Strategy Patrick Dangerfield

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Sep 19, 2007
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I'd like to pose a question to the BigFooty brains trust:

Would we be better off playing Patrick Dangerfield as predominantly a Forward, with just the odd cameo into the midfield?

We all know that Dangerfield is a contested beast, however he also boasts awesome speed, strength in the marking contest and continues to show himself to be more than capable around goals.

Whilst there's little doubt Danger wins a lot of clearances and finds plenty of the ball in his primary role as inside mid, however how much value do we truly get from this? His disposal is one of the worst in the league among the top ball winners and the majority of his clearances result in at best a 50-50.

But what about his pace/run and carry? How often do we actually see it these days? With the attention he receives from taggers and his inside role, we just don't see it, certainly don't gain much value from it. I was startled, or perhaps not so, to find that Paddy had recorded a grand total of 0 bounces this year. He might as well be Scott Thompson really, big and strong, wins clearances and has poor disposal offering nothing on the outside.

Today was a great example of how winning the hit outs and clearances are so meaningless without a decent outside game and forward structure.

Now whilst Paddy has great speed, his disposal prevents him from offering much as an outside mid.

However, like his predecessor in the 32, Paddy presents a unique target up forward. Strong enough both in body and overhead to play as a KPF, but with elite ground ball ability to make a mockery of any KPD placed on him.

Today, he was without a doubt our most dangerous forward, yet he played most of the game as a mid. He had 4 shots on goal before anyone else in our side, whilst we were getting hammered.

At the moment I feel our forward line lacks someone to make a contest in the air. Neither Jenkins, nor Lynch are contested marking types, they struggle to force contests when the ball enters the 50 without purpose. Leaving it all essentially up to Walker and believe it or not Betts!

This is where I think Paddy would benefit our forward line immensely. Not only would he relieve pressure from Betts and Walker to score goals, his ability to force a contest is elite, something which a player like Betts would just feed off of.

With regards to covering Paddy in the midfield, we have inside mids coming out of every orriface. Lyons, M.Crouch, Grigg, plus Kerridge coming back from injury, not to mention Thompson, Sloane, VB, Ellis-Yolman and Wright already being predominantly inside.

The question becomes, is Paddy's inside clearance/inside work worth more than the potentially 50-60 goals he'd kick as predominantly a forward, then the others he'd set up through his contested work and pressure taken off Walker/Betts?

Plus he could still have bursts through the midfield, especially if he's been quiet up front.

Personally, I just feel that since his breakout year in 2012, Paddy has struggled to have the true impact he's capable of. He always seems to be laboring a touch and as a result has just become a Thommo clone. Which is not to say that means he's a bad player, far, far from it, just that he's capable of so much more. He's the ultimate impact player, who's getting bogged down with the day-in day-out midfield roles and responsibilities, essentially the "inside mid grunt work" that could quite easily be adequately compensated for by another player.
 
:cool:
I'd like to pose a question to the BigFooty brains trust:

Would we be better off playing Patrick Dangerfield as predominantly a Forward, with just the odd cameo into the midfield?

We all know that Dangerfield is a contested beast, however he also boasts awesome speed, strength in the marking contest and continues to show himself to be more than capable around goals.

Whilst there's little doubt Danger wins a lot of clearances and finds plenty of the ball in his primary role as inside mid, however how much value do we truly get from this? His disposal is one of the worst in the league among the top ball winners and the majority of his clearances result in at best a 50-50.

But what about his pace/run and carry? How often do we actually see it these days? With the attention he receives from taggers and his inside role, we just don't see it, certainly don't gain much value from it. I was startled, or perhaps not so, to find that Paddy had recorded a grand total of 0 bounces this year. He might as well be Scott Thompson really, big and strong, wins clearances and has poor disposal offering nothing on the outside.

Today was a great example of how winning the hit outs and clearances are so meaningless without a decent outside game and forward structure.

Now whilst Paddy has great speed, his disposal prevents him from offering much as an outside mid.

However, like his predecessor in the 32, Paddy presents a unique target up forward. Strong enough both in body and overhead to play as a KPF, but with elite ground ball ability to make a mockery of any KPD placed on him.

Today, he was without a doubt our most dangerous forward, yet he played most of the game as a mid. He had 4 shots on goal before anyone else in our side, whilst we were getting hammered.

At the moment I feel our forward line lacks someone to make a contest in the air. Neither Jenkins, nor Lynch are contested marking types, they struggle to force contests when the ball enters the 50 without purpose. Leaving it all essentially up to Walker and believe it or not Betts!

This is where I think Paddy would benefit our forward line immensely. Not only would he relieve pressure from Betts and Walker to score goals, his ability to force a contest is elite, something which a player like Betts would just feed off of.

