This Hawks team. POTENTIALLY the best ever ?

[Procrastinator35]

[
Sorry buddy, but you're the one who come's off sounding the idiot.
I was 15 years old in 83' and had been going to the footy to watch my Hawks since 78'.
My birthday is the 30th of September so Grandfinal day from 83-91 WAS my birthday.
I never went out Saturday night before watching the replay, even if the Hawks only made the highlights.
That 80's time was my football life.
I watched everyone of those boys real close, and just because you think differently, sorry, doesn't make you close to being right.
Good luck to you though, those rose colored glasses will be handy in your old age [/QUOTE]


Ah ha....Any one who says that Rocket, Judge & Wittman were soft is clearly in need of glasses!....I never missed a game from 1982-1989 mate & was privy to the 70's from pretty much 1974 onward!...You'll notice that I never argued the point over Pritchard or Abbott yes?....No rose colored glasses here flinchfree, as my continued critique of our current teams performances versus the Cats will attest to!....I call a spade a spade, you've flipped 3 cards over there & made the wrong suite call on them, which is why I've called you out on it!

 

[crazywildhorse]

Foll: ? Hodge Platten
Coach: Jeans

The player that should be there is Salmon. If only we got him a few years earlier.

 

[crazywildhorse]

A more pertinent question is whether another flag would place Clarkson as our greatest ever coach.

This is especially relevant if he becomes the first coach to guide us to back to back flags

As far as impact no one will ever take Kennedy's spot. But, if he can keep this team up and about in the next 5-6 years and win couple more flags, I would put him past Jeans. His ability to think beyond the square is pretty exceptional.

 

[macdaddio]

I don't think any team will ever be as meen and tough and as good as the 80s hawks!

 

[Pessimistic]

The squiggle does not lie
http://maxbarry.com/squiggle/1988.html

http://maxbarry.com/squiggle/2014.html

 

[Lord_Espos]

Sorry I should be clear. I still have all my footy cards that I used to own back then. They are at home.

Along with a large collection of Return of the Jedi cards. Now they were cool.

 

[dixyland]

Let's let history decide how good this team was when the era is finished (hopefully not until Hartung retires a multiple premiership winner in 10-15 years).

 

[Pessimistic]

Absolutely. Can tick off the boxes on the way. You cant win a premiership in may

 

[bards]

Dunstall, Brereton, Tuck, Buckenara, Platten, Ayres, Langford, Pritchard, Dipierdomenico, Mew, Collins, Kennedy Jr. They are some of the greatest names in our clubs history, and all played in the 1989 grand final. Add players like Dear, Condon, Maginness, Anderson etc and you'll see how great that team was. Our current team is super, especially in an era where its harder to stay up, but theres a strong argument that Geelong have been better, and I'd fight to the death to say that our 86-91 teams were better than the current Geelong lineup.

 

[macdaddio]

Dunstall, Brereton, Tuck, Buckenara, Platten, Ayres, Langford, Pritchard, Dipierdomenico, Mew, Collins, Kennedy Jr. They are some of the greatest names in our clubs history, and all played in the 1989 grand final. Add players like Dear, Condon, Maginness, Anderson etc and you'll see how great that team was. Our current team is super, especially in an era where its harder to stay up, but theres a strong argument that Geelong have been better, and I'd fight to the death to say that our 86-91 teams were better than the current Geelong lineup.

I will be by your side fighting the good fight

 

[parsons nose]

Dunstall, Brereton, Tuck, Buckenara, Platten, Ayres, Langford, Pritchard, Dipierdomenico, Mew, Collins, Kennedy Jr. They are some of the greatest names in our clubs history, and all played in the 1989 grand final. Add players like Dear, Condon, Maginness, Anderson etc and you'll see how great that team was. Our current team is super, especially in an era where its harder to stay up, but theres a strong argument that Geelong have been better, and I'd fight to the death to say that our 86-91 teams were better than the current Geelong lineup.

I was thinking the same. Geelong have been able to maintain a successful run due to nucleus of greats; much in the way Hawthorn were able to in the 80's. Guys like a Bartell, Johnston, Taylor, Selwood, Enright and Kelly have operated at a high level of output over a long period of time. Thus the losses of Ling, Scarlett, Corey and Ottens have been ameliorated somewhat.
What remains to be seen as far as the modern crop of hopefuls for us (the likes of Gunston, Rioli, Breust, Hill, Sheils, Stratton et.el.) is how they carry the mantle once Mitchell, Burgoyne, Hodge, Sewell, Gibbo and Lake retire. The progress of GWS may also be a factor in the equation. They will threaten, the only question is when. If GWS's rise is slow we may well be thereabouts for the next five years.

