List Mgmt. List planning 2015 and onwards

[Forzaport]

Your argument seems to be that if we don't have say, a top 8-10 pick there is no point picking a mid. We'll be picking 10-18 this year and there's a perfectly reasonable chance of picking a high calibre midfielder in that range. Best case scenarios you're talking Nat Fyfe, Callan Ward, Patrick Cripps, Nathan Jones, Brad Ebert, Kane Cornes, Brandon Ellis, Isaac Smith, Mitch Duncan. Or more recently Luke Dunstan.

Take another in the second round, who may have been overlooked for the typical reasons that players do in the AFL draft, and all you're doing is buying another ticket to the lottery.

If we have to wait until we're picking in the top 5 again to address the midfield we'll have have a gap in the list. All I'm saying.

No, by all means we should draft a mid and another KPF. My original question was whether there would be any "out and out" midfielders at our first selection as those types of players tend to go very early in the draft and late first rounders are usually more inside or outside type players. You listed a few mid-late draft players who have by far exceeded their pre-draft ranking and were not relevant to my original question. If anything, those players prove that there few "out and out" midfielders beyond round 1.

Even the players you've just listed now, how many of those were drafted as "out and out" midfielders that would be available at our first pick assuming we finish top 4? Ebert? Pick 13. Fyfe? drafted as a forward flanker. Jones? Pick 12. Dunstan is probably the closest we could get to an "out and out" midfielder at the tail end of round 1 but even he had question marks over his pace and kicking. You're probably going to have to temper your expectation and decide whether we go for a mid with stronger inside abilities or an outside runner because it's unlikely a player with both attributes will be available at our first pick.

 

[Byrons Firen]

2013 Draft = speed and flankers + Harvey
2014 Draft = development KPP + Palmer

Our age/depth profile in our list is pretty good in all areas. It may take a bit of a hit if we lose a Shaw/Clurey or Butcher. However a 22-26yo KPP swingman wouldn't go astray.. but they don't grow on trees.

2015 Draft = Best available 183-190cm mid. Preferrably good skills over speed/endurance.

Preferrably both. Ken/the club rate speed very highly. Look at the last 2 drafts.
Its one of the reasons our list is better than the crows who are slow by comparison.

 

[Byrons Firen]

The discussion above about drafting mids is interesting. Lets not overlook how we got Polec and White,
both from other clubs that we have turned into better players. I'm not suggesting a Bryce Gibbs type cos he's
the wrong side of 25 and slow but if we are becoming a 'destination' club our needs could be met via non draft methods.
There are a few clubs unlikely to make finals in the next few years with players itching to a part of September football.

 

[Nemisis]

We had the long term KPP draft last year.

With Cornes leaving, Newton too, and Young, Moore and Ah Chee promising but still questionable long term, I'd like to see us pick up some out-and-out midfielders in this year's draft. 2 or 3 guys who really have the ball on the string and can spend a couple of years honing their craft in the SANFL. Some insurance for unexpected injuries, departures or others not panning out also factors in.

Triple like for this comment - pick up three ball magnets and let them develop

 

[Jonts]

If you want an out and out midfielder not in the top 10 (ie not an outside or inside player but an all around midfielder)

You go second round when they have deffiency but are good improvement prospects, or when they
re only B graders in juniors but development to go to that next level, often they play in that second midfield rotation and start at HFF

Duncan - 28
Jack Redden - 26
Zaharakis - 23
Hannebery
Luke Parker - 40
Levi Greenwood - 32

 

[Portmanteau]

If you want an out and out midfielder not in the top 10 (ie not an outside or inside player but an all around midfielder)

You go second round when they have deffiency but are good improvement prospects, or when they
re only B graders in juniors but development to go to that next level, often they play in that second midfield rotation and start at HFF

Duncan - 28
Jack Redden - 26
Zaharakis - 23
Hannebery
Luke Parker - 40
Levi Greenwood - 32

That's what I'm saying brah. Reckon Maris Olekalns would be worth a look based on current phantoms.

 

[Lawnchair Larry]

Some data on height and weight of a current 2015 Port best 22 vs the Hawthorn best 22 from 2008 and 2014 Premiership years.
Of course it relies on the data from club web sites being correct.

The 2015 Port team is a nominal and includes Cornes but that should not make a huge difference to height and weight, but it might to the age data (see thumbnails).
Boak Broadbent Carlile Cornes Ebert Gray Hartlett Hombsch Impey Jonas Lobbe Monfries Neade Pittard Polec Ryder Schulz Trengove Westhoff White Wines Wingard
are the nominal 22
I have the shown data for ages in the premiership years of Hawthorn as I wanted to see whether we were in the "window", but the Port data may be inaccurate because Cornes is not going to be there. I can't be bothered redoing the data! It certainly gives an insight into why Hawthorn has done so well over recent years; their 2008 premiership team was very young. I can count 6 players from that time who have carried over to still be playing now. That and some interesting recruiting have done it for them. We are starting to do this sort of stuff ourselves now with the recruitment of Ryder, but perhaps one or two more will be the answer.
Apart from that 2008 Hawthorn team, at least based upon age data, we are in the premiership window or PERHAPS one year off . No accounting for skill of course.
Btw median is the "middle value", which for a team of 22 is the average of the 2 middle values "75% older than" obviously means "25% younger than" (or the boundary between the first and second quartile if you are stats inclined)

 

[Long live PAFC]

Whilst scoffed at before when I suggested Will Minson, perhaps rightly so, ruck depth remains a huge issue. Considering Frampton's injury and youth and Redden's injury prone history and poor athleticism - we are some bad luck away from Trengrove holding done duties. I know REH has suggested a state level ruckman but I think we need to be drafting another young ruck who we can put time into and looking at options for back up depth.

