Review Positives (Ha!) and Negatives vs Richmond

[West Coast 06]

Why are people saying it was a gutless performance?

I was at the game and saw two teams going at it in atrocious conditions, the slightly more polished team winning in the end. Didn't think West Coast lacked effort, they just weren't classy enough up forward to finish off their grunt work.

I thought Richmond would steam roll us after half time, they were smashing us in every stat and ran off united after the crowd turned on Vickery. When I looked at the stats again at 3/4 time they had largely evened up and except for an arsey goal in the last and a couple of goals from a dodgy 50 metre penalty and soft free kicks in front of goals, there wasn't that much in it.

 

[Arecsa]

Positives - Wasn't home to see the match

Negatives - We left Vickery standing at the end of the game

 

[The Dodger]

a) they don't trust their ability to hit a target in the wet, b) they don't trust the forwards to take a grab in the wet.

No confidence. Much easier to kick it as far as possible and make it someone else's problem.

Yep confidence in yourself to execute basic skills in any conditions is lacking. Much better to take the safe 50m bomb option and try and setup to stop the counter attack than try a difficult pass and turn it over.

Other teams are miles ahead of us in this regard because we have put up with sub standard skills from so many for too long. Waters, ASelwood, SSelwood, Priddis, Mackenzie (slightly improved but still relies on 50m down the line too much), Dalziell, McGinnity to players who are ok skilled but lack confidence in Sheppard, Brown & Smith.
Watching this bevy of no confidence under skilled players trying to hit targets and instead doing soul sapping turnovers instead has lead the team to also have no confidence in the guy delivering the ball.
Other teams can lead confidently at the ball carrier at top pace and expect / demand to be hit on the chest. They can make tight leads in minimal space and ease the pressure off by crisp sharp ball movement when under pressure. We cant, so when the pressure goes up we bomb.

 

[The Dodger]

Why are people saying it was a gutless performance?

I was at the game and saw two teams going at it in atrocious conditions, the slightly more polished team winning in the end. Didn't think West Coast lacked effort, they just weren't classy enough up forward to finish off their grunt work.

I thought Richmond would steam roll us after half time, they were smashing us in every stat and ran off united after the crowd turned on Vickery. When I looked at the stats again at 3/4 time they had largely evened up and except for an arsey goal in the last and a couple of goals from a dodgy 50 metre penalty and soft free kicks in front of goals, there wasn't that much in it.

I might be wrong but I think there may have been a big difference in contested possessions at the end of the game. I know at one stage IIRC they had 20 more.

 

[The Dodger]

Also Josh Kennedy's game has gone down the toilet.
Cant mark well, doesn't position himself well in contests and is selfish with ball in hand.

 

[Eaglemaniac]

I know what's going on by watching the game and taking note of what happens, that's the best method I think. You seem to think that because Simpson explained himself then what he did can't be questioned. Late in the quarter I noticed McGinnity went to Chaplin which seemed to be a belated acknowledgment that this was an issue, but the horse had already bolted by then.

No, I watched the game and watched us win the ball by having extra numbers around the contest (because we were getting smashed in contested ball), and then watched players with plenty of time waste their kick by kicking it directly to the opposition where none of our players were even close to. Face it, bad kicking and bad decision making was a much the reason for us losing that game last night as it has been all year. There no point having all your forwards manned up and them getting cold because you can't win the ball enough to get it there.

 

[Daveismad]

Also Josh Kennedy's game has gone down the toilet.
Cant mark well, doesn't position himself well in contests and is selfish with ball in hand.

No the problem is we move the ball so slowly that by the time Kennedy is leading there is so many players clogging the space

If we move ball quicker by having some leg speed on the outside and with better kicking Kennedy will be more one out more often

Last night Hurn on two or three occasions had the ball and he just stands there ..........bloody move the pill quicker FFS .......

 

[Eaglemaniac]

No the problem is we move the ball so slowly that by the time Kennedy is leading there is so many players clogging the space

If we move ball quicker by having some leg speed on the outside and with better kicking Kennedy will be more one out more often

Last night Hurn on two or three occasions had the ball and he just stands there ..........bloody move the pill quicker FFS .......

Our ball movement hasn't been great but Kennedy's been dropping easy marks all year unless it's been against the easy beats. He's definitely out of form.

