Recommitted Zach Merrett [UFA 2027] - Wanted a trade to Hawthorn, but it didn't get done

[Lore]

There we go, that's the clip:

 

[jannissary]

But if all Essendon wanted to do was waste time and screw Hawthorn by preventing them from trading for any other player then I guess they succeeded. A bit too much of a pyrrhic victory in my opinion but Essendon will do Essendon things I suppose.

it's pretty dastardly for essendon to control what hawthorn chooses to do during the trade period. they had the entire time to seek OTHER players who were available (aka petracca) and elected not to do so. how exactly is this essendon's fault when the club signalled from the get go that he wasn't going to be traded? can you please quote me anytime essendon had specifically, and explicitly stated that "we're open to trading zach merrett" because otherwise this just sounds like some glass barbeque business.

I imagine they’re referring to this post:

Recommitted - Zach Merrett [UFA 2027] - Wanted a trade to Hawthorn, but it didn't get done

There we go, that's the clip:

www.bigfooty.com

They’ve conveniently omitted the part about “if we don’t get whacked by injuries again” though.

i'm shocked that someone would be so disingenuous!

 

[boncer34]

Blessing as in Hawthorn has already indicated they are willing to part with that player in order to complete the trade so as to expedite the fishing expedition process. I realise clubs can talk to any player they want whenever they want but we’re talking specifically about Essendon being satisfied with the quality of the player included in this trade with Hawthorn and the best way to do that is by discussing it well beforehand.

But if all Essendon wanted to do was waste time and screw Hawthorn by preventing them from trading for any other player then I guess they succeeded. A bit too much of a pyrrhic victory in my opinion but Essendon will do Essendon things I suppose.

The point is that it was idiotic to expect Hawthorn to hurt themselves over this trade and to stoop to the incompetence the Bombers are renowned for.

Recent past history shows that Hawthorn do not operate that way. If Essendon had people with a modicum of intelligence running the club, they should have had the foresight to realise that Hawthorn would not play their silly games that would undermine Hawthorn’s relationship with their players. Only moronically run clubs would fall for that.

The AFL isn’t the NBA where players are constantly traded without their approval. If a club wants another one to trade one of their required key players then that club has to at the VERY LEAST make the effort to reach out to a player (after Hawthorn had confirmed it’s one of the players their willing to part with and include in a trade) that tickles their fancy and present a convincing case to move. That’s not stupidity, that’s just common sense and how well run clubs operate.




Stop lying, if you were haunted by stupidity you would’ve already been rendered catatonic by your occasionally broken Shift Key and in particular your acceptance of the truly frightening display of stupidity by the Bombers admin for about 2 decades, which this failed trade is the latest example of. You seem to have it backwards, you appear to thrive on stupidity like a pig in shit as evidenced by your strenuous vigorous defence of the incompetence of those running Essendon.

Blessing as in Hawthorn has already indicated they are willing to part with that player in order to complete the trade so as to expedite the fishing expedition process. I realise clubs can talk to any player they want whenever they want but we’re talking specifically about Essendon being satisfied with the quality of the player included in this trade with Hawthorn and the best way to do that is by discussing it well beforehand.

But if all Essendon wanted to do was waste time and screw Hawthorn by preventing them from trading for any other player then I guess they succeeded. A bit too much of a pyrrhic victory in my opinion but Essendon will do Essendon things I suppose.



If that’s your interpretation of my post then you’re definitely the one with a lack of critical thinking skills.

It’s not about ‘minimising disruption’ of another club’s culture, the point is that it was idiotic to expect Hawthorn to hurt themselves over this trade and to stoop to the incompetence the Bombers are renowned for.

Recent past history shows that Hawthorn do not operate that way. If Essendon had people with a modicum of intelligence running the club, they should have had the foresight to realise that Hawthorn would not play their silly games that would undermine Hawthorn’s relationship with their players. Only moronically run clubs would fall for that.

The AFL isn’t the NBA where players are constantly traded without their approval. If a club wants another one to trade one of their required key players then that club has to at the VERY LEAST make the effort to reach out to a player (after Hawthorn had confirmed it’s one of the players their willing to part with and include in a trade) that tickles their fancy and present a convincing case to move. That’s not stupidity, that’s just common sense and how well run clubs operate.




