Craig Interview On 5AA

[tinman]

What normal human being would walk away from a $200-300K for a years work?! Not a single person on this board would walk away from that money.

Er........I have. I now only earn just over $80k a year to be back in Oz.

But it is besides the point. I think that what Welsh did was understandable. I also understand the clubs reluctance to commit to him for longer.

What I do agree with is that every other poster here has some choice about where they take their labour, who they sell it to, and how much for. Why doesn't Scott Welsh? If you want to work somewhere for less, so be it, but most will understandably opt for more. After all, that's the purpose of working isn't it?

The players are professionals. Of course they will go wherever they get the best deal. I think it is remarkable that there isn't a lot more movement between clubs.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

I find it ironic that people whine for changes without suggesting any of their own changes and then whine about Craig offering empty rhetoric.

But I suppose that's just me.

If you actually have changes to the way Adelaide should be run put them up and justify them. If not get off Craig and the football club's back by offering nothing but whinging and empty rhetoric*

*That was not aimed at any personal posters but anyone who is unhappy but hasn't offered a solution.

You might want to check the "we need to get better at that" thread there are plenty of suggestions being thrown around. Funny, didn't see any suggestions from you.

As for reid, he would be one of the worst traders in the competition. And he has been one of the worst traders for the past 8 years now. Lets not forget also forget all those 1st round draft picks were blown under his watch. So what do we do, let's keep him on for another 5 years, let him really prove how incompetent he is. No wonder they love the AFC, they wouldn't last 5 minutes in a job in the eal world.

Employment Agency: Can we have a look at your CV John.
Reidy: Prepare to be dazzled, here you go.
EA: Hmmmm is this an error................Matt Bode for pick 12???
JR: Gary Ayres errrr Robert Shaw errrr no, no I meant gary Ayres..........

 

[Crow-mo]

You need to do some research .... I thought you already had!

Jon Hay & Nathan Thompson say hi

that's 4 first round picks right there.

 

[King Elvis]

what I would have done?

as I said over and over at the time. Give him his contract.
we lowballed him, and paid the price. His demands were very reasonable, and the market agreed.

for a starting ruckman, that was a very low ask. I know for fact of one ruckman not too far away who is earning twice what Hudson asked for. Hell Cain Ackland got his contract in the PSD, 2 years earlier and he got the same as Hudson was asking for in the open market.

we cut off our nose to spite our face, and I would not have done that.

Hudson & Maric is a very appealing ruck duo to me right now.

Crow-Mo - you aren't taking into account whether or not Hudson was pissed off at the Club/Leaders and wanted to leave; if that was the case, then it wouldn't have mattered what we put in front of him.

Of course, that's rumour and innuendo, nothing concrete, but it does make the actions of the Club more understandable.

I also didn't realise that about Welsh - that's pretty pissweak by the Crows. If we've given him a verbal assurance that if he fulfils a number of criteria he gets an automatic second year, why the hell wouldn't we be willing to put it in his contract, which is a simple exercise?

 

[Crow-mo]

Crow-Mo - you aren't taking into account whether or not Hudson was pissed off at the Club/Leaders and wanted to leave; if that was the case, then it wouldn't have mattered what we put in front of him.

Of course, that's rumour and innuendo, nothing concrete, but it does make the actions of the Club more understandable.

look it s a fair question.

what's more, its been the position of a few people that Hudson asked for a contract so unreasonable he knew we couldn't possibly accept it as leverage to squeeze out the door. which all works, except his contract ask was at the very lower end of market value.

a pretty big fly in the ointment if you ask me.

edit: the Australian is reporting that Carlton has offered Warnock $1M for 3 years, reportedly the same contract has been offered to Griffin by Freo.

so that would make Cain Ackland, Jonathan Griffin, Robbie Warnock worth that contract, but not Ben Hudson?

spin spin spin....

I also didn't realise that about Welsh - that's pretty pissweak by the Crows. If we've given him a verbal assurance that if he fulfils a number of criteria he gets an automatic second year, why the hell wouldn't we be willing to put it in his contract, which is a simple exercise?

and that is the question welsh and his manager were asking loudly all over the place on their way out the door.

the answer as to why is unfortunately all too obvious.