 

[The Dodger]

No the problem is we move the ball so slowly that by the time Kennedy is leading there is so many players clogging the space

If we move ball quicker by having some leg speed on the outside and with better kicking Kennedy will be more one out more often

Last night Hurn on two or three occasions had the ball and he just stands there ..........bloody move the pill quicker FFS .......

That doesnt help. But he flails around in 1 on 1's when the ball is kicked in and burnt 2 or 3 opportunities last night to hand off and took the blind snap option.

 

[Daveismad]

- Ellis was the first to fly the flag for Cox and he's been here less than a year. At this stage of the year where we are going no where and players are fighting for careers someone should have shown Pride in the jumper and Pride for their team mate and knocked Vickory. Brown you've had a good year but you were right there. Clip him! Worst of all is we wrestled with little eggs like Conca. The only player that ever flys the flag is McGovern really. Schofield you were there too. Who cares if you give away a retaliation free kick. We haven't showed heart for the best part of a decade now. If that was me I'd be happy to cop a 3 week suspension because you don't do that to my teammate.

- the VFL

Ad can you believe the commentators for having a crack at the big fella who put his face over the dugout but was still within the seated area and gave his opinion to Vickory

That whole commentary team were the disgrace .....I want to hear commentators say the bloody truth

That Vickory was a dog and that fan had every right to vent his spleen

God I wish I could do special comments for that game

I would have called it like this ....

Vickory youre a dog and a disgrace to be wearing that jumper .....and that bloke leaning over the fence good on you mate for flying the flag for your footy club .....

And I bet all the eastern states guys on channel 7 would have shut the hell up after that .....

That bloke who leaned over the fence should be invited to the club this week .......and tell the players to fly the flag when your club legend gets filed like that


Vent over

 

[Daveismad]

Our ball movement hasn't been great but Kennedy's been dropping easy marks all year unless it's been against the easy beats. He's definitely out of form.

The whole club is out of form bar Mackenzie ...thought shuey did some good things last night

 

[Eaglemaniac]

The whole club is out of form bar Mackenzie ...thought shuey did some good things last night

That's what Shuey does though, some good things. Unfortunately he doesn't do it often enough or regularly against the top teams. He needs some help at times but other times he just drifts out of the game.

 

[Pottering]

No, I watched the game and watched us win the ball by having extra numbers around the contest (because we were getting smashed in contested ball), and then watched players with plenty of time waste their kick by kicking it directly to the opposition where none of our players were even close to. Face it, bad kicking and bad decision making was a much the reason for us losing that game last night as it has been all year. There no point having all your forwards manned up and them getting cold because you can't win the ball enough to get it there.

It seems that nothing more than a trade off occurred, our contested possessions went up which converted into their uncontested possessions rising. Given the conditions it was unlikely that a few more contested possessions would magically translate into quality entries into an outmanned forward line. In the end we had as many effective kicks as they did, but they scrounged their goals and we over possessed, which is something we usually do and in the wet that's the last thing you want.

 

[che88]

Ad can you believe the commentators for having a crack at the big fella who put his face over the dugout but was still within the seated area and gave his opinion to Vickory

That whole commentary team were the disgrace .....I want to hear commentators say the bloody truth

That Vickory was a dog and that fan had every right to vent his spleen

God I wish I could do special comments for that game

I would have called it like this ....

Vickory youre a dog and a disgrace to be wearing that jumper .....and that bloke leaning over the fence good on you mate for flying the flag for your footy club .....

And I bet all the eastern states guys on channel 7 would have shut the hell up after that .....

That bloke who leaned over the fence should be invited to the club this week .......and tell the players to fly the flag when your club legend gets filed like that


Vent over

mate i was at the game i think vikery was bang out of line(and is a w***er) but i had a similar wc suppporter near me and he was scaring 10 year old kids with his anger and abuse theres nothing cool about that.im a footy tragic but its just a game those kids will remember that for life.

 

[J_M_J]

Positives;

NicNat building and impressive
Priddis working hard
Shuey beasted through injury
MacKenzie elite
Brown and Schofield very good
McGovern a gem
No longer have to play for finals and can play to develop our list

Negatives;

Gaff very soft at the contest
Sheed will need to grow into a permanent role
Depth players lost the game - Smith, Tunbridge et al needed to step up higher
Forwards where underwhelming

 

[che88]

on a side note(im not trolling)alot of vic clubs rate gaff would you trade him?