 

[killerspud]

If they won in 2012 and go on to win this year that would be a three-peat with 2008 still fresh enough to give the late 80's team a shake but Platten, Dunstall, Pritchard, Tony Hall, Collins, Langford snr, Ayers, Kennedy Robertson - I mean you would be so so hard pressed to ever top that line up - the Brisbane 2001-03 team is the only one who came close and that was only because they were coached by You Know Who.

 

[killerspud]

I was thinking the same. Geelong have been able to maintain a successful run due to nucleus of greats; much in the way Hawthorn were able to in the 80's. Guys like a Bartell, Johnston, Taylor, Selwood, Enright and Kelly have operated at a high level of output over a long period of time. Thus the losses of Ling, Scarlett, Corey and Ottens have been ameliorated somewhat.
What remains to be seen as far as the modern crop of hopefuls for us (the likes of Gunston, Rioli, Breust, Hill, Sheils, Stratton et.el.) is how they carry the mantle once Mitchell, Burgoyne, Hodge, Sewell, Gibbo and Lake retire. The progress of GWS may also be a factor in the equation. They will threaten, the only question is when. If GWS's rise is slow we may well be thereabouts for the next five years.

Me thinks Gold coast is way more threatening than GWS - both have impressive forwards but GC even without the best player in the comp has a midfield that is 2 years away from completely dominating the competition - Swallow, Bennell, O'Meara, Prestia

 

[Upgrayedd]

Its not even a third of the way into the season. We lost against Geelong.

Jeez, We dismantled two contenders and destroyed a couple of pretenders, when we do geelong in by 10 goals and port by 10 and win a premiership then lets talk

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

You can only beat what you are up against. You can only compare against their peer group, not from one generation to the next.

For the purpose of "best ever", the squiggle is brilliant IMO.

This group isn't even close to the 88 all-stars.

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

That's a little hard to read, but for context - the higher the more attacking, the further right the more defensive.

1988 was as good defensively as the 05 Swans, as good offensively as the 11 Cats. Better at both than almost anyone else in history.

 

[Roddy]

You don't have to fight for the late 80/early 90s Hawks against the 07-11 Cats. If you think those Cats sides are better than the Hawks you are a deluded, ignorant fool.

 

[Pessimistic]

The squiggle is the benchmark

 

[Great 2008]

Absolutely dominating the h&a seems to have come about after carlton 95 and essendon 2000

Hawthorn 1988/1989 Played 48 Won 42 Lost 6.....Winning Percentage 87%......Now that's elite domination of the competition, & over 2 seasons for 2 Premierships not just a single one!

We also had a 21/3 record in 1971....Not too shabby either. And last year 2013, we went 22/3, our best yet!


Rocket wasn't tough hey?.....Mate did you even see him play?.....Do me a favor & watch the 1986 Grand Final & wash your mouth out with soap!
Judge not tough???....Seriously mate, I don't know where your getting your info from but you are way off the mark there!....This bloke never took a backwards step on the field, was a gun boxer & could knock a bloke out with one punch, which I saw him do with my own eyes at Victoria Park against Fitzroy.
Wittman a receiver....O.K now your just being silly.....Wittman was a tough & uncompromising in & under small, who stood up in big games when it mattered, unlike half our blokes today against the Cats, who could learn a thing or 2 off Witts!

In short your comments here are as ridiculous as they are absurd![/QUOTE]


Flinchtree also wrote, 'and Pritch was very good but not as damaging with his feet as Hill and Smith are proving.' Sorry flinchtree, Pritchard was one of the best deliverers of the ball into the forward line we have had at this club and very underrated. Half of Dunstall's goal were results of being hit on the chest by this guy time and time again.

 

[Pessimistic]

I was meaning the essendon 200o model where if it wasnt a 10 goals plus margin sheedy used to threaten to drop players. IMO sheedy burnt that list out prematurely.

Didnt see every 88 89 game but would it be fair to say that group used to cruise then blow teams away in a few minutes of play. If anything their stats could have been higher to get a. True reflection of dominance


Ps whats wrong with our 2014 squiggle ? Too straight ? Looks remarkable consistent to me

 

[Phil McCreviss]

You don't have to fight for the late 80/early 90s Hawks against the 07-11 Cats. If you think those Cats sides are better than the Hawks you are a deluded, ignorant fool.