 

[Cap]

Just on the raw stats

In 2007 we averaged 12.3 goals per game and 11.9 points per game, in 2008 we averaged 13.0 (+0.7) goals and 13.4(+1.5) points per game, so we are better off without Welsh – however It would have been nice to see the goals increase at the same rate as the points
In 2007 we averaged 30.6 hitouts per game in 2008 we averaged 34.4 hitouts per game – that is a big difference considering that we had basically 2 rookies and Maric – so better off without Hudson.


they can both take there over exuberant contracts and **** off

 

[Stiffy_18]

Just on the raw stats

In 2007 we averaged 12.3 goals per game and 11.9 points per game, in 2008 we averaged 13.0 (+0.7) goals and 13.4(+1.5) points per game, so we are better off without Welsh – however It would have been nice to see the goals increase at the same rate as the points
In 2007 we averaged 30.6 hitouts per game in 2008 we averaged 34.4 hitouts per game – that is a big difference considering that we had basically 2 rookies and Maric – so better off without Hudson.


they can both take there over exuberant contracts and **** off

Wow, what a narrow minded analysis!

Surely you realise there are a lot of variables that affect those stats you just presented?!

 

[Elite Crow]

So Craigy has uncovered the secret to success in 2009, we need to work harder. So much insight. You would have thought after 4 years coaching in the AFL he would know how hard we have to work.

Also great to see he has big plans for our forward line, throwing amongst others, Griffin up forward. Well that worked once for about a quarter. Griffin cant mark and he is a poor kick. So we can look forward to another year with no forward line.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

So Craigy has uncovered the secret to success in 2009, we need to work harder. So much insight. You would have thought after 4 years coaching in the AFL he would know how hard we have to work.

Also great to see he has big plans for our forward line, throwing amongst others, Griffin up forward. Well that worked once for about a quarter. Griffin cant mark and he is a poor kick. So we can look forward to another year with no forward line.

Craigies not stupid. He knows he has to make changes to retain his job. If he doesn't, then he's even more stubborn/deluded than Ayres.

 

[TheLeftFist8]

So was it confirmed or denied that many players felt they were worked too hard before the final? Craig's response to that suggestion was that they need to work even harder to get tougher (mentally and physically). Gee i hope he is right on this issue cos he is extremely stubborn about it. Yes, has the pedigree but is he infallible?? We may be fit as in running, running, running but if they are overworked perhaps the cannot lift the intensity to explosive level when required?

The Griffin reference is very puzzling to me also. Is he pumping up his trade value, because of all the names to throw up forward he would be well down on the list. Suspect kicking, doesn't find the ball, and would provide zero defensive pressure when the ball spills. I'd prefer Tippett, Sellar, Walker, Stevens, Hentschel, Moran, Gill, Maric as options well before Griffin. Maybe after another 6 pre-seasons he will be a power forward He is a Matthew Clarke clone who just runs a little quicker, not a forward.

Also read about the fact Craig believes the game will slow next year due to ongoing evolution and refinement of all-field zoning. No doubt he is onto something, and he needs to develop a game plan to implement a form of it and counter it the other way, but more importantly i hope he can show some ingenuity and come up with the next evolution of the game after this one.

As far as the countering 'slow footy' we need to:
- improve our tackling because we cannot keep the zone effectively when players just run through it
- our skills must be precise and currently our skills are shocking; we must prioritise skilful players on half-back and thru the middle; there must be limited places for high possession winners that screw us over cos of turnovers. Thompson stays because of his clearance work but I'd be only giving room to one of Symes, Knights, Shirley, Doughty in those positions. I am sick of backwards defensive handballs, loopy kicks, short kicks that go nowhere, turnovers turnovers etc etc. We need to prioritise vB, Mackay, Vince, Reilly, Porps.
- our line-breaking and pace thru half-back, middle (while the zone is rarely fully broken, it can certainly be thinned out with very quick ball movement and the ability to go thru/around players...huge hopes for Danger)
- and of course the old chestnut, develop a decent forward line. The previous two points will make a massive difference, and with the development of Walker et al, i am hoping our forward line looks strong enough in a couple years.

 

[jenny61_99]

what's this "we" white woman?

you were spruiking how everything was rosy last year, just like this year.

I was happy with most aspects last year but did mention that I thought he needed to work on his match day coaching.