So for me a ruck and another KPP are priorities. Midfield depth is ok for the moment, especially if we can continue some Polec esque trades.

 

[Holden Hillbilly]

Whilst scoffed at before when I suggested Will Minson, perhaps rightly so, ruck depth remains a huge issue. Considering Frampton's injury and youth and Redden's injury prone history and poor athleticism - we are some bad luck away from Trengrove holding done duties. I know REH has suggested a state level ruckman but I think we need to be drafting another young ruck who we can put time into and looking at options for back up depth.

So for me a ruck and another KPP are priorities. Midfield depth is ok for the moment, especially if we can continue some Polec esque trades.

The only ruckman of note is the Sturt lad - we'll see how he goes in the Championships: Andre Parella - SA (203.0 cm, 104.0 kg)

 

[davesnothere]

The only ruckman of note is the Sturt lad - we'll see how he goes in the Championships: Andre Parella - SA (203.0 cm, 104.0 kg)

Matthew Flynn of the GWS Academy may be one to keep an eye on. I'd for no other reason than the GWS Academy seems a good place to look.

 

[davesnothere]

Just of interest I'll put it here I noticed a GWS academy results last season playing the Swans academy.
Results
Under 18s
Giants 9.10 (64) d Swans 6.12 (48)
Goals: Austin 3, Spinks 2, Howard 2, Etto, Griffiths.

Does seem a good place to look for talented players.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

Another Austin - related?

 

[Porked04]

Would love to look at bringing in a left footed midfielder, we look so one-dimensional through the midfield.

 

[Janus]

Another Austin - related?

Last season, Ford

 

[Ford Fairlane]

Last season, Ford

It's late, I'm tired.

 

[Long live PAFC]

Would love to look at bringing in a left footed midfielder, we look so one-dimensional through the midfield.

I agree about the left footed mid part, when drafting mids though are we expecting them to play in their first year? If there aren't injuries they will find it hard to get past Boak, Ebert, Gray, Hartlett, Wines, Winguard and Polec. They would be vying against White, Moore, Young, Ah Chee, Mitchell - pending off season movements.

 

[Long live PAFC]

Great video up on AFL.com looking at the American prospects - couple of solid options, the two fast lads have size and speed. Not sure if the club will go near another category B after Flynn or if that is just water off a ducks back.

Otherwise the local ruck prospects look pretty light on and, at this stage, mid draft range.

Seems like a shallow draft with some great smalls and plenty of flanker types who might shift into the middle.

 

[philthy05]

I'm liking what I'm reading about the draft. Some good prospects from sa I would be keen on like partington. Ryan burton will slide because of his broken leg. Aaron Francis. A few interesting prospects , and a lot of talent from vic country this year I think which we tend to like going for vic country kids.

 

[port_adelaide_1870]

Love my crazy trade scenario... Will probably get shot down for it but anyways

We could potentially trade westhoff to Fremantle for their first round draft pick (around pick 18) and a late pick (late 50s). With sandilands and pavlich coming to the end of their careers freo are in need for big men. And with Ryder here now and with Harvey, Shaw, and Howard coming through I reckon we would be able to cover a 29 (at time of the trade) swingman. Would leave us with two first rounders (one to potentially trade for a more experienced player) and another late pick (krakouer upgrade).

 

[Porked04]

Love my crazy trade scenario... Will probably get shot down for it but anyways

We could potentially trade westhoff to Fremantle for their first round draft pick (around pick 18) and a late pick (late 50s). With sandilands and pavlich coming to the end of their careers freo are in need for big men. And with Ryder here now and with Harvey, Shaw, and Howard coming through I reckon we would be able to cover a 29 (at time of the trade) swingman. Would leave us with two first rounders (one to potentially trade for a more experienced player) and another late pick (krakouer upgrade).

Can't see Freo taking Westoff, they have Mayne, Mundy and Fyfe as tall marking options across the ground/half forward, Tabaneur coming good as a KPF and Clarke rolling forward kicking goals.

Westy has never played as the number one KPF for us and Freo would be looking for a like for like replacement for Pav.

It would be great to get 2 first rounders though!

 

[philthy05]

Yeah can't see westhoff going anywhere. At his best he is a match up nightmare , gives us a skilful ball user and marking option across the ground and a guy who can drop back into defensive fifty when we are under siege and take some marks and steady. But he is just so inconsistent , especially this year. I don't see teams parting with a high pick. And I'm not sure we should ship him off as he has been a good club man for so long , it's not worth it for little gain.

 

[davesnothere]

No hope of Westoff being traded. Anytime a contract comes around you never hear anything about him looking elsewhere he just signs.... One of a few players loyal to the club when they could have done better elsewhere. Does Justin have a couple of sons as well?

Be sensible and get back to trading Hammer

 

[GreyPower]

Freo aren't going to trade their first rounder for Westhoff!

 

[Long live PAFC]

Barring something drastic, the 22 on the park currently won't be going anywhere and the SA lads will all stay. Few teams ever trade KPPs, particularly not those who are getting games and starting 22.

It's fringe players like O'Shea, Clurey, Young and Moore that may have some currency.

 

[philthy05]

[QUOTE="Long live PAFC, post: 38650263, member: 147848]


It's fringe players like O'Shea, Clurey, Young and Moore that may have some currency.[/QUOTE]

Yeah , a few vic teams should be heavily targeting those four as guys who could come in as solid first 22 players. Not that I think we should trade out our depth though. I'm really keen to see what Moore and young can do in the back end of this season. I wouldn't trade any of the four for speculative pics though. Only if they asked out and we thought we can work something good out of it.