]

Meanwhile small country towns are vanishing. How about pulling some migrants away from the big cities and contribute to the small town economies. I'm talking towns of between 100-2000. They are often no more than half an hour to bigger towns of 5-10k.

 

[Jello_B]

First you changed the maths though, it will be $2M vs $2M

2 x $1M senior managers
vs
20 x 100K engineers

A senior manager in an engineering company doesn’t earn $1M a year, it’s one of the issues with your original premise.

 

[RupieDupie]

A senior manager in an engineering company doesn’t earn $1M a year, it’s one of the issues with your original premise.

If we’re talking Google, Apple, etc etc senior management are in the millions, like, look at someone like Luka Maestri for Apple, from what I understand his salary is >$25M, Apple has at least 250 engineers at ~100K each, would you want 2 x Luka or 500 engineers - over to you Jello_B...

It’s not even a trick question where both answers are wrong, like “would you prefer to eat poo or lick a panda’s twat?” the answer is so obvious that if you ask me I could answer it within seconds

500 engineers! Whoops I accidentally answered it

Are you sure RupieDupie, what if I throw in a free Chief Financial Officer for free?

Ahhh... am I building a lawn bowls team here or a software company? 500 engineers!

 

[Jello_B]

If we’re talking Google, Apple, etc etc senior management are in the millions, like, look at someone like Luka Maestri for Apple, from what I understand his salary is >$25M, Apple has at least 250 engineers at ~100K each, would you want 2 x Luka or 500 engineers - over to you Jello_B...

It’s not even a trick question where both answers are wrong, like “would you prefer to eat poo or lick a panda’s twat?” the answer is so obvious that if you ask me I could answer it within seconds

500 engineers! Whoops I accidentally answered it

Are you sure RupieDupie, what if I throw in a free Chief Financial Officer for free?

Ahhh... am I building a lawn bowls team here or a software company? 500 engineers!

Why would I comment on something I know nothing about? I don’t know Luke Maestri, and I don’t know what Luke does.
I know real engineering companies in Australia and the commentary I am providing is around what I know. Suggesting that highly paid Senior Managers at engineering companies are being remunerated excessively compared to their engineering compatriots is wrong from everything I know and have seen over my career in engineering.

 

[RupieDupie]

Why would I comment on something I know nothing about? I don’t know Luke Maestri, and I don’t know what Luke does.
I know real engineering companies in Australia and the commentary I am providing is around what I know. Suggesting that highly paid Senior Managers at engineering companies are being remunerated excessively compared to their engineering compatriots is wrong from everything I know and have seen over my career in engineering.

Your Plebism runs deep...

 

[Jello_B]

Your Plebism runs deep...

Ok well have a good day.

 

[RupieDupie]

Ok well have a good day.

Yes, Happy Easter to you as well.

Take time to ponder this problem though my son, take the steps to shed your Plebism.

 

[FireKrakouer]

If we’re talking Google, Apple, etc etc senior management are in the millions, like, look at someone like Luka Maestri for Apple, from what I understand his salary is >$25M, Apple has at least 250 engineers at ~100K each, would you want 2 x Luka or 500 engineers - over to you Jello_B...

It’s not even a trick question where both answers are wrong, like “would you prefer to eat poo or lick a panda’s twat?” the answer is so obvious that if you ask me I could answer it within seconds

500 engineers! Whoops I accidentally answered it

Are you sure RupieDupie, what if I throw in a free Chief Financial Officer for free?

Ahhh... am I building a lawn bowls team here or a software company? 500 engineers!

You are ignoring basic economics. Companies are profit driven, so won't pay some lazy golfer millions a year for no reason. Supply and demand dictate wages. Highly paid managers have a rare (low-supply) skillset that is in high demand. If they make 10x what entry level engineers make, it's because the free market has valued them accordingly.

Your question is meaningless without more context. But the simple answer is "I would take whichever option I believed would lead to the company making a higher profit".

 

[RupieDupie]

You are ignoring basic economics. Companies are profit driven, so won't pay some lazy golfer millions a year for no reason. Supply and demand dictate wages. Highly paid managers have a rare (low-supply) skillset that is in high demand. If they make 10x what entry level engineers make, it's because the free market has valued them accordingly.