On the Huddo thing (as mentioned later in the thread), you say you think we should have offered him what he wanted. Just thought I'd let you know that a little (very reliable) birdy told me that he's been in a bit of strife down at the Bullies in recent weeks. (ie. he hasn't changed). Best thing that happened to us IMO, was to get rid of him and bring on Maric, Griffin, Moran and Tippett.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Just on the Welsh, Hudson contuning saga....and this is easy to say in hindsight

With the draft concessions there is no doubt Welsh would have been delisted this year and Hudson next season .......so they were quite within their rights to chase security.

In fact they helped the club ......Maric has flourished, Moran was brought to the club as a result, and Tippett also developed .....so really the result has been a win/win IMO

Both Welsh and Hudson are just contributing ATM .....it's not as if, based on this years form, that we would have been any better for them staying

 

[WaynesWorld19]

.

Also read about the fact Craig believes the game will slow next year due to ongoing evolution and refinement of all-field zoning. No doubt he is onto something, and he needs to develop a game plan to implement a form of it and counter it the other way, but more importantly i hope he can show some ingenuity and come up with the next evolution of the game after this one.

As far as the countering 'slow footy' we need to:
- improve our tackling because we cannot keep the zone effectively when players just run through it
- our skills must be precise and currently our skills are shocking; we must prioritise skilful players on half-back and thru the middle; there must be limited places for high possession winners that screw us over cos of turnovers. Thompson stays because of his clearance work but I'd be only giving room to one of Symes, Knights, Shirley, Doughty in those positions. I am sick of backwards defensive handballs, loopy kicks, short kicks that go nowhere, turnovers turnovers etc etc. We need to prioritise vB, Mackay, Vince, Reilly, Porps.- our line-breaking and pace thru half-back, middle (while the zone is rarely fully broken, it can certainly be thinned out with very quick ball movement and the ability to go thru/around players...huge hopes for Danger)
- and of course the old chestnut, develop a decent forward line. The previous two points will make a massive difference, and with the development of Walker et al, i am hoping our forward line looks strong enough in a couple years.

Some good points

The advantage of some real talls is felt by some clubs to be very advantageous against the defensive tactics being used ....bang the ball in high and if the targets are exceptionally tall ....like Tippett ...then that is one way of overcoming


Think we'll see the re-emergence of much taller forwrd structures and much less samller more mobile forwrd structures the likes of which the Crows employed for much of the season

 

[Cap]

Wow, what a narrow minded analysis!

Surely you realise there are a lot of variables that affect those stats you just presented?!

i put it there for an arguement but it seems people are ingnoring me now

 

[feenix67]

what I would have done?

as I said over and over at the time. Give him his contract.
we lowballed him, and paid the price. His demands were very reasonable, and the market agreed.

for a starting ruckman, that was a very low ask. I know for fact of one ruckman not too far away who is earning twice what Hudson asked for. Hell Cain Ackland got his contract in the PSD, 2 years earlier and he got the same as Hudson was asking for in the open market.

we cut off our nose to spite our face, and I would not have done that.

Hudson & Maric is a very appealing ruck duo to me right now.

It's interesting that when you finally respond to a request to provide your thoughts rather than the usual one line sniping, you expose yourself as really having no clue - just an above average vocabulary.

Hudson, hailing from WB zone and feeling unfairly dealt with mid season due to action taken against an indiscretion that wasnt isolated, sought to create a situation that would return him to the Bulldogs. This was easily done - AFC is on record as not offering contracts that extend into a player's 30's. So all Ben had to do was demand it. He knew AFC wouldnt budge. If they dont budge for the champions of the club, why would they budge for a late bloomer coming back from a reco? WB were in on the game from an early point, as their need for a ruckman was well documented. Case closed, deal done. (And btw it's not a stretch to suggest that Welshy's surprise move to the same club was borne from one or two late night drinking sessions between the two....far too coincidental otherwise.)

If you believe it was as simple as Huddo being low-balled, you're really just very simple and naiive. As someone else posted in this thread, what we hear in the media is about 10% of what actually goes on.

 

[Jumbo]

Just on the Welsh, Hudson contuning saga....and this is easy to say in hindsight

With the draft concessions there is no doubt Welsh would have been delisted this year and Hudson next season .......so they were quite within their rights to chase security.