In an ideal world that’s how things should play out, with players honouring and seeing out their contracts. But in the real world pro athletes can change their minds for all sorts of reasons. Some are petty and selfish like say Tim Kelly and GAJ.

Both of those individuals left Geelong basically for being selfish narcissistic greedy like Karmichael Hunts and not because they had had a falling out with anyone at the club.

Irrespective of GAJ fans saying Bomba was being a big meanie to him and blame it all on him for GAJ leaving. The truth is Bomba knew GAJ had already signed a contract with the GC in December 2009 and couldn’t stomach his lying arse and treating Geelong supporters as idiots, hence his iciness towards GAJ in the last few months at the club.

GAJ just baselessly felt that Geelong had screwed him over when signed a 5 year deal in 2005, a deal he was over the moon at the time he signed it. But when he made huge strides in 2007 he felt cheated and demanded a bump to his contract, which couldn’t be done as all his other teammates also deserved to get paid as well, leaving no room in the salary cap for pay rises to any player that had signed years prior.

GAJ saw that as an excuse (it wasn’t, it was the truth) and decided to get what he felt he deserved and Geelong was ‘keeping’ from him via the new franchises and the rest as they say is history.

With Kelly it was obvious that he had made a lucrative and illegal draft circumventing and tampering agreement with the Weagles (explains his refusal to play for Fremantle at any stage of negotiations and made a mockery of his claims that his family needed to be back for the sake of the children) and why he continued to thrive and play great footy in his second season at Geelong after his request to be traded to the Weagles after just playing 10 games for Geelong was denied.

His partner had also something to do with it, she desperately desired to be a relevant famewhoring WAG in a location she had families and friends in, and could use the footy fame of her husband to her advantage.

Others leave for their own personal private reasons such as Allen Christensen who was right in his prime when he decided he wanted out of Geelong and the club accommodated his wishes without too much fuss.

But then there are others like Merrett that have nothing to do with the love of lucre but everything with wanting to leave a mediocre situation that they’ve tolerated for years and can’t stand anymore.

In these instances it is foolish to keep these types of players around as a club runs the risk of creating a toxic environment among the playing group by forcing a player that has made it clear that he no longer wishes to be there.

Essendon acting as if they had all the leverage in this situation and not being painfully aware of the damage they’re doing to their playing group by behaving in this manner goes a long way in explaining why the Bombers haven’t done anything for about 20 years, and that’s not a ‘troll’ that’s just facts.

A large part of the reason why Geelong has been successful is that they recognize their players are human beings and not pieces of meat to bartered with to improve the playing list.

Players all over the AFL have become well aware of Geelong’s respectful treatment of their players and unsurprisingly that has resulted in Geelong being the club more players at rival clubs make enquiries about to their managers to find out whether there’s mutual interest and a potential pathway to facilitate a move to Geelong.

I get that Essendon wanted to spoil Hawthorn’s chances of winning Premierships in the upcoming years but I don’t think Merrett moves the needle enough for them to do so.

The Hawks’ offer would have stripped them of a lot of substantial draft capital in the upcoming years and more or less remove them from the trading table for any of the future star free agents in the upcoming trade periods.

Regardless of what Essendon fans say, the trade offer was more than generous and all those Hawthorn picks could have aided in fast forwarding the process of building a Premiership list.

Assuming they’re used correctly of course and I guess that's the issue at the end of the day as Essendon has not shown the ability to do just that for many years.

 

[boncer34]

Under this coach? Or are we going back 7 years under Clarkson?

Oh a clubs history doesnt count anymore if you change coaches?

 

[HairyO]

Oh a clubs history doesnt count anymore if you change coaches?

You guys changed coach more times while having Merrett than Shiel ran back to help out in defence.

 

[boncer34]

You guys changed coach more times while having Merrett than Shiel ran back to help out in defence.

Zing!

 

[fishardansin]

I Imagine we wanted if for points for Academy players and fathersons in 2027 - Bewick, Rodan & Darwish all could be top 20.

Well that is why I wanted it anyway.

Yes, which is why trading him next year for a late first-rounder, a 2027 first-rounder and a player would be optimal. There is enough time to find a club that Merrett wants to go to and can do that trade before next trade period.