 

[Arthaus]

yes, kennedy, darling and lecras have been quite poor all year, whats with that..they being gangbanged? poor delivery into the arc? their whole lead up is unsettled..darling just seems to flusterfluk everything now, gave away 3-4 frees. he's not good below the knees, goes to ground a lot. its seems other teams have a blueprint on how to quell our forward line, week in week out. but they should be better than what weve seen. whats up with that.
mcgovern comes in with fresh attack on the ball, but he's being chopped out moreso now. nobody takes marks anymore. everybody punches the ball to no-one, so it becomes a chaos ball.many times,not just last nite being greasy, they could easily mark the ball.

i'm trying to find some rational explanation for the strange loss of skills, its like a growing bermuda triangle, the team that slowly disappeared?
i like to think we're at our lowest point in this unsettled period of transition and all will turn around certainly by next season..but its just weird how bad weve become in certain areas. maybe theres some truth to the club oversanitising our list re player culture?
the preseason,draft, trade, etc cant come soon enough.
whats up with bennell?
smith..uurgh.
we need smarts, skills, pace, class, grunt, grit, big bodies and a midfield.
i think we need a new team?

 

[Eaglemaniac]

It seems that nothing more than a trade off occurred, our contested possessions went up which converted into their uncontested possessions rising. Given the conditions it was unlikely that a few more contested possessions would magically translate into quality entries into an outmanned forward line. In the end we had as many effective kicks as they did, but they scrounged their goals and we over possessed, which is something we usually do and in the wet that's the last thing you want.

Our stupid decisions with the ball cost us forward, nothing else. The coach can't kick the ball for them as well. As I've pointed out a million times to you but you dont seem to understand, what's the point of having your players manned up in the forward line and never seeing the ball because the opposition is just running it easily out of the contests? You should hang with Woosha as you both have the same gam plan, do nothing and hope things get better.

 

[Adam Selwood]

Story of our year

• Control long periods of the game and pepper the goals, but only for minor scores
• Opposition breaks from defense and kicks the easiest goal against the run of play (see Martin in the 3rd last night, Pavlich in the first Derby)

Need a huge injection of class in the midfield and Simpson needs to take a broom to the whole playing group (and probably the higher ups too)

 

[Milenko]

Let's trade Josh Kennedy for Jaeger O'Meara before everyone wakes up smells the roses

 

[che88]

the good thing about your club is you have the key tall pillars its just your midfield.

 

[Oneiros]

Was in the upper level, off to the right of the interchange and everyone saw the bloke leaning over to give the dog a spray. Got a decent cheer and round of applause at the time. Haven't seen anything to change my view that that was the right course of action.

 

[SpaceClef]

Yep confidence in yourself to execute basic skills in any conditions is lacking. Much better to take the safe 50m bomb option and try and setup to stop the counter attack than try a difficult pass and turn it over.

Other teams are miles ahead of us in this regard because we have put up with sub standard skills from so many for too long. Waters, ASelwood, SSelwood, Priddis, Mackenzie (slightly improved but still relies on 50m down the line too much), Dalziell, McGinnity to players who are ok skilled but lack confidence in Sheppard, Brown & Smith.

There wasn't really significantly wrong with Dalziell's footskills. Infinitely better than Brown's. Just had no contested ability.

 

[The Dodger]

There wasn't really significantly wrong with Dalziell's footskills. Infinitely better than Brown's. Just had no contested ability.

Now I know you were his sponsor , they were pretty bad. Would often kick floaters when short passing.

 

[SpaceClef]

Well I know I will get jumped on for saying it because no one ever notices the good things he does, but Hutch hit up Shuey last night inside the 50 with a short kick while on the run instead of blazing away, so we can do it, but last night we had experienced players like Hurn, Darling and others just kicking directly to the opposition. If our experienced players are that dumb, we're in trouble.

Yeah i think Hutchings knows his limits and plays within them, which is a good thing about him. Though part of that is realising he can't kick on his left and so i don't think i've ever seen him use it.