Strategy Trade and List .Management thread 5 (...the post coitus cigarette. Edition)

[Struggle]

Please let the rumors if complaints about Connors be true. If we get that flog deregistered it would be amazing

 

[Igloo]

Perfect. We take 2 top end talent guys in a shallow draft and upgrade Smith with that pick the 80's. Also keep 1 of Crameri and Honey too I guess or do we have enough list space?

I think we need to delist both. I'd hope we would delist Crameri and then attempt to pick him up again at our pick in the 80's, and delist Smith but then re-draft him in the rookie draft.

 

[VitalDread]

Overall a A- for our trade
Bit bummed we gave up a 2018 second rounder

 

[Zephiisdaman]

Been very quiet on here as of late but **** me some of you people are sooks.

Stringer is an absolute piece of s**t of a person. Did we get ripped off or should we have taken the earlier deal? Sure, but taking the earlier deal could have tied our hands with other deals in mind.
I for one am glad that lazy campaigner is gone.
Hopefully now that Schache is back home he can sort himself out and play good footy for us

That's the spirit Matt. The campaigner is yesterdays news as of 2pm.
Note to future trade teams: never trade with that campaigner Dodoro again.

 

[CaptainMurphy]

Campbell refusing to be traded likely costs Crameri his spot.

 

[the dog's kennel]

Well, I am hugely flat about our trade period. Obviously if Schache becomes a gun then it will look great in hindsight. But that is a long way away.

One thing people should remember when comparing the Schache trade or the Cameron trade or the Weller trade to the Stringer trade, is we're talking about different clubs here.

The moral of this year's story is trade with Qld clubs (or rather basketcase clubs) wherever possible. They always give you value!

 

[BRWB]

JMac made a statement about what we wanted for Stringer and of course he wasn't going to lowball himself.

Do you think we were serious about taking Stringer back? There is so much we don't know about each element of each trade. How can we say with certainty that we were ever a realistic chance of getting a top 10 pick. I have no idea whether that was ever on the cards. Tell me how you know for sure we could have received a top 10 pick for Stringer.

We are talking from afar - but an undamaged Stringer was at least worth the Beams price (5,20ish, Crisp) which was a negotiation with one nominated club with no other suitors. A Top ten or 11 pick was the discounted price.

Our management of this process has been highly questionable:

1 - Media management - fail. This starts with Barrett. We may get satisfaction that Bev physically confronted Bev but we unneceesarily made an enemy for life of one of the most infuential journos. Also failed to predict and counteract media bias

2 - failed to market Stringer discreetly and effectively to gauge and build multi club interest

3 - failed to foresee and defuse the Abby bomb. Given Abby's love of public sharing and Stringer's alleged treatment of her - the PR disaster was completely predictable and preventable.

4 - failed to communicate effectively with Jake to the extent he was blindsided and became bitter. (Even if he is dumb as dogshit we still needed to get our message across to him effectively)

5 - failed to manage the player manager effectively to the extent that he went rogue.

6 - bluffed on takin Stringer back. Laughable failure.

Really ordinary performance

 

[yebiga]

If Bev had exited Stringer after his first year or even last year, I would have been cooler about it. But he had him for 3 years and the club for 5.
This points to failed man management, failed or non existent processes to deal with situations which are entirely predictable. And this after the palaver amongst the players back in 2014.

There needs to be a full review of the process and escalation procedure for identifying problem players early and a process to discipline and exit without this circus.

Bev has flexed his muscle, its his team. All power to him. His given them an almighty slap across the face - lets see how they respond.

I understand supporters wanting to have faith in the club, but just consider the immense talent we have lost. Jake is unique. Fact is when Jake plays poorly, there is still always a quality defender preoccupied with his every movement. He has tremendous X factor and we have absolutely Zero X factor now. That's fine, Hawthorn exited Gary Ablett Snr and won a series of flags, Hawthorn lost Franklin and did the same again. So it may be the making of us.

But there are no excuses if it back fires. We better have done our home work on Schache too. Hopefully we have not traded out one head case only to replace him with another And the collective better come out breathing fire next season.

 

[Thommo333]

I was in the keep Stringer camp but after we traded him I didn't feel as disappointed as I thought I would and was quite happy that we got rid of him in the end, especially after the Schache trade which was a steal. The most disappointing aspect was giving up the future 2nd in the Carlton trade but it's not that big of a negative.

Hopefully we manage to pick up both Crameri and Smith again. I would pick Crameri in the main draft if still available and Smith in the rookie draft.

Overall, I am very happy with our trade period and glad it is over for another year. Go Dogs!

 

[True Dog]

I'm going to have my say on stringer a bit later

I look forward to it Fronk

 

[darklake]

WELCOME BACK JONGY!!!
Never wanted to see you go!

 

[Claythesmiths]

I think we need to delist both. I'd hope we would delist Crameri and then attempt to pick him up again at our pick in the 80's, and delist Smith but then re-draft him in the rookie draft.

Is that allowed?

 

[_M_16_]

We are talking from afar - but an undamaged Stringer was at least worth the Beams price (5,20ish, Crisp) which was a negotiation with one nominated club with no other suitors. A Top ten or 11 pick was the discounted price.