Curnow after the trade went through said how relieved he was that he did not have to do this again in 12 months time.

In the end Merrett will likely ask again in 12 months time and Essendon will get way less just like they did with Daniher its probably the worst non-trade decision i can recall a club making.

If Essendon has another year like last year, then the club will be happy to let him go. Daniher lost value because he didn't play for the year in between, suffering more injuries and making him a risk for other clubs to take him on. This is not the same scenario as a small guy with zero injury history likely winning his 7th best and fairest.

People like you are creating these narratives as if they were anything other than a reflection of your dislike for Essendon. It ain't true. Merrett was offered 4 or 5 years at over $1 mil per year to join. This was also a big pay jump for him because he's in the final two years of a heavily front-loaded contract. He's going to be offered over $1 mil per season next year by a club that works with Essendon from early in the year to make a trade that makes everyone happy, in the 90% chance that he goes.

Weddle will take a pay cut yo avoid going to essendon

So, I'm guessing you've never been offered life-changing money. If Essendon remain bottom four and look locked into it, and Hawthorn continue to progress, then he'll want to continue with that, and get a payday a few years later. However, following this off-season, neither of those outcomes is certain.

 

[ReturningHawk]

I have often thought that if Hawthorn were more mature about things this deal may very well have gotten done.

Reports state that HH was never the needle mover, literally would have been steak knives. How arrogant Hawthorn were is what denied this ever being done imho

You say that Hawthorn were immature and arrogant. I’d suggest that you’re seeing what you want to see.

Ultimately there was very little difference between how this trade was negotiated and the Curnow trade, except that Charlie was open to several clubs, and one of them was able to convince players to move. Hawthorn only managed to convince Hustwaite to move. Essendon didn’t make any reasonable demands, they clearly didn’t want to make a deal.

 

[Yoda_]

You say that Hawthorn were immature and arrogant. I’d suggest that you’re seeing what you want to see.

Ultimately there was very little difference between how this trade was negotiated and the Curnow trade, except that Charlie was open to several clubs, and one of them was able to convince players to move. Hawthorn only managed to convince Hustwaite to move. Essendon didn’t make any reasonable demands, they clearly didn’t want to make a deal.

The timeline dictated by Hawthorn has been called out by many

 

[WN123]

Ultimately there was very little difference between how this trade was negotiated and the Curnow trade, except that Charlie was open to several clubs, and one of them was able to convince players to move. Hawthorn only managed to convince Hustwaite to move. Essendon didn’t make any reasonable demands, they clearly didn’t want to make a deal.

The Curnow trade (and the Petracca trade) were considerably more than what Hawthorn offered. When the dust is settled I wonder whether Zach will look at that at think “Hawthorn just didn’t value me enough”.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

The timeline dictated by Hawthorn has been called out by many

That and to go for gold they trade down and give a junk pick 22 which Essendon won't use lol

Hey but didn't you hear it's a first rounder...forgetting you have 5 before then and don't have the list spots. If I hear one more time it will help trade up to pick 1 I'll need another tequila! WCE have no use for a pick in the 30 range after all the bidding either. If you trade to 1 it will be your first two picks it would have zilch to do with a pick in the 20's (you won't)

 

[ReturningHawk]

The timeline dictated by Hawthorn has been called out by many

Called out by many Essendon fans and past players in the media.

The message behind the deadline was pretty simple: ”We’ve been waiting to find out what the asking price is, and you haven’t returned our texts, so here’s an offer we think is fair. If you don’t want that deal, we’re going to trade that pick, so if you don’t respond to us (again), we’ll presume it’s a no.”

Essendon didn’t respond, and the pick was traded. There was nothing dramatic about it. The pick swap enabled us to make a better offer second up.

 

[joey_jo_jo]

Called out by many Essendon fans and past players in the media.

The message behind the deadline was pretty simple: ”We’ve been waiting to find out what the asking price is, and you haven’t returned our texts, so here’s an offer we think is fair. If you don’t want that deal, we’re going to trade that pick, so if you don’t respond to us (again), we’ll presume it’s a no.”