In fact they helped the club ......Maric has flourished, Moran was brought to the club as a result, and Tippett also developed .....so really the result has been a win/win IMO
Both Welsh and Hudson are just contributing ATM .....it's not as if, based on this years form, that we would have been any better for them staying

the question is would the crows have been in the top four if both had stayed at the club? there is no difinitive answer but I reckon your chances would have increased.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

Just on the Welsh, Hudson contuning saga....and this is easy to say in hindsight

With the draft concessions there is no doubt Welsh would have been delisted this year and Hudson next season .......so they were quite within their rights to chase security.

In fact they helped the club ......Maric has flourished, Moran was brought to the club as a result, and Tippett also developed .....so really the result has been a win/win IMO

Both Welsh and Hudson are just contributing ATM .....it's not as if, based on this years form, that we would have been any better for them staying

I don't have a problem with Welsh and Hudson leaving (even the lack of loyalty shown by Hudson) but IMO we rolled over too easy in trade week, again (Mattner). What did Paul Roos say about us, we are the easiest club to deal with, hmmm I wonder why.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

But we also need to consider that for two years in a row, we lost games that we were leading by some 5 odd goals at some stage of the game. Craig himself raised this as a pretty serious issue with us. We lost last 2 finals, the games that we shouldn't have lost. Win those 2 games and the issue thats currently staring us down is not an issue. Craig himself said in the interview that those are the 2 games we should have won and he still thinks we should have won it. We needed to hold a position of the ball for 30 seconds against Hawks last year and we couldn't do it. Craig himself raised this. We should have beaten the side Collingwood put on the park and we didn't look like it for most of the game.

It is an issue, and its becoming more srious. We do need to address it because it can haunt us for years to come. I think we have the right coach, and I think we have a good group of young player going forward. I do think there is still a LOT of work to do to get to the genuine contender status but we do need to seriously address this in prompt manner.

Disagree with this line of thinking. And I really hope that the club does not console itself by saying we lead these finals by 5 goals, just made a few mistakes after half time. Fix these mistakes and we will be ok. Should've won? Rubbish. Weren't good enough and would have been exposed at some stage.

If our review from 2008 reads "Everything was fine until the 24.16 minute mark of the second quarter against Collingwood" it is a cop out of the highest order. Very much like saying "if Thommo hadn't kicked out on the full..." last season.

If this is the club's attitude then there is a real danger that we will tinker around the edges and wrongly believe we are on the right track. We could ignore some real issues, some bigger problems and broader themes that have emerged.

Why are we finding ourselves in knockout finals?
Why are extremely poor football teams like St Kilda, Collingwood, Kangaroos and Port Adelaide finishing above us and winning more finals games?
Why is it so difficult to identify our next captain(s)?
Why are some of our 'role' players still filling the same role to the same standard as they were 3-4 years ago, whereas these type of players progress at other clubs?
Why do we only average 91 points per game, even in seasons where we have a winning record?
Are teams physically intimidated by us?
Why were we the only team in the eight who had kicked more behinds than goals?
Why did we beat relatively few teams in the top eight?
Etc.

A Thompson clanger and a second half fade out against Collingwood are not the problems. They are the symptoms.

 

[*PAF]

... Why are extremely poor football teams like St Kilda, Collingwood, Kangaroos and Port Adelaide finishing above us and winning more finals games?
...

Once you start being more realistic then perhaps you could ask real questions that would make a difference.
The above quote is wishful thinking more than reality.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Once you start being more realistic then perhaps you could ask real questions that would make a difference.
The above quote is wishful thinking more than reality.

Now, now. No need to be so sensitive.

 

[*PAF]

Now, now. No need to be so sad.

Let's just say that I am just curious on how you have come to that conclusion. I find it rather baseless.

 

[jenny61_99]

I'm confused Carl.... did Port finish ahead of us this year??

 

[*PAF]

I'm confused Carl.... did Port finish ahead of us this year??

jenny jenny, you know the answer.
Absolutely not, our season finished a week before yours did.

 

[crowsup]

jenny jenny, you know the answer.
Absolutely not, our season finished a week before yours did.

I thought your season finished 10 weeks before ours. Didn't you play the last 9 weeks of the h%a season to sort out next year's playing squad?

 

[*PAF]

I thought your season finished 10 weeks before ours. Didn't you play the last 9 weeks of the h%a season to sort out next year's playing squad?

For mine it finished 3 weeks before that.