Our management of this process has been highly questionable:

1 - Media management - fail. This starts with Barrett. We may get satisfaction that Bev physically confronted Bev but we unneceesarily made an enemy for life of one of the most infuential journos. Also failed to predict and counteract media bias

2 - failed to market Stringer discreetly and effectively to gauge and build multi club interest

3 - failed to foresee and defuse the Abby bomb. Given Abby's love of public sharing and Stringer's alleged treatment of her - the PR disaster was completely predictable and preventable.

4 - failed to communicate effectively with Jake to the extent he was blindsided and became bitter. (Even if he is dumb as dogshit we still needed to get our message across to him effectively)

5 - failed to manage the player manager effectively to the extent that he went rogue.

6 - bluffed on takin Stringer back. Laughable failure.

Really ordinary performance

I'm also curious to where the "leak" came from. That is what started this s**t storm. If Stringers management team which I suspect were the reason, well we've unfairly copped the heat from the media. If some s**t stain of a "journalist" has people inside the club paid off, we need to lynch them behind the stands. Too many "leaks" over the last few years at our club for my liking. That being said we do need to improve player and media management. We look like idiots and lose respect of the rest of the football world when we are trying to build the club up as professional, well run, respected by all and a good culture

 

[Mutt]

Sorry, don't agree with your logic there. We traded Schache for 25 and 40 and having acquired 16 had nothing to do with this going through.

We only needed to grab Carlton's third (40) to go with 25 for the Schache deal to work, and at that time we had 28 and 30 and all our future picks to play with.

There is no doubt that we overpaid Carlton for Picks 16 and 40, at a point during the overall negotiations timeline that we had more than enough resources to secure Schache for what turned out to be the final asking price.

Ok, so we traded Stringer for 25 + 30. That gave us #9; #25; #28 and #30. So what if Carlton refuses to trade 25 + 30 for 16? We send Brisbane what for Schache? 28 and 30? We would have been left with #9 and #25. Is that a better outcome? Remember the Schache deal was completed with 30 seconds to spare according to David Noble. We'll never know whether arguing over the 2018 second would have meant we ran out of time to do Schache but I'm pretty sure that Dalrymple would much rather have 9 and 16 this draft period and forgo 25 or 30 or whatever next year's second is going to be.

 

[Braybrook Son]

Ryan Griffen and Brett Deledio disagree.

Who lost with the Griffen deal? Has to be GWS, although, I thought it was quite fair. They got pick 6 as well

 

[paulveed]

There was some awful trading this year.

Pick 2 for Weller and 2 first Round picks for Gibbs are both outstandingly bad. Props to Carlton and Freo (and WTF to GCS and Crows).

Kind of puts the stringer thing into context.

Sorry mate, I reckon the only "context" the Stringer trade could sit comfortably in, is a major disaster movie.

 

[_M_16_]

Is that allowed?

It would be, but no chance Crameri will last to pick 82

Can someone please tell me, on the assumption Honey and Crameri are both moved on, are they stuck in the draft or they declared delisted free agents and can sign anywhere pre draft?

 

[Braybrook Son]

Can we keep picks 9 and 16 and use them next year? I’m not 100% clear on how it all works

 

[synchrodogcal]

anyone that can't see that losing stringer makes us a much better team, isn't looking hard enough

butter soft, lazy & a massively disruptive team spirit killer

really exited about next year now

 

[Struggle]

Pick 2 for weller is one of the worst things i have ever heard. He's not even a better player than Mclean or Dale

 

[Pannalstaroz]

View attachment 430082

VitalDread this screenshot I illegally appropriated is copyrighted. Stop using my s**t on your Facebook page

 

[Braybrook Son]

OK. If we had held out and refused to trade our 2018 second and the Carlton trade had subsequently fallen over, how would you feel? No pick #16. Probably no Schache.

It's so hard to pass judgement when we weren't in the room. That's why the overall net result to the club is the most sensible way to look at it in my view. We could find fault with every single element of every trade...we, theoretically, could always have done better in every transaction. Meanwhile, back in the real world, s**t happens, variables change with not a moment's notice, other parties change their minds and the clock ticks.

I'm not defending the team. Just saying it's easy to be armchair quarterbacks.

Ifs, whats, and buts, sums up the Western Bulldogs football club. What’s done is done. Leave it!

 

[maddog37]

All the deals that got good returns were for players clubs were trying to pry out of other clubs.

All the poop deals were players that clubs wanted to sell.

I'm shocked.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

Perfect. We take 2 top end talent guys in a shallow draft and upgrade Smith with that pick the 80's. Also keep 1 of Crameri and Honey too I guess or do we have enough list space?

It's a shallow draft in terms of the quality of 2nd and 3rd rounders being lower than other years, but I've also heard that it's a very wide draft, in the sense that recruiters think that there's a lot larger entire pool of players who can hack it at AFL level (ie 4th round and rookie picks are better than average at the same time)

 

[Mattdougie]

WELCOME BACK JONGY!!!
Never wanted to see you go!

F!cking joke