Essendon didn’t respond, and the pick was traded. There was nothing dramatic about it. The pick swap enabled us to make a better offer second up.

Jake Niall, Peter Ryan and Mick Gleeson all agreed on the Age's realfooty podcast that it was both too late and not adequate as an offer. Andrew Wu another Age journo that criticised the hawks.

Riley Beveridge stated on gettable that he thought it was an adequate offer but far too late.
Tim Miller on the Roar another to criticise the way the hawks list management team acted during trade week.
None of these guys are essendon fans or past players.

 

[ReturningHawk]

Jake Niall, Peter Ryan and Mick Gleeson all agreed on the Age's realfooty podcast that it was both too late and not adequate as an offer. Andrew Wu another Age journo that criticised the hawks.

Riley Beveridge stated on gettable that he thought it was an adequate offer but far too late.
Tim Miller on the Roar another to criticise the way the hawks list management team acted during trade week.
None of these guys are essendon fans or past players.

The adequacy of the offer is different to the deadline.

I’m intrigued how Essendon are simultaneously confirming that Merrett was never going to be traded, and outraged at the timing of Hawthorn’s offer.

 

[joey_jo_jo]

The adequacy of the offer is different to the deadline.

I’m intrigued how Essendon are simultaneously confirming that Merrett was never going to be traded, and outraged at the timing of Hawthorn’s offer.

All those guys that I referenced mentioned the timing in their trade day reviews (as did guys like Barrett and Cornes but I dont respect them enough to use for a supportive argument haha).

I dont know what the relevance of the 2nd paragraph is to my post, I was just providing evidence it wasn't just essendon fans and ex players criticising thr timing of the first offer.

 

[jannissary]

The adequacy of the offer is different to the deadline.

I’m intrigued how Essendon are simultaneously confirming that Merrett was never going to be traded, and outraged at the timing of Hawthorn’s offer.

something to do with the trade period being about "respect" and how essendon didn't do enough to respect hawthorn's teams time...

 

[Philhawk]

Ultimately, Zach couldn’t pass up the opportunity to be coached by a board member.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

The adequacy of the offer is different to the deadline.

I’m intrigued how Essendon are simultaneously confirming that Merrett was never going to be traded, and outraged at the timing of Hawthorn’s offer.

The timing of the matter only offers if Essenon had no idea that Merret was wanting to make a move to Hawthorn.

We all knew it was happening. It's not like Hawks made the offer and Essendon went "oh my god this is such a surprise! We didn't know this was coming - we have no idea what price will demand or accept and had no way of being prepared for this exact situation"

Essendon just acting dumb by saying the timing of the offer affected their ability to negotiate. Surely they're smarter than that.

 

[ReturningHawk]

All those guys that I referenced mentioned the timing in their trade day reviews (as did guys like Barrett and Cornes but I dont respect them enough to use for a supportive argument haha).

I dont know what the relevance of the 2nd paragraph is to my post, I was just providing evidence it wasn't just essendon fans and ex players criticising thr timing of the first offer.

But this is the double-speak I’m talking about.

If the offer was inadequate, why is the timing important? If that offer had been made on day 1, and Essendon responded by asking for 4x1sts, the outcome would’ve been the same. There is a view that it would’ve been reasonable for Hawthorn to offer 10, 22 and Cam Mackenzie. Firstly, that’s the worst deal in trade history, secondly the kid didn’t want to go. If Worpel and CJ had wanted Essendon, this could’ve happened differently.

Ultimately Petroro thought the bombers would trade him, because it made more sense for a rebuilding team to take a draft haul than keep a disgruntled player who is in the latter stage of his career. Bombers thought differently. Both clubs lost out here, Petroro takes the responsibility.

 

[Duckworth]

But this is the double-speak I’m talking about.

If the offer was inadequate, why is the timing important? If that offer had been made on day 1, and Essendon responded by asking for 4x1sts, the outcome would’ve been the same. There is a view that it would’ve been reasonable for Hawthorn to offer 10, 22 and Cam Mackenzie. Firstly, that’s the worst deal in trade history, secondly the kid didn’t want to go. If Worpel and CJ had wanted Essendon, this could’ve happened differently.