With regards to covering Paddy in the midfield, we have inside mids coming out of every orriface. Lyons, M.Crouch, Grigg, plus Kerridge coming back from injury, not to mention Thompson, Sloane, VB, Ellis-Yolman and Wright already being predominantly inside.

The question becomes, is Paddy's inside clearance/inside work worth more than the potentially 50-60 goals he'd kick as predominantly a forward, then the others he'd set up through his contested work and pressure taken off Walker/Betts?

Plus he could still have bursts through the midfield, especially if he's been quiet up front.

Personally, I just feel that since his breakout year in 2012, Paddy has struggled to have the true impact he's capable of. He always seems to be laboring a touch and as a result has just become a Thommo clone. Which is not to say that means he's a bad player, far, far from it, just that he's capable of so much more. He's the ultimate impact player, who's getting bogged down with the day-in day-out midfield roles and responsibilities, essentially the "inside mid grunt work" that could quite easily be adequately compensated for by another player.
James_37 for coach
 
I think danger needs to improve his game in areas. I think we are using him in the right positions atm to be honest.
 

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all good but he kicks for goal like a little girl. not much good getting the ball as a supposedly elite talent and missing sodas from 30 out directly in front.

Wow. How many players have missed shots 30 metres out? Even the best forwards do. 'Kicks for goal like a girl'....wow. One loss and people lose their s**t
 
Wow. How many players have missed shots 30 metres out? Even the best forwards do. 'Kicks for goal like a girl'....wow. One loss and people lose their s**t

He's currently kicked 7.17 in his last 12 games, last night was not a one off in regards to goal kicking.
 
We've been saying for however long that he needs to get a better balance of contested/uncontested possessions and learn to hurt teams more on the outside. Hasn't been much progress here. Every time it seems as if he is rounding off his game he is back at the bottom of every pack the next week trying to lift up three tacklers.
 
Pretty much agree with everything. The club hasn't made progress on tactics to get the most out of his assets. He cops that much attention in close that he's even struggling to dish out effective handballs

Putting him predominantly up forward is a move I endorse. As long as he works on his set shots.
 
I think danger needs to improve his game in areas. I think we are using him in the right positions atm to be honest.

Thing is, how much improvement can we realistically expect? He's 24/25 now, played over a hundred games, his scope for improvement is minimal now and quite frankly I don't think we're getting value for money from him at present and I don't see it changing. He just always appears to be pushing s**t up hill to play even close to his explosive best these days. When was the last time he actually went for a run with the footy? Its not very often because every time he finds the footy there's 3 blokes hanging off of him.

As a forward, he actually offers us the contested marking, pack crashing option we've lacked since Tippett. He actually makes that contest that we so lacked yesterday, the contest that Boyd offered the Bulldogs, allowing their other forwards to feed off.
 

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Thing is, how much improvement can we realistically expect? He's 24/25 now, played over a hundred games, his scope for improvement is minimal now and quite frankly I don't think we're getting value for money from him at present and I don't see it changing. He just always appears to be pushing s**t up hill to play even close to his explosive best these days. When was the last time he actually went for a run with the footy? Its not very often because every time he finds the footy there's 3 blokes hanging off of him.

As a forward, he actually offers us the contested marking, pack crashing option we've lacked since Tippett. He actually makes that contest that we so lacked yesterday, the contest that Boyd offered the Bulldogs, allowing their other forwards to feed off.
If thats his future then we cannot pay him a million bucks.
 
He's currently kicked 7.17 in his last 12 games, last night was not a one off in regards to goal kicking.
17 of those shots on goal were with three players hanging off him. One having him in a headlock, another holding one arm long before he even got the ball and the other tackling him below the waist.
 
We've been saying for however long that he needs to get a better balance of contested/uncontested possessions and learn to hurt teams more on the outside. Hasn't been much progress here. Every time it seems as if he is rounding off his game he is back at the bottom of every pack the next week trying to lift up three tacklers.


What he's never mastered is the ability to steady himself from his breakneck pace for that split second before disposing of the footy.

Two words: Andrew McLeod. Watch and learn, Patty.

Actually, just watch. Because you probably can't learn that.
 
No. Patty with short stints forward is ok, but he would really struggle as a more permanent forward. He just doesn't have the ability and tricks to play forward. He got pantsed there against Collingwood over and over again.

He isn't a great overhead mark, he isn't evasive and he can't kick a simple set shot. Not great characteristics for a forward.
 
He's currently kicked 7.17 in his last 12 games, last night was not a one off in regards to goal kicking.


It's an interesting one. We've never been quite able to establish whether his disposal is great, or average, because he has games like Carlton at the dome in 2012 where he bangs 50m goals off a step on his left foot... then he has games like yesterday.

Think about this though: He's the fastest player in the competition. And he's probably the best contested-ball winner in the competition.

We're asking him to be hall-of-fame elite in a lot of areas. Perhaps we need to take a cold shower.
 

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