Exactly. How could those two eras even be mentioned in the same breath. A Hawthorn 80's team at their best would have belted the living suitcase out of Geelong in their prime. Not only beaten them, but physically smashed them.

Brisbane 01-03 v 80's Hawthorn. Now there's a ball game right there.

 

[Roddy]

Exactly. How could those two eras even be mentioned in the same breath. A Hawthorn 80's team at their best would have belted the living suitcase out of Geelong in their prime. Not only beaten them, but physically smashed them.

Brisbane 01-03 v 80's Hawthorn. Now there's a ball game right there.

With the Hawks still coming out comfortable 6-8 goal winners....

 

[Pessimistic]

With the Hawks still coming out comfortable 6-8 goal winners....

Depends who gets lethal

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

Depends who gets lethal

I guess that would be up to the opposition coach.

 

[Hawkk]

Exactly. How could those two eras even be mentioned in the same breath. A Hawthorn 80's team at their best would have belted the living suitcase out of Geelong in their prime. Not only beaten them, but physically smashed them.

Brisbane 01-03 v 80's Hawthorn. Now there's a ball game right there.

Because I'm procrastinating at work...

Brisbane was an amazing finals team, but amazingly they never headed the home and away season...

Aside from the extra flag, Brisbane 2001 - 2004 was very similar to Hawthorn 1983 - 1986

2001: 17/5 (2nd), FLAG
2002: 17/5 (2nd), FLAG
2003: 14/1/7 (3rd), FLAG
2004: 16/6 (2nd), RUNNERS UP

1983: 15/7 (2nd), FLAG
1984: 17/5 (2nd), RUNNERS UP
1985: 15/1/6 (3rd), RUNNERS UP
1986: 18/4 (1st), FLAG

Our record in the home + away season was almost identical. Unfortunately we ran into Essendon in 1984/85 which was arguably their greatest side ever...

Geelong 2007 - 2013 V Hawthorn 1987 - 1993

2007: 18/4 (1st), FLAG
2008: 21/1 (1st), RUNNERS UP
2009: 18/4 (2nd), FLAG
2010: 17/5 (2nd), PRELIMINARY FINAL
2011: 19/3 (2nd), FLAG
2012: 15/7 (6th), ELIMINATION FINAL
2013: 18/4 (2nd), PRELIMINARY FINAL

1987: 17/5 (2nd), RUNNERS UP
1988: 19/3 (1st), FLAG
1989: 19/3 (1st), FLAG
1990: 14/8 (5th), ELIMINATION FINAL
1991: 16/6 (2nd), FLAG
1992: 14/8 (5th), ELIMINATION FINAL
1993: 13/7 (4th), ELIMINATION FINAL

Late '80's early '90's Hawthorn is very similar to late '00's early '10's Geelong, but together Hawthorn (1983-1992) shits on Geelong...

In fact if you took the very best from Brisbane Lions (2001-2004) and combined it with Geelong (2007-2013) and played it against Hawthorn 1983-1993 the results would be almost identical from a statistics POV.

Throw in North Melbourne 1993-2000 and our 1971-1978 era and I'd suggest that the best North Melbourne, Fitzroy/Brisbane Lions and Geelong eras of all time combined wouldn't hold a candle to our 1970's + 1980's DYNASTY...

North Melbourne 1993-2000 V Hawthorn 1971-1978 for what its worth...

1993: 13/7 (4th), PRELIMINARY FINAL
1994: 13/9 (4th), PRELIMINARY FINAL
1995: 14/8 (6th), PRELIMINARY FINAL
1996: 16/6 (2nd), FLAG
1997: 12/10 (7th), PRELIMINARY FINAL
1998: 16/6 (1st), RUNNERS UP
1999: 17/5 (2nd), FLAG
2000: 14/8 (4th), PRELIMINARY FINAL

1971: 19/3 (1st), FLAG
1972: 13/9 (6th), MISSED FINALS
1973: 11/11 (7th), MISSED FINALS
1974: 15/7 (3rd), PRELIMINARY FINAL
1975: 17/5 (1st), RUNNER UP
1976: 16/6 (2nd), FLAG
1977: 17/5 (2nd), PRELIMINARY FINAL
1978: 16/6 (2nd), FLAG

Throw in our little 2008-2014 run and its pretty obvious why the flogs on Swan the Coach despise us. We've pretty much owned the competition, aside from 12 year abyss (1995-2007) since the NASA put a man on the moon