Your question is meaningless without more context. But the simple answer is "I would take whichever option I believed would lead to the company making a higher profit".

Which 1,000,000 times out of 1,000,000 will mean you would always take the option of 500 engineers. It would be a “dumb-as” decision to choose having two Chief Financial Officers, unless you are struggling to find a wayward titleist on the 7th.

If I were Chief Financial Officer at Apple I could save the company >$25M subtract 100K US annually in one decision. Look at that, not even employed at the company and already winning! He doesn’t seem to be doing a good job if he doesn’t realise this, maybe it’s due to all the sand getting up his nose in the hole 9 bunker.

Incidentally, 100K US p.a. is pretty comfortable, and in a reasonable cost of living and housing market would be like living like a king... You’ll have to explain to me, because I’ve never read the pleb-Bible, what would happen to this Chief Financial Officer if he didn’t get $25M pa, will his head fall off?

 

[RupieDupie]

The day in the life of the CFO

Well I’ve been employed for a whole 5 months and have $10M, I’m not far from 60 and plan on living for another 25 years, I could lose my job now and live off $400K per year. I have minions for my minions doing my job for me, now here’s the big question for the day, am I;

1) going to pretend I’m working but really play golf
2) do actual work like a sucker...?

 

[greyhound punter]

Australia has accepted over 500 000 net arrivals in the last 12 months. This is simply unacceptable.
Hospitals overflowing, people dying in ambulances waiting to be treated, public services overwhelmed. That is without even mentioning the environmental impacts of such unsustainable growth - net zero anyone?

Of course, both political parties are hopelessly captured by vested interests who love a BIG Australia.

Was helping a friend move house a few days ago, into a new housing estate - streets are filled with cars - i had to pull over several times just to let cars coming from the opposite direction pass. My mate explained to me that each house probably has a number of generations living in it - kids, parents and grandparents - these households use their garages as an extra living area/room and then park on the street.

Tent cities popping up in every major city.

Anyway, nothing will change. Never felt this despondent about the direction our country is going.

The vast majority of the population don't want this population growth - so why are we having it hoisted on us from above by people who don't have to live with the consquences of overcrowding and congestion.

The next election cannot come quick enough.

Vote em out.

 

[Gough]

You're utterly deranged if you think the coalition of thieves and sex pests in the opposition deserve to be anywhere government.

 

[Rob R]

Australia has accepted over 500 000 net arrivals in the last 12 months. This is simply unacceptable.
Hospitals overflowing, people dying in ambulances waiting to be treated, public services overwhelmed. That is without even mentioning the environmental impacts of such unsustainable growth - net zero anyone?

Of course, both political parties are hopelessly captured by vested interests who love a BIG Australia.

Was helping a friend move house a few days ago, into a new housing estate - streets are filled with cars - i had to pull over several times just to let cars coming from the opposite direction pass. My mate explained to me that each house probably has a number of generations living in it - kids, parents and grandparents - these households use their garages as an extra living area/room and then park on the street.

Tent cities popping up in every major city.

Anyway, nothing will change. Never felt this despondent about the direction our country is going.

The vast majority of the population don't want this population growth - so why are we having it hoisted on us from above by people who don't have to live with the consquences of overcrowding and congestion.

The next election cannot come quick enough.

Vote em out.

And who do we vote in? ALP.has let far too many people in, Libs would have been far worse. What party do you think is going to cut immigration to what Australia needs rather than what lobbyists want?

On SM-A125F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[greyhound punter]

And who do we vote in? ALP.has let far too many people in, Libs would have been far worse. What party do you think is going to cut immigration to what Australia needs rather than what lobbyists want?

On SM-A125F using BigFooty.com mobile app

We can only go on the available evidence. The LNP had a substantially lower immigration intake than the ALP had had during their time in government.

They probably would have done the same thing as the ALP. But we can't be sure. Life under Morrison was a hell of a lot easier than what it is under albanese.

Such betrayal of the Australian populace and gasloghting about skill shortages etc. It is unforgivable. As I said vote em out.

We can worry about the new government later. VOTE THEM OUT.

Ignore those voices shrieking word salads about sex pests and being deranged.