Ultimately Petroro thought the bombers would trade him, because it made more sense for a rebuilding team to take a draft haul than keep a disgruntled player who is in the latter stage of his career. Bombers thought differently. Both clubs lost out here, Petroro takes the responsibility.

Ask the journo's, they're the ones criticising the Hawks. They're saying the offer was late AND inadequate. Those two things are not mutually exclusive. It is surely not that hard to get.

 

[ReturningHawk]

Ask the journo's, they're the ones criticising the Hawks. They're saying the offer was late AND inadequate. Those two things are not mutually exclusive. It is surely not that hard to get.

I see a lot of people saying that hawks should’ve got this deal done, but not many saying they should’ve given the equivalent of 4 first round picks. Those journos would have been laughing at Hawthorn if they had given Mackenzie and 2 firsts. There was just no deal to be done here

 

[Jeremy McLovin]

The timing of the matter only offers if Essenon had no idea that Merret was wanting to make a move to Hawthorn.

We all knew it was happening. It's not like Hawks made the offer and Essendon went "oh my god this is such a surprise! We didn't know this was coming - we have no idea what price will demand or accept and had no way of being prepared for this exact situation"

Essendon just acting dumb by saying the timing of the offer affected their ability to negotiate. Surely they're smarter than that.

Yeah, essendon knew it was happening, and said he wouldn't be traded. Should have listened.

 

[Duckworth]

I see a lot of people saying that hawks should’ve got this deal done, but not many saying they should’ve given the equivalent of 4 first round picks. Those journos would have been laughing at Hawthorn if they had given Mackenzie and 2 firsts. There was just no deal to be done here

That's why there is criticism of Hawthorn by the media; the initial offer wasn't enough. Pick 10, 22, F1, and FF1 were too high, but there wasn't enough time to find a middle ground. Could easily have thrashed out some seconds going back to Hawthorn in this case and got there.

 

[ReturningHawk]

That's why there is criticism of Hawthorn by the media; the initial offer wasn't enough. Pick 10, 22, F1, and FF1 were too high, but there wasn't enough time to find a middle ground. Could easily have thrashed out some seconds going back to Hawthorn in this case and got there.

I don’t think they would have got there. Hawks offer of 10,22, F1 and Henry Hustwaite is certainly the maximum they were going to give. It was already well past the middle ground.

This discussion of “Hawks should’ve included a best 22 player” is stupid. The straight swap wasn’t on. Essendon were thinking of picks 10,22, F1 with Cam Mackenzie on top.

We shouldn’t really apportion blame to either club. Essendon valued Zach to be the equivalent of 4 first rounders. It was a price they thought no club would pay, and they were right. Only Petroro had the possibility to do it all differently.

 

[Duckworth]

I don’t think they would have got there. Hawks offer of 10,22, F1 and Henry Hustwaite is certainly the maximum they were going to give. It was already well past the middle ground.

This discussion of “Hawks should’ve included a best 22 player” is stupid. The straight swap wasn’t on. Essendon were thinking of picks 10,22, F1 with Cam Mackenzie on top.

We shouldn’t really apportion blame to either club. Essendon valued Zach to be the equivalent of 4 first rounders. It was a price they thought no club would pay, and they were right. Only Petroro had the possibility to do it all differently.

Well, my opinion counts for naught, but I think they could have gotten there with more time. I think the Hawthorn offer was reasonable, and 10,22, F1 + HH is not far from changing out HH for FF1 (Essendon's counteroffer). I'm not sure where Essendon asked for a specific players, other than to say no to Hustwaite. I've seen no specific players reported, but Sydney was able to include a player to get it done for Curnow, so calling it stupid is a bit discourteous to the process. Hawthorn was not prepared to include a player to get the deal done (Essendon never asked) is likely more accurate phrasing, and each club is within their rights to act like this.

I see the two requests as being close enough to negotiate a middle ground. I attribute blame to Hawthorn for choosing a tactic of here is our first and best offer one night out. Now, I can't say if this was based on advice from Petoro, but IMHO it hindered a successful trade. For the record, I would have done this deal and saw it as benefiting both clubs.

You may be right, and Essendon may never have intended to trade (Which is fine). However, issuing a strong-arm ultimatum is surely not a tactic to leverage such a valuable